Legislature(2007 - 2008)BARNES 124

05/04/2007 01:00 PM RESOURCES


Download Mp3. <- Right click and save file as

* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
*+ HB 241 STAMPEDE STATE RECREATION AREA TELECONFERENCED
<Bill Hearing Canceled>
*+ HJR 21 OPPOSE UN LAND DESIGNATIONS IN ALASKA TELECONFERENCED
Moved CSHJR 21(RES) Out of Committee
*+ HB 94 MARINE PARKS ADDITIONS/HUNTING ALLOWED TELECONFERENCED
Moved CSHB 94(RES) Out of Committee
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
+= HB 128 OIL & GAS PRODUCTION TAX: EXPENDITURES TELECONFERENCED
Moved CSHB 128(RES) Out of Committee
                    ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE                                                                                  
               HOUSE RESOURCES STANDING COMMITTEE                                                                             
                          May 4, 2007                                                                                           
                           1:11 p.m.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Representative Carl Gatto, Co-Chair                                                                                             
Representative Craig Johnson, Co-Chair                                                                                          
Representative Bob Roses                                                                                                        
Representative Paul Seaton                                                                                                      
Representative Peggy Wilson                                                                                                     
Representative Bryce Edgmon                                                                                                     
Representative David Guttenberg                                                                                                 
Representative Scott Kawasaki                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Representative Vic Kohring                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 128                                                                                                              
"An Act relating to allowable  lease expenditures for the purpose                                                               
of determining  the production tax value  of oil and gas  for the                                                               
purposes of the oil and gas  production tax; and providing for an                                                               
effective date."                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     - MOVED CSHB 128(RES) OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 94                                                                                                               
"An  Act relating  to fishing,  hunting, and  trapping in  marine                                                               
park units  of the  Alaska state park  system, amending  the area                                                               
within  designated marine  park units  of the  Alaska state  park                                                               
system, and  adding marine  park units to  the Alaska  state park                                                               
system."                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     - MOVED CSHB 94(RES) OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 21                                                                                                   
Opposing the  designation of  any area  in the  state as  a world                                                               
heritage  site,   biosphere  reserve,   or  any  other   type  of                                                               
international  designation  without  the consent  of  the  Alaska                                                               
State Legislature and affected local  governments; and urging the                                                               
United   States  Congress   to  enact   legislation  to   require                                                               
congressional approval  before an area  in the United  States may                                                               
be considered for an international designation.                                                                                 
     - MOVED CSHJR 21(RES) OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 241                                                                                                              
"An Act creating the Stampede State Recreation Area."                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     - BILL HEARING CANCELED                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HB 128                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: OIL & GAS PRODUCTION TAX: EXPENDITURES                                                                             
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) OLSON                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
02/12/07       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
02/12/07       (H)       O&G, RES, FIN                                                                                          
02/22/07       (H)       O&G AT 3:00 PM CAPITOL 124                                                                             
02/22/07       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
02/22/07       (H)       MINUTE(O&G)                                                                                            
03/01/07       (H)       O&G AT 3:00 PM CAPITOL 124                                                                             
03/01/07       (H)       Moved CSHB 128(O&G) Out of Committee                                                                   
03/01/07       (H)       MINUTE(O&G)                                                                                            
03/05/07       (H)       O&G RPT CS(O&G) 3DP 1NR                                                                                
03/05/07       (H)       DP: DOOGAN, RAMRAS, OLSON                                                                              
03/05/07       (H)       NR: SAMUELS                                                                                            
03/19/07       (H)       RES AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
03/19/07       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
03/19/07       (H)       MINUTE(RES)                                                                                            
03/21/07       (H)       RES AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
03/21/07       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
03/21/07       (H)       MINUTE(RES)                                                                                            
03/23/07       (H)       RES AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
03/23/07       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
03/23/07       (H)       MINUTE(RES)                                                                                            
03/26/07       (H)       RES AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
03/26/07       (H)       -- MEETING CANCELED --                                                                                 
03/28/07       (H)       RES AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
03/28/07       (H)       Heard & Held; Assigned to Subcommittee                                                                 
03/28/07       (H)       MINUTE(RES)                                                                                            
05/01/07       (H)       RES AT 9:00 AM BARNES 124                                                                              
05/02/07       (H)       RES AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
05/02/07       (H)       Failed To Move Out Of Committee                                                                        
05/02/07       (H)       MINUTE(RES)                                                                                            
05/04/07       (H)       RES AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HB  94                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: MARINE PARKS ADDITIONS/HUNTING ALLOWED                                                                             
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) KERTTULA, CISSNA                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
01/16/07       (H)       PREFILE RELEASED 1/12/07                                                                               
01/16/07       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
01/16/07       (H)       RES, FIN                                                                                               
04/30/07       (H)       RES AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
04/30/07       (H)       Scheduled But Not Heard                                                                                
05/04/07       (H)       RES AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HJR 21                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: OPPOSE UN LAND DESIGNATIONS IN ALASKA                                                                              
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) THOMAS                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
04/26/07       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
04/26/07       (H)       RES                                                                                                    
05/04/07       (H)       RES AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
WITNESS REGISTER                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
KEVIN BANKS, Acting Director                                                                                                    
Central Office                                                                                                                  
Division of Oil & Gas                                                                                                           
Department of Natural Resources (DNR)                                                                                           
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  During hearing of HB 128, answered                                                                       
questions.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
JONATHAN IVERSEN, Director                                                                                                      
Anchorage Office                                                                                                                
Tax Division                                                                                                                    
Department of Revenue                                                                                                           
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  During hearing of HB 128, answered                                                                       
