Legislature(2017 - 2018)BARNES 124

01/22/2018 01:00 PM RESOURCES

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Audio Topic
01:03:21 PM Start
01:04:11 PM HB288
02:15:07 PM Adjourn
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
Heard & Held
-- Testimony <Invitation Only> --
**Streamed live on AKL.tv**
                    ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE                                                                                  
               HOUSE RESOURCES STANDING COMMITTEE                                                                             
                        January 22, 2018                                                                                        
                           1:03 p.m.                                                                                            
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                                                               
Representative Andy Josephson, Co-Chair                                                                                         
Representative Geran Tarr, Co-Chair                                                                                             
Representative Harriet Drummond                                                                                                 
Representative Justin Parish                                                                                                    
Representative Chris Birch                                                                                                      
Representative DeLena Johnson                                                                                                   
Representative George Rauscher                                                                                                  
Representative David Talerico                                                                                                   
Representative Chris Tuck (alternate)                                                                                           
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                                                                
Representative Mike Chenault (alternate)                                                                                        
OTHER LEGISLATORS PRESENT                                                                                                     
Representative Paul Seaton                                                                                                      
COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                                                                            
HOUSE BILL NO. 288                                                                                                              
"An Act relating to the minimum tax imposed on oil and gas                                                                      
produced from leases or properties that include land north of 68                                                                
degrees North latitude; and providing for an effective date."                                                                   
     - HEARD & HELD                                                                                                             
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION                                                                                                     
BILL: HB 288                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: OIL AND GAS PRODUCTION TAX                                                                                         
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) TARR                                                                                              
01/16/18       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
01/16/18       (H)       RES, FIN                                                                                               
01/22/18       (H)       RES AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
WITNESS REGISTER                                                                                                              
No witnesses to report                                                                                                          
ACTION NARRATIVE                                                                                                              
1:03:21 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR  ANDY  JOSEPHSON  called the  House  Resources  Standing                                                             
Committee  meeting  to  order  at   1:03  p.m.    Representatives                                                               
Josephson, Birch,  Parish, Talerico, Rauscher,  Tuck (alternate),                                                               
Johnson, Drummond,  and Tarr were  present at the call  to order.                                                               
Also present was Representative Seaton.                                                                                         
               HB 288-OIL AND GAS PRODUCTION TAX                                                                            
1:04:11 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR  JOSEPHSON announced  that  the only  order of  business                                                               
would be HOUSE BILL NO. 288,  "An Act relating to the minimum tax                                                               
imposed on  oil and gas  produced from leases or  properties that                                                               
include land  north of 68  degrees North latitude;  and providing                                                               
for an effective date."                                                                                                         
1:04:40 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR TARR informed the committee  HB 288, in a manner similar                                                               
to other proposed  legislation, is before its  first committee of                                                               
referral and many changes will be  made as the bill is discussed.                                                               
She  directed attention  to a  PowerPoint presentation  entitled,                                                               
"House Bill  288 Fairness in  Oil Taxes," [undated]  and recalled                                                               
the  House majority  coalition announced  last session  there are                                                               
four pillars to its [fiscal plan]:   strategic cuts; oil tax fix;                                                               
broad-based  measure; percent  of Market  Value (POMV)  [from the                                                               
Earnings  Reserve Account  of the  Alaska Permanent  Fund] (slide                                                               
2).  She recalled the plan began  [in 2017] with a major tax fix,                                                               
which was the removal of the  cash credit system.  Further, House                                                               
