05/07/2007 01:00 PM House RESOURCES
| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| Commissioner, Alaska Department of Fish & Game - Denby Lloyd | |
| Board of Fisheries | |
| HJR12 | |
| HB15 | |
| Adjourn |
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| += | HB 15 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | HJR 12 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | TELECONFERENCED | ||
| + | TELECONFERENCED |
ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE
HOUSE RESOURCES STANDING COMMITTEE
May 7, 2007
1:34 p.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Representative Carl Gatto, Co-Chair
Representative Craig Johnson, Co-Chair
Representative Vic Kohring
Representative Bob Roses
Representative Paul Seaton
Representative Peggy Wilson
Representative Bryce Edgmon
Representative David Guttenberg
Representative Scott Kawasaki
MEMBERS ABSENT
All members present
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
CONFIRMATION HEARINGS
Commissioner, Alaska Department of Fish & Game
Denby Lloyd - Juneau
- CONFIRMATION ADVANCED
Board of Fisheries
Howard Delo - Big Lake
Larry Edfelt - Juneau
Vince Webster - King Salmon
- CONFIRMATIONS ADVANCED
HOUSE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 12
Urging the United States Congress to pass legislation to open
the coastal plain of the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge to oil
and gas exploration, development, and production.
- MOVED CSHJR 12(O&G) OUT OF COMMITTEE
HOUSE BILL NO. 15
"An Act relating to participation in matters before the Board of
Fisheries by members of the board; and providing for an
effective date."
- MOVED CSHB 15(RES) OUT OF COMMITTEE
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION
BILL: HJR 12
SHORT TITLE: ENDORSING ANWR LEASING
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) JOHNSON
03/07/07 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
03/07/07 (H) O&G, RES
04/26/07 (H) O&G AT 3:00 PM BARNES 124
04/26/07 (H) -- MEETING CANCELED --
05/03/07 (H) O&G AT 3:00 PM BARNES 124
05/03/07 (H) Moved CSHJR 12(O&G) Out of Committee
05/03/07 (H) MINUTE(O&G)
05/04/07 (H) O&G RPT CS(O&G) 4DP 2AM
05/04/07 (H) DP: DOOGAN, RAMRAS, DAHLSTROM, KOHRING
05/04/07 (H) AM: KAWASAKI, OLSON
05/07/07 (H) RES AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124
BILL: HB 15
SHORT TITLE: BOARD OF FISHERIES CONFLICTS OF INTEREST
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) SEATON
01/16/07 (H) PREFILE RELEASED 1/5/07
01/16/07 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
01/16/07 (H) FSH, RES
03/14/07 (H) FSH AT 8:30 AM BARNES 124
03/14/07 (H) Heard & Held
03/14/07 (H) MINUTE(FSH)
03/19/07 (H) FSH AT 8:30 AM BARNES 124
03/19/07 (H) Heard & Held
03/19/07 (H) MINUTE(FSH)
03/21/07 (H) FSH AT 8:30 AM BARNES 124
03/21/07 (H) Heard & Held
03/21/07 (H) MINUTE(FSH)
03/23/07 (H) FSH AT 8:30 AM BARNES 124
03/23/07 (H) Moved CSHB 15(FSH) Out of Committee
03/23/07 (H) MINUTE(FSH)
03/27/07 (H) FSH RPT CS(FSH) 2DP 3NR 1AM
03/27/07 (H) DP: LEDOUX, SEATON
03/27/07 (H) NR: JOHNSON, HOLMES, EDGMON
03/27/07 (H) AM: WILSON
05/02/07 (H) RES AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124
05/02/07 (H) Scheduled But Not Heard
05/07/07 (H) RES AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124
WITNESS REGISTER
DENBY LLOYD, Commissioner-Designate
Alaska Department of Fish & Game (ADF&G)
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Spoke as the commissioner-designate of
ADF&G.
MONTE ROBERTS
Soldotna, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of Mr. Lloyd's
appointment to the position of commissioner of ADF&G.
MIKE FENTON, President
Kenai River Professional Guide Association
Soldotna, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of Mr. Lloyd's
appointment to the position of commissioner of ADF&G.
RON RAINEY
Kenai, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of Mr. Lloyd's
appointment to the position of commissioner of ADF&G.
BILL GIFFORD
Soldotna, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Echoed Mr. Rainey's testimony.
REUBEN HANKE, Owner/Operator
Harry Gnes Kenai River Fishing
Kenai, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of Mr. Lloyd's
appointment to the position of commissioner of ADF&G.
GREG BRUSH
Soldotna, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of Mr. Lloyd's
appointment to the position of commissioner of ADF&G.
RICKY GEASE, Executive Director
Kenai River Sport Fishing Association, Inc.
Soldotna, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of Mr. Lloyd's
appointment to the position of commissioner of ADF&G.
ANDY SZCZESNY
Soldotna, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of Mr. Lloyd's
appointment to the position of commissioner of ADF&G.
DREW SPARLIN
Kenai, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Related his hope that Mr. Lloyd can manage
the fisheries with the best biology available, with politics
being secondary to that.
RICK BUCY
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified that Mr. Lloyd will bring a fair
and balanced outlook to all the various issues.
JOHN JENSEN
Petersburg, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of Mr. Lloyd's
appointment to the position of commissioner of ADF&G.
LARRY EDFELT, Appointee
Board of Fisheries
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Related his experience applicable to the
Board of Fisheries.
