Legislature(2001 - 2002)

02/07/2002 03:13 PM MLV

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
                    ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE                                                                                  
            HOUSE SPECIAL COMMITTEE ON MILITARY AND                                                                           
                       VETERANS' AFFAIRS                                                                                      
                        February 7, 2002                                                                                        
                           3:13 p.m.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Representative Mike Chenault, Chair                                                                                             
Representative Lisa Murkowski                                                                                                   
Representative Sharon Cissna                                                                                                    
Representative Joe Hayes                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Representative Beverly Masek                                                                                                    
Representative Joe Green                                                                                                        
Representative Pete Kott                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
OTHER LEGISLATORS PRESENT                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Representative Richard Foster                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE CONCURRENT RESOLUTION NO. 20                                                                                              
Relating to declaring September 11, 2002, as Emergency Service                                                                  
Providers and Armed Forces Appreciation Day.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     - HEARD AND HELD                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 33                                                                                                   
Expressing  gratitude  to  President   George  W.  Bush,  to  the                                                               
President's  cabinet, and  to the  men  and women  of the  United                                                               
States  armed  forces  and  declaring  support  for  the  war  on                                                               
terrorism.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     - MOVED CSHJR 33(MLV) OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
PREVIOUS ACTION                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HCR 20                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE:EMERGENCY SERVICE PROVIDER DAY                                                                                      
SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S)STEVENS                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Jrn-Date   Jrn-Page                     Action                                                                                  
01/14/02     1946       (H)        READ THE FIRST TIME -                                                                        
                                   REFERRALS                                                                                    
01/14/02     1946       (H)        MLV                                                                                          
01/14/02     1946       (H)        REFERRED TO MLV                                                                              
01/29/02                (H)        MLV AT 3:00 PM CAPITOL 124                                                                   
01/29/02                (H)        Heard & Held                                                                                 
                                   MINUTE(MLV)                                                                                  
02/07/02                (H)        MLV AT 3:00 PM CAPITOL 124                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HJR 33                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE:SUPPORT WAR ON TERRORISM                                                                                            
SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S)JAMES                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Jrn-Date   Jrn-Page                     Action                                                                                  
01/22/02     2028       (H)        READ THE FIRST TIME -                                                                        
                                   REFERRALS                                                                                    
01/22/02     2028       (H)        MLV                                                                                          
01/22/02     2028       (H)        REFERRED TO MLV                                                                              
02/07/02                (H)        MLV AT 3:00 PM CAPITOL 124                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
WITNESS REGISTER                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GARY STEVENS                                                                                                     
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Capitol Building, Room 428                                                                                                      
Juneau, Alaska  99801                                                                                                           
POSITION STATEMENT:  Sponsor of HCR 20.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MARK JOHNSON, Chief                                                                                                             
Community Health & Emergency Medical Services                                                                                   
Division of Public Health                                                                                                       
Department of Health & Social Services                                                                                          
P.O. Box 110616                                                                                                                 
Juneau, Alaska  99811-0616                                                                                                      
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of the intent behind                                                                  
HCR 20.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JEANNETTE JAMES                                                                                                  
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Capitol Building, Room 214                                                                                                      
Juneau, Alaska  99801                                                                                                           
POSITION STATEMENT:  Sponsor of HJR 33.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
ACTION NARRATIVE                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
TAPE 02-7, SIDE A                                                                                                               
Number 0001                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  MIKE  CHENAULT  called  the  House  Special  Committee  on                                                               
Military  and Veterans'  Affairs meeting  to order  at 3:13  p.m.                                                               
Representatives  Chenault,  Murkowski,  Cissna,  and  Hayes  were                                                               
present at the call to order.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