questions.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
AURORA HAUKE, Staff                                                                                                             
to Representative Beth Kerttula                                                                                                 
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:  Presented HB 94 on behalf of Representative                                                              
Kerttula, one of the joint prime sponsors.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MIKE EBERHARDT, Superintendent                                                                                                  
Southeast Area                                                                                                                  
Division of Parks & Outdoor Recreation                                                                                          
Department of Natural Resources                                                                                                 
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION  STATEMENT:     During   hearing  of  HB   94,  answered                                                             
questions.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
IAN FISK, Staff                                                                                                                 
to Representative Bill Thomas                                                                                                   
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:   Presented HJR 21 on behalf  of the sponsor,                                                             
Representative Thomas.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
STEVE BORELL, P.E., Executive Director                                                                                          
Alaska Miners Association, Inc.                                                                                                 
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HJR 21.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
BOBBY FITHIAN, Executive Director                                                                                               
Alaska Professional Hunters Association Inc. (APHA)                                                                             
Copper Center, Alaska                                                                                                           
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HJR 21.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
ACTION NARRATIVE                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  CARL   GATTO  called   the  House   Resources  Standing                                                             
Committee  meeting  to  order at  1:11:45  PM.    Representatives                                                             
Gatto, Kawasaki,  Wilson, Seaton,  Roses, Guttenberg,  and Edgmon                                                               
were  present  at the  call  to  order.   Representative  Johnson                                                               
arrived as the meeting was in progress.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
HB 128-OIL & GAS PRODUCTION TAX: EXPENDITURES                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
1:11:53 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR GATTO announced  that the first order  of business would                                                               
be  HOUSE BILL  NO.  128,  "An Act  relating  to allowable  lease                                                               
expenditures for  the purpose of  determining the  production tax                                                               
value  of  oil and  gas  for  the purposes  of  the  oil and  gas                                                               
production tax;  and providing for  an effective date."   [Before                                                               
the  committee   is  CSHB  128(O&G),   as  amended   at  previous                                                               
hearings.]                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
1:12:12 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SEATON  referred  to  an  amendment  labeled  25-                                                               
LS0561\K.4, Bullock, 5/3/07, which read:                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     Page 4, line 1, following "equipment":                                                                                 
          Insert ";                                                                                                         
               (20)  costs related to the maintenance of                                                                    
     oil and  gas facilities, equipment,  and infrastructure                                                                
     that  are incurred  as a  result  of a  violation of  a                                                                
     regulation adopted  by the person in  the Department of                                                                
     Natural   Resources  who   is  the   lead  person   for                                                                
     exercising oversight  over the  maintenance of  oil and                                                                
     gas  facilities, equipment,  and infrastructure  in the                                                                
     state"                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     Page 4, lines 4 - 5:                                                                                                       
          Delete all material and insert:                                                                                       
          "APPLICABILITY.   (a)    AS 43.55.165(e)(19),   as                                                                    
     enacted in sec.  1 of this Act, applies to  oil and gas                                                                    
     produced after March 31, 2006.                                                                                             
          (b)  AS 43.55.165(e)(20), as enacted in sec. 1 of                                                                     
     this Act,  applies to  oil and  gas produced  after the                                                                    
     effective date  of the regulations described  in sec. 5                                                                    
     of this Act."                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
     Page 4, line 20:                                                                                                           
          Delete "Section 1 of this Act"                                                                                        
          Insert "AS 43.55.165(e)(19), as enacted in sec. 1                                                                     
     of this Act,"                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
     Page 4, line 21:                                                                                                           
          Delete all material and insert:                                                                                       
        "*  Sec.  5. The  uncodified  law  of the  State  of                                                                
     Alaska is amended by adding a new section to read:                                                                         
          CONDITIONAL       EFFECT;        NOTICE.       (a)                                                                    
     AS 43.55.165(e)(20), as enacted in  sec. 1 of this Act,                                                                    
     takes effect  only if the  person in the  Department of                                                                    
     Natural   Resources  who   is  the   lead  person   for                                                                    
     exercising oversight  over the  maintenance of  oil and                                                                    
     gas  facilities, equipment,  and infrastructure  in the                                                                    
     state adopts regulations related  to the maintenance of                                                                    
     oil and  gas facilities, equipment,  and infrastructure                                                                    
     in the state.                                                                                                              
          (b)  The commissioner of natural resources shall                                                                      
     notify the  revisor of statutes  of the  effective date                                                                    
     of the regulations described in (a) of this section.                                                                       
        *  Sec. 6.  If  AS 43.55.165(e)(20),  as enacted  in                                                                  
     sec. 1  of this Act,  takes effect, it takes  effect on                                                                    
     the  effective date  of  the  regulations described  in                                                                    
     sec. 5 of this Act.                                                                                                        
      * Sec. 7. Except as provided in sec. 6 of this Act,                                                                   
    this    Act    takes     effect    immediately    under                                                                     
     AS 01.10.070(c)."                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   SEATON   explained   that   the   aforementioned                                                               
amendment is  Don Bullock's [version of]  Conceptual Amendment 4,                                                               
which  was adopted  unanimously  [at the  May  2, 2007  hearing].                                                               
Therefore,   K.4  has   already   been   incorporated  into   the                                                               
legislation.   He explained that  Conceptual Amendment 4  added a                                                               
new subsection, which read:                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     costs incurred as a result  of an action or inaction in                                                                    
     violation of  regulation or  procedures adopted  by the                                                                    
     pipeline safety integrity  organization (PSIO) or other                                                                    
     appropriate agency.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON  pointed out  that the PSIO  isn't included                                                               
