Legislature(2019 - 2020)BARNES 124
03/22/2019 03:15 PM House LABOR & COMMERCE
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| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| HB48 | |
| Confirmation Hearing(s): Alcohol Beverage Control Board | |
| HB79 | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| + | TELECONFERENCED | ||
| += | HB 79 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| += | HB 44 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | TELECONFERENCED | ||
| += | HB 48 | TELECONFERENCED | |
ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE
HOUSE LABOR AND COMMERCE STANDING COMMITTEE
March 22, 2019
3:18 p.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Representative Gabrielle LeDoux, Co-Chair
Representative Adam Wool, Co-Chair
Representative Sara Hannan
Representative Dave Talerico
MEMBERS ABSENT
Representative Zack Fields
Representative Louise Stutes
Representative Josh Revak
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
HOUSE BILL NO. 48
"An Act removing from the exempt service of the state persons
who are employed in a professional capacity to make a temporary
or special inquiry, study, or examination as authorized by the
governor and including those persons in the partially exempt
service of the state."
- MOVED HB 48 OUT OF COMMITTEE
CONFIRMATION HEARING(S):
Alcohol Beverage Control Board
Charles Cross - Nome
- HEARD
HOUSE BILL NO. 79
"An Act relating to participation of certain peace officers and
firefighters in the defined benefit and defined contribution
plans of the Public Employees' Retirement System of Alaska;
relating to eligibility of peace officers and firefighters for
medical, disability, and death benefits; relating to liability
of the Public Employees' Retirement System of Alaska; and
providing for an effective date."
- HEARD & HELD
HOUSE BILL NO. 44
"An Act relating to fees for using an automated teller machine;
and providing for an effective date."
- BILL HEARING CANCELED
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION
BILL: HB 48
SHORT TITLE: TEMP STATE EMPLOYEES IN PART EXEMPT SVCE
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) WILSON
02/20/19 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
02/20/19 (H) L&C, FIN
03/18/19 (H) L&C AT 3:15 PM BARNES 124
03/18/19 (H) Heard & Held
03/18/19 (H) MINUTE(L&C)
03/20/19 (H) L&C AT 3:15 PM BARNES 124
03/20/19 (H) Moved HB 48 Out of Committee
03/20/19 (H) MINUTE(L&C)
03/22/19 (H) L&C AT 3:15 PM BARNES 124
BILL: HB 79
SHORT TITLE: PEACE OFFICER/FIREFIGHTER RETIRE BENEFITS
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) KOPP
03/06/19 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
03/06/19 (H) L&C, FIN
03/20/19 (H) L&C AT 3:15 PM BARNES 124
03/20/19 (H) Heard & Held
03/20/19 (H) MINUTE(L&C)
03/22/19 (H) L&C AT 3:15 PM BARNES 124
WITNESS REGISTER
CHARLES CROSS, Appointee
Alcohol Beverage Control Board (ABC)
Department of Commerce, Community & Economic Development (DCCED)
Nome, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified as appointee to the Alcohol
Beverage Control Board.
REPRESENTATIVE CHUCK KOPP
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: As prime sponsor of HB 79, answered
questions from the committee.
KEN TRUITT, Staff
Representative Chuck Kopp
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions during the hearing on HB
79, on behalf of Representative Kopp, prime sponsor.
PAUL MIRANDA, Firefighter
Anchorage Fire Department;
Member, Alaska Professional Firefighters Association
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 79.
SEAN CASE, Captain
Anchorage Police Department
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified during the hearing on HB 79.
JODIE HETTRICK, Fire Chief
Anchorage Fire Department
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified during the hearing on HB 79.
PATRICK VAUGHAN, Officer
Juneau Police Department
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 79.
JIM STYERS, Fire Chief
Fairbanks Fire Department;
Vice President, Alaska Fire Chiefs Association
Fairbanks, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 79.
RANDY MCLELLAN, Sergeant
Hiland Mountain Correctional Center
Department of Corrections (DOC);
President, Alaska Correctional Officers Association
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 79.
DAVID SCHNEIDER, Officer
Fairbanks International Airport Police and Fire
Department of Transportation & Public Facilities (DOT&PF)
Fairbanks, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 79.
CHRISTOPHER CAIRNS
Juneau Education Support Staff (JESS)
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified during the hearing on HB 79.
TRAVIS WOLFE, President
International Association of Firefighters (IAFF) Local 4303
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 79.
DOUGLAS SCHRAGE
Alaska Fire Chiefs Association
Fairbanks, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 79.
STEVE NELSON, Executive Director
Law Enforcement Officers' and Fire Fighters (LEOFF) Plan 2
Retirement Board
Olympia, Washington
POSITION STATEMENT: Offered information and answered questions
during the hearing on HB 79.
MATTHEW PRESSER, Officer
Ted Stevens Anchorage International Airport Police and Fire
Department
Department of Transportation and Public Facilities (DOT&PF)
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 79.
JUSTIN MCGINNIS, State Trooper
Alaska Wildlife Troopers
Department of Public Safety (DPS)
Glennallen, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified and offered comments on HB 79.
RUSSELL DENNIS, Firefighter/Paramedic
Fairbanks Fire Department
Fairbanks, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 79.
MATTHEW DUBOIS, Sergeant
Juneau Police Department;
Member, Public Safety Employee Association (PSEA)
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 79.
ELIAS LAMB, Firefighter/Paramedic
Fairbanks Fire Department;
Member, Alaska Professional Fire Fighters Association
Fairbanks, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified during the hearing on HB 79.
CODY CARVER, Firefighter
Bellingham Fire Department
Bellingham, Washington
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified during the hearing on HB 79.
EDWIN ANDERSON, State Trooper
Alaska State Troopers (AST)
Department of Public Safety (DPS)
Bethel, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified during the hearing on HB 79.
SHEA HALLETT, Officer
Fairbanks International Airport Police and Fire
Department of Transportation & Public Facilities (DOT&PF);
Member, Public Safety Employees Association (PSEA)
Fairbanks, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 79.
LANE WRAITH, State Trooper
Alaska State Troopers (AST)
Department of Public Safety (DPS)
Wasilla, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 79.
PETER HAWBAKER, Officer
Fairbanks International Airport Police and Fire
Department of Transportation & Public Facilities (DOT&PF)
Fairbanks, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified during the hearing on HB 79.
SAMUEL WEBBER, State Trooper
Alaska State Troopers (AST)
Department of Public Safety (DPS);
Member, Public Safety Employees Association (PSEA)
Soldotna, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 79.
ROBERT BENTLER, Officer
Ted Stevens Anchorage International Airport Police and Fire
Department
Department of Transportation and Public Facilities (DOT&PF);
Member, Public Safety Employees Association (PSEA)
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 79.
SHAYNE WESTCOTT, Firefighter/Paramedic
Anchorage Fire Department
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 79.
CODY FENTON, officer
Ted Stevens Anchorage International Airport Police and Fire
Department
Department of Transportation and Public Facilities (DOT&PF);
Member, Public Safety Employees Association (PSEA)
Wasilla, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 79.
ERNIE BRENT
Seattle, Washington
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 79.
AMANDA WRAITH
Wasilla, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 79.
WESLEY MCQUILLIN, Officer
Ted Stevens Anchorage International Airport Police and Fire
Department
Department of Transportation and Public Facilities (DOT&PF)
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 79.
BEN ENDRES, State Trooper
Alaska State Trooper (AST)
Department of Public Safety (DPS)
Seward, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 79.
ACTION NARRATIVE
3:18:55 PM
CO-CHAIR ADAM WOOL called the House Labor and Commerce Standing
Committee meeting to order at [3:18] p.m. Representatives
Hannan, Talerico, LeDoux, and Wool were present at the call to
order.
HB 48- TEMP STATE EMPLOYEES IN PART EXEMPT SVCE
3:20:00 PM
CO-CHAIR WOOL announced that the first order of business would
be HOUSE BILL NO. 48, "An Act removing from the exempt service
of the state persons who are employed in a professional capacity
to make a temporary or special inquiry, study, or examination as
authorized by the governor and including those persons in the
partially exempt service of the state." [HB 48 was moved from
committee on 3/20/19.]
3:20:30 PM
CO-CHAIR LEDOUX made a motion to rescind the committee's action
on 3/20/19 in reporting HB 48 from committee. There being no
objection, it was so ordered.
3:20:55 PM
CO-CHAIR LEDOUX moved to report HB 48 out of committee with
individual recommendations and the accompanying fiscal notes.
There being no objection, HB 48 was reported out of the House
Labor and Commerce Standing Committee.
3:21:19 PM
The committee took an at-ease from 3:21 p.m. to 3:24 p.m.
^CONFIRMATION HEARING(S): Alcohol Beverage Control Board
CONFIRMATION HEARING(S): Alcohol Beverage Control Board
3:24:57 PM
CO-CHAIR WOOL announced that the next order of business would be
the confirmation hearing for Charles Cross, the governor's
appointment to the Alcohol Beverage Control (ABC) Board.
3:25:32 PM
CHARLES CROSS, Appointee, Alcohol Beverage Control Board (ABC),
Department of Commerce, Community & Economic Development
(DCCED), informed the committee that he was born and raised in
Nome, Alaska and gave a short description of his educational
background and experience working as a state trooper for 20
years. Mr. Cross noted that he is currently employed by the
Norton Sound Economic Development Corporation (NSEDC) as their
[Human Resources] director. His desire to serve on the board
stems from his life experience and vested interest in the
welfare of Western Alaska.
3:27:24 PM
REPRESENTATIVE HANNAN asked for Mr. Cross's view on what roll
the ABC Board serves and if he had an opinion on the governor's
proposal to terminate the board.
MR. CROSS answered that he had not given any consideration to
the governor's proposal. He offered his belief that it is the
board's job to be objective and represent the voices of the
industry, [law] enforcement, and the public. He reiterated his
experience working in [law] enforcement for the Western Alaska
Alcohol and Narcotics Team (WAANT) [Department of Public Safety
(DPS)] where his duties included investigating bootlegged
alcohol. He emphasized the importance of the ABC Board's
existence with regard to licensure and the distribution and
manufacture of alcohol.
REPRESENTATIVE HANNAN addressed the ability for communities to
control and impose certain limits on the availability of alcohol
in their locality. She asked Mr. Cross about his views on
"local option" laws [AS 04.11.491: Local option] and
restrictions.
MR CROSS reflected on living in a community that exercised their
local option, adding that he experienced firsthand the
devastation that occurs when alcohol is abused. He opined that
small communities should have the same authority as the state
has to impose restrictions on substances like marijuana and
alcohol.
3:32:03 PM
CO-CHAIR LEDOUX, referencing Mr. Cross's resume, asked for the
definition of a "Financial Coach Master."
MR. CROSS explained that it is an online training program
offered by the Ramsey Group that familiarized him with all
aspects of personal finance.
CO-CHAIR LEDOUX questioned whether the financial training is
something he does as a hobby or if there is remuneration
involved.
MR. CROSS replied that his initial intent was to create a side
business from it, however he currently only offers his financial
coaching on a volunteer basis.
CO-CHAIR LEDOUX, referencing Mr. Cross's resume, asked how he
gained proficiency in the French language.
MR. CROSS replied that he learned it while at the University of
Alaska Fairbanks in order to get closer to his then-girlfriend
and now wife of 22 years.
3:35:16 PM
CO-CHAIR WOOL noted that the ABC Board has both a rural and a
law enforcement seat. He questioned whether Mr. Cross, having
both a rural and a law enforcement background, noticed "any
redundancy" in his history.
MR. CROSS answered not necessarily. He opined that if a board
member has a [law] enforcement background and is from a [rural]
region they can "provide knowledge behind the issues."
CO-CHAIR WOOL pointed out that the ABC Board has over 1,000
licensees, many of whom are in urban centers and operating
businesses. He asked if Mr. Cross would be able to consider the
issues that arise objectively and not just through his
experience in Nome.
MR. CROSS answered yes, adding that every community is unique
and has its own relationship with alcohol.
CO-CHAIR WOOL asked which issues are important to the ABC Board.
MR. CROSS replied he is not familiar with any "burning" issues.
3:40:39 PM
CO-CHAIR WOOL opened public testimony. After ascertaining that
no one wished to testify, he closed public testimony.
[The confirmation of Charles Cross, appointee to the Alcoholic
Beverage Control Board, was treated as advanced to the joint
session for consideration. Although not stated on the record,
signing the reports regarding appointments to board and
commissions to boards and commissions in no way reflects
individual members' approval or disapproval of the appointees,
and the nominations are merely forwarded to the full legislature
for confirmation or rejection.]
HB 79-PEACE OFFICER/FIREFIGHTER RETIRE BENEFITS
3:41:05 PM
CO-CHAIR WOOL announced that the final order of business would
be HOUSE BILL NO. 79, "An Act relating to participation of
certain peace officers and firefighters in the defined benefit
and defined contribution plans of the Public Employees'
Retirement System of Alaska; relating to eligibility of peace
officers and firefighters for medical, disability, and death
benefits; relating to liability of the Public Employees'
Retirement System of Alaska; and providing for an effective
date."
3:41:14 PM
REPRESENTATIVE CHUCK KOPP, Alaska State Legislature, as prime
sponsor of HB 79, summarized key aspects of the bill. He stated
that HB 79 is a hybrid piece of legislation and different than
any other defined benefits bill that the state has seen before.
He highlighted the multiple levers that keep unforeseen risk
contained, including the eligibility age requirement of 55 years
old, keeping the health retirement account from Tier 4, limiting
post retirement pension adjustments if the plan becomes less
than 90 percent funded, and the ability to increase the employee
contribution. He admitted that there are "less than ideal"
aspects of the current bill, however, it is those things that
"make the numbers work" and keep the state's unfunded liability
to an absolute minimum. He remarked that the current plan
assures employees of a future cash benefit payout, a health plan
that will bridge them to Medicare, and certainty that their
spouses will be covered as well.
3:44:29 PM
REPRESENTATIVE HANNAN inquired as to what the eligibility age is
for spousal coverage.
REPRESENTATIVE KOPP explained that the spouse's eligibility is
tied to the actual employee, meaning that once the employee is
eligible their partner will be too.
3:45:26 PM
CO-CHAIR WOOL asked for clarification on what happens if the
plan becomes less than 90 percent funded.
REPRESENTATIVE KOPP replied that the plan's percentage of
funding is determined by the actuaries who decide whether the
amount of contribution coming into the system is enough to
generate the projected load going out in the future. The Alaska
Retirement and Management (ARM) Board [Division of Retirement
and Benefits (DRB)] would perform a reanalysis every year and if
the projection comes in under 90 percent that's when the levers
come in to play for course corrections.
REPRESENTATIVE KOPP, responding to a follow up question from Co-
Chair Wool, said that those levers include increasing employee
contribution from 8 percent to 10 percent and withholding the
Post-Retirement Pension Adjustment (PRPA).
3:47:10 PM
KEN TRUITT, Staff, Representative Chuck Kopp, Alaska State
Legislature, on behalf of Representative Kopp, prime sponsor of
HB 79, added that if the employee contribution is raised, the
employer contribution can be too.
CO-CHAIR WOOL sought clarification on whether both the employer
and employee will automatically contribute more if the funding
falls below 90 percent or if there are variables.
MR. TRUITT explained that the 90 percent threshold is a specific
lever to the [PRPA]. Once the ARM Board goes through its annual
actuarial reevaluation and finds that there are deficiencies or
accruing liabilities, that's when the adjustments would be made
to both the employee and employer contributions until the fund
increases.
3:49:00 PM
CO-CHAIR WOOL opened public testimony.
3:49:30 PM
PAUL MIRANDA, Firefighter, Anchorage Fire Department; Member,
Alaska Professional Firefighters Association, noted he is an 8
year firefighter paramedic with the Anchorage Fire Department
[AFD] and a Tier 4 member. He stated there is wide support for
HB 79 within the Alaska Professional Firefighters Association
which consists of over 500 professional firefighters and EMS
[Emergency Professional Services] personnel across the state.
He explained that in 2006 Alaska began placing all state and
municipal employees into the new Defined Contribution (DC) plan,
Tier 4, which he believes has generated many unintended
consequences. He described the clearest consequence as the
competitive disadvantage Alaska now faces in recruiting and
retaining public safety employees. Another unintended
consequence from the switch to Tier 4 is the lack of "retirement
security" that Tier 4 provides for public safety employees who
dedicate a career to serving Alaska in jobs that take a physical
and mental toll. He pointed out that, for years, a professional
actuary expressed that Tier 4 would be inadequate for public
safety in retirement; however, this has now been validated by
testimony from the state investment officer at a recent ARM
Board meeting as well as additional predictions by the
Department of Administration (DOA). Mr. Miranda continued by
stating that all the tools and benefit modifications contained
in HB 79 help to provide a reasonable and conservative
retirement plan for public safety employees, reduce risk for the
state, and make Alaska competitive in the recruitment and
retention of public safety employees. He said it is a bill that
both management and labor strongly agree on. He offered his
belief that becoming competitive will help Alaska's public
safety agencies retain highly skilled employees and better
fulfill their missions and responsibilities to the communities
they serve, as well as conserve important dollars that are lost
when employees leave the state. The Alaska Professional
Firefighters Association, he said, strongly supports HB 79 and
recognizes it is a good compromise to address the issues that
public safety faces in Alaska today.
3:55:23 PM
SEAN CASE, Captain, Anchorage Police Department, stated that
recruitment is something that a Defined Benefit (DB) plan could
help with. Having a retirement package that allows for defined
benefits attracts future employees, which is something that the
department is struggling with. He noted that the intake for the
last two academies was 35 percent lower than usual. He opined
that having an increased workforce could impact crime in a
positive because more officers could be available on the street
to initiate activity. He added that working in law enforcement
is a tough job that is both mentally and physically taxing.
Over the last 7 years, he said, the use of force rates has
increased by 37 percent within the Anchorage Police Department,
indicating that violence on police officers is increasing. He
offered his belief that as a community, it is beneficial to
provide a retirement system to the employees who dedicate their
lives to public service.
3:58:54 PM
JODIE HETTRICK, Fire Chief, Anchorage Fire Department, offered
her belief that the current retirement and benefits system has
had a negative effect on public safety and recruitment at the
AFD. She stated that prior to Tier 4 implementation, the AFD
would receive between 800-1,000 firefighter applications each
year. Most recently, she said, the number of applicants has
decreased to 305, majority of whom are from Alaska. She opined
that other states with a DB plan are taking employees away. She
further noted that as a parent of two children who are
interested in EMS as a career, she discourages them from looking
at jobs in Alaska because of the lack of long-term financial
healthcare that this state has to offer.
4:02:03 PM
PATRICK VAUGHAN, Officer, Juneau Police Department, stated that
he has worked as a law enforcement officer for the last 8 years;
5 years in Alaska and 3 years in Oregon. He pointed out that
when he lived in Oregon his DB plan was completely state and
employer funded and significantly more competitive than
Alaska's. He referenced statistics that show the average life
expectancy of a police officer as less than 60 years, so with
the current eligibility age of 65, some officers may not even
get to access their retirement. He recalled several incidents
during which he was injured at work to highlight the physical
demands and difficulty of the job. He concluded by mentioning
that although he had higher pay and better benefits in Oregon,
Alaska is where he wants to be. He offered his belief that the
current bill could get more qualified and motivated public
safety employees here in Alaska.
4:05:12 PM
JIM STYERS, Fire Chief, Fairbanks Fire Department; Vice
President, Alaska Fire Chiefs Association, noted that he agreed
with all the previous testimony and wanted to further convey
what was taking place in the city of Fairbanks. He recalled
that there was always a small percentage of firefighters that
left the Fairbanks department for the larger and higher-paying
AFD; however, now that same percentage of trained firefighters
are abandoning Fairbanks for the Lower-48 after 3 or 4 years on
the job. He added that, currently, there is a 6-year gap
between Tier 3 and Tier 4 individuals that's increasing every
year, which has never been seen before.
CO-CHAIR WOOL asked for clarification on the gap between Tier 3
and Tier 4 employees.
MR. STYERS responded with an example in which a Tier 4 employee
has worked for 5 years and a Tier 3 employee has worked for 11
years, leaving a 6-year gap between them.
4:07:16 PM
RANDY MCLELLAN, Sergeant, Hiland Mountain Correctional Center,
Department of Corrections (DOC); President, Alaska Correctional
Officers Association, stated that Alaska has nearly 900 officers
serving in 12 correctional facilities throughout the state. He
noted that he worked as a correctional officer for the past 22
years and was testifying from his personal experience on the job
and as the President of the Alaska Correctional Officers
Association for the past 8 years. He remarked that the
correctional officer profession is one where experience matters,
and the turnover rate is "dangerously" high. He expressed the
need for a retirement system that "makes sense" and would enable
the state to keep experienced corrections officers; a system
that incentivizes officers to stay instead of encouraging them
to leave after 5 years. He asserted that correctional officers
are being lost at record numbers of over 120 officers per year,
adding that between FY13 and FY17 over 1600 correctional
officers separated, which is over 60 percent of the current
workforce. He said data shows that losing one correctional
officer who is trained and certified results in the loss of an
estimated 130,000 dollars that the state invests to recruit,
train, and certify that officer. Consequently, with the annual
loss of 120 correctional officers the state is needlessly
spending approximately 16 million dollars per year. He further
stated that HB 79 is necessary to improve officer moral,
increase safety and security of the institution, and combat
correctional officer fatigue that leads to poor retention in the
Department of Corrections (DOC).
4:09:39 PM
DAVID SCHNEIDER, Officer, Fairbanks International Airport Police
and Fire, Department of Transportation & Public Facilities
(DOT&PF), stated that he has lived in Alaska for nearly 10
years. He lamented that even though he would like to stay in
Alaska, he is one of the Tier 4 individuals who is looking
outside the state at other opportunities that would offer a
defined pension program. He pointed out that public safety
officers' work is physically demanding and for that reason, can
only be done for so long. He relayed that in Fairbanks, most
public safety workers are leaving after 5 years for the Lower-48
or Federal jobs that offer a retirement plan.
CO-CHAIR WOOL asked if the current bill were to pass would it
encourage Mr. Schneider to stay in Alaska.
MR. SCHNEIDER answered yes.
4:12:26 PM
CHRISTOPHER CAIRNS, Juneau Education Support Staff (JESS),
opined that in targeting only first responders, HB 79 draws a
needless distinction between first responders and other public
employees. He noted that he doesn't reject the idea that first
responders should be treated with "special consideration," as
their job is of "a special and extreme nature." He reflected on
his experience working for the National Alliance on Mental
Health as a specialist on the matter of suicide prevention and
intervention, during which he learned firsthand a small portion
of the immense mental and emotional burden first responders must
contend with. Nonetheless, if a DB system is to be restored to
some public employees there is an opportunity being missed to
restore the system to all public employees. He opined that
although offering peace officers and firefighters a DB system
would alleviate some of the challenges associated with their
recruitment and retention, all public institutions in Alaska
have difficulty with these matters. He offered his belief that
retaining staff in any institution is the key to accomplishing
more with less, which is the very challenge that public
employees are faced with in the current budgetary environment.
He pointed out that in a DC model, an employee's own
contributions fund their retirement, whereas in a DB model the
contributions of those still working fund the retirement of
those that have retired. He further noted that the "fiscally
responsible" return to defined benefits should be a model in
which the number of employees paying into the system is as broad
as possible.
4:15:31 PM
TRAVIS WOLFE, President, International Association of
Firefighters (IAFF) Local 4303, expressed his support for HB 79
on behalf of the International Association of Firefighters
(IAFF) Local 4303 to return firefighters and police officers to
a DB plan.
4:16:49 PM
DOUGLAS SCHRAGE, Alaska Fire Chiefs Association, voiced his
support for HB 79. He stated that the issue constitutes a
"general management problem," which is the reason there is
unanimous support for the current bill from fire and police
chiefs across the state. He pointed out that retention issues
are especially difficult on the smaller communities for whom
losing a single firefighter can be a challenge to maintaining
their day-to-day coverage. He attributed part of the problem to
departments in the Pacific Northwest whose headhunters identify
and approach candidates in Alaska.
4:18:42 PM
STEVE NELSON, Executive Director, Law Enforcement Officers' and
Fire Fighters (LEOFF) Plan 2 Retirement Board, explained that
the LOEFF plan 2 represents all the fulltime law enforcement
officers and firefighters in the state of Washington and is a 12
billion dollar plan that is 109 percent funded, making them one
of the most successful DB plans in the country according to the
National Association of State Retirement Administrators. He
noted that the plan was established in 1977 and has 18,000
active members and 5,000 retirees. He mentioned that he
reviewed William Fornia's presentation on HB 79 that was before
the committee on 3/20/19 and was willing to point out several
similarities between the current bill's proposal and the
provisions offered in the state of Washington. He highlighted
that both plans have a 5-year final average pay period, which in
Washington, has been successful in preventing spikes in salary
that could impact the projected liabilities. Both plans also
have similar retirement ages, conservative actuarial
assumptions, and annual actuarial evaluations, all of which rank
among the best practices for DB plans. He further noted that in
the LOEFF Plan 2's over 40-year existence they have remained
fully funded the whole time.
4:21:53 PM
REPRESENTATIVE HANNAN questioned whether other public employees
in Washington state have a DB retirement system.
MR. NELSON answered yes.
REPRESENTATIVE HANNAN inquired as to why in 1977 police officers
and firefighters created a separate pension system.
MR. NELSON explained that Washington had a previous statewide
police and fire plan that was created in 1971; however, it
became quickly apparent that the benefits provided under that
plan were not financially sustainable. Thus, the LOEFF Plan 2
was created in 1977 for all law enforcement officers and
firefighters hired after that date.
REPRESENTATIVE HANNAN asked how many years an employee must have
to retire under Washington's system.
MR. NELSON replied that they have a normal retirement age of 53
with any years of service, or an individual could retire with an
actuarial reduction