03/24/2006 01:00 PM House RESOURCES
| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| HB57 | |
| SB55 | |
| Adjourn |
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| *+ | HB 57 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | SB 55 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | TELECONFERENCED |
ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE
HOUSE RESOURCES STANDING COMMITTEE
March 24, 2006
1:07 p.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Representative Jay Ramras, Co-Chair
Representative Ralph Samuels, Co-Chair
Representative Jim Elkins
Representative Gabrielle LeDoux
Representative Paul Seaton
Representative Harry Crawford
Representative Mary Kapsner
MEMBERS ABSENT
Representative Carl Gatto
Representative Kurt Olson
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
SPONSOR SUBSTITUTE FOR HOUSE BILL NO. 57
"An Act relating to the sale of certain state land to adjacent
landowners."
- MOVED SSHB 57 OUT OF COMMITTEE
CS FOR SENATE BILL NO. 55(FIN)
"An Act instructing the commissioner of natural resources to
issue a patent for the remaining interest in certain state land
to the owner of the agricultural rights to that land."
- MOVED CSSB 55(FIN) OUT OF COMMITTEE
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION
BILL: HB 57
SHORT TITLE: SALE OF STATE LAND TO ADJACENT LANDOWNERS
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) WEYHRAUCH
01/10/05 (H) PREFILE RELEASED 1/7/05
01/10/05 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
01/10/05 (H) RES, FIN
02/10/06 (H) SPONSOR SUBSTITUTE INTRODUCED
02/10/06 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
02/10/06 (H) RES, FIN
03/24/06 (H) RES AT 1:00 PM CAPITOL 124
BILL: SB 55
SHORT TITLE: AGRICULTURAL LAND
SPONSOR(s): SENATOR(s) WAGONER
01/14/05 (S) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
01/14/05 (S) RES, FIN
02/02/05 (S) RES AT 3:30 PM BUTROVICH 205
02/02/05 (S) Moved SB 55 Out of Committee
02/02/05 (S) MINUTE(RES)
02/04/05 (S) RES RPT 5DP
02/04/05 (S) DP: WAGONER, ELTON, STEVENS B, SEEKINS,
DYSON
01/17/06 (S) FIN AT 9:00 AM SENATE FINANCE 532
01/17/06 (S) Heard & Held
01/17/06 (S) MINUTE(FIN)
01/19/06 (S) FIN RPT CS 5DP SAME
TITLE
01/19/06 (S) DP: WILKEN, GREEN, OLSON, DYSON,
STEDMAN
01/19/06 (S) FIN AT 9:00 AM SENATE FINANCE 532
01/19/06 (S) Moved CSSB 55(FIN) Out of Committee
01/19/06 (S) MINUTE(FIN)
02/08/06 (S) TRANSMITTED TO (H)
02/08/06 (S) VERSION: CSSB 55(FIN)
02/10/06 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
02/10/06 (H) RES, FIN
03/24/06 (H) RES AT 1:00 PM CAPITOL 124
WITNESS REGISTER
REPRESENTATIVE BRUCE WEYHRAUCH
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Presented SSHB 57 as sponsor.
DICK MYLIUS, Director
Division of Mining, Land and Water
Department of Natural Resources
POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions regarding SSHB 57 and SB
55.
JOHN SCHNABEL, landowner
Haines, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of SSHB 57.
AMY SEITZ, Staff
to Senator Tom Wagoner
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Presented SB 55 on behalf of Senator
Wagoner, sponsor.
FRANK MILLER, landowner
Hope, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of SB 55.
CHUCK GRAHAM, landowner
Hope, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Speaking on behalf of himself and his wife,
Linda Graham, testified in support of SB 55.
ERICA MILLER, landowner
Hope, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of SB 55.
DOUGLAS VOLLMAN
Copper Center, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of the Millers getting
the land made available in SB 55, but warned legislators about
unintended consequences.
ACTION NARRATIVE
CO-CHAIR JAY RAMRAS called the House Resources Standing
Committee meeting to order at 1:07:01 PM. Representatives
Ramras, Samuels, Elkins, Seaton, and Crawford were present at
the call to order. Representatives Kapsner and LeDoux arrived
as the meeting was in process. Representative Bill Thomas was
also present.
The committee took an at-ease from 1:07 p.m. to 1:09 p.m.
HB 57-SALE OF STATE LAND TO ADJACENT LANDOWNERS
1:09:30 PM
CO-CHAIR RAMRAS announced that the first order of business would
be SPONSOR SUBSTITUTE FOR HOUSE BILL NO. 57, "An Act relating to
the sale of certain state land to adjacent landowners."