Bill  111  [passed in  the  Thirtieth  Alaska State  Legislature]                                                               
created  a bicameral/bipartisan  working  group,  which seeks  to                                                               
continue working on oil tax structure.                                                                                          
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHNSON  urged  for  the  aforementioned  working                                                               
group   to   make    recommendations   regarding   the   proposed                                                               
1:08:37 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR  TARR   directed  attention  to  slide   3,  noting  the                                                               
fundamentals of  the current  oil tax  structure remain  in place                                                               
[within HB 288]  including the 35 percent tax base  rate, the per                                                               
barrel credit,  the gross value  reduction, the minimum  tax, and                                                               
the  lease expenditure  deductions.   She  pointed  out [HB  288]                                                               
would  change  one  calculation  for the  minimum  tax,  but  the                                                               
working  group  will  focus  on   the  fundamental  structure  of                                                               
Alaska's  oil tax  because  [legislative]  consultants have  made                                                               
recommendations  to improve  the  fundamental  oil tax  structure                                                               
(slide  4).   For example,  consultants  have noted  the oil  tax                                                               
functions as  both a  gross and net  profits tax;  she attributed                                                               
the  decision to  choose the  system  enacted by  Senate Bill  21                                                               
[passed  in the  Twenty-Eighth Alaska  State Legislature]  to the                                                               
price of oil at that time, which  was $100 per barrel.  Since the                                                               
enactment of  Senate Bill 21,  when oil  is at lower  prices, the                                                               
state's tax structure  functions as a gross tax,  and when prices                                                               
are higher  it functions as  a net  profits tax.   Currently, the                                                               
tax structure is functioning as a  gross tax, and she opined [the                                                               
minimum tax] should be between  10 percent and 18 percent instead                                                               
of 4  percent.  Another challenge  with the current system  is it                                                               
has components  of both  a severance tax  and a  corporate income                                                               
tax and  she explained that  a severance  tax is applied  once to                                                               
the value  of a nonrenewable resource;  however, corporate income                                                               
tax allows oil companies to deduct  for the same expenses in both                                                               
severance and corporate income taxes.   Co-Chair Tarr advised the                                                               
working group will discuss a  severance tax, carryforward losses,                                                               
and other components  more typical of corporate income  taxes.  A                                                               
third  challenge to  the existing  system is  there are  too many                                                               
components  linked  to  price  - for  example,  oil  prices  have                                                               
fluctuated by $25 to $50 in  one year - and consultants suggested                                                               
a more  appropriate link  is to the  production tax  value (PTV).                                                               
Finally, the present  system is too complicated, and  she gave an                                                               
example.  Co-Tarr stressed understanding  oil tax revenue will be                                                               
integral to Alaska's budget for the foreseeable future.                                                                         
1:14:42 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR TARR continued to slide  5 and acknowledged at this time                                                               
the state  has heard  lots of good  news related  to exploration,                                                               
new development,  the National Petroleum  Reserve-Alaska (NPR-A),                                                               
and lease  sales, but  there are  looming budget  deficit issues.                                                               
She advised the announcements of  good news should be followed by                                                               
three questions:   How much  profit per barrel, how  many barrels                                                               
total, and how  much revenue would there be to  the state? (slide                                                               
6).  She  reviewed the current tax structure  on expenditures and                                                               
costs  -  at oil  prices  ranging  from  $40-$140 per  barrel  of                                                               
taxable oil -  and identified each component at a  $60 per barrel                                                               
oil  price (slide  7).    She opined  the  impact  of per  barrel                                                               
credits at lower  oil prices was not discussed  during the debate                                                               
on Senate  Bill 21:  the  net tax [at  $60 per barrel of  oil] is                                                               
1:18:54 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE BIRCH  pointed out  revenue from royalty  share is                                                               
not  reflected  on  [slide  7];  in fact,  if  there  is  no  oil                                                               
production, the state  does not receive any  royalty revenue, and                                                               
if  revenue  from royalty  is  not  considered,  [slide 7]  is  a                                                               
misrepresentation of the overall  state revenues that are derived                                                               
from increased production.                                                                                                      
