Legislature(2001 - 2002)

04/10/2001 05:30 PM O&G

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
                    ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE                                                                                  
             HOUSE SPECIAL COMMITTEE ON OIL AND GAS                                                                           
                         April 10, 2001                                                                                         
                           5:30 p.m.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Representative Scott Ogan, Chair (via teleconference)                                                                           
Representative Hugh Fate, Vice Chair                                                                                            
Representative Fred Dyson                                                                                                       
Representative Mike Chenault                                                                                                    
Representative Vic Kohring                                                                                                      
Representative Gretchen Guess                                                                                                   
Representative Reggie Joule                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
All members present                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
SENATE BILL NO. 164                                                                                                             
"An Act prohibiting leases under  the Right-of-Way Leasing Act on                                                               
state land in or adjacent to  the Beaufort Sea; and providing for                                                               
an effective date."                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     - MOVED HCS SB 164(O&G) OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
SPONSOR SUBSTITUTE FOR SENATE BILL NO. 76                                                                                       
"An  Act relating  to the  Alaska Right-of-Way  Leasing Act;  and                                                               
providing for an effective date."                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     - MOVED SSSB 76 OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
CS FOR SENATE BILL NO. 156(RES)                                                                                                 
"An Act amending  the Alaska Land Act to  clarify the requirement                                                               
of a single written best  interest finding required for the sale,                                                               
lease,  or  other disposal  of  state  land  or resources  or  an                                                               
interest  in them,  and relating  to certain  disposals involving                                                               
multiphased development; and providing for an effective date."                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     - MOVED CSSB 156(RES) OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATE BILL NO. 143                                                                                                             
"An Act authorizing the Department  of Natural Resources to enter                                                               
into agreements with  a person or persons desiring to  own an oil                                                               
or natural gas pipeline proposed to  be located on state land for                                                               
the purposes  of providing  for payment  of the  reasonable costs                                                               
incurred  in  preparing  for  activities  before  receipt  of  an                                                               
application under  the Alaska Right-of-  Way Leasing Act  and for                                                               
activities  relating to  the processing  of an  application under                                                               
that Act; and providing for an effective date."                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     - MOVED SB 143 OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
PREVIOUS ACTION                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
BILL: SB 164                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE:NO GAS PIPELINE OVER BEAUFORT SEA                                                                                   
SPONSOR(S): SENATOR(S) TORGERSON                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Jrn-Date   Jrn-Page                     Action                                                                                  
03/23/01     0786       (S)        READ THE FIRST TIME -                                                                        
                                   REFERRALS                                                                                    
03/23/01     0787       (S)        RES                                                                                          
03/28/01                (S)        RES AT 3:30 PM BUTROVICH 205                                                                 
03/28/01                (S)        Moved Out of Committee                                                                       
                                   MINUTE(RES)                                                                                  
03/29/01     0856       (S)        RES RPT 7DP                                                                                  
03/29/01     0856       (S)        DP: TORGERSON, TAYLOR,                                                                       
                                   HALFORD, PEARCE,                                                                             
03/29/01     0856       (S)        KELLY, LINCOLN, ELTON                                                                        
03/29/01     0856       (S)        FN1: ZERO(DNR)                                                                               
03/30/01                (S)        RLS AT 10:45 AM FAHRENKAMP                                                                   
                                   203                                                                                          
04/02/01     0903       (S)        RULES TO CALENDAR 4/2/01                                                                     
04/02/01     0906       (S)        READ THE SECOND TIME                                                                         
04/02/01     0906       (S)        ADVANCED TO THIRD READING                                                                    
                                   UNAN CONSENT                                                                                 
04/02/01     0906       (S)        READ THE THIRD TIME SB 164                                                                   
04/02/01     0907       (S)        PASSED Y18 N- A1 E1                                                                          
04/02/01     0907       (S)        EFFECTIVE DATE(S) SAME AS                                                                    
                                   PASSAGE                                                                                      
04/02/01     0908       (S)        TRANSMITTED TO (H)                                                                           
04/02/01     0908       (S)        VERSION: SB 164                                                                              
04/03/01     0821       (H)        READ THE FIRST TIME -                                                                        
                                   REFERRALS                                                                                    
04/03/01     0821       (H)        O&G, RES                                                                                     
04/03/01     0831       (H)        CROSS SPONSOR(S): CROFT,                                                                     
                                   WHITAKER                                                                                     
04/10/01                (H)        O&G AT 5:00 PM CAPITOL 124                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
BILL: SB 76                                                                                                                   
SHORT TITLE:RIGHT-OF-WAY LEASING ACT: TERM & RENEWAL                                                                            
SPONSOR(S): SENATOR(S) THERRIAULT                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Jrn-Date   Jrn-Page                     Action                                                                                  
02/07/01     0301       (S)        READ THE FIRST TIME -                                                                        
                                   REFERRALS                                                                                    
02/07/01     0301       (S)        RES                                                                                          
03/29/01     0859       (S)        SPONSOR SUBSTITUTE                                                                           
                                   INTRODUCED-REFERRALS                                                                         
03/29/01     0859       (S)        RES                                                                                          
04/02/01                (S)        RES AT 3:30 PM BUTROVICH 205                                                                 
04/02/01                (S)        Moved Out of Committee                                                                       
                                   MINUTE(RES)                                                                                  
04/03/01     0919       (S)        RES RPT 3DP 2NR                                                                              
04/03/01     0919       (S)        DP: TORGERSON, PEARCE,                                                                       
                                   HALFORD;                                                                                     
04/03/01     0919       (S)        NR: LINCOLN, ELTON                                                                           
04/03/01     0919       (S)        FN1: INDETERMINATE(DNR)                                                                      
04/04/01     0932       (S)        RULES TO CALENDAR 4/4/01                                                                     