CLAUDE VINCENT WEBSTER, Appointee
Board of Fisheries
King Salmon
POSITION STATEMENT: Spoke as an appointee to the Board of
Fisheries.
HOWARD DELO, Appointee
Board of Fisheries
Big Lake, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Related his experience applicable to the
Board of Fisheries.
MONTE ROBERTS
Soldotna, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of all three
appointees to the Board of Fisheries.
MIKE FENTON, President
Kenai River Professional Guide Association
Soldotna, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of all three
appointees to the Board of Fisheries.
RON RAINEY
Kenai, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of the three
appointees to the Board of Fisheries.
BILL GIFFORD
Soldotna, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Echoed Mr. Rainey's testimony.
REUBEN HANKE, Owner/Operator
Harry Gnes Kenai River Fishing
Kenai, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of all three
appointees to the Board of Fisheries.
GREG BRUSH
Soldotna, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of the three
appointees to the Board of Fisheries.
RICKY GEASE, Executive Director
Kenai River Sport Fishing Association, Inc.
Soldotna, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of the three
appointees to the Board of Fisheries.
ANDY SZCZESNY
Soldotna, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of the three
appointees to the Board of Fisheries.
DREW SPARLIN
Kenai, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in opposition to Mr. Delo's
appointment to the Board of Fisheries, but in support of Mr.
Webster's appointment.
JOHN JENSEN
Petersburg, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of the three
appointees to the Board of Fisheries.
RICK BUCY
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of the three
appointees to the Board of Fisheries.
KEVIN HOGAN
Homer, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of Mr. Webster's
appointment to the Board of Fisheries, but expressed concerns
with the appointments of Mr. Edfelt and Mr. Delo.
STEVEN DAUGHERTY, Assistant Attorney General
Natural Resources Section
Civil Division (Anchorage)
Department of Law
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: During hearing of HB 15, testified that
Amendment 1 would seem to address all the legal issues [the
department] had.
ROD ARNO, Executive Director
Alaska Outdoor Council (AOC)
Wasilla, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in opposition to HB 15.
JIM MARCOTTE, Executive Director
Board of Fisheries
Boards Support Section
Alaska Department of Fish & Game (ADF&G)
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified that the Board of Fisheries and
ADF&G don't have an official position on HB 15.
ACTION NARRATIVE
CO-CHAIR CARL GATTO called the House Resources Standing
Committee meeting to order at 1:34:35 PM. Representatives
Gatto, Johnson, Edgmon, Kawasaki, Wilson, Seaton, and Roses were
present at the call to order. Representatives Kohring and
Guttenberg arrived as the meeting was in progress.
^CONFIRMATION HEARINGS:
^Commissioner, Alaska Department of Fish & Game - Denby Lloyd
1:34:46 PM
CO-CHAIR GATTO announced that the first order of business would
be the confirmation hearing for Denby Lloyd as commissioner of
the Alaska Department of Fish & Game.
1:34:54 PM
DENBY LLOYD, Commissioner-Designate, Alaska Department of Fish &
Game (ADF&G), informed the committee that he has a lot of
natural resource management experience within the state.
Additionally, his post-high school education was at the
University of Alaska Fairbanks. He noted that he has experience
outside of ADF&G and within ADF&G, most recently as the director
of the Division of Commercial Fisheries. Over the past few
months as commissioner-designate, Mr. Lloyd said that he has
become more familiar with the sport fishery and wildlife
conservation issues. Although the sport fishery and wildlife
conservation share much with commercial fisheries, the details
are distinct and challenging on their own merits.
1:36:06 PM
CO-CHAIR GATTO mentioned that there is some opposition to Mr.
Lloyd's appointment. There is concern that because of Mr.
Lloyd's background in commercial fisheries, he may rule in its
favor over sport fisheries. However, Co-Chair Gatto said that
in discussions with Mr. Lloyd, he related that he wouldn't
arbitrarily do so because the clear job is to [manage] both
sport and commercial fisheries while representing the governor.
Co-Chair Gatto opined that it was clear to him that Mr. Lloyd
wouldn't be biased.
1:37:09 PM
MONTE ROBERTS related his support for Mr. Lloyd's appointment to
the position of commissioner of ADF&G. In response to Co-Chair
Gatto, Mr. Roberts specified that he is a sport fisherman.
1:37:43 PM
MIKE FENTON, President, Kenai River Professional Guide
Association, related support for Mr. Lloyd's appointment to the
position of commissioner of ADF&G.
1:38:33 PM
RON RAINEY said that he had the same concerns that Co-Chair
Gatto did. However, after several conversations with Mr. Lloyd
and after watching his performance as the commissioner-
designate, Mr. Rainey opined that Mr. Lloyd was very fair with
the sport fishery issues brought before him and will do an
outstanding job. He characterized Mr. Lloyd as the "right man
for the job."
1:39:06 PM
BILL GIFFORD, speaking as a sport fisherman, echoed Mr. Rainey's
testimony.
1:39:24 PM
REUBEN HANKE, Owner/Operator, Harry Gnes Kenai River Fishing,
voiced his support for the appointment of Mr. Lloyd as
commissioner of ADF&G. Mr. Hanke related that he has known Mr.
Lloyd personally for two to three years. He said that Mr. Lloyd
seems to be a fair individual who listens, considers the facts,
and makes sound decisions.