because it  is to  be under the  Department of  Natural Resources                                                               
(DNR).  "So, they identified  the agency or any subsidiary agency                                                               
such as PSIO that would be adopting these regulations," he said.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
1:14:03 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR GATTO then  turned attention to page  3, paragraph (19),                                                               
which he said is the only  issue keeping CSHB 128(O&G) from being                                                               
forwarded to  the next committee  of referral.    He  related his                                                               
understanding  that if  paragraph  (19) is  maintained, then  the                                                               
next  committee  of  referral is  the  House  Judiciary  Standing                                                               
Committee.   However, if paragraph  (19) is deleted,  no referral                                                               
to House Judiciary  Standing Committee is necessary  and it could                                                               
be forwarded  to the  House Finance  Committee.   He acknowledged                                                               
that the administration says paragraph  (19) needs to be included                                                               
in the legislation.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
1:15:13 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON noted  his agreement that with  the inclusion of                                                               
paragraph (19)  a House Judiciary Standing  Committee referral is                                                               
necessary.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
1:15:44 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SEATON related  that  in  conversations with  the                                                               
administration he has come to  understand that it's uncomfortable                                                               
with the  language of  paragraph (19).   Therefore,  he expressed                                                               
the  need  for  some  better  definitions  if  the  will  of  the                                                               
committee is to "do something retroactively."                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
1:16:24 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GUTTENBERG pointed  out  that  HB 128  originally                                                               
included  paragraph (19)  and didn't  receive  a House  Judiciary                                                               
Standing  Committee  referral.    He opined  that  if  the  House                                                               
Finance  Committee, the  next committee  of referral,  believes a                                                               
House Judiciary Standing Committee  referral is appropriate, then                                                               
it can be  referred to that committee at that  point.  He related                                                               
his desire to leave the legislation on its current path.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
1:17:08 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  KAWASAKI   clarified  that  paragraph   (19)  was                                                               
changed a  lot in  the House  Special Committee  on Oil  and Gas.                                                               
Therefore,  he opined  that  a referral  to  the House  Judiciary                                                               
Standing  Committee is  probably  appropriate  if paragraph  (19)                                                               
remains.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
1:17:32 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON  moved that the committee  delete paragraph                                                               
(19) on page 3, lines 19-23.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON objected.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GUTTENBERG stated  a  point of  order.   He  then                                                               
related  his understanding  that in  order to  take action  on HB                                                               
128, the  committee would need  to vote to bring  the legislation                                                               
back before it.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
1:18:16 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR GATTO related his understanding  that when the motion to                                                               
report legislation from committee  fails, the legislation remains                                                               
with the chair.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
1:18:37 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR GATTO moved  to bring HB 128 back  before the committee.                                                               
There  being  no objection,  HB  128  was before  the  committee.                                                               
[Representative Seaton's earlier motion  to delete paragraph (19)                                                               
was treated as withdrawn.]                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
1:19:10 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON  moved that  the committee  adopt Amendment                                                               
6, as follows:                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     Page 3, lines 19-23 through page 4, line 2:                                                                                
          Delete all material                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  JOHNSON  objected.    He  then  asked  if  there  is  a                                                               
representative from the administration  who could shed some light                                                               
as to why the administration  has some problems with the language                                                               
of paragraph (19).                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
1:20:25 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   SEATON  related   his  understanding   that  the                                                               
commissioner  of  the  Department  of  Revenue  agrees  with  the                                                               
language  in  the   amendment  [labeled  25-LS0561\K.4,  Bullock,                                                               
5/3/07]  regarding  going  forward  with  regulations.    If  the                                                               
legislature wants  to go back  and try  to put in  standards, the                                                               
[department] needs  something for standards  if the desire  is to                                                               
go back  to 2006  and have  a standard  other than  the standards                                                               
included in the legislation.  He  said that paragraph (20) in the                                                               
amendment [labeled 25-LS0561\K.4,  Bullock, 5/3/07] doesn't cover                                                               
retroactively a standard lower than  gross negligence, other than                                                               
the other partners in the oil field rejecting the bill.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
1:21:40 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  GATTO furthered  that  the [commissioner  of DOR]  said                                                               
that  he  couldn't write  regulations  without  the authority  in                                                               
statute to  write the regulations  that allow the refusal  of the                                                               
deduction that's submitted.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
1:22:07 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  JOHNSON inquired  as to  the problems  the [department]                                                               
had with the language.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
1:22:22 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON clarified that  the amendment the committee                                                               
adopted  was  the  statutory  portion  necessary  for  [creating]                                                               
regulations.  He further clarified  that the regulations wouldn't                                                               
be writing retroactive regulations,  but rather [the regulations]                                                               
would provide  a standard to  sue against.  [The  department] did                                                               
have problems, he  related, with regard to the  effect this might                                                               
have throughout  the current  language on  the incentives  in the                                                               
petroleum production profits tax (PPT).                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
1:23:17 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR GATTO reminded the committee  that the amendment labeled                                                               
25-LS0561\K.4, Bullock, 5/3/07,  has been adopted and  will be in                                                               
the forthcoming committee substitute (CS).                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
1:23:56 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GUTTENBERG  related  his understanding  that  the                                                               
retroactivity  remains,  although  it  looks  different  than  in                                                               
previous legislation.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON related his agreement.   He the pointed out                                                               
that  two applicability  subsections were  necessary because  the                                                               
regulation  section would  begin  at the  effective  date of  the                                                               
regulations,  which  is  different   than  the  March  31,  2006,                                                               
effective date in paragraph (19).                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
1:25:06 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  GATTO,   referring  to  paragraph  (19),   related  his                                                               
understanding that  there was a reduction  in corrosion inhibitor                                                               