1:20:12 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR  TARR said  information on  revenue from  royalty shares                                                               
will be reflected  on upcoming slide 9.  She  observed one of the                                                               
challenges to  interpreting data is all  companies differ related                                                               
to  expenses  and  operations and  Department  of  Revenue  (DOR)                                                               
aggregate data  is based on  averages, thus "it doesn't  tell the                                                               
full story."   She noted a consultant recommended  looking at the                                                               
tax as  a percentage of PTV,  not as a percentage  of gross value                                                               
at the  point of production (GVPP)  or as a percentage  of price.                                                               
This  would be  a  true  net profits  tax  system with  allowable                                                               
expenses deducted before the tax  is applied, and would result in                                                               
the   current   effective  rate   of   10   percent  (slide   7).                                                               
Representative Tarr  opined a  10 percent tax  is not  working in                                                               
Alaska's favor,  and there  are lessons to  be learned  about the                                                               
volatility of  oil prices.   She directed  attention to  slide 8,                                                               
which illustrated state oil tax  revenue, using 20,000 barrels as                                                               
an  example; this  amount was  used  in the  example because  the                                                               
increase  in  oil   production  on  the  North   Slope  has  been                                                               
approximately 20,000  barrels per  day.  She  concluded increased                                                               
production of 1.2  billion barrels of oil is needed  to equal the                                                               
budget shortfall of $2.5 billion.                                                                                               
1:24:34 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR TARR  continued to  slide 9, which  used the  example of                                                               
20,000  barrels  per day  and  a  12.5  percent royalty  rate  to                                                               
estimate royalty  revenue.  Calculating  royalty uses  GVPP, thus                                                               
with taxable  barrels added to  royalty share barrels,  the state                                                               
would need  to produce about 47  billion more barrels of  oil [to                                                               
equal the  budget shortfall of  $2.5 billion].  She  reviewed the                                                               
prospects  of new  discoveries and  possible future  increases to                                                               
oil production  affected by property and  corporate income taxes,                                                               
and  related  the  industry  has   concerns  about  the  lack  of                                                               
stability, planning,  and overdue  unpaid oil  tax credits.   Co-                                                               
Chair Tarr  continued to slide  10, which illustrated  changes to                                                               
the revenue  stream by increased  minimum tax rates.   Also shown                                                               
on  slide 10  were the  impacts  of taxes  at $60  oil prices  on                                                               
legacy and new fields, and  she provided examples.  Co-Chair Tarr                                                               
suggested the committee discuss  modest [minimum tax] adjustments                                                               
at a  rate that  could be  made without  jeopardizing investment,                                                               
and  said  there is  no  intent  to  rush  the bill  through  the                                                               
committee.   Further, proposals  for other  sources of  income to                                                               
the  state  "seem   to  be  off  the  table"   which  leaves  the                                                               
legislature only with the options of oil taxes and fuel taxes.                                                                  
1:32:48 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE  RAUSCHER  questioned  how  the  bill  would  cure                                                               
instability   because  the   industry   is  currently   operating                                                               
according to previous legislation.                                                                                              
CO-CHAIR TARR said the committee  will hear testimony on the bill                                                               
from industry at  an upcoming hearing.  She  related the industry                                                               
urges the state  to diversify its revenue sources  to those other                                                               
than oil  and gas;  however, there  are few  other options.   She                                                               
pointed out  the bill looks  at a range  of minimum taxes  from 4                                                               
percent  to   7  percent,  [and   seeks]  to   avoid  threatening                                                               
investment and jobs.   Co-Chair Tarr returned  attention to slide                                                               
7 and  said a 10 percent  rate is not  too low at $30  per barrel                                                               
prices;  however,  the crossover  point  is  between $60-$80  per                                                               
barrel, which  may be the short-term  stable price for oil.   The                                                               
working group  will address the  underlying structure of  oil tax                                                               
policy and long-term oil prices.                                                                                                
1:36:03 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE  BIRCH  asked  whether  the  sponsors  would  have                                                               
introduced HB 288  if a broad-based income tax  was passed during                                                               