1:40:06 PM
GREG BRUSH informed the committee that he is a sport fisherman,
father, and Kenai River guide. Mr. Brush stated his support for
Mr. Lloyd's appointment to the position of commissioner of
ADF&G. He said he would echo the comments of Mr. Rainey and Mr.
Hanke.
1:40:33 PM
RICKY GEASE, Executive Director, Kenai River Sport Fishing
Association, Inc., related that the Kenai River Sport Fishing
Association, Inc., fully supports Mr. Lloyd's appointment to the
position of commissioner of ADF&G. He opined that Mr. Lloyd is
balanced, fair, objective, and has good management skills to
bring to the department. Furthermore, there is more to the
department than commercial fishing and sport fishing. Mr.
Lloyd, he further opined, has put together a good management
team to ensure that ADF&G is on track.
1:41:12 PM
ANDY SZCZESNY informed the committee that he and his wife have
run a fly fishing business for 22 years on the Upper Kenai
River. He noted that he knows Mr. Lloyd personally and supports
his confirmation.
1:42:15 PM
DREW SPARLIN told the committee that he has been a commercial
fishermen in the Cook Inlet for 43 years. Mr. Sparlin noted
that he has known Mr. Lloyd for 20 years and has great hope that
Mr. Lloyd can manage these fisheries with the best biology
available and place politics secondary to that. He said that
it's important for the economy of [Kenai] that [fisheries
management] is balanced. Although the aforementioned will be a
tough task, he opined that Mr. Lloyd can accomplish it.
1:43:15 PM
CO-CHAIR GATTO asked if Mr. Sparlin believes Mr. Lloyd
understands both economics and politics.
MR. SPARLIN related his belief that Mr. Lloyd understands both.
Mr. Sparlin said that although he has great faith in Mr. Lloyd,
there has to be some changes over the past.
1:44:07 PM
RICK BUCY echoed the comments of the other witnesses. He said
he has had several conversations with Mr. Lloyd and feels
comfortable with his appointment as commissioner of ADF&G. He
opined that Mr. Lloyd will bring a fair and balanced outlook to
all the various issues. In regard to the three appointees to
the Board of Fisheries, Mr. Bucy said that he supports them as
well. He related his belief that the governor did an excellent
job choosing the Board of Fisheries appointees in a manner that
brings balance to the board.
1:44:57 PM
JOHN JENSEN testified in support of Mr. Lloyd's appointment to
the position of commissioner of ADF&G. He informed the
committee that he is a commercial, sport, and subsistence
fishermen as well as a big game hunter.
1:45:59 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON highlighted that in the past, one area of
concern has been analysis and reviewing harvest for the highest
recovery of the resource for Alaskans. For the first time, the
department has provided a readable, reasonable analysis of
success in achieving salmon escapement goals in a monitored
system. The department was also able to identify a number of
issues that it will review in terms of maximizing the benefit to
Alaskans in those monitored systems. Representative Seaton
noted that there was an extensive hearing with Mr. Lloyd, with
whom he said he is personally pleased with the information that
has come forth. Therefore, Representative Seaton said that he,
too, supports the appointment of Mr. Lloyd to the position of
commissioner of ADF&G.
1:47:31 PM
CO-CHAIR GATTO emphasized the importance of the position of
commissioner of ADF&G. He then related that his conversations
with Mr. Lloyd have lead him to believe that he is sincere and
recognizes that he has to represent "the people you don't like
and the people you do like."
1:48:06 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON moved that the appointment of Mr. Denby
Lloyd to the position of commissioner of ADF&G be forwarded to a
joint session for consideration. Representative Seaton reminded
members that signing the report regarding appointments to boards
and commissions in no way reflects individual members' approval
or disapproval of the appointees, and that the nominations are
merely forwarded to the full legislature for confirmation or
rejection.
There being no objection, Mr. Lloyd's name was forwarded.
^Board of Fisheries
1:49:11 PM
CO-CHAIR GATTO announced that the next order of business would
be the confirmations of three appointees to the Board of
Fisheries: Larry Edfelt, Claude Vincent Webster, and Howard
Delo.
1:49:39 PM
LARRY EDFELT, Appointee, Board of Fisheries, informed the
committee that he is a retired ADF&G employee, where he worked
from 1963-1986. Upon retirement he started a charter fishing
business in the Juneau area. He further informed the committee
that he is a past member, 1992-1997, of the Board of Fisheries.
He explained that he is being appointed for one year to fill the
position of Rupe Andrews who recently passed away. Mr. Edfelt
related that his experience with ADF&G was primarily with the
Division of Commercial Fisheries, but he also worked for two
years each with the Division of Sport Fish, the Division of
Habitat, and the Division of Boards.
1:51:02 PM
CLAUDE VINCENT WEBSTER, Appointee, Board of Fisheries, pointed
out that his appointment is for a three-year term. He noted
that the committee should have his resume, to which he doesn't
have much to add.
1:51:47 PM
HOWARD DELO, Appointee, Board of Fisheries, informed the
committee that he didn't apply for the position, but was called
by the governor's office and asked if he would accept an
appointment to the Board of Fisheries. He then informed the
committee that he is a retired ADF&G employee, who served from
1979-1999. Mr. Delo noted that he has a Masters degree in
wildlife management from the University of Maine as well as
undergraduate degrees from the University of Alaska Fairbanks in
wildlife management/fisheries biology. He likened himself to
Mr. Lloyd in that he, too, is a sport fish guy with whom those
in the commercial fisheries have concern.