HCR 20 - EMERGENCY SERVICE PROVIDER DAY                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Number 0077                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  CHENAULT  announced the  first  order  of business,  HOUSE                                                               
CONCURRENT  RESOLUTION NO.  20, Relating  to declaring  September                                                               
11,  2002,  as  Emergency  Service  Providers  and  Armed  Forces                                                               
Appreciation Day.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR CHENAULT  pointed out a  new proposed  committee substitute                                                               
(CS) in  packets.  [Prepared by  the committee aide, it  bore the                                                               
title, "Relating  to declaring  September 11, 2002,  as a  Day of                                                           
Remembrance."]                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Number 0116                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GARY  STEVENS, Alaska State  Legislature, sponsor,                                                               
noted that HCR  20 had been discussed at a  previous meeting.  He                                                               
pointed out that  [the proposed CS] asks the  governor to declare                                                               
September 11, 2002,  as a day of remembrance.   Included are [the                                                               
people on] Flight 93 [which  crashed in Pennsylvania on September                                                               
11, 2001], as well as those who  were at the Pentagon.  He stated                                                               
the intention  of paying respect  to and honoring the  people who                                                               
were  so  deeply   involved  in  that  tragedy.     He  expressed                                                               
satisfaction with the new proposed CS.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR CHENAULT voiced appreciation  for the cooperative effort to                                                               
try to  "round this out"  so it  [encompasses] all of  the groups                                                               
being discussed with regard to September 11.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Number 0239                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MURKOWSKI referred to  the second "Whereas" clause                                                               
in the  proposed CS,  relating to Flight  93; she  suggested that                                                               
the name  of the  airline should  be specified.   She  noted that                                                               
some people  truly fought  to take  that plane  down in  order to                                                               
avoid  the taking  of more  human life  [by the  hijackers].   At                                                               
first,  she expressed  concern that  the  resolution talks  about                                                               
everybody  on that  flight; she  then acknowledged  that all  the                                                               
people on the plane certainly sacrificed their lives.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE STEVENS  agreed it should say  "American Airlines"                                                               
for  clarity.   He also  agreed  that everyone  [on that  flight]                                                               
sacrificed his or her life, even if unable to respond.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Number 0414                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR CHENAULT  clarified that the  first "Whereas"  clause deals                                                               
with New  York City  and the World  Trade Center,  specifying the                                                               
343  firefighters and  23  police officers.    [In the  following                                                               
"Whereas" clauses]  Flight 93 is  the flight [that went  down] in                                                               
Pennsylvania, and  those who died  in the attack on  the Pentagon                                                               
are included.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Number 0527                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  HAYES  proposed  recognizing the  people  on  the                                                               
other planes as well.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE STEVENS said  that is a good point.   He suggested                                                               
it may  go best in the  first "Whereas" clause, which  deals with                                                               
New York City.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR CHENAULT  offered that it  could go after "collapsed".   He                                                               
indicated  perhaps  the airlines  and  flight  numbers should  be                                                               
specified.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Number 0616                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  MURKOWSKI suggested  that if  it were  to be  put                                                               
chronologically, the  first "Whereas" clause might  recognize the                                                               
United Airlines  and American Airlines flights  that crashed into                                                               
the World  Trade Center, as well  as the lives lost  onboard; the                                                               
second "Whereas"  clause could cite the  firefighters [and police                                                               
officers] who lost their lives there.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  MURKOWSKI  turned   attention  to  the  "Whereas"                                                               
clause that  mentions the lives lost  at the Pentagon.   She said                                                               
it sounds  impersonal to say  "casualties".  She  proposed saying                                                               
that  125 lives  were lost,  so it  sounds less  like a  military                                                               
statistic.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  STEVENS  replied  that he  was  comfortable  with                                                               
that.  He  specified that it could read, "125  lives were lost in                                                               
the terrorist attack on the Pentagon".                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Number 0795                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  MURKOWSKI  asked  whether the  125  included  the                                                               
people on the airliner as well as those in the Pentagon.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  STEVENS   offered  his  belief  that   it  was  a                                                               
cumulative total.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Number 0846                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HAYES  suggested specifying  the flight  number of                                                               
the plane [that crashed into the Pentagon], for consistency.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Number 0930                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MARK  JOHNSON,  Chief,  Community   Health  &  Emergency  Medical                                                               
Services,  Division  of Public  Health,  Department  of Health  &                                                               