04/04/01                (S)        RLS AT 10:45 AM FAHRENKAMP                                                                   
                                   203                                                                                          
04/04/01     0943       (S)        READ THE SECOND TIME                                                                         
04/04/01     0943       (S)        ADVANCED TO THIRD READING                                                                    
                                   UNAN CONSENT                                                                                 
04/04/01     0943       (S)        READ THE THIRD TIME SSSB 76                                                                  
04/04/01     0943       (S)        PASSED Y19 N- E1                                                                             
04/04/01     0943       (S)        EFFECTIVE DATE(S) SAME AS                                                                    
                                   PASSAGE                                                                                      
04/04/01     0946       (S)        TRANSMITTED TO (H)                                                                           
04/04/01     0946       (S)        VERSION: SSSB 76                                                                             
04/05/01     0852       (H)        READ THE FIRST TIME -                                                                        
                                   REFERRALS                                                                                    
04/05/01     0852       (H)        O&G, RES                                                                                     
04/05/01     0870       (H)        CROSS SPONSOR(S): HARRIS                                                                     
04/10/01                (H)        O&G AT 5:00 PM CAPITOL 124                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
BILL: SB 156                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE:BEST INTEREST FINDING UNDER AK LAND ACT                                                                             
SPONSOR(S): RESOURCES                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Jrn-Date   Jrn-Page                     Action                                                                                  
03/21/01     0756       (S)        READ THE FIRST TIME -                                                                        
                                   REFERRALS                                                                                    
03/21/01     0756       (S)        RES                                                                                          
03/28/01                (S)        RES AT 3:30 PM BUTROVICH 205                                                                 
03/28/01                (S)        Moved CS(RES) Out of                                                                         
                                   Committee                                                                                    
                                   MINUTE(RES)                                                                                  
03/29/01     0855       (S)        RES RPT CS 5DP 2NR SAME TITLE                                                                
03/29/01     0855       (S)        DP: TORGERSON, TAYLOR,                                                                       
                                   HALFORD, PEARCE,                                                                             
03/29/01     0855       (S)        KELLY; NR: LINCOLN, ELTON                                                                    
03/29/01     0855       (S)        FN1: ZERO(DNR)                                                                               
03/30/01                (S)        RLS AT 10:45 AM FAHRENKAMP                                                                   
                                   203                                                                                          
04/02/01     0903       (S)        RULES TO CALENDAR 4/2/01                                                                     
04/02/01     0905       (S)        READ THE SECOND TIME                                                                         
04/02/01     0905       (S)        RES CS ADOPTED UNAN CONSENT                                                                  
04/02/01     0905       (S)        ADVANCED TO THIRD READING                                                                    
                                   UNAN CONSENT                                                                                 
04/02/01     0905       (S)        READ THE THIRD TIME CSSB                                                                     
                                   156(RES)                                                                                     
04/02/01     0906       (S)        PASSED Y14 N4 A1 E1                                                                          
04/02/01     0906       (S)        EFFECTIVE DATE(S) SAME AS                                                                    
                                   PASSAGE                                                                                      
04/02/01     0906       (S)        ELLIS NOTICE OF                                                                              
                                   RECONSIDERATION                                                                              
04/03/01     0922       (S)        RECONSIDERATION NOT TAKEN UP                                                                 
04/03/01     0923       (S)        TRANSMITTED TO (H)                                                                           
04/03/01     0923       (S)        VERSION: CSSB 156(RES)                                                                       
04/04/01     0836       (H)        READ THE FIRST TIME -                                                                        
                                   REFERRALS                                                                                    
04/04/01     0836       (H)        O&G, RES                                                                                     
04/10/01                (H)        O&G AT 5:00 PM CAPITOL 124                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
BILL: SB 143                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE:RIGHT-OF-WAY LEASING ACT:APPLICATION COST                                                                           
SPONSOR(S): RESOURCES                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Jrn-Date   Jrn-Page                     Action                                                                                  
03/14/01     0659       (S)        READ THE FIRST TIME -                                                                        
                                   REFERRALS                                                                                    
03/14/01     0659       (S)        RES, FIN                                                                                     
03/19/01                (S)        RES AT 3:30 PM BUTROVICH 205                                                                 
03/19/01                (S)        Moved Out of Committee                                                                       
                                   MINUTE(RES)                                                                                  
03/20/01     0733       (S)        RES RPT 4DP 1NR                                                                              
03/20/01     0733       (S)        DP: TORGERSON, TAYLOR,                                                                       
                                   PEARCE, KELLY;                                                                               
03/20/01     0733       (S)        NR: ELTON                                                                                    
03/20/01     0733       (S)        FN1: INDETERMINATE(DNR)                                                                      
03/28/01     0837       (S)        FIN RPT 6DP 2NR                                                                              
03/28/01     0837       (S)        DP: DONLEY, KELLY, GREEN,                                                                    
                                   AUSTERMAN,                                                                                   
03/28/01     0837       (S)        WILKEN, LEMAN; NR: HOFFMAN,                                                                  
                                   OLSON                                                                                        
03/28/01     0838       (S)        FN1: INDETERMINATE(DNR)                                                                      
03/28/01                (S)        FIN AT 9:00 AM SENATE FINANCE                                                                
                                   532                                                                                          
03/28/01                (S)        Moved Out of Committee                                                                       
                                   MINUTE(FIN)                                                                                  
03/30/01                (S)        RLS AT 10:45 AM FAHRENKAMP                                                                   
                                   203                                                                                          
04/02/01     0902       (S)        RULES TO CALENDAR 4/2/01                                                                     
04/02/01     0904       (S)        READ THE SECOND TIME                                                                         
04/02/01     0904       (S)        ADVANCED TO THIRD READING                                                                    
                                   UNAN CONSENT                                                                                 
04/02/01     0904       (S)        READ THE THIRD TIME SB 143                                                                   
04/02/01     0904       (S)        PASSED Y18 N- A1 E1                                                                          
04/02/01     0905       (S)        EFFECTIVE DATE(S) SAME AS                                                                    
                                   PASSAGE                                                                                      
04/02/01     0908       (S)        TRANSMITTED TO (H)                                                                           
04/02/01     0908       (S)        VERSION: SB 143                                                                              