CO-CHAIR GATTO remarked that it must be quite an honor to have
the governor call and request service on a board for which he
didn't apply.
MR. DELO noted his agreement.
1:53:58 PM
MONTE ROBERTS related his support for all three appointees to
the Board of Fisheries. He opined that the governor did a good
job picking these three appointees.
1:54:15 PM
MIKE FENTON, President, Kenai River Professional Guide
Association, also related his support for all three appointees
to the Board of Fisheries. He then remarked that the past
experience of these three employees will serve the state well.
1:54:38 PM
RON RAINEY stated his support for all three of the appointees to
the Board of Fisheries.
1:55:37 PM
BILL GIFFORD, speaking as a sport fisherman, echoed support for
all three of the appointees to the Board of Fisheries. He noted
that Mr. Delo has experience in angler access, which is
extremely important to private fishermen like himself. The
aforementioned, he opined, will be an added benefit to the board
that hasn't been in the past.
1:56:03 PM
REUBEN HANKE, Owner/Operator, Harry Gnes Kenai River Fishing,
voiced support for all three appointees to the Board of
Fisheries. He opined that it's rare to have three people
nominated for the Board of Fisheries who have the background and
experience that these three have. In fact, Mr. Delo and Mr.
Webster were serving as chairman of advisory committees.
Furthermore, Mr. Edfelt has been involved in the board process
for quite some time. Therefore, these three bring a wealth of
knowledge and will do a great job.
1:57:01 PM
GREG BRUSH, speaking as a sport fisherman, father, and guide,
related his support for all three appointees to the Board of
Fisheries. He said that although he doesn't know the appointees
personally, after listening to them several times he is aware of
their extensive backgrounds and is impressed with the fact that
they would be fair and objective in the decision-making process.
1:57:53 PM
RICKY GEASE, Executive Director, Kenai River Sport Fishing
Association, Inc., pointed out that the committee should have a
written letter of support for all three appointees to the Board
of Fisheries. He informed the committee that he has personally
interviewed these appointees on a broad range of issues,
including statewide issues. Mr. Gease opined that all three
bring the proper perspective to the Board of Fisheries. That is
they place the resource and doing what's appropriate in relation
to conservation and then go from there with regard to
allocations of surplus harvest. All of the appointees have
experience with the Board of Fisheries process, and furthermore
they have the necessary experience to continue having the Board
of Fisheries on step with its management decisions.
1:59:05 PM
ANDY SZCZESNY, recalling his time as a former Board of Fisheries
member, related his support for all three appointees to the
Board of Fisheries. He opined that all Alaskans will benefit
from these appointees.
1:59:24 PM
DREW SPARLIN began by noting that he is a commercial fisherman
who serves on the Board of the Cook Inlet Aquaculture
Association and is an officer in [the Upper Cook Inlet Drift
Association] (UCIDA). Mr. Sparlin related his objection to Mr.
Delos' appointment, which is based on some of Mr. Delo's
comments concerning the need for a long fishing corridor in the
central part of the Cook Inlet. His comments clearly indicated
that Mr. Delo has very little understanding about the harvest of
fish in Cook Inlet. Therefore, Mr. Sparlin expressed hope that
Mr. Delo would open his mind to [the notion] that some of his
ideas might not be the best. Mr. Sparlin recalled that Mr.
Edfelt served on the Board of Fisheries after being appointed by
former governor Tony Knowles. He further recalled that board
was very hard on the commercial fishing industry. With regard
to Mr. Webster, Mr. Sparlin said that he doesn't know him,
although he received a good report on him from those in Bristol
Bay who thought he would be a fine appointee, and thus Mr.
Sparlin supported his appointment. Mr. Sparlin expressed
further hope that those current members of the Board of
Fisheries could take a fair look at the information and try to
rectify the problems in the Kenai, including that it has the
smallest fry, smallest smolt, and lowest population of
zooplankton and copepods in the history of sockeye biology in
the world. "We cannot continue to put that type of fish and
those numbers of fish into that system and expect them to keep
reproducing; this has to be looked at," he emphasized.
2:01:50 PM
JOHN JENSEN stated his support for all three appointees to the
Board of Fisheries. He opined that he has liked what the
appointees have said and what he has heard about them, and
therefore he said he believes they will do a good job.
2:02:16 PM
RICK BUCY, as a sports fisherman, highlighted the importance of
having a board that balances the needs of all users of the
resource. He said he was pleased that the governor chose to
appoint an individual from each of the following areas: Bristol
Bay, Southeast, and Cook Inlet. He concluded by stating his
support for all three appointees to the Board of Fisheries.
2:03:00 PM
KEVIN HOGAN informed the committee that he is a commercial
fisherman in the Upper Cook Inlet and is a fish buyer in Homer.
Mr. Hogan voiced his support for Mr. Webster, and noted that he
has concerns about the other two appointees. Mr. Hogan said
that although he respects Mr. Edfelt's intellect and past
service on the Board of Fisheries, he was a member of the board
when fisheries resources were being allocated to leisure over
livelihood. Mr. Hogan opined that those who depend on fishing
as a livelihood should have a little higher level of
representation on the Board of Fisheries. He expressed concern
with the current balance of the board and what is going on in
Cook Inlet, where he indicated [commercial fishermen] are
fighting for their way of life. Therefore, he said he is
moderately neutral on the appointment of Mr. Edfelt, and he
expressed the need to propose another appointee rather than Mr.