Social  Services,  came forward  to  testify  in support  of  the                                                               
intent behind the  resolution.  Mentioning that he  hadn't seen a                                                               
copy of the proposed CS, he  pointed out that he'd noted a couple                                                               
of items  in the original  bill that sound  as if they  have been                                                               
addressed.  He  mentioned law-enforcement people who  died in New                                                               
York City as an example.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MR.  JOHNSON  also  said  he  was  pleased  that  the  resolution                                                               
recognizes  emergency responders  in  Alaska; many  of them  were                                                               
involved  in responding  to the  events after  September 11.   He                                                               
expressed hope  that the  revision would  include those  as well.                                                               
He pointed out  that most of the firefighters  and EMS [emergency                                                               
medical service] providers in Alaska are volunteers.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Number 1016                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR CHENAULT announced that the  resolution would be fine-tuned                                                               
and then brought back before the committee on February 12.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Number 1062                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  STEVENS recapped  the  earlier  discussion.   The                                                               
first "Whereas"  clause would  deal with  the two  airplanes that                                                               
struck  the World  Trade Center.    What would  become the  third                                                               
"Whereas"  clause would  relate to  Flight 93;  American Airlines                                                               
would  be added  as a  clarification.   In  the "Whereas"  clause                                                               
about  the  Pentagon,  included  would  be  language  about  [the                                                               
people] aboard the flight, specifying  the airline and the flight                                                               
number.   He added that  in response to Mr.  Johnson's testimony,                                                               
he wanted to include a  comment in the next-to-the-last "Whereas"                                                               
clause about Alaskan participants.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR CHENAULT added  that "lives lost" would be a  change in the                                                               
fourth "Whereas" clause.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE STEVENS concurred.  [HCR 20 was held over.]                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
HJR 33 - SUPPORT WAR ON TERRORISM                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Number 1166                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  CHENAULT  announced the  final  order  of business,  HOUSE                                                               
JOINT  RESOLUTION  NO.  33,  Expressing  gratitude  to  President                                                               
George W.  Bush, to the President's  cabinet, and to the  men and                                                               
women of  the United  States armed  forces and  declaring support                                                               
for the war on terrorism.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Number 1170                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   JEANNETTE  JAMES,   Alaska  State   Legislature,                                                               
sponsor  of HJR  33, explained  that the  [terrorist attacks]  on                                                               
September  11,  2001,  forced  recognition  of  how  serious  the                                                               
terrorist issue is globally.   "They're in our midst, and they're                                                               
everywhere," she said.  Emphasizing  that time is of the essence,                                                               
she said this issue must be put on the top of the list.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JAMES suggested that  the most discouraging aspect                                                               
is  a feeling  of  powerlessness.   Furthermore,  a suspicion  of                                                               
others "totally destroys  our own basic freedoms that  we have in                                                               
this  country  that  we  ...   like  so  very  much,"  she  said.                                                               
Representative James proposed  that a hard line must  be taken in                                                               
order to  defeat [the attitudes  by the perpetrators that  led to                                                               
the attacks];  she cited  poverty and despair  as factors  in the                                                               
"fertile ground" that results in  these kinds of problems in many                                                               
countries, which often are managed  by dictatorships.  She stated                                                               
the need for  the nation to "reach  our hand out to  help some of                                                               
these other people  be able to help themselves  to rid themselves                                                               
of this scourge."                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Number 1353                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JAMES told members  she believes the importance of                                                               
having a resolution  is that "the people who are  there with this                                                               
assignment didn't  necessarily ask for this  assignment when they                                                               
went there."   She said  almost everyone nationwide  supports the                                                               
efforts to  "rid ourselves of  this scourge."  She  expressed her                                                               
belief that  Alaskans are behind  these efforts, as is  the whole                                                               
nation.   Even though  Alaskans are  a long  way from  [where the                                                               
particular attacks  occurred], Valdez  and the oil  pipeline have                                                               
been  listed as  valid targets,  she  noted.   Therefore, she  is                                                               
voicing support and gratitude [through the resolution].                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Number 1443                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JAMES  brought attention to an  amendment proposed                                                               
by Representative Cissna [later  adopted as Amendment 3], labeled                                                               
22-LS1314\A.1, Cook, 2/7/02, which read:                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     Page 1, line 3, following "terrorism":                                                                                   