REPRESENTATIVE BRUCE WEYHRAUCH, Alaska State Legislature,
sponsor, informed the committee that SSHB 57 was introduced to
spur the State of Alaska to purchase more federal land from the
federal government. However, information from the Department of
Law and the Department of Natural Resources made moot the
purpose of the bill. Still, the legislation came to the
attention of Mr. Schnabel who owns a gold mine in the Haines
area. Essentially, SSHB 57 will help Mr. Schnabel to proceed
with his operation while the state would receive fair market
value for the land.
1:12:47 PM
REPRESENTATIVE ELKINS commented that although SSHB 57 may appear
to be special legislation, it might help someone else in the
future.
1:13:14 PM
REPRESENTATIVE CRAWFORD opined that the problem with special
interest legislation is that it provides an advantage to someone
to the disadvantage of someone else. Although SSHB 57 only
applies to one individual at this point, it doesn't disadvantage
anyone else. Therefore, Representative Crawford said that he
didn't view SSHB 57 as special interest legislation.
Representative Crawford further opined that Mr. Schnabel should
be able to purchase the property he is working.
1:14:20 PM
REPRESENTATIVE CRAWFORD asked if there are any ways that what
SSHB 57 proposes could be abused.
REPRESENTATIVE WEYHRAUCH said he didn't know.
1:14:43 PM
DICK MYLIUS, Director, Division of Mining, Land and Water,
Department of Natural Resources, said he has worked with the
sponsor on SSHB 57. He explained that the route taken by the
legislation was chosen to address Mr. Schnabel's situation
because Mr. Schnabel expressed interest in purchasing a parcel
of land that the state couldn't sell to him under existing law.
Mr. Mylius explained that in most instances when state land is
sold, it's through a competitive process that provides all
Alaskans an equal chance to purchase it. However, this parcel
has two problems with offering it to the general public. First,
the land is totally surrounded by land owned by Mr. Schnabel and
thus there is no legal access to the parcel. Second, there are
mining claims under the property, and if the parcel were sold a
split estate situation would result. The aforementioned is
generally avoided. Therefore, SSHB 57 allows the land to be
sold under a preference rights sale, which allows DNR to offer
the land to one individual due to that individual's specific
interest in the land. Mr. Mylius opined that the situation SSHB
57 addresses could theoretically apply to other situations
because state land surrounded by land owned by one individual is
of very little value to the public and that state land can't be
sold through the state's regular sale programs without access to
the land. Mr. Mylius concluded by characterizing SSHB 57 as a
good solution.
1:17:16 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON asked if the access issue will be
considered in the fair market value.
MR. MYLIUS said an appraiser will review the value of
surrounding lands, although the appraiser will likely reduce the
value of land such as Mr. Schnabel's because of the lack of
legal access. He said that the value would be determined
through a fair market appraisal.
1:18:17 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON asked if there are other state parcels in
a similar situation.
MR. MYLIUS said that although he doesn't know of specific
parcels, he said he is sure such parcels exist. Mr. Mylius said
this situation is unusual because the state acquired this parcel
under the 1959 state law requiring people to register their
parcels and if they didn't, then the state foreclosed on the
parcel. The parcel under discussion is a foreclosed mining
claim.
1:19:24 PM
JOHN SCHNABEL, landowner, informed the committee that he wants
to purchase the 13 acres of land without an outcry auction
because anyone can bid for a parcel of land that he has elected
to lease or purchase without having to pay the upfront costs for
the survey, legal research, advertising, title insurance, et
cetera. He further informed the committee that he is in the
process of developing the 80 acres he owns that surrounds the
state's parcel into a tourist destination. Mr. Schnabel related
that to date he has invested over $1 million and he needs the
state's parcel in order to avoid future conflict. He mentioned
that he has no problem complying with the R.S. 2477 [easement].
He concluded by expressing his hope that the legislature could
make it possible to transfer the land this year.
1:21:17 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON asked if the R.S. 2477 easement is
something that the department normally ensures occurs during the
transfer of state lands.
MR. MYLIUS replied yes. He clarified that if it's determined
that there is a R.S. 2477 easement, then the desire would be to
reserve it for the State of Alaska. In further response to
Representative Seaton, Mr. Mylius confirmed that conditions to
that effect could be attached to the sale.
REPRESENTATIVE ELKINS moved to report SSHB 57 out of committee
with individual recommendations and the accompanying fiscal
notes. Hearing no objection, SSHB 57 was passed out of the
House Resources Standing Committee.