CO-CHAIR TARR,  speaking for herself,  said she preferred  a fair                                                               
fiscal package; the  passage of a tax would  have [decreased] the                                                               
state's  deficit  outlook  and,  therefore, "the  math  would  be                                                               
1:37:31 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE BIRCH  advised there have been  great increases to                                                               
oil  production  on  the  North  Slope due  to  the  present  tax                                                               
environment.    He  asked  how  the  proposed  legislation  would                                                               
contribute to  three years of increased  production and cautioned                                                               
the bill is "going the wrong direction."                                                                                        
CO-CHAIR  TARR  said  from her  perspective  diversifying  [state                                                               
revenue] would  change the present situation  but the legislature                                                               
must come  to agreement.   She returned to  slide 2 and  the four                                                               
pillars of  a plan  to [address the  budget deficit],  noting her                                                               
constituents  seek  to "spread  the  burden  more evenly."    She                                                               
restated  her  interest in  comments  from  the industry  and  in                                                               
following the working  group process.  She  returned attention to                                                               
slide 7 and observed there  are different perspectives from those                                                               
who must  provide state  services and from  those of  an industry                                                               
that answers to its shareholders.                                                                                               
1:42:20 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE BIRCH  recalled last year the  legislature created                                                               
a working  group to  address this  issue, but  the bill  has been                                                               
introduced  without  the  benefit  of  the  working  group.    He                                                               
stressed  the House  Resources Standing  Committee is  a resource                                                               
committee  that  has  a  duty  and  responsibility  to  focus  on                                                               
increasing production  and recognizing the importance  of revenue                                                               
earned  by royalty  oil.   He directed  attention to  the sponsor                                                               
statement and expressed his belief that  the bill appears to be a                                                               
bargaining   chip  in   the   issue   of  broad-based   taxation.                                                               
Representative  Birch said  he  does not  support  the bill;  the                                                               
committee has a duty and  obligation to increase production since                                                               
increased production  is beneficial to  all.  He urged  to return                                                               
to the process established through the working group.                                                                           
1:44:43 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR  TARR  acknowledged  the  legislation is  not  the  only                                                               
option  and  she has  no  wish  to  repeat  an extended  oil  tax                                                               
legislative  session, thus  the bill  is  limited in  scope.   In                                                               
further  response  to  Representative  Birch as  to  whether  the                                                               
administration   has   embraced   the    bill,   she   said   the                                                               
administration  will  testify  during   an  upcoming  hearing  on                                                               
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON agreed  the bill is a  bargaining chip and                                                               
noted after House Bill 111  [passed in the Thirtieth Alaska State                                                               
Legislature], her desire  was to address the issue  of paying off                                                               
the  tax credits,  which is  not being  discussed.   She strongly                                                               
opined introducing an oil tax bill  to the committee at this time                                                               
is  the opposite  of stability  and  is again  sending the  wrong                                                               
message.  She asked the following  questions:  How would the bill                                                               
bring stability  to the  industry; how is  the bill  not creating                                                               
"an oil  tax session," how  is the  bill advancing ...?   Lastly,                                                               
she disagreed that consultants supported  the intent of the bill,                                                               
and asked which consultants are in support.                                                                                     
CO-CHAIR TARR,  in response  to the  question of  stability, said                                                               
without  a diversified  revenue stream  the pressure  for raising                                                               
revenue will always be on the  oil and gas industry.  She pointed                                                               
out  there  is instability  created  by  a citizens'  initiatives                                                               
regarding   resource  development   policy,   the   use  by   the                                                               
legislature  of the  [Alaska Permanent  Fund], and  other issues.                                                               
She acknowledged consultants have  not made recommendations about                                                               
specifics in oil  policy, but they do urge for  the state to make                                                               
fundamental changes  such as taxing  based on PTV.   She stressed                                                               
legislation last  year was not  a fundamental rewrite of  oil tax                                                               