as a  way to  save money.   Although it saved  money in  2006, it                                                               
cost  money  in 2007.    The  aforementioned  is the  reason  for                                                               
allowing  the commissioner  to go  back  and say  that the  state                                                               
doesn't want to pay for expenses related to negligence.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
1:26:02 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES,   referring  to  paragraph  (20)   in  the                                                               
amendment  labeled  25-LS0561\K.4,  Bullock,  5/3/07],  asked  if                                                               
regulations  that  govern  how  the  producers  are  supposed  to                                                               
maintain oil  and gas  facilities, equipment,  and infrastructure                                                               
are currently in place.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
1:27:22 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
KEVIN BANKS, Acting  Director, Central Office, Division  of Oil &                                                               
Gas, Department  of Natural Resources  (DNR), related  his belief                                                               
that  there  are regulations  that  govern  how DEC  reviews  the                                                               
facilities.   The intention was to  have a gap analysis  over the                                                               
next   several  months   in  order   to  determine   whether  new                                                               
regulations need  to be added.   There could also  be regulations                                                               
from  the  Department  of   Transportation  &  Public  Facilities                                                               
(DOT&PF) and other agencies.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
1:27:49 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR GATTO  questioned then if  the legislation  is necessary                                                               
to  go back  and  deny maintenance  costs,  if their  regulations                                                               
exist.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MR. BANKS explained  that the regulations DNR  would be reviewing                                                               
aren't  focused on  whether it  relates to  an exception  for the                                                               
Trans-Alaska  Pipeline  System  (TAPS).     The  intent  of  this                                                               
language seems  to address a  situation in which a  regulation in                                                               
place  that   addresses  maintenance   or  proper  care   of  the                                                               
facilities is  violated, then costs  related to that  are subject                                                               
to a disapproved allowance.   Mr. Banks opined that the amendment                                                               
is trying  to disallow those  costs incurred as a  consequence of                                                               
violating some regulation related to maintenance.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
1:29:34 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES  surmised that paragraph (20)  captures most                                                               
of  what  is  specified  in  paragraph  (19),  and  therefore  he                                                               
questioned whether  paragraph (20) is  redundant.  He  then asked                                                               
if   the  deletion   of  paragraph   (19)  would   eliminate  the                                                               
redundancy.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MR. BANKS  said that when  paragraph (19) was first  proposed, he                                                               
read it  as creating a  setting in  which DOR begins  to question                                                               
whether a cost is related  to improper maintenance and could then                                                               
turn to DNR for advice as to whether  that was true or not.  Then                                                               
language was developed to guide  that kind of advice.  Therefore,                                                               
it seems  that by including  [paragraph (20)], a  circumstance in                                                               
which  a regulatory  violation constitutes  an  improper cost  is                                                               
being selected.  Paragraph (20),  he opined, seems to be slightly                                                               
more specific than paragraph (19).                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
1:31:59 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR GATTO  related his  understanding from  the commissioner                                                               
that paragraph (19) allows [the retroactivity].                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
1:32:13 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON  asked if yet  to be written regulations  can be                                                               
applied retroactively.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES remarked that was his question.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
1:32:42 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  WILSON asked  if DNR  has regulations  that would                                                               
cover [what is referred to in paragraph (20)].                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MR. BANKS said  that he doesn't believe that DNR,  at the moment,                                                               
has articulated maintenance and  requirements in regulation.  The                                                               
department relies on the lease  contract and the general scope of                                                               
the lease stipulations to govern  whether activities conducted on                                                               
the lease  are appropriate.   [This legislation] seems  to expand                                                               
those concepts into a more regulatory framework.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
1:34:11 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE    SEATON   related    his   understanding    from                                                               
conversations  with the  administration  that  going forward  the                                                               
amendment is vital.   Although the [department] can  go back now,                                                               
it would have to do so for  one of the existing standards:  gross                                                               
negligence, wilful  misconduct, or because the  partners rejected                                                               
the bill because it wasn't  performed as a prudent operator would                                                               
do.    He  related  his  further  understanding  that  the  lease                                                               
agreements  at Prudhoe  Bay include  clauses regarding  items for                                                               
which they don't  pay.  As of today, the  other partners have not                                                               
been billed  for the  BP spill,  shutdown, and  pipe replacement.                                                               
The purpose  of paragraph  (19) is to  have a  different standard                                                               
that's lower  than gross  negligence and will  only apply  if the                                                               
other  partners  accept  the  bills.    He  noted  that  improper                                                               
maintenance is  not necessarily the  negligence standard,  and in                                                               
fact it may be lower than that in  some cases.  "If you want them                                                               
to go  back and look at  a standard that's lower  than those that                                                               
are incorporated  in here ...  then [paragraph] (19)  is needed,"                                                               
Representative Seaton opined.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
1:36:44 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JONATHAN  IVERSEN,  Director,  Anchorage  Office,  Tax  Division,                                                               
Department  of  Revenue,  characterized  Representative  Seaton's                                                               
comments as  an accurate summary.   He  then said that  he didn't                                                               
know whether BP has billed  the aforementioned costs to the other                                                               
working  interest owners  in  the  unit or  if  any requests  for                                                               
payment have been  approved or denied.  Paragraph  (19) fills the                                                               
gap between  where gross  negligence stops  and the  costs denied                                                               
between the working interest owners, he opined.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
1:37:45 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES  asked if  the  state  has the  ability  to                                                               
exempt those  costs under  the gross  negligence definition.   If                                                               
the answer  is no  and the  desire is to  reduce the  standard to                                                               
simple  negligence, then  it's probably  important to  understand                                                               
the difference  between gross  negligence and  simple negligence.                                                               
Black's  Law Dictionary  specifies  that "gross  negligence is  a                                                             
lack of slight  diligence or care; a conscience  voluntary act or                                                               
omission  in  reckless disregard  of  a  legal  duty and  of  the                                                               
consequences  to   another  party   who  may   typically  recover                                                               