04/03/01     0820       (H)        READ THE FIRST TIME -                                                                        
                                   REFERRALS                                                                                    
04/03/01     0820       (H)        O&G, RES, FIN                                                                                
04/10/01                (H)        O&G AT 5:00 PM CAPITOL 124                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
WITNESS REGISTER                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR JOHN TORGERSON                                                                                                          
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Capitol Building, Room 427                                                                                                      
Juneau, Alaska 99801                                                                                                            
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified as the sponsor of SB 164; as                                                                     
chairman of the Senate Resources Standing Committee, presented                                                                  
the sponsor statement for SB 143 and answered questions.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MICHAEL J. HURLEY, Government Relations                                                                                         
North American Natural Gas Pipeline Group                                                                                       
601 West 5th Avenue, Suite 500                                                                                                  
Anchorage, Alaska  99501                                                                                                        
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in opposition to SB 164 because                                                                  
it limits routing options; answered questions.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
WILDA RODMAN, Staff                                                                                                             
to Senator Gene Therriault                                                                                                      
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Capitol Building, Room 121                                                                                                      
Juneau, Alaska 99801                                                                                                            
POSITION  STATEMENT:   Presented  SSSB 76  on  behalf of  Senator                                                               
Therriault, sponsor.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
WILLIAM G. BRITT, JR., Pipeline Coordinator                                                                                     
Office of the Commissioner                                                                                                      
Department of Natural Resources (DNR)                                                                                           
411 West Fourth Avenue, Second Floor                                                                                            
Anchorage, Alaska  99501-2343                                                                                                   
POSITION STATEMENT:   Testified in support of  SSSB 76; testified                                                               
on  SB  143   that  clarification  of  the   DNR's  authority  is                                                               
beneficial,  but expressed  concern  about the  sunset clause  in                                                               
Section 2.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
STEVEN JONES, Manager                                                                                                           
Trans-Alaska Pipeline System (TAPS) Right-of-Way Renewal                                                                        
Alyeska Pipeline Service Company                                                                                                
1835 South Bragaw Street                                                                                                        
Anchorage, Alaska  99512                                                                                                        
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of SSSB 76.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR DRUE PEARCE                                                                                                             
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Capitol Building, Room 119                                                                                                      
Juneau, Alaska 99801                                                                                                            
POSITION  STATEMENT:   As  vice  chair  of the  Senate  Resources                                                               
Standing  Committee, presented  the  sponsor  statement for  CSSB                                                               
156(RES) and clarified the intent of page 2, lines 21-26.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
CAROL CARROLL, Director                                                                                                         
Division of Support Services                                                                                                    
Department of Natural Resources (DNR)                                                                                           
400 Willoughby Avenue, Fifth Floor                                                                                              
Juneau, Alaska  99801-1724                                                                                                      
POSITION  STATEMENT:   Testified on  behalf  of the  DNR and  the                                                               
administration in support of CSSB 156(RES).                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
JUDY BRADY, Executive Director                                                                                                  
Alaska Oil and Gas Association                                                                                                  
121 West Fireweed Lane                                                                                                          
Anchorage, Alaska  99503                                                                                                        
POSITION  STATEMENT:   Testified  in  support  of CSSB  156(RES);                                                               
asked about intent on page 5, lines 21-26.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
ACTION NARRATIVE                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
TAPE 01-27, SIDE A                                                                                                              
Number 0001                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
VICE CHAIR  HUGH FATE called  the House Special Committee  on Oil                                                               
and Gas  meeting to order  at 5:30 p.m.   Members present  at the                                                               
call  to order  were Representatives  Fate, Dyson,  Chenault, and                                                               
Joule.   Representatives Guess,   Ogan (via  teleconference), and                                                               
Kohring joined the meeting as it was in progress.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
SB 164 - NO GAS PIPELINE OVER BEAUFORT SEA                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
[Contains discussion relating to HB 83]                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Number 0100                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
VICE CHAIR  FATE announced  the first  order of  business, SENATE                                                               
BILL NO. 164,  "An Act prohibiting leases  under the Right-of-Way                                                               
Leasing Act  on state land  in or  adjacent to the  Beaufort Sea;                                                               
and providing for an effective date."                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Number 0120                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
VICE  CHAIR  FATE  requested  a  motion  to  adopt  the  proposed                                                               
committee  substitute (CS),  Version  J [22-LS0809\J,  Chenoweth,                                                               
4/5/01], as a work draft.   [Representative Chenault subsequently                                                               
said  "yes,"  which was  taken  as  a  motion; no  objection  was                                                               
stated, and Version J was treated as adopted.]                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
VICE CHAIR FATE  explained that on page 2 of  Version J, language                                                               
was added  on lines 17-25.   However, an amendment was  needed on                                                               
page  3,  lines  7-11,  subparagraph   (B),  to  remove  language                                                               
regarding  capacity  that  doesn't  fit   in  the  bill  in  this                                                               
particular area.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
[Adopted as  a work draft  at the 4/2/01 hearing  on HB 83  was a                                                               
proposed CS,  Version L; the original  HB 83 had been  gutted and                                                               
had language from SB 164 put  into it, and Version L retained the                                                               
employment language and language  dealing with pipeline capacity.                                                               
Senator  Torgerson,  sponsor of  SB  164,  had testified  at  the                                                               
4/2/01 hearing  on HB 83, indicating  he had no problem  with the                                                               
employment wording,  but felt the pipeline  capacity language did                                                               
not fit in the  bill.  Therefore, when SB 164 was  to be heard by                                                               
the House  Special Committee on  Oil and  Gas, a new  proposed CS                                                               