Delo.
2:04:54 PM
CO-CHAIR GATTO, upon determining no one else wished to testify,
closed public testimony.
2:05:11 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GUTTENBERG noted that he is an Interior fisher
not a coastal fisher. Personal use, no matter where, is
important to those in the Interior. He recalled that there used
to be a healthy commercial salmon fishery on the Yukon [River],
which is now gone. Representative Guttenberg expressed concern
that the entire perspective focuses on coastal management,
although escapement and reaching the spawning sites is a
secondary issue. He recalled an earlier comment about
livelihood over leisure, and mentioned that under state
management the big issue for him is personal use.
Representative Guttenberg wished these appointees the best and
expressed hope that when matters with the Interior arise, they
are reviewed honestly.
2:07:10 PM
CO-CHAIR GATTO noted his agreement with Representative
Guttenberg regarding the Yukon [River] as he, too, is worried
about the Yukon fishery.
2:07:55 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON began by specifying that he isn't in
opposition to sport fishing representatives, but it's
problematic if members of the board have an agenda for a user
group, no matter the agenda. He noted that the committee has a
February 14, 2007, letter from the Matanuska Valley Fish & Game
Advisory Committee, which is signed by Mr. Delo, to the
governor's office. He paraphrased from the following excerpt
from the February 14, 2007, letter:
Because lack of returning Fish Creek sockeye, there
has been no Mat-Su Valley personal fishery in over 10
years. ... Also a weak stock policy of the Yentna is
subject to a strong stock sockeye salmon escapement
policy for the Kenai River. This should not be
permitted ....
It is apparent that a significant problem exists with
the Division of Commercial Fisheries managing the
Central District commercial fisheries based on a
preseason forecast that has very little accuracy until
sufficient in-season data becomes available around the
25th of July. ...
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON expressed concern with the aforementioned
statement because discussions with the biologists illuminate
that the statement is incorrect. He related that the biologists
do an entry curve, an assessment of the bottom of Cook Inlet,
and restrictions in the central part of the district if the
salmon aren't present. Therefore, much of [the information in
the letter] is inaccurate and depicts a disregard for the
biological data used to manage the Cook Inlet fishery. He
pointed out that the letter then also says, the following:
Historically, the Central District drift fleet has
been fished according to the inaccurate preseason
forecast; and they fish in the center of Cook Inlet
where Northern District stocks move through. To
protect depressed northern bound salmon stocks, a
conservation corridor may need to be established
through the center of Cook Inlet in the Central
District during the period from July 9-25.
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON pointed out that the historic high catch
for the Central District and Cook Inlet is July 17-24.
Therefore, this letter basically suggests restricting a
commercial fishery out of where it catches its fish.
Representative Seaton expressed concern that this letter might
indicate a preconceived agenda.
2:11:40 PM
MR. DELO, to put this in context, explained that the Board of
Fisheries issued a white paper expressing its concerns regarding
the various management plans for Cook Inlet and some of the
problems the board anticipated. After circulating this white
paper, the board sought comments from the public. The Matanuska
Valley Fish & Game Advisory Committee, the Homer Fish & Game
Advisory Committee, and the Central Peninsula Fish & Game
Advisory Committee submitted comments. The two Kenai Peninsula
advisory committees submitted comments expressing concerns about
the over escapement occurring in both the Kenai and Kasilof
Rivers. They suggested possible scenarios to address the over
escapement. The Matanuska Valley Fish & Game Advisory Committee
reviewed the fact that the Northern District was experiencing
severe under escapement. The conservation corridor was
submitted merely as a talking point for a possible scenario to
address under escapement. Mr. Delo clarified that it was merely
a conversation starter, it wasn't part of an agenda. He
explained that part of the Matanuska Valley Fish & Game Advisory
Committee's concerns have arisen because the weak stock/strong
stock management policy doesn't seem to be in concert with the
sustainable management salmon policy that's part of the
regulation to be followed during the course of developing these
management scenarios. With regard to the preseason forecast, in
this white paper the Alaska Department of Fish & Game (ADF&G)
admitted concern about the accuracy of its preseason forecast.
The department acknowledged that the preseason forecast isn't as
accurate a tool as it would like to have for a management tool.
Still, much of the management strategy is based on the preseason
forecast, which is why the February 14, 2007, letter addressed
that matter. Mr. Delo then pointed out that this letter was
written as a cover to a formal response to the white paper
issued by the Board of Fisheries that was drafted by the Alaska
Outdoor Council (AOC). The [regional advisory committee]
reviewed the AOC response and felt it was representative of the
concerns held by the Northern District and there was a unanimous
vote to support the response to the white paper.
2:15:11 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON asked Mr. Delo if he is committed to
working with the management biologists and looking at the
management data, including the entry curve of fish to Cook Inlet
instead of preseason forecast.
MR. DELO specified that his number one interest is looking out
for the welfare of the resource itself and returning all the
stocks to a healthy condition. The aforementioned, he opined,
can only be achieved by using the best biological data available
as developed and used by ADF&G biologists, along with input from
the various user groups. Mr. Delo further opined that there
must be a balanced, "Big Picture" approach. The overall welfare
of the resource must be reviewed and then the resource should be
managed based on the best possible and available techniques.