exemplary damages."   Representative Roses opined  that the gross                                                               
negligence standard isn't going to be that difficult to prove.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
1:39:09 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR GATTO inquired  as to the definition of  the term "legal                                                               
duty."   He further  inquired as  to whether  the injection  of a                                                               
corrosion inhibitor is smart or a legal duty.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
1:39:25 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  WILSON   opined  that  Alaska   statutes  include                                                               
definitions  for  gross  negligence  and  negligence,  which  she                                                               
surmised  would  be   followed  over  what  is   specified  in  a                                                               
dictionary.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
1:39:48 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  GATTO suggested  that  since  Representative Roses  was                                                               
reading   from  Black's   Law  Dictionary   that  would   be  the                                                             
[definition] to which to refer.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
1:40:03 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  JOHNSON  remarked  that the  aforementioned  discussion                                                               
exemplifies why  HB 128  should receive a  referral to  the House                                                               
Judiciary Standing  Committee.  He  said that although  he agrees                                                               
that  [paragraph  (19)]  should  be  included,  it  needs  to  be                                                               
appropriate language  and language with which  the administration                                                               
can "live with."                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
1:41:12 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON maintained his objection.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
1:42:43 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
A roll call  vote was taken.  Representatives  Wilson, Roses, and                                                               
Seaton  voted   in  favor  of   the  adoption  of   Amendment  6.                                                               
Representatives Edgmon, Kawasaki,  Guttenberg, Johnson, and Gatto                                                               
voted against  it.  Therefore,  Amendment 6 failed to  be adopted                                                               
by a vote of 3-5.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
1:43:52 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR GATTO informed the committee  that the next committee of                                                               
referral for HB 128 is the  House Finance Committee.  He reminded                                                               
the  committee  that   on  a  previous  motion   to  report  this                                                               
legislation  from committee,  it failed  on a  4-4 vote.   Unless                                                               
someone is willing to change  from that previous vote, the result                                                               
is unlikely  to change.  Therefore,  he said, "So what  I'm going                                                               
to do is  say, 'Let it go  to Judiciary; I hope  that will change                                                               
one vote.'"                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
1:44:21 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  JOHNSON interjected  that he  believes HB  128 is  good                                                               
legislation that needs to pass [out  of this committee] and go to                                                               
the House Judiciary Standing Committee.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
1:44:29 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON moved  to report CSHB 128(O&G),  as amended, out                                                               
of   committee   with    individual   recommendations   and   the                                                               
accompanying fiscal  notes as well  as a recommendation  that the                                                               
legislation receive  a referral  to the House  Judiciary Standing                                                               
Committee.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
1:45:12 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GUTTENBERG  suggested  dividing the  motion  such                                                               
that there  is a  motion to report  CSHB 128(O&G)  from committee                                                               
and  a  second motion  to  refer  the  legislation to  the  House                                                               
Judiciary Standing Committee.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
1:45:43 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON moved to rescind his prior motion.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
1:45:53 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON opined  that if the question  is divided as                                                               
stated,  then   whether  there's   a  House   Judiciary  Standing                                                               
Committee  referral will  influence  whether  the legislation  is                                                               
reported from committee.  Therefore,  he suggested first taking a                                                               
vote as  to whether the  committee wants to recommend  a referral                                                               
to the House Judiciary Standing Committee.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
1:46:32 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GUTTENBERG  noted that  although everyone  has the                                                               
ability to go to the  speaker and offer recommendations regarding                                                               
referrals,   the   speaker   isn't   required   to   follow   the                                                               
recommendations.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR GATTO  related that he  would take the message  from the                                                               
committee to the speaker.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
1:47:17 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON  moved that  the committee take  a sense  of the                                                               
body  as to  whether the  committee would  recommend that  HB 128                                                               
receive a House Judiciary Standing Committee.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR GATTO objected.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
1:47:57 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
A  roll call  vote  was taken.    Representatives Seaton,  Roses,                                                               
Edgmon, Kawasaki,  Wilson, Gatto, and  Johnson voted in  favor of                                                               
recommending  that HB  128  be referred  to  the House  Judiciary                                                               
Standing Committee.  Representative  Guttenberg voted against it.                                                               
Therefore,  the  sense  of the  committee  regarding  whether  to                                                               
recommend  that  HB  128  receive   a  House  Judiciary  Standing                                                               
Committee passed by a vote of 7-1.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
1:48:51 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON moved  to report CSHB 128(O&G),  as amended, out                                                               
of   committee   with    individual   recommendations   and   the                                                               
accompanying fiscal notes.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON objected.  He  then clarified that he isn't                                                               
opposed to having  a standard, but he expressed  concern that the                                                               
standard in paragraph (19) inserts  uncertainty and risk into the                                                               
PPT and  could result  in not sanctioning  projects in  Alaska by                                                               
the oil companies.  He then removed his objection.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
 1:50:10 PM                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
There  being no  further  objection, CSHB  128(RES) was  reported                                                               
from the House Resources Standing Committee.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
HB  94-MARINE PARKS ADDITIONS/HUNTING ALLOWED                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
1:50:35 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR GATTO  announced that the  next order of  business would                                                               
be HOUSE BILL  NO. 94, "An Act relating to  fishing, hunting, and                                                               
trapping in  marine park units  of the Alaska state  park system,                                                               
amending  the area  within designated  marine park  units of  the                                                               
Alaska state  park system,  and adding marine  park units  to the                                                               
Alaska state park system."                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
1:50:53 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
AURORA  HAUKE, Staff,  to  Representative  Beth Kerttula,  Alaska                                                               
State  Legislature,   paraphrased  from  the   following  sponsor                                                               
statement:                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     House  Bill  94  adds  13 islands  in  Lynn  Canal  and                                                                    
     additional  land  on  Shelter  Island  to  the  state's                                                                    
     marine park units of the  Alaska state park system.  HB                                                                    