ordered by the  committee was to include  the employment language                                                               
from Version L of HB 83,  but not the capacity language; however,                                                               
the  resulting proposed  CS  for SB  164,  Version J,  mistakenly                                                               
included the capacity language.]                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Number 0400                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR JOHN  TORGERSON, Alaska  State Legislature,  came forward                                                               
to testify  as sponsor of SB  164.  He explained  that the thrust                                                               
of  SB 164  is  to eliminate  the  "over-the-top" [gas  pipeline]                                                               
route,  rather than  to talk  about [pipeline]  capacities.   The                                                               
bill talks about  eliminating a choice by  making the legislative                                                               
finding  that  [the  "over-the-top"  route]  isn't  in  the  best                                                               
interests of  the state because  it wouldn't  include value-added                                                               
uses, for example.   Referring members to  subparagraph (A) [page                                                               
3], Senator Torgerson emphasized  that the capacity question just                                                               
doesn't fit within the context of the bill.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Number 0545                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  DYSON moved  to adopt  a conceptual  amendment to                                                               
Version J, page 3, "taking out  (A) on line 4, and ... everything                                                               
from  line  7  through  line  12."   There  being  no  objection,                                                               
conceptual Amendment 1 was adopted.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
[A  motion to  move the  bill from  committee was  made, but  was                                                               
withdrawn in order to hear testimony.]                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Number 0709                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MICHAEL J.  HURLEY, Government Relations, North  American Natural                                                               
Gas  Pipeline  Group,  came  forward   to  testify,  noting  that                                                               
committee members had  his written testimony.   He emphasized the                                                               
group's opposition  to the  bill, saying  it is  inappropriate at                                                               
this point to be taking options off the table.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
Number 0796                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  CHENAULT  asked  whether looking  at  alternative                                                               
routes is  a requirement of  the FERC [Federal  Energy Regulatory                                                               
Commission] or something that the group  has decided to do on its                                                               
own.                                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MR. HURLEY specified  that a section in the  U.S. regulations, 18                                                               
C.F.R. 380.12,  sets out the  requirements for an  application to                                                               
the  FERC.   Section  12 of  18  C.F.R 380  outlines  one of  the                                                               
appendices required  for a filing, which  includes an alternative                                                               
analysis and  specifies that it  must look at  alternative costs,                                                               
environmental impacts, and so forth.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Number 0934                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  OGAN  said  right   now  there  is  no  pipeline;                                                               
therefore, [the legislature]  is choosing a preferred  route.  He                                                               
added that  Congress already  has chosen a  route.   He suggested                                                               
that the  policy call is similar  to whether the State  of Alaska                                                               
wants to invest  in "fast ferries" or  a road out of  Juneau.  It                                                               
isn't prohibiting something that already  exists, he said, but is                                                               
making a policy call regarding the route.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR. HURLEY  restated his belief  that it is premature  for anyone                                                               
to  make   those  kinds  of  determinations   before  having  the                                                               
information.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
VICE CHAIR  FATE asked  whether there  were questions  of William                                                               
Britt,   Jr.,  Pipeline   Coordinator,   Department  of   Natural                                                               
Resources, who was on teleconference; none were offered.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Number 1168                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  DYSON made  a  motion  to move  HCS  for SB  164,                                                               
version  22-LS0809\J,  Chenoweth,  4/5/01,  as  amended,  out  of                                                               
committee  with individual  recommendations and  the zero  fiscal                                                               
note.   There being no objection,  HCS SB 164(O&G) was  moved out                                                               
of the House Special Committee on Oil and Gas.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
SB 76 - RIGHT-OF-WAY LEASING ACT                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
VICE CHAIR  FATE announced  the next  order of  business, SPONSOR                                                               
SUBSTITUTE  FOR SENATE  BILL  NO.  76, "An  Act  relating to  the                                                               
Alaska Right-of-Way  Leasing Act; and providing  for an effective                                                               
date."                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Number 1258                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
WILDA  RODMAN, Staff  to Senator  Gene  Therriault, Alaska  State                                                               
Legislature, presented  SSSB 76 on behalf  of Senator Therriault,                                                               
sponsor,  explaining the  changes  it makes  to  the 1972  Alaska                                                               
Right-of-Way  Leasing  Act.    In Section  1,  it  increases  the                                                               
maximum term of  right-of-way lease renewals from  the current 10                                                               
years to 30 years; this changes  the length of terms for renewals                                                               
only, not  the length  of the original  lease terms.   Therefore,                                                               
the  renewal process  for pipelines  with leases  that expire  in                                                               
2004,  including the  Trans-Alaska Pipeline  System (TAPS),  will                                                               
proceed uninterrupted.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MS. RODMAN reported that Section  2 places in statute a provision                                                               
allowing for the  extension of leases under  their existing terms                                                               
if the lessee has applied for  renewal but the terms of the lease                                                               
are  still under  negotiation on  the  date of  expiration.   She                                                               
explained that the language proposed  in AS 38.35.110 states that                                                               
the  lease will  be  continued until  the  commissioner issues  a                                                               
final determination on renewal.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MS. RODMAN  noted that Section  3 requires lessees under  new and                                                               
renewed  right-of-way leases  to  reimburse the  state for  costs                                                               
associated  with  monitoring   the  operation,  maintenance,  and                                                               
termination of pipelines.  Under  current statute, they reimburse                                                               
for costs associated  with the monitoring of  construction.  This                                                               
adds operation,  maintenance, and  termination, which  Ms. Rodman                                                               
said  she  understands  to  be   the  status  quo,  written  into                                                               
individual leases  and contracts currently; therefore,  this just                                                               
puts into statute what is already being done.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Number 1385                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MS.  RODMAN explained  that Section  4 amends  the definition  of                                                               
"state  land" for  purposes of  the  Alaska Right-of-Way  Leasing                                                               
Act.    She  said  in  talking  to  Bill  Britt,  state  pipeline                                                               
coordinator for  the Department of Natural  Resources (DNR), this                                                               