       Insert "and for the President's effort to support                                                                      
     democracies and promote peace worldwide"                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     Page 2, line 8, following "terrorism":                                                                                     
          Insert "; and be it                                                                                                   
          FURTHER   RESOLVED    that   the    Alaska   State                                                                  
     Legislature  declares   support  for   the  President's                                                                    
     effort  to   support  democracies  and   promote  peace                                                                    
     worldwide"                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JAMES  advised members that she  supports the idea                                                               
behind the amendment and believes it makes HJR 33 stronger.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Number 1490                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JAMES  remarked that she wouldn't  be surprised to                                                               
wake up  some morning  to find  [another attack],  but emphasized                                                               
the  importance  of "getting  on  with  our  lives."   She  again                                                               
expressed gratitude that people are  taking care of this issue in                                                               
a  direct  way, doing  their  best  to try  to  get  rid of  this                                                               
scourge.  She offered to answer questions.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Number 1552                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  MURKOWSKI noted  that  although perhaps  Alaskans                                                               
feel a modicum of safety  [from terrorist attacks] because of the                                                               
geographical  location, many  serious  issues still  arise.   She                                                               
agreed  that it  is important  to send  a message  thanking these                                                               
people for what they are doing.   Calling it a timely resolution,                                                               
she suggested perhaps it should have been sent even earlier.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   MURKOWSKI  noted   that   HJR  33   specifically                                                               
recognizes  the efforts  of Secretary  of  State [Colin  Powell],                                                               
Secretary of Defense [Donald Rumsfeld],  and Director of Homeland                                                               
Security  [Tom   Ridge];  she  suggested   adding  them   to  the                                                               
distribution list as well.   She suggested perhaps doing the same                                                               
for the  Joint Chief of Staff,  so that the message  could get to                                                               
the members of the armed services.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MURKOWSKI also proposed  having a reference to the                                                               
National Guard.  She said the  guard certainly "hopped to" in all                                                               
50 states in order to address any contingencies.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Number 1681                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JAMES indicated  agreement.   She added  that the                                                               
National  Guard  will  have  an  increasing  role  in  protecting                                                               
[Americans].   She also noted  that the President  is encouraging                                                               
more  people to  go  into  the Peace  Corps,  for  example.   She                                                               
pointed  out that  not only  must terrorism  be fought,  but also                                                               
there must be a plan "that  helps these people to help themselves                                                               
in their  freedom issues  that they  have and  being able  to ...                                                               
help  these  little  places  where   they  just  don't  have  the                                                               
wherewithal or  the power to  make changes."   She added,  "If we                                                               
have people  willing to go  do that,  I think we  should probably                                                               
recognize that."  She restated her  willingness to add that as an                                                               
amendment.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Number 1779                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  MURKOWSKI moved  to adopt  [conceptual] Amendment                                                               
1,  on page  2,  line  2, after  "Coast  Guard",  to insert  "the                                                               
National Guard" and fix the grammar and commas.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  CHENAULT  asked whether  there  was  any objection.    [No                                                               
objection was stated, and Amendment 1 was treated as adopted.]                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
Number 1824                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  MURKOWSKI moved  to adopt  [conceptual] Amendment                                                               
2, on page 2, line 12,  after "Congress", to insert "Secretary of                                                               
State  Colin  Powell,  Secretary   of  Defense  Donald  Rumsfeld,                                                               
Director of Homeland  Security Tom Ridge", and  whoever the Joint                                                               
Chief of  Staff is.   There being  no objection, Amendment  2 was                                                               
adopted.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Number 1874                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  CISSNA moved  to adopt  Amendment 3,  labeled 22-                                                               
LS1314\A.1, Cook, 2/7/02 [text provided previously].                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  CHENAULT objected  in order  to  ask whether  this is  the                                                               
correct  format;   he  removed   his  objection  after   a  brief                                                               
explanation was offered.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Number 2040                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  HAYES  objected  to   Amendment  3,  noting  that                                                               
amendments he  would offer  may conflict.   He  expressed concern                                                               
about leaving  out Congress.   He  suggested the  first "Whereas"                                                               
clause could  say "the federal  government has  shown leadership,                                                               
using  their  offices  [and  so   forth]";  it  then  would  list                                                               
President Bush,  the Secretaries,  and so  on, and  would include                                                               