1:51:15 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR  JOSEPHSON noted  his support  for paying  down the  tax                                                               
credits which will  cost about $900 million;  there is bipartisan                                                               
support to do so if a plan  emerges.  He agreed that a consultant                                                               
advised making a change to  the state's tax structure.  Regarding                                                               
["whiplash,"  caused by]  the  introduction of  a  new bill  that                                                               
would  increase   the  gross  tax,   he  recalled   the  governor                                                               
recommended this legislation  in January of 2016,  and since then                                                             
the committee as seen this issue as a consistent theme.                                                                         
REPRESENTATIVE  PARISH questioned  whether it  is typical  for an                                                               
oil company  to utilize profits earned  in Alaska for use  by its                                                               
global business.                                                                                                                
1:53:04 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR  TARR  said  data  from the  Department  of  Revenue  is                                                               
limited and she cannot comment.                                                                                                 
REPRESENTATIVE PARISH  asked whether the 10  percent tax received                                                               
from severance taxes [shown on  slide 7] is typical when compared                                                               
to other nations.                                                                                                               
CO-CHAIR TARR said  the percentage varies widely thus  it is hard                                                               
to find  a fair comparison.   She  restated her belief  if Senate                                                               
Bill 21  [passed in the  Twenty-Eighth Alaska  State Legislature]                                                               
was written now, the [minimum]  percentage would have been in the                                                               
13  percent to  18 percent  range,  but perhaps  still linked  to                                                               
price.    However,  at  that  time,  the  "new  normal"  was  not                                                               
considered; discussion  related to the percentage  of minimum tax                                                               
has been ongoing for over ten years.                                                                                            
1:55:49 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE PARISH read from  the Alaska State Constitution as                                                               
     Article VIII - Natural Resources                                                                                           
     General Authority                                                                                                          
     The legislature shall provide for the utilization,                                                                       
     development, and conservation of all natural resources                                                                   
     belonging to the state, including land and waters, for                                                                   
     the maximum benefit of its people.                                                                                         
REPRESENTATIVE PARISH  asked Co-Chair  Tarr whether  she believes                                                               
the state is securing maximum benefit for the people of Alaska.                                                                 
CO-CHAIR  TARR stated  she is  but one  member of  the collective                                                               
body of  the legislature  who seeks  to debate  the issue  of the                                                               
minimum 10  percent tax  in the present  price environment.   She                                                               
returned attention to slide 7  which illustrated several proposed                                                               
minimum tax percentages and expressed  her personal hope that the                                                               
[state  budget] can  maintain a  strong  [Alaska Permanent  Fund]                                                               
dividend and public safety.                                                                                                     
CO-CHAIR  JOSEPHSON,   in  further  response   to  Representative                                                               
Parish,  pointed  out there  are  differing  opinions as  to  how                                                               
maximum   benefit  can   be  achieved,   such  as   increases  to                                                               
[Alaskans'] salaries and to [oil and gas] production in Alaska.                                                                 
REPRESENTATIVE PARISH  opined the  work of  the committee  is not                                                               
finished in regard  to oil taxes and brought  up points suggested                                                               
by various legislative consultants.                                                                                             
2:01:13 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE  RAUSCHER   inquired  as  to   the  aforementioned                                                               
company   that  [transferred   its  Alaska   profits  to   global                                                               
REPRESENTATIVE PARISH  offered to provide written  information on                                                               
REPRESENTATIVE TALERICO  recalled data from "those  old [oil tax]                                                               
plans" resulted  in an  alarming 6-8  percent decrease  in annual                                                               
production that inspired much of  the ongoing work on various tax                                                               
plans.   His  concern is  the  current surges  in production  and                                                               
price  should have  taught a  lesson  that Alaska  is subject  to                                                               
pricing  decisions  made by  the  Organization  of the  Petroleum                                                               
Exporting Countries (OPEC).  He  said one of his biggest concerns                                                               