     94    would   protect    recreational   and    economic                                                                    
     opportunities for Alaskans and visitors alike.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     The   islands  are   popular  locations   for  fishing,                                                                    
     hunting, trapping,  kayaking, camping,  and picnicking.                                                                    
     Transferring  these  state-owned  lands to  the  marine                                                                    
     park  system will  ensure  they are  kept  open to  the                                                                    
     public.    Additionally,  House Bill  94  ensures  that                                                                    
     hunting and  fishing will not be  prohibited within the                                                                    
     marine park.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     The  islands  included  in  HB   94  are  important  to                                                                    
     Southeast  Alaska's  economy.   The  incredible  scenic                                                                    
     beauty  and  abundant  wildlife  viewing  opportunities                                                                    
     make   the  waters   around  the   islands  a   popular                                                                    
     passageway  for   whale  watching   tour  boats.     In                                                                    
     addition,  the  waters  around   these  islands  are  a                                                                    
     vibrant  fishing ground  for  our important  commercial                                                                    
     fisheries.   Adding  the islands  to  the marine  parks                                                                    
     will  ensure that  they remain  the  natural gems  that                                                                    
     make them so important to local industry.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     I urge your support of House Bill 94.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MS. HAUKE informed the committee  that HB 94 has received support                                                               
from  the Alaska  Outdoor Council,  Territorial Sportsmen,  Inc.,                                                               
Southeast Alaska  Land Trust,  Juneau Audubon  Society, Southeast                                                               
Alaska  Conservation  Council   (SEACC),  Goldbelt  Incorporated,                                                               
private  inholders on  one  of the  islands,  Juneau State  Parks                                                               
Advisory Board,  and the  City &  Borough of  Juneau.   Ms. Hauke                                                               
submitted  the written  testimony  of Gary  Miller, Juneau  State                                                               
Parks Advisory Board, to the committee.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
1:52:35 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SEATON  moved  to  adopt  CSHB  94,  Version  25-                                                               
LS0377\E, Kane,  4/30/07, as the  working document.   There being                                                               
no objection, Version E was before the committee.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
1:52:51 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS. HAUKE explained  that the two changes  encompassed in Version                                                               
E can be found  in the intent language.  Page  2, lines 1-3, adds                                                               
language stressing  the importance of  fishing in the  Lynn Canal                                                               
area.   On page  2, lines  16 and 30,  the 20  fathom bathymetric                                                               
line  apron  around the  islands  is  changed  to the  10  fathom                                                               
bathymetric  line.   The 10  fathom bathymetric  line is  clearly                                                               
delineated  on charts  and  allows the  space  necessary to  make                                                               
improvements, should they choose to do so.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
1:53:39 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  GATTO asked  if "marine  parks" are  designated by  the                                                               
state, including federal  designations.  He opined  that the word                                                               
"park" usually has a fairly significant definition.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
1:54:12 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS. HAUKE deferred to the  Department of Natural Resources (DNR).                                                               
However,  she pointed  out that  HB 94  includes protections  for                                                               
hunting  and fishing  so that  those activities  can continue  in                                                               
marine parks.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
1:54:43 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MIKE  EBERHARDT,  Superintendent,  Southeast  Area,  Division  of                                                               
Parks  & Outdoor  Recreation,  Department  of Natural  Resources,                                                               
began by informing the committee that  he is in charge of all the                                                               
parks  within  Southeast  Alaska.   There  are  approximately  32                                                               
marine parks,  which is  a bit different  designation due  to the                                                               
statutory  designation.   [The division]  is very  different from                                                               
the  National Park  Service in  that a  park designation  doesn't                                                               
mean hunting,  fishing, or  use are  prohibited.   The division's                                                               
mission statement  is for the  use and  enjoyment of the  land by                                                               
the people of the state.  He  related that there is the desire by                                                               
the user  groups that  some active  management take  place within                                                               
these islands.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
1:56:00 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR GATTO  asked if scuba  divers with compressed air  and a                                                               
scuba gun can hunt within the marine park waters.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MR.  EBERHARDT   replied  yes,   adding  that   the  restrictions                                                               
basically  only apply  to resource  damage.   [The division],  he                                                               
related,  is to  prevent  resource damage  for  the purposes  set                                                               
forth in statute.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
1:56:54 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ROSES related  his experience  with Kachemak  Bay                                                               
State Park,  which has  never been closed  to fishing  or hunting                                                               
prior to or following its designation as a state park.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
1:57:40 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR GATTO asked if the  harvesting of kelp to obtain herring                                                               
eggs would be considered a destructive behavior.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MR. EBERHARDT said that in such  instances [in which the issue is                                                               
harvesting] the division would defer  to the Alaska Department of                                                               
Fish  &  Game  (ADF&G)  to  determine  whether  it's  destructive                                                               
behavior.   However,  he noted  that  within all  of the  [marine                                                               
park] units in Sitka the harvest of herring roe is allowed.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
1:59:23 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON  asked if this legislation  actually expands the                                                               
size of this park.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
MR. EBERHARDT  replied yes, the  legislation adds islands  to the                                                               
marine parks  system.  In  further response to  Co-Chair Johnson,                                                               
Mr. Eberhardt specified  that the actual expansion  in acreage is                                                               
12.1 square miles of land and 11.5 square miles of water.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MS. HAUKE  clarified that the  11.5 square miles of  water refers                                                               
to  the 10  fathom bathymetric  line  rather than  the 20  fathom                                                               
bathymetric line.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
2:00:52 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR GATTO  inquired as  to how many  miles of  beachfront is                                                               
being added.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. EBERHARDT  answered that although  it's an addition of  a lot                                                               
of  beachfront, it  isn't substantial  in comparison  to what  is                                                               
currently  held.   In  further response  to  Co-Chair Gatto,  Mr.                                                               
Eberhardt  confirmed that  there are  some inholdings  within the                                                               
park  units.   However, the  vast  majority are  only uplands  to                                                               
which the  marine park system  would receive the tidelands.   For                                                               
instance, there  is a small  private inholding on  Shelter Island                                                               
for  which  the tidelands  in  front  of that  private  inholding                                                               