is  more  a   preventive  measure  than  to   address  a  current                                                               
situation.  She said as Mr.  Britt explains it, if the state were                                                               
to purchase a highway easement  across private property under the                                                               
current terms of the Act,  prospective pipeline owners would have                                                               
to apply  for a lease  under the Act.   However, the  DNR doesn't                                                               
have  authority for  a Department  of  Transportation and  Public                                                               
Facilities easement.   Therefore,  this restricts  the definition                                                               
of "state  land" to say that  pipeline owners only have  to apply                                                               
for  a right-of-way  permit over  lands  in which  the state  has                                                               
sufficient interest to grant the right-of-way lease.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MS. RODMAN turned  attention to Section 5, noting  that it allows                                                               
for  existing pipeline  leases to  be amended,  upon request,  to                                                               
incorporate the  new provision  for renewal periods  of up  to 30                                                               
years; she  reiterated that  this applies  to the  renewal period                                                               
only.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Number 1529                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
WILLIAM  G.  BRITT,  JR., Pipeline  Coordinator,  Office  of  the                                                               
Commissioner,  Department  of  Natural Resources,  responded  via                                                               
teleconference to  a question by  Representative Dyson.   He said                                                               
the bill is  a good idea.   He also indicated the  DNR has worked                                                               
with Senator Therriault's office as  well as with the TAPS owners                                                               
to craft language that they all support.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Number 1580                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
STEVEN  JONES,  Manager,   Trans-Alaska  Pipeline  System  (TAPS)                                                               
Right-of-Way  Renewal,  Alyeska  Pipeline Service  Company,  came                                                               
forward to  testify on SSSB  76.   Voicing support for  the bill,                                                               
Mr.  Jones   concurred  with  Mr.   Britt's  comment   that  this                                                               
represents  a joint  effort  to  work out  language  on what  are                                                               
basically some administrative changes  to the Alaska Right-of-Way                                                               
Leasing Act.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
VICE  CHAIR FATE  asked whether  there were  any questions;  none                                                               
were offered.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Number 1611                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  DYSON  made  a  motion   to  move  SSSB  76  from                                                               
committee [with  individual recommendations and  an indeterminate                                                               
fiscal note].   There being no  objection, SSSB 76 was  moved out                                                               
of the House Special Committee on Oil and Gas.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
SB 156 - BEST INTEREST FINDING UNDER AK LAND ACT                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
TAPE 01-28, SIDE A                                                                                                              
Number 0047                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
VICE  CHAIR FATE  announced the  next order  of business,  CS FOR                                                               
SENATE BILL  NO. 156(RES), "An  Act amending the Alaska  Land Act                                                               
to  clarify the  requirement of  a single  written best  interest                                                               
finding required for the sale,  lease, or other disposal of state                                                               
land  or  resources or  an  interest  in  them, and  relating  to                                                               
certain   disposals   involving  multiphased   development;   and                                                               
providing for an effective date."                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Number 0081                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  DRUE PEARCE,  Alaska  State  Legislature, presented  the                                                               
sponsor  statement  for   SB  156,  noting  that   the  bill  was                                                               
introduced by  the Senate Resources Standing  Committee [of which                                                               
she  is vice  chair].   She explained  that the  bill amends  the                                                               
Alaska Land  Act to clarify  the requirement that  the Department                                                               
of  Natural  Resources  (DNR)  prepare   a  single  written  best                                                               
interest finding for multiphase development projects.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PEARCE provided  some history.  In  1994, the legislature                                                               
passed SB 308 in reaction to  a series of decisions by the Alaska                                                               
Supreme Court  concerning what the  court characterized  as DNR's                                                               
"phasing"  of  its review  of  various  mining  and oil  and  gas                                                               
projects;  that  bill  explicitly  allowed  project  phasing  and                                                               
precisely  defined  the  scope   of  the  best  interest  finding                                                               
determination.  At  the time, the legislature was  aware that the                                                               
post-disposal    phases   -    exploration,   development,    and                                                               
transportation -  would be subjected to  numerous federal, state,                                                               
and   local  laws,   as  well   as  regulations,   policies,  and                                                               
ordinances; would be reviewed by  numerous agencies; and would be                                                               
subject to public review and comment.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PEARCE  explained that while  the legislature  did intend                                                               
that  there would  be a  detailed review  of the  project at  any                                                               
later phase,  the legislature did  not intend that the  DNR would                                                               
have  to issue  another best  interest  finding as  part of  that                                                               
review.   However,  the Alaska  Supreme  Court recently  declared                                                               
that the DNR  is obliged, at each phase of  development, to issue                                                               
an entire  best interest  finding relating  to that  phase before                                                               
the proposed development may proceed.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PEARCE told  members [CSSB 156(RES)] is  intended to make                                                               
it clear that, first, no  other best interest finding is required                                                               
after  the  disposal phase;  second,  the  best interest  finding                                                               
shall  be  based  upon  known  information  or  information  made                                                               
available  to  the director,  even  if  all potential  cumulative                                                               
impacts of the  project are not known; and,  third, public notice                                                               
and the  opportunity to comment  shall be provided at  each phase                                                               
of  an oil  and  gas project.    The intent  is  that the  phases                                                               
subject  to   this  notice  are  exploration,   development,  and                                                               
transportation.  She  noted that the Division of Oil  & Gas (DNR)                                                               
had  testified before  the  Senate  Resources Standing  Committee                                                               
that the administration is in support of the bill.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Number 0336                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  PEARCE pointed  out  that beyond  the  time required  to                                                               
develop a best interest finding at  every phase of a project, the                                                               
best  interest finding  also could  be  costly.   A typical  best                                                               
interest finding  for a  lease disposal,  for example,  costs the                                                               
Division  of  Oil  &  Gas  approximately  $75,000;  this  doesn't                                                               
include  costs  for other  agencies  such  as the  Department  of                                                               