2:16:42 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON posed a scenario in which the data on the
large escapement goals of the Kenai River find small amounts of
feed and small fry with a likely low survival rate. He asked if
in such a scenario, Mr. Delo would review adjusting the
escapement goals in order to maintain the healthiest biological
condition in the streams and lake.
2:17:28 PM
MR. DELO said that he would prefer to look at the concrete
biological data of things that have occurred, not those that
"probably will" occur. He furthered that he would prefer to see
hard data prior to committing to any management scheme. If
there is a size relationship that does result in a reduced
return, then there should be data that the level of fish in the
system was more than what the system could accommodate. He said
he isn't aware that such has occurred at this point.
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON clarified that he wasn't seeking a
commitment on a particular management scheme. However, he said
he is interested in whether Mr. Delo would be looking at that
particular type of data and whether he would be willing to
address the problem.
MR. DELO said that if there is concern from the biologists about
the size of the fish and the amount of zooplankton and copepods
available, then it would definitely warrant being watched.
Furthermore, he said he would be amenable to adjusting the
management scheme according to the results the biologists
developed as a result of having the follow-up data.
2:19:19 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GUTTENBERG noted that the committee has been
provided with a copy of an editorial written by Mr. Delo, for
which Representative Guttenberg thanked him. He characterized
the editorial as "right on."
2:19:48 PM
REPRESENTATIVE WILSON moved that the committee forward the names
of Larry Edfelt, Vince Webster, and Howard Delo, appointees to
the Board of Fisheries, to the full body for consideration in
joint session. Representative Wilson reminded members that
signing the reports regarding appointments to boards and
commissions in no way reflects individual members' approval or
disapproval of the appointees, and that the nominations are
merely forwarded to the full legislature for confirmation or
rejection. There being no objection, the aforementioned names
were forwarded.
HJR 12-ENDORSING ANWR LEASING
2:20:45 PM
CO-CHAIR GATTO announced that the next order of business would
be HOUSE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 12, Urging the United States
Congress to pass legislation to open the coastal plain of the
Arctic National Wildlife Refuge to oil and gas exploration,
development, and production. [Before the committee is CSHJR
12(O&G).]
2:21:25 PM
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON, speaking as the sponsor of HJR 12, explained
that this resolution encouraging the opening of the coastal
plain of the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge (ANWR) to drilling.
However, HJR 12 takes a bit of a different approach as it takes
into consideration some of the environmental concerns that are
real. For example, the resolution encourages directional
drilling and a minimal footprint. The resolution also
encourages that [any activity] pay attention to the environment,
particularly the Porcupine Caribou herd. Co-Chair Johnson
encouraged the committee to forward this resolution.
2:23:00 PM
CO-CHAIR GATTO asked if there was any public testimony. [No one
stated interest in testifying.]
2:23:06 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON moved to report CSHJR 12(O&G) out of
committee with individual recommendations and the accompanying
zero fiscal notes.
2:23:22 PM
REPRESENTATIVE KOHRING objected for discussion purposes. He
then related his strong support for HJR 12, even in light of
current events. He commended the sponsor for "keeping the flame
alive" and then withdrew his objection.
2:23:47 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GUTTENBERG referred to page 3, lines 4-5, which
read:
WHEREAS the oil industry has shown at Prudhoe Bay, as
well as at other locations along the Arctic coastal
plain, that it is capable of conducting oil and gas
activity without adversely affecting the environment
or wildlife populations;
REPRESENTATIVE GUTTENBERG related his belief that the oil
industry is capable of doing the aforementioned and he wished
the industry would do so.
2:24:11 PM
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON commented that if Alaskans forget about ANWR,
it won't be long before it's totally forgotten. Therefore, he
related the need to continue to "squeak."
2:25:17 PM
There being no further objection, CSHJR 12(O&G) was reported
from the House Resources Standing Committee.
HB 15-BOARD OF FISHERIES CONFLICTS OF INTEREST
2:25:30 PM
CO-CHAIR GATTO announced that the final order of business would
be HOUSE BILL NO. 15, "An Act relating to participation in
matters before the Board of Fisheries by members of the board;
and providing for an effective date." [Before the committee was
CSHB 15(FSH).]
2:26:27 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON, speaking as the sponsor of HB 15,
explained that HB 15 better allows members of the Board of
Fisheries to perform their duty and represent Alaskans. Under
this legislation, members of the Board of Fisheries who
participate in the sport or commercial fishery or have immediate
family members who do so are allowed to participate but not vote
on related matters before the board. He noted that [under HB
15] the definition of "immediate family member" is defined as
those [family members] living in the household of the Board of
Fisheries member. This has been problematic, particularly in
rural Alaska where there is such a wide interconnected family
relationship. The previous definition of "family" included
aunts, uncles, and step children whether they resided in the
household or not. Therefore, in areas where fishing is the
predominant activity in the region, the member from that region
was likely to be conflicted out and couldn't participate and
vote. This legislation doesn't allow those members of the Board
of Fisheries to vote on matters that in which they or family
members living in their household have a financial interest.
2:29:03 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON noted that the committee packet should
include an amendment that addresses the fiscal note from the
Department of Law (DOL). The DOL said that the location of the
definition of "immediate family" would only apply to Board of
Fisheries members who participated in the fishery, but not board
members who had a relative that was financially connected to the
industry. Therefore, the amendment specifies a new
applicability section so that the definition of "immediate
family" would apply to all members of the Board of Fisheries.