weren't exempted.   Therefore,  the tidelands  in front  of those                                                               
inholdings would be transferred to park management.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
2:03:07 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS. HAUKE,  in response to  Co-Chair Gatto, said that  she hasn't                                                               
heard any  objections to  doing what's  proposed in  HB 94.   She                                                               
noted that she has a letter  from a private inholder who supports                                                               
HB 94.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
2:03:27 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. EBERHARDT interjected that the  important thing to know about                                                               
that inholder is that he  is currently developing that parcel for                                                               
commercial  recreation.    The  division  has  worked  with  that                                                               
inholder to establish that parcel for that use.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
2:03:46 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  JOHNSON   recalled  that  there  are   several  private                                                               
inholdings within the marine park, and  asked if those are in the                                                               
expanded park or in the entire park.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MR. EBERHARDT specified  that within the units  that the division                                                               
is  asking   to  expand  he   knows  of  three,   possibly  four,                                                               
inholdings.    He noted  that  they  are  small inholdings.    In                                                               
further  response to  Co-Chair Johnson,  Mr. Eberhardt  said that                                                               
[the  division]   hasn't  received  objections  from   the  other                                                               
inholders who have been notified of this.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
2:04:53 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  WILSON   related  her  understanding   that  this                                                               
legislation  merely ensures  that all  the existing  designations                                                               
that allow hunting, fishing, and etcetera to continue.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MR.  EBERHARDT replied  yes, adding  that once  it's a  statutory                                                               
mandate the division no longer has  the opportunity to do a lease                                                               
or other things that could restrict hunting and fishing.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
2:05:32 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES asked if the  individuals who currently have                                                               
sites within the park own the land.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
MR.   EBERHARDT   replied   yes.     In   further   response   to                                                               
Representative   Roses,   Mr.   Eberhardt  confirmed   that   the                                                               
designation of  the land only  goes to  the mean mean  high water                                                               
mark and  thus any land  outside of that  would be a  state park,                                                               
regardless.     Mr.   Eberhardt  further   confirmed  that   this                                                               
legislation doesn't  really impact any  land but rather  the land                                                               
underneath the high tide mark.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
2:06:08 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  JOHNSON  inquired  as  to the  type  of  public  notice                                                               
required  before this  is enacted.    He further  inquired as  to                                                               
whether  the  inholders have  been  notified  and if  there's  an                                                               
opportunity for the inholders to respond to this proposal.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MR. EBERHARDT informed the committee  that this has been proposed                                                               
since 1991  and he has been  in personal contact with  all of the                                                               
landholders.   He indicated that  the only [difficulty]  could be                                                               
if the land has changed hands within the last 15 years.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:06:59 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GUTTENBERG   reviewed  the  various   letters  of                                                               
support in the committee packet.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
2:07:21 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  WILSON  moved  to  report CSHB  94,  Version  25-                                                               
LS0377\E,  Kane,  4/30/07,  out   of  committee  with  individual                                                               
recommendations  and the  accompanying zero  fiscal note.   There                                                               
being  no objection,  CSHB 94(RES)  was reported  from the  House                                                               
Resources Standing Committee.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
HJR 21-OPPOSE UN LAND DESIGNATIONS IN ALASKA                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
2:07:41 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR GATTO announced  that the final order  of business would                                                               
be HOUSE  JOINT RESOLUTION  NO. 21,  Opposing the  designation of                                                               
any  area  in the  state  as  a  world heritage  site,  biosphere                                                               
reserve, or  any other type of  international designation without                                                               
the consent  of the Alaska  State Legislature and  affected local                                                               
governments;  and  urging the  United  States  Congress to  enact                                                               
legislation to  require congressional approval before  an area in                                                               
the  United  States  may  be   considered  for  an  international                                                               
designation.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
2:07:59 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
IAN  FISK, Staff,  to Representative  Bill  Thomas, Alaska  State                                                               
Legislature, began  by informing the  committee that HJR 21  is a                                                               
resolution that  was sponsored by the  late Representative Elkins                                                               
in  the Twenty-Fourth  Alaska State  Legislature.   That original                                                               
resolution  passed   the  House   and  Senate   unanimously,  but                                                               
unfortunately it  was caught in  the end  of session chaos.   Mr.                                                               
Fisk explained  that HJR  21 is about  local, state,  and federal                                                               
sovereignty over  land use designations, particularly  as related                                                               
to  United  Nations (UN)  designations  known  as World  Heritage                                                               
sites and Biosphere Reserves.   World Heritage sites are intended                                                               
to  protect   and  preserve  places   of  cultural   and  natural                                                               
significance  around  the world  that  are  considered to  be  of                                                               
outstanding value to humanity.   Included in World Heritage sites                                                               
are the Great  Wall of China, Independence Hall,  and the Statute                                                               
of Liberty as  well as national parks.  Mr.  Fisk related from UN                                                               
materials  the  following:   "What  makes  the concept  of  World                                                               
Heritage  exceptional  is  its   universal  application.    World                                                               
Heritage  sites   belong  to  all   the  peoples  of   the  world                                                               
irrespective of the territory on which they are located."                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
2:09:59 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  FISK  explained   that  part  of  the   problem  with  these                                                               
designations is that  they can be made  without any congressional                                                               
oversight.   Therefore, the critical  resolve in  this resolution                                                               
is the  clause requesting  that Congress  pass and  the president                                                               
sign  legislation that  would mandate  congressional approval  of                                                               
any sites  nominated by the  U.S. Secretary of Interior  prior to                                                               
the sites being approved by the  UN.  Part of the difficulty with                                                               
these land use designations is that  they can be used in land use                                                               
conflicts  for  the  purposes  of  preventing  development.    In                                                               
summary, Mr.  Fisk said that HJR  21 doesn't seek to  dispute the                                                               
value of these programs in some  areas of the world where nations                                                               
may need more UN support to  do basic conservation of parks.  The                                                               