is how  the bill would  impact throughput,  volumes, exploration,                                                               
and investment.   He cautioned that although the  bill is limited                                                               
to one subject, the bill  may acquire creative amendments related                                                               
to, for  example, changes  to gross value  reduction (GVR)  or to                                                               
gross value at the point  of production.  Representative Talerico                                                               
said, "I  do also appreciate  though, the  fact that you  put ...                                                               
several different scenarios  to look at because I  think, I think                                                               
we should do that as we work forward ...."                                                                                      
CO-CHAIR TARR  restated lessons learned  from Senate Bill  21 and                                                               
from the original intent of  the tax credits, which were intended                                                               
to  encourage  smaller  independent  and  new  companies  in  the                                                               
industry  in  Alaska.    She questioned  whether  the  intent  to                                                               
diversify the North Slope was  undermined.  These are issues that                                                               
can  be thoroughly  evaluated by  the working  group process  and                                                               
restated her concerns as above.                                                                                                 
2:08:35 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR JOSEPHSON  asked whether the sponsor  would have offered                                                               
the  legislation  had  [oil]  prices remained  in  the  $45  [per                                                               
barrel] range.                                                                                                                  
CO-CHAIR TARR  returned attention to slide  7.  At the  $60 price                                                               
range there is  an approximate split of $18 of  profit to the oil                                                               
company and  $2 to  the state,  and she asked  whether that  is a                                                               
fair split  of profit.   In  response to  Representative Parish's                                                               
question as  to when the  committee would hear  invited testimony                                                               
on  the bill,  she said  state and  industry representatives  are                                                               
scheduled to provide testimony on [1/26/18].                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHNSON asked  whether the  legislation would  be                                                               
presented to the working group.                                                                                                 
CO-CHAIR TARR said no.  She  clarified the working group will not                                                               
review  proposed legislation,  but will  evaluate tax  policy and                                                               
other  state  actions such  as  infrastructure  investment.   For                                                               
example, a  permanent road system  built by the state  to replace                                                               
ice roads  in oil development  areas would be an  opportunity for                                                               
the  state.   Representative Tarr  pointed out  portions the  tax                                                               
credit program  paid large sums  of money for some  projects that                                                               
did not  lead to  increased production,  or new  development, and                                                               
suggested  a better  use  of state  money  may be  infrastructure                                                               
development.  Further, she stated  her understanding a bill could                                                               
not be  referred to  the working  group for a  hearing to  due to                                                               
public notice procedures.                                                                                                       
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON urged for bill  in general to be discussed                                                               
in the working group as is appropriate.                                                                                         
[HB 288 was held over.]                                                                                                         
2:15:07 PM                                                                                                                    
There being no  further business before the  committee, the House                                                               
Resources Standing Committee meeting was adjourned at 2:15 p.m.                                                                 

Document Name Date/Time Subjects
HB288 ver A 1.16.18.PDF HRES 1/22/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 1/26/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 1/29/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/30/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 4/2/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 4/13/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 4/14/2018 2:00:00 PM
HRES 4/16/2018 1:00:00 PM
HB 288
HB288 Fiscal Note DOR-TAX 1.20.18.pdf HRES 1/22/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 1/26/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 1/29/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/30/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 4/2/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 4/13/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 4/14/2018 2:00:00 PM
HRES 4/16/2018 1:00:00 PM
HB 288
HB288 Sponsor Statement 1.21.18.pdf HRES 1/22/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 1/26/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 1/29/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/30/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 4/2/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 4/13/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 4/14/2018 2:00:00 PM
HRES 4/16/2018 1:00:00 PM
HB 288
HB288 Sectional Analysis 1.21.18.pdf HRES 1/22/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 1/26/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 1/29/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/30/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 4/2/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 4/13/2018 1:00:00 PM
HRES 4/14/2018 2:00:00 PM
HRES 4/16/2018 1:00:00 PM
HB 288