Furthermore, it's very clear as it sets out this definition in
Title 39. Representative Seaton clarified that the amendment
doesn't change the intent of HB 15, but rather specifies that it
applies to all members of the Board of Fisheries not just those
with a participatory interest.
2:30:35 PM
CO-CHAIR GATTO moved that the committee adopt Amendment 1,
labeled 25-LS0114\M.1, Kane, 4/27/07, which read:
Page 1, line 2, following "board":
Insert "and to the definition of 'immediate
family member' under the Alaska Executive Branch
Ethics Act as that Act applies to members of the Board
of Fisheries;"
Page 2, lines 4 - 5:
Delete "In this subsection, "immediate family"
has the meaning given in AS 24.60.990."
Page 2, following line 5:
Insert a new bill section to read:
"* Sec. 3. AS 39.52 is amended by adding a new
section to read:
Sec. 39.52.915. Applicability to the Board of
Fisheries. Notwithstanding any other provision of this
chapter, with respect to the application of this
chapter to a member of the Board of Fisheries,
"immediate family member" means
(1) the spouse or domestic partner of the
member; or
(2) a parent, child, including a stepchild
and an adoptive child, or sibling of the member if the
parent, child, or sibling resides with the member, is
financially dependent on the member, or shares a
substantial financial interest with the member."
Renumber the following bill sections accordingly.
Page 2, line 14:
Delete "sec. 6"
Insert "sec. 7"
Page 2, line 16:
Delete "Section 3"
Insert "Section 4"
2:30:45 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GUTTENBERG objected, but subsequently withdrew
his objection.
2:31:06 PM
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON objected in order to see what is being deleted
by Amendment 1.
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON clarified that Amendment 1 deletes the
reference to the definition of "immediate family" in AS
24.60.990, which is a different chapter. This amendment then
inserts the actual definition [of "immediate family"] in AS
39.52, the Board of Fisheries statutes.
2:32:44 PM
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON withdrew his objection.
2:32:47 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GUTTENBERG turned attention to page 2, line 4, of
HB 15 and inquired as to whether the term "may" is the same as
"shall" in this case.
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON explained that "shall" and "may not" are
both a permissive determiner.
2:33:25 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GUTTENBERG, referring to page 2, line 6, then
inquired as to what is AS 39.52.120(f), which is being repealed.
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON explained, "We've got a repealer here and
that reinstates the current language so that it sunsets it."
Therefore, this is basically sunset language. In further
explanation, Representative Seaton explained that AS
39.52.120(f) is the new definition section where the definition
is applied to the Board of Fisheries. On June 30, 2011, this
definition is repealed and it will return to the definition the
Board of Fisheries currently uses.
2:35:42 PM
CO-CHAIR GATTO inquired as to who determines that a conflict
exists.
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON answered that the chair of the Board of
Fisheries makes that determination.
2:35:57 PM
REPRESENTATIVE KAWASAKI inquired as to what happens if the chair
of the Board of Fisheries has the conflict.
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON said that it's similar to what occurs in
legislative committees in that the chair can pass the gavel to
the vice chair. Furthermore, the board can vote to override the
ruling of the chair. He noted that anyone can make a motion
regarding a conflict.
2:36:29 PM
CO-CHAIR GATTO asked if there was any further objection. There
being no further objection, Amendment 1 was adopted.
2:37:05 PM
STEVEN DAUGHERTY, Assistant Attorney General, Natural Resources
Section, Civil Division (Anchorage), Department of Law, said
that although he hasn't seen the amendment language, he has been
working with the sponsor's staff and it sounds like it would
address all the legal issues. There may be some policy issues,
he remarked. He related his understanding that the intent is to
make the legislative definition of "immediate family" apply to
the Board of Fisheries for all purposes. The prior language
would have accepted the close family, but didn't provide an
exception for more distant family.
2:38:15 PM
ROD ARNO, Executive Director, Alaska Outdoor Council (AOC),
related that legitimizing all government processes is important
to AOC, which wants to ensure that the board process doesn't
have the appearance of conflict. Therefore, AOC opposes the
passage of HB 15 at this time.
2:39:19 PM
JIM MARCOTTE, Executive Director, Board of Fisheries, Boards
Support Section, Alaska Department of Fish & Game (ADF&G),
addressed the approach the Board of Fisheries uses for the
conflict of interest disclosures. He explained that prior to
each of the regulatory meetings, the board members will go
through the proposals up for discussion at the meeting. A list
of proposals to which there will be conflicts is compiled. At
the beginning of the meeting, the chair calls on each of the
board members and the chair will pass the [gavel] to the vice
chair for purposes of the chair disclosing.
2:40:21 PM
MR. MARCOTTE, in response to Co-Chair Gatto, clarified that it's
the responsibility of the board members to identify when there
is a potential conflict. He pointed out that there is a
guideline that is followed such that the member describes
his/her income sources, lists any personal or financial interest
that he/she or family members may have as well as any fishing
businesses, and they'll identify any personal or financial
interest that he/she or family members may have with any of the
proposals/issues before the board at the meeting. Anything in
the gray area [of conflicts] is discussed by the board. The
chair will invite questions from fellow board members, sometimes
there will be discussion about potential conflicts. Based on
that discussion, the chair will make a ruling. As
Representative Seaton mentioned, that ruling of the chair is
subject to being overruled by the body as a whole. The
aforementioned occurs about once a year, he related. When board
members are found to have a conflict with any given proposal,
they do not participate in the committee process, the
deliberations, or the voting of that proposal. He noted that
each quarter Mr. Marcotte files a report on that to DOL's
ethic's attorney.