Environmental  Conservation (DEC)  or  the  Alaska Department  of                                                               
Fish & Game (ADF&G).                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  PEARCE said  although the  division has  never issued  a                                                               
best interest  finding for  an exploration  well, it  estimates a                                                               
minimum cost of $50,000; with  approximately 15 wells planned for                                                               
the 2000-2001 drilling  season on state land,  the division would                                                               
have spent  an extra $750,000 if  required to do a  best interest                                                               
finding for  each well.   Although the division  hasn't estimated                                                               
the cost  for doing a  best interest finding for  the development                                                               
phase,  it would  likely  be  at least  as  expensive  as for  an                                                               
exploration well.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PEARCE informed members  that present to answer questions                                                               
was  Patrick Coughlin,  special counsel  to the  Senate Resources                                                               
Standing Committee, who had experience  working with the division                                                               
when  SB 308  was  passed.   She  noted  that  Jim Eason,  former                                                               
Division of Oil & Gas director, had  worked on SB 308, as had Ken                                                               
Boyd, director of  the division at the time, who  had brought the                                                               
problem  [to  the  attention of  the  Senate  Resources  Standing                                                               
Committee] last fall before he left the division.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Number 0583                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CAROL   CARROLL,   Director,   Division  of   Support   Services,                                                               
Department of  Natural Resources, came  forward on behalf  of the                                                               
DNR.  She advised the  committee that the administration supports                                                               
this  bill and  agrees there  should  be only  one best  interest                                                               
finding, at the disposal phase when  doing a disposal.  She noted                                                               
that  the DNR  does a  preliminary best  [interest] findings  and                                                               
gives  the public  many opportunities  to participate  before the                                                               
findings and the disposal are finalized.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MS. CARROLL pointed  out that the bill provides that  in order to                                                               
phase oil and  gas activities, post-disposal phases  also must be                                                               
subject  to public  notice and  participation.   Furthermore, the                                                               
DNR believes  [the bill] requires  the Division  of Oil &  Gas to                                                               
promulgate regulations  in order  to provide  to the  public both                                                               
notice  and the  means to  participate.   Ms. Carroll  noted that                                                               
online to answer  technical questions was Bill Van  Dyke from the                                                               
Division of Oil & Gas.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Number 0720                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  OGAN asked  why the  zero fiscal  note [from  the                                                               
DNR] doesn't reflect a cost savings.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MS. CARROLL answered that it reflects  what the DNR is doing now,                                                               
which is  what is stated  in the bill.   She explained that  as a                                                               
result of  the court case  in the  year 2000, the  department had                                                               
not yet  started doing best  interest findings for each  phase of                                                               
development; therefore, there is no fiscal impact.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Number 0848                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
JUDY BRADY,  Executive Director,  Alaska Oil and  Gas Association                                                               
(AOGA),  testified via  teleconference  in support  of the  bill,                                                               
noting that AOGA  had testified on the Senate side  as well.  She                                                               
characterized this  as an  important step  forward to  make clear                                                               
what  the  legislature has  always  intended  regarding the  best                                                               
interest findings.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
MS. BRADY  said AOGA continues  to struggle with the  language on                                                               
page 5, lines  21-26, however.  She expressed the  need to assure                                                               
the  public and  to ensure  there are  public notice  and comment                                                               
allowed for major  changes regarding major phases of  oil and gas                                                               
development.   She  expressed her  understanding that  under that                                                               
language, if there  is an oil and gas project  outside of coastal                                                               
zones,  the  DNR  will [promulgate]  regulations  so  that  those                                                               
phases that  normally would be  noticed under the  Alaska Coastal                                                               
Management Plan (ACMP) program will be noticed instead by DNR.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MS.  BRADY  continued,  offering that  [AOGA's]  experience  with                                                               
language involving public notice and  regulations in the past has                                                               
been  that  if there  is  any  possible  way to  misconstrue  the                                                               
language, someone will do so.   She said [AOGA] is trying to work                                                               
now  with the  offices of  Senator Pearce  and Senator  Torgerson                                                               
[chair  of the  Senate  Resources Standing  Committee] to  ensure                                                               
that  everyone's  understanding  is   clearly  reflected  in  the                                                               
language  [of  the  bill].    She  indicated  those  efforts  are                                                               
continuing.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Number 1054                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  PEARCE  suggested  there  is   no  need  to  change  the                                                               
language, but said  her own intent, as the bill  is passed on the                                                               
House floor,  is to read into  the record the intent  just stated                                                               
by Ms. Brady, along with  "the best interest findings intentions"                                                               
that she  herself had stated.   She clarified that the  intent of                                                               
the paragraph  [page 5, lines 21-26]  is to make sure  that there                                                               
is  public  notice; it  will  either  be  given pursuant  to  the                                                               
coastal zone  management program  or pursuant to  the regulations                                                               
adopted by the  department [DNR], but will  not impose additional                                                               
work under the coastal zone management program.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  PEARCE   reiterated  the  intent  of   streamlining  the                                                               
process, as was  intended with [SB] 308 in 1994.   In response to                                                               
Vice  Chair  Fate, she  specified  that  she wouldn't  provide  a                                                               
letter of intent but would just  provide a statement on the House                                                               
floor when the bill passed.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Number 1157                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE OGAN asked whether it  would be appropriate to add                                                               
language  to  the  "purpose"  section of  the  bill,  to  provide                                                               
clarification.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  PEARCE said  no.   She explained  that the  language had                                                               
been  worked in  every  direction possible,  and  the more  words                                                               
there were,  the more  confusion would exist  and the  more words                                                               
there  would be  for a  third party  to try  to decide  what [the                                                               
legislature] intended.  She reiterated  her preference of stating                                                               
on the House floor what the bill does and doesn't do.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MS. BRADY,  in response to  Representative Ogan, said  she thinks                                                               