Congress.  The resolution would  require another "Whereas" clause                                                               
discussing Congress  also, which  has just  as much  relevance in                                                               
this, he  said, as the  President and his cabinet.   Furthermore,                                                               
under  the "Be  It  Resolved"  section, it  would  still need  to                                                               
either say "the  federal government, as [an]  omnibus" or include                                                               
Congress.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HAYES explained  that it is nice  to recognize the                                                               
President  by himself,  but  the current  language  leaves out  a                                                               
large part  [of the government].   He  pointed out that  if there                                                               
were  a  resolution  recognizing Alaska's  governor,  legislators                                                               
would object [to not being included].   Furthermore, HJR 33 is to                                                               
be sent  to Alaska's congressional delegation,  although Congress                                                               
isn't even recognized in it.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Number 2135                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JAMES respectfully disagreed,  saying it isn't the                                                               
purpose for which she  did it.  "It's not to  make a laundry list                                                               
of  everyone who  has  participated and  who  hasn't," she  said.                                                               
Although  the majority  of  Congress has  supported  [the war  on                                                               
terrorism], there  has been  some dispute, she  noted.   She said                                                               
she didn't think  it was appropriate, although  perhaps she could                                                               
think about  it further.   She  suggested that  if it  would make                                                               
Representative Hayes  happier, Alaska's  congressional delegation                                                               
could be left  out [of the distribution  list] specifically, with                                                               
all members of Congress to receive a copy instead.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
[Representative Hayes  didn't respond verbally, but  indicated he                                                               
didn't agree with this last suggestion.]                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JAMES concluded by saying she didn't understand.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Number 2200                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  HAYES offered  his understanding  that as  far as                                                               
the war  on terrorism goes,  there is no opposition  in Congress;                                                               
rather,  there is  opposition  regarding  domestic policies  that                                                               
have  no relevance  to  the war  on terrorism.    In the  federal                                                               
government,  he   noted,  there   has  been   quite  of   bit  of                                                               
bipartisanship  when  it  has  involved   financing  the  war  on                                                               
terrorism and supporting the troops.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HAYES said he understood  the desire to not have a                                                               
laundry list.  He reiterated  his earlier suggestion to begin the                                                               
resolution  with the  federal  government,  followed by  specific                                                               
"Whereas" clauses [that include Congress].                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Number 2250                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JAMES  responded that  it isn't  intended to  be a                                                               
partisan issue.   The President happens to be  commander in chief                                                               
of  the  military, and  that  is  where  the leadership  in  this                                                               
particular  issue comes  from.   She  suggested that  encouraging                                                               
[President Bush]  fully regarding  this issue covers  the breadth                                                               
of  the issue.   She  said everyone  knows that  other folks  are                                                               
supporting this issue.   "I don't want to make  this appear to be                                                               
partisan or  nonpartisan or bipartisan  or partisan at  all," she                                                               
added.   "This has to  do with the  commander in [chief]  and the                                                               
decisions that have  been made at the top  level," she concluded.                                                               
"And that was my intent."                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Number 2316                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  HAYES  replied  that  he wouldn't  want  to  vote                                                               
against  this or  any other  resolution.   However,  it would  be                                                               
shortsighted to  not recognize the  work Congress did.   At least                                                               
theoretically,  if the  plane [that  crashed  in Pennsylvania  on                                                               
September 11,  2001] had found its  target, there might not  be a                                                               
Congress right now.   "I think we should recognize  the work that                                                               
those brave men and women are  also doing," he added, noting that                                                               
the  President has  to obtain  funds  from Congress  in order  to                                                               
declare war.  "The Congress is  an integral part of this process,                                                               
and I  just think  that you  have to recognize  them -  some way,                                                               
shape, or form - in this, or  you're leaving out a large chunk of                                                               
your ... government," Representative Hayes concluded.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Number 2361                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MURKOWSKI remarked that  she understands where the                                                               
sponsor  is   coming  from.     President  Bush   represents  and                                                               
symbolizes the  government, in addition  to being  an individual.                                                               
She  said she  had no  problem with  singling him  out, since  he                                                               
leads "from the top down."                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  MURKOWSKI  then   suggested  that  Representative                                                               