2:42:43 PM
MR. MARCOTTE highlighted that the Board of Fisheries is on a
three-year cycle and addresses fisheries in various geographic
regions of the state once every three years. Each year
approximately 10 percent of the proposals before the board have
been subject to a conflict, although the rate has varied from 3-
20 percent as measured by the number of proposals. Typically,
conflicts occur during regional meetings when a board member
actively participates in one or more of the fisheries in that
region.
2:43:30 PM
REPRESENTATIVE EDGMON related his understanding that when a
member has a conflict, he/she can't participate or vote. The
member with the conflict doesn't sit with the body and must sit
in the audience as a member of the general public during the
proposal with which there is a conflict.
MR. MARCOTTE said that's correct. A good example would be with
board member John Jensen, who is an active fisher from
Petersburg, when the board is having a Southeast regional
meeting. Rarely would more than one board member have a
conflict because of the diverse background of the board members,
he stated. Mr. Marcotte directed attention to tables 1-6 in the
summary of proposals over the last six years titled "Summary of
Board of Fisheries Vote Abstentions (2001-2006)." Table 7
provides a summary over the six-year period. Since October
2001, the Board of Fisheries has addressed a total of 2,458
proposals of which 253 were subject to board member recusals.
Therefore, in a typical year that amounts to about 410 proposals
of which 42 would be subject to recusals or a conflict. The
aforementioned results in an overall rate of 10.3 percent.
Table 8 provides the same information over the same time, but
it's per board member rather than per meeting. He noted that
for seven of the board members it's an incomplete term, and thus
the study period represents only a portion of their overall
voting record.
2:46:02 PM
MR. MARCOTTE told the committee that the Board of Fisheries &
ADF&G have not taken an official position on HB 15.
2:46:33 PM
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES asked if Mr. Marcotte viewed HB 15 as
working in favor of or against Mr. Marcotte's ability to do the
job necessary on the board.
MR. MARCOTTE said that he doesn't have a position as there are
pros and cons. He characterized it as a judgment call with
regard to how the board functions in light of the public's
perception of fairness. On any given day, depending on how a
vote goes, some interest group might feel the process was
compromised. The aforementioned would occur, no matter the
guidelines, he opined.
2:47:31 PM
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES asked if the conflicts that Mr. Marcotte
has observed have arisen mainly as a result of the geographic
area for which they serve or the broad definition of "immediate
family."
MR. MARCOTTE pointed out that the current version [of HB 15]
makes two significant changes. One such change is that it
allows the board members to participate in the deliberations,
but not the voting [when he/she has a conflict]. The narrowing
of the definition of family is also a substantive change.
During the House Special Committee on Fisheries meeting it was
pointed out that often members will have many extended family
members involved with fisheries if sons and daughters with
fishing permits in other households are included. Therefore,
having a more narrow definition of family will make a
substantial difference in the number of conflicts before the
board.
2:49:32 PM
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON noted he also sits on the House Special
Committee on Fisheries. He informed the committee that when the
legislation was first before the House Special Committee on
Fisheries, it removed all conflicts of interest. Therefore,
this current legislation represents a compromise. Co-Chair
Johnson expressed concern if HB 15 returned to the original
version once leaving this committee. He noted that the sponsor
has assured him that the aforementioned won't happen, and if it
does he wouldn't advance the legislation.
2:51:54 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON clarified that he fully supports the
amendments made in the House Special Committee on Fisheries. He
said that [CSHB 15(FSH)] wasn't really a compromise, but rather
a discussion as to how best to meet the goal of maintaining a
high ethical standard while allowing the people of Alaska to
effectively participate in the management of the fish resource.
Representative Seaton said that he fully supports the existing
version of HB 15 and wouldn't support returning to the previous
[original] version.
2:53:08 PM
REPRESENTATIVE WILSON highlighted the importance of realizing
that all legislation that leaves the committee is subject to
change. In reviewing the data provided, it seems that those
with expertise in a particular area aren't allowed to provide
that expertise, which is important because they may be the only
ones with expertise on a particular subject.
2:54:28 PM
REPRESENTATIVE EDGMON noted that he also sits on the House
Special Committee on Fisheries, and stated that the legislation
before this committee does get the job done. He also noted that
all three of the appointees to the Board of Fisheries were on
the record as basically supporting the notion encompassed in
this legislation. He, too, stated his agreement with previous
speakers that this legislation needs to move forward as
currently written [and amended].
2:55:08 PM
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON clarified that his use of the term "compromise"
wasn't meant to impugn anyone.
2:55:30 PM
REPRESENTATIVE EDGMON opined that [CSHB 15(FSH)] was a
compromise, and a good one at that.
2:55:40 PM
REPRESENTATIVE EDGMON moved to report CSHB 15(FSH), as amended,
out of committee with individual recommendations and the
accompanying fiscal notes. There being no objection, CSHB
15(RES) was reported from the House Resources Standing
Committee.
2:55:59 PM
ADJOURNMENT
There being no further business before the committee, the House
Resources Standing Committee meeting was adjourned at 2.56 p.m.
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