Senator Pearce's  reading the intent  into the record would  go a                                                               
long way  towards clarifying  it to the  court, any  other party,                                                               
and the agencies.   She agreed with Senator Pearce  that "we have                                                               
been struggling  with language and so  far have not come  up with                                                               
any brilliant  solutions."  In further  response, she highlighted                                                               
the dilemma:   Alaska has a dual set of  regulations, through the                                                               
ACMP process  and the  agencies as  well; in  fact, on  the North                                                               
Slope, local borough  regulations are also overriding.   There is                                                               
almost no way to make that clear in the statute itself.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  OGAN  suggested   perhaps  the  committee  should                                                               
discuss the  supreme court's  "clear statement  doctrine" rulings                                                               
and look at  perhaps incorporating language into  some bills that                                                               
give the administration the ability to interpret regulations.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Number 1521                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PEARCE stated that there is  a very clear interest on the                                                               
part  of the  Senate Resources  Standing Committee  to make  sure                                                               
there  is pubic  notice; part  of  the reason  the committee  had                                                               
struggled over  this paragraph [on page  5] was to make  it clear                                                               
that there  is to  be proper  public notice, but  not to  have it                                                               
fall under  two different regulatory  regimes - the  coastal zone                                                               
management program and  the areas outside of that,  both of which                                                               
the   [statutory]  language   must  fit   when  regulations   are                                                               
promulgated.  Therefore,  the intent is to have  public notice be                                                               
pursuant to  one or the other,  and not to impose  any additional                                                               
work under the coastal zone management program.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Number 1583                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE OGAN  recalled that the Cook  Inlet areawide lease                                                               
sale went  through perhaps the  most extensive public  process in                                                               
the  state's  history,  after  which  the  governor  created  the                                                               
"stakeholders' group"  and opened it  up to another  process that                                                               
was, in  some people's minds,  outside the scope of  the statutes                                                               
and regulations.   Noting  that the  department has  testified in                                                               
favor  of this  bill,  he  asked whether  the  bill would  affect                                                               
something like the additional public process in that instance.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PEARCE  responded that she  herself was "one of  the most                                                               
vocal detractors" of that stakeholders'  process, not because she                                                               
didn't think  it was useful to  have people get together  to talk                                                               
through  the questions  and concerns,  but  because she  believes                                                               
there   was   no   statutory   authority   to   incorporate   the                                                               
recommendations from that process  into regulations, for example.                                                               
If  one good  thing came  out of  the stakeholders'  process, she                                                               
said it was  a clear understanding by some  concerned people that                                                               
even if  SB 308 was being  implemented, there would still  be the                                                               
right to public comment at every step.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PEARCE  explained that  when there is  a lease  sale, the                                                               
successful  company brings  a proposal  for an  exploration well,                                                               
after  which  there is  another  opportunity  for public  comment                                                               
during the permitting process.   Under CSSB 156(RES), there would                                                               
not  be  another  best  interest finding,  but  would  be  public                                                               
comment.     She   stated  her   belief  that   members  of   the                                                               
stakeholders' group  who represented the commercial  fisheries in                                                               
Cook Inlet,  in particular,  had felt  more comfortable  with the                                                               
areawide  lease   sale  after  realizing  they   would  have  the                                                               
opportunity for  public comment  at every step.   Noting  that it                                                               
was the  "environmental community"  opposing the lease  sale, she                                                               
suggested it is  important to have the language in  the bill that                                                               
talks about the  public process "because that's  how we've helped                                                               
other users reach a comfort level."                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Number 1798                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  OGAN asked  whether Senator  Pearce believes  the                                                               
bill  will   help  to  mitigate   future  "stakeholder-group-type                                                               
scenarios."                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PEARCE  replied, "We do  not have any power  over whether                                                               
or  not  the  third  floor   decides  to  pull  together  another                                                               
stakeholder group;  as a  matter of  fact, I  would say  that the                                                               
pipeline council that they put together is somewhat the same."                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
VICE  CHAIR FATE  asked whether  there was  further testimony  or                                                               
discussion; none was offered.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Number 1851                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE DYSON made  a motion to move CSSB  156(RES) out of                                                               
committee with  individual recommendations and the  attached zero                                                               
fiscal note.   There being no objection, CSSB  156(RES) was moved                                                               
out of the House Special Committee on Oil and Gas.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
SB 143 - RIGHT-OF-WAY LEASING ACT:APPLICATION COST                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Number 1890                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
VICE CHAIR  FATE announced  the final  order of  business, SENATE                                                               
BILL  NO. 143,  "An  Act authorizing  the  Department of  Natural                                                               
Resources  to enter  into  agreements with  a  person or  persons                                                               
desiring to  own an oil  or natural  gas pipeline proposed  to be                                                               
located on state  land for the purposes of  providing for payment                                                               
of  the reasonable  costs incurred  in  preparing for  activities                                                               
before receipt of  an application under the  Alaska Right-of- Way                                                               
Leasing Act and  for activities relating to the  processing of an                                                               
application  under  that  Act; and  providing  for  an  effective                                                               
date."                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Number 1930                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR JOHN  TORGERSON, Alaska  State Legislature,  came forward                                                               
as  the  chairman of  the  Senate  Resources Standing  Committee,                                                               
sponsor of SB  143.  He explained that under  current Alaska law,                                                               
the state cannot start charging  for applications costs on right-                                                               
of-way  leasing  for  pipelines until  after  an  application  is                                                               
actually filed.  Therefore, SB  143 says the department can enter                                                               
into  a  memorandum  of understanding  with  pipeline  owners  or                                                               