resolution,  he specified,  in  no  way seeks  to  end the  World                                                               
Heritage or  Biosphere Reserve  programs as  it merely  says that                                                               
congressional approval  of such designations should  be required.                                                               
The  resolution  further states  that  Alaska's  local and  state                                                               
governments should be consulted in these matters.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
2:11:57 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  FISK  then pointed  out  that  the committee  packet  should                                                               
include an  amendment that clarifies  the locations in  Alaska of                                                               
the World Heritage and Biosphere Reserve sites.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
2:12:47 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR GATTO  moved that  the committee  adopt Amendment  1, as                                                               
follows:                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     Page 2, lines 25-30:                                                                                                       
          Delete all material                                                                                                   
          Insert "WHEREAS the United Nations Educational,                                                                     
     Scientific  and  Cultural Organization  (UNESCO),  with                                                                    
     the collaboration  of the U.S. Department  of Interior,                                                                    
     has    recognized   the    Wrangell-St.   Elias/Glacier                                                                    
     Bay/Kluane/Tatshenshini-Alsek  World  Heritage Site  in                                                                    
     Alaska,  and has  listed the  Aleutian Islands  Unit of                                                                    
     the  Alaska  Maritime  National  Wildlife  Refuge,  the                                                                    
     Arctic National Wildlife  Refuge, Denali National Park,                                                                    
     Gates of the Arctic  National Park, and Katmai National                                                                    
     Park on the Tentative List  of areas nominated for full                                                                    
     status; and                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     WHEREAS  the  United  Nations  Man  and  the  Biosphere                                                                  
     Program  has identified  the  Glacier  Bay -  Admiralty                                                                    
     Island, Noatak,  Denali and Aleutian  Islands Biosphere                                                                    
     Reserves in Alaska; and"                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
There being no objection, Amendment 1 was adopted.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
2:13:31 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
STEVE   BORELL,   P.E.,   Executive   Director,   Alaska   Miners                                                               
Association,  Inc.,  noted  that   the  committee  packet  should                                                               
include a letter  of support from the  Alaska Miners Association,                                                               
Inc.  Mr. Borell said that most  of the sites that he is aware of                                                               
are ones  in which World  Heritage sites  were used to  block and                                                               
harass  mining  projects.   However,  there  are other  areas  of                                                               
concern such as the impact  a World Heritage or Biosphere Reserve                                                               
site would have on drilling in  the Chukchi Sea or subsequent sea                                                               
floor oil  or gas pipeline.   Another concern is the  impact such                                                               
designations would  have on commercial  fishing, whaling,  or the                                                               
harvesting of other marine mammals.   These aren't abstract fears                                                               
as  around the  world such  designations have  been used  against                                                               
projects, he  related.   Therefore, he urged  the passage  of HJR                                                               
21.                                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
2:14:57 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
BOBBY  FITHIAN, Executive  Director, Alaska  Professional Hunters                                                               
Association  Inc.  (APHA), said  APHA  agrees  with Mr.  Borell's                                                               
comments.   This  resolution represents  a long-needed  sideboard                                                               
for international designations of  Alaska's lands.  He questioned                                                               
how  many Alaskans  knew in  [1978] when  the Wrangell-St.  Elias                                                               
National Monument was  created that in less than a  year it would                                                               
be submitted and  accepted to the UN World  Heritage Committee in                                                               
Cairo,  Egypt.   Other  areas  of  Alaska, including  the  Denali                                                               
National  Park   and  Preserve  and  the   Glacier  Bay  National                                                               
Monument, were  similarly impacted  under the World  Heritage and                                                               
Biosphere Reserves programs.  Mr.  Fithian informed the committee                                                               
that the mission statement of  this UN subcommittee is to protect                                                               
natural and  cultural properties  of outstanding  universal value                                                               
against the threat  of damage in a rapidly developing  world.  He                                                               
pointed out  that worldwide several  of these World  Heritage and                                                               
Biosphere Reserves  sites are being  actively managed  by UNESCO.                                                               
Some  of those  management activities  include controlling  human                                                               
population  densities,  access  to  sites,  and  water  shed  and                                                               
ecological  concerns  as  well  as  agricultural  and  industrial                                                               
guidelines.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MR. FITHIAN  related that  there are 22  World Heritage  sites in                                                               
the U.S.  Additionally, World  Heritage nominated sites in Alaska                                                               
includes  areas  in the  Aleutian  Islands,  the Arctic  National                                                               
Wildlife Refuge, Denali National  Park, and Katmai National Park.                                                               
At all  of the 26 sessions  of the World Heritage  Committee, the                                                               
U.S.  Department  of  Interior  has  had  a  full  contingent  of                                                               
representatives.   He said  that those  who have  followed Alaska                                                               
Board of Game issues and concerns  for the past decade and a half                                                               
know  how  much  the  U.S. Department  of  Interior's  management                                                               
values differ  from the [state's]  constitutional mandates.   Mr.                                                               
Fithian related  that APHA would like  to be involved and  have a                                                               
say  with the  decisions  creating these  designations of  public                                                               
lands  upon   which  the   [professional  hunting]   industry  is                                                               
dependent.   He furthered that  the way  of life of  APHA members                                                               
and a  substantial part of  the $200 million annual  revenue APHA                                                               
members  generate   for  Alaska  within  these   areas  could  be                                                               
jeopardized by  these designations.   In conclusion,  Mr. Fithian                                                               
opined that  HJR 21 addresses  the oversight that Alaska  and its                                                               
residents  need  with  regard to  these  types  of  designations.                                                               
Therefore, APHA encourages the committee's  support of HJR 21, he                                                               
said.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
2:18:25 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR GATTO, upon  determining no one else  wished to testify,                                                               
closed public testimony.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
2:18:41 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  JOHNSON moved  to report  HJR  21, as  amended, out  of                                                               
committee  with individual  recommendations and  the accompanying                                                               
zero fiscal notes.   There being no objection,  CSHJR 21(RES) was                                                               
reported from the House Resources Standing Committee.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
2:19:05 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ADJOURNMENT                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
There being no  further business before the  committee, the House                                                               
Resources Standing Committee meeting was adjourned at 2:19 p.m.                                                                 

Document Name Date/Time Subjects