SB 55-AGRICULTURAL LAND
CO-CHAIR SAMUELS announced that the final order of business
would be CS FOR SENATE BILL NO. 55(FIN), "An Act instructing the
commissioner of natural resources to issue a patent for the
remaining interest in certain state land to the owner of the
agricultural rights to that land."
1:23:29 PM
AMY SEITZ, Staff to Senator Tom Wagoner, Alaska State
Legislature, speaking on behalf of the sponsor, pointed out that
CSSB 55(FIN) is similar to SSHB 57 in that it gives the
commissioner of the Department of Natural Resources (DNR) the
authority to transfer rights to certain parcels. The three
requirements the property has to meet are as follows: it has to
be no more than 15 acres; the state had to have originally
acquired the land through the Alaska Statehood Act for purposes
of community expansion; and the owner of the agricultural rights
has to pay the fair market value. A 15-acre parcel in Hope, to
which the Ross Miller family has the agricultural rights, meets
these requirements. Ms. Seitz related that the Ross Miller
family homesteaded in Hope before statehood and had 27 acres of
their own as well as 15 acres that were leased from the state
for pasture land. During the 1964 earthquake, several of the
family's own acreage fell into the Turnagain Arm and the family
was compensated with one acre through the Earthquake Exchange
Program. The state did not think that was fair, and therefore
turned over the agricultural rights of the 15 acres to the Ross
Miller family. Since that time, the family has attempted to
purchase the remaining rights, which the state wants to sell to
the family. However, the state cannot do so without a statutory
change, which is what SB 55 accomplishes.
1:25:33 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON asked if there are any R.S. 2477 easements
through the property.
MS. SEITZ said that she did not know.
1:26:00 PM
DICK MYLIUS, Director, Division of Mining, Land and Water,
Department of Natural Resources, noted his agreement that SB 55
is similar to SSHB 57 in that it's a parcel that the state would
like to sell, but cannot under existing law. Mr. Mylius noted
that SB 55 was narrowly crafted to apply to the situation in
Hope, although it may also apply to a few parcels in Gustavus.
However, the legislation would not apply to other agricultural
parcels. In response to Representative Seaton's earlier
question, Mr. Mylius confirmed that there are no R.S. 2477
[easements] through this parcel, although the parcel does front
a road with an existing right-of-way.
1:27:28 PM
CO-CHAIR SAMUELS asked if the language on page 1, line 9,
regarding issuing a patent is legal ease that means "to sell
it."
MR. MYLIUS said that it's the department's intention to sell the
parcel at fair market value.
1:28:00 PM
FRANK MILLER informed the committee that he is the son of Ross
Miller, the original homesteader, and he and his sister, Linda
Graham, co-own the agricultural rights to the aforementioned
acreage. He further informed the committee that he and his
sister have been working for a number of years to try to resolve
the situation to make the land fee simple. This bill would
solve the problem and bring closure to this difficult situation,
he said.
1:28:56 PM
CHUCK GRAHAM, speaking on behalf of his wife Linda Graham,
related that the two strongly support the bill, as it seems to
be the only means to resolve this problem.
ERICA MILLER, Ross Miller's granddaughter, related her strong
support for SB 55. She said she didn't want to wait another
year for full rights to the property.
1:31:06 PM
DOUGLAS VOLLMAN informed the committee that he is involved with
the agricultural community in Copper Center. Although Mr.
Vollman said that he didn't oppose SB 55, he cautioned that the
bill could open up the door for transferring other agricultural
rights. He then inquired as to how the department will
determine the fair market value. He emphasized that he supports
the Miller family and its attempt to obtain the patent to the
land. However, he reiterated concern with regard to the legal
aspects of doing this legislation and others with agricultural
rights wanting their conveyance or the elimination of the
agricultural restrictions.
1:32:47 PM
CO-CHAIR RAMRAS relayed that Mr. Mylius, in relation to SSHB 57,
testified that in order to determine the fair market value of a
property, an appraiser would be hired to determine the fair
market value. Furthermore, the bill was written by the
Department of Law, and is presumed legal until such time as
there is a court challenge.
CO-CHAIR RAMRAS closed public testimony.
1:33:21 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON noted that the legal opinion from
Legislative Legal Services states that the bill is constructed
as a law of general application. Any other person who falls
under similar circumstances would be entitled to the same
provisions, and therefore this is not special legislation.
1:33:53 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON moved to report CSSB 55(FIN) out of
committee with individual recommendations and the accompanying
fiscal notes. Hearing no objections, it was so ordered.
ADJOURNMENT
There being no further business before the committee, the House
Resources Standing Committee meeting was adjourned at 1:34:46
PM.
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