producers during  the preapplication period, for  example, to put                                                               
a  pipeline in  and then  collect  the costs  of the  assessments                                                               
until the application is filed.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR TORGERSON  informed members that  this is in  response to                                                               
the  $10  million fiscal  note  from  the governor's  office  for                                                               
pipeline work  that [the  governor] wants to  do this  next year.                                                               
He characterized  it as a  "pay-as-you-go" bill, noting  that its                                                               
sunset date  of December 31,  2003, could be extended  easily, if                                                               
so desired; he cautioned, however,  against having these pipeline                                                               
agreements come before [the legislature] "forever."                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Number 2050                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
WILLIAM  G.  BRITT,  JR., Pipeline  Coordinator,  Office  of  the                                                               
Commissioner,  Department of  Natural Resources  (DNR), testified                                                               
via  teleconference, explaining  that  the  DNR fairly  routinely                                                               
enters  into  agreements   for  reimbursement  of  preapplication                                                               
costs.  He noted  that he is in the process  of working with both                                                               
the  producers and  Foothills  [Pipe Lines  Ltd.]  to craft  such                                                               
agreements for  the gas  pipeline.   Acknowledging that  there is                                                               
some disagreement over whether the  DNR has existing authority to                                                               
do  so, he  said clarifying  the existence  of that  authority is                                                               
certainly beneficial.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR. BRITT expressed  concern, however, that the  sunset clause in                                                               
Section 2  has the potential  of precluding [the DNR]  from doing                                                               
what it  has routinely done, and  what appears to be  good policy                                                               
for the state,  after December 31, 2003.  He  agreed with Senator                                                               
Torgerson that  [the sunset date]  is not difficult to  undo, but                                                               
said the  existing standard operating procedure  within the DNR's                                                               
Pipeline Coordinator's  office of seeking reimbursement  prior to                                                               
an  application  -  as  well  as the  rest  of  the  bill,  which                                                               
indicates the DNR has  the ability to do so -  appears to be good                                                               
public policy that should not expire on that date.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Number 2141                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE OGAN  responded, saying it  seems the idea  of the                                                               
sunset date  is to  set a timeline  for this  particular proposed                                                               
project to come  to fruition.  He brought attention  to the large                                                               
amount of gas available in the  Lower 48.  He said perhaps having                                                               
a deadline  expresses the legislature's  intent to  expedite [the                                                               
pipeline]; the longer [Alaska] waits,  the more gas wells will be                                                               
drilled [elsewhere]  and the less  likely it is that  the project                                                               
will be built.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  OGAN also  suggested the  same argument  could be                                                               
used  regarding this  project that  has  been used  about an  LNG                                                               
[liquefied  natural  gas]  project,  since  this  [proposed  gas]                                                               
pipeline would be more than 2,000  miles long, into a market that                                                               
already has a  lot of gas that is closer  and cheaper to develop.                                                               
He said  time is  of the  essence, which is  the message  that he                                                               
believes the sunset date sends.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR TORGERSON  replied that  it is part  of it;  he believes,                                                               
however,  that   if  the  department   is  charging   people  for                                                               
preapplication costs, it is currently  against the law.  He noted                                                               
that Foothills [Pipe Lines Ltd.] has an application in, even if                                                                 
it is an old one.  He stated:                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
     I know  [they] entered  into an agreement  with Alyeska                                                                    
     on renewal of  that pipeline, but you  could argue that                                                                    
     there's  been   enough  correspondence,   although  not                                                                    
     necessarily   an  application   in   writing,  ...   to                                                                    
     certainly say that  that was the intent,  to go forward                                                                    
     with that ....   I think we all know  they're not going                                                                    
     to pick that pipeline up  and leave in three years when                                                                    
     their renewal is  up.  But the law  clearly states that                                                                    
     you cannot  start charging until ...  an application is                                                                    
     filed. ...                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     I'm not  here to  pick on  what they  have done  in the                                                                    
     past, but as far as the  gas line is concerned, ... and                                                                    
     the amount of money that's  being asked for us to spend                                                                    
     upfront  on  this gas  line,  I  believe the  producers                                                                    
     should pay  for it.   Anything that's  reimbursable ...                                                                    
     within regular business terms that  we have done in the                                                                    
     past, they should  pony up the money as  they go along.                                                                    
     And that's what the intent of this bill is.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     And in  any event,  a lot  of this  stuff is  after the                                                                    
     application  is  filed;  there's a  "look-back"  period                                                                    
     where you can ... charge  the money that you've already                                                                    
     spent  on a  preapplication, but  it'd only  be on  one                                                                    
     route.  Now, we can all  assume that we have one route,                                                                    
     but we also  know there's looking at  other routes; and                                                                    
     I  certainly   hope  that  they   don't  pick   one  in                                                                    
     particular,  but  there  are   ...  other  routes  that                                                                    
     they're  looking at,  ...  and I  don't  know if  we're                                                                    
     going to  spend the money  on it or  not.  But,  in any                                                                    
     event, if we do, we ought  to get paid back, or paid in                                                                    
     advance, and this bill calls for that.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
VICE CHAIR FATE thanked Senator Torgerson and asked whether                                                                     
there was further testimony; none was offered.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
Number 2359                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JOULE  made  a  motion  to move  SB  143  out  of                                                               
committee  with individual  recommendations  and attached  fiscal                                                               
notes.   There being no  objection, SB 143  was moved out  of the                                                               
House Special Committee on Oil and Gas.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
ADJOURNMENT                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
There being no further business before the committee, the  House                                                                
Special Committee on Oil and Gas meeting was adjourned at 6:27                                                                  
p.m.                                                                                                                            

Document Name Date/Time Subjects