Hayes could resolve  his objection by adding Congress  in the "Be                                                               
It  Resolved" clause  [page 2,  beginning  on line  4] where  the                                                               
legislature  is  expressing  gratitude   to  the  President,  his                                                               
cabinet, and  the men  and women  of the  armed forces  for their                                                               
leadership and sacrifice.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JAMES said she had no problem with that.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Number 2428                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HAYES  replied that it  is acceptable to him  to a                                                               
point.  If  it just expressed gratitude to the  President for the                                                               
great job he has done, that would  be fine with him.  However, it                                                               
highlights [in the "Whereas" clauses  and the title] his cabinet,                                                               
the  Secretary  of  State,  the Secretary  of  Defense,  and  the                                                               
Director of  Homeland Security - who  is new in the  position and                                                               
hasn't  really  done  a  lot  yet.   If  people  other  than  the                                                               
President are  included, then Congress  also should  be commended                                                               
for the bipartisan  manner in which it worked  to achieve victory                                                               
too.   It should be  either all or  just the President,  he again                                                               
proposed.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Number 2489                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  MURKOWSKI suggested  another  compromise, in  the                                                               
first "Whereas"  clause:  "recognizing that  [President] Bush has                                                               
shown leadership  at home, using  his office to rally  the nation                                                               
and  Congress".   She explained  that the  President has  rallied                                                               
Congress and set the example  and tone; Congress, reasonably, has                                                               
followed.  She added, "I think it's kind of superfluous myself."                                                                
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HAYES proposed the  wording, "rallied Congress and                                                               
the nation".                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JAMES  said she would like  to have Representative                                                               
Cissna's amendment [Amendment 3] approved.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Number 2560                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  CHENAULT   asked  whether  there  was   any  objection  to                                                               
Amendment 3.  There being no objection, Amendment 3 was adopted.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Number 2570                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  MURKOWSKI  came  up  with  another  proposal  [to                                                               
address the  concerns of Representative  Hayes], on page  1, line                                                               
8,   to   have   it   say  "shown   leadership   nationally   and                                                               
internationally,  building  a  broad   coalition  of  nations  to                                                               
support the fight against terrorism".   She said [President Bush]                                                               
has shown  leadership throughout the country,  which is reflected                                                               
in Congress.  Further in  the resolution, then, Congress could be                                                               
thanked in the "Resolved" section.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  HAYES indicated  agreement  with  that idea,  but                                                               
again pointed  out that the  "Whereas" section of  the resolution                                                               
highlights three  men from  the President's  cabinet; he  said he                                                               
doesn't see  why it  can't include  Congress there  as well.   He                                                               
reiterated that Congress  is who presents the  budget that allows                                                               
this war on terrorism.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Number 2651                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MURKOWSKI moved  to adopt Amendment 4,  on page 2,                                                               
line 5 [in the "Be  It Resolved" section], after "the President's                                                               
cabinet,"  to  insert   the  U.S.  Congress.     There  being  no                                                               
objection, Amendment 4 was adopted.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Number 2685                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HAYES indicated  he needed more time  to arrive at                                                               
wording  regarding  the addition  of  Congress  in the  "Whereas"                                                               
section.  He asked whether the resolution could be held over.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  CHENAULT  noted  that  the  committee  had  moved  in  the                                                               
direction  of including  Congress by  adopting Amendment  4.   He                                                               
stated  his intention  of moving  the resolution  from committee,                                                               
however.    He  acknowledged that  perhaps  Representative  Hayes                                                               
hadn't  received his  committee  packet earlier  enough to  draft                                                               
amendments.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  HAYES announced  that he  would come  up with  an                                                               
amendment for the House floor.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
Number 2778                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MURKOWSKI moved to report  HJR 33, as amended, out                                                               
of   committee   with    individual   recommendations   and   the                                                               
accompanying  fiscal  notes.   There  being  no objection,  CSHJR                                                               
33(MLV)  was  reported  from  the   House  Special  Committee  on                                                               
Military and Veterans' Affairs.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
ADJOURNMENT                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
There being no further business before the committee, the House                                                                 
Special Committee on Military and Veterans' Affairs meeting was                                                                 
adjourned at 3:57 p.m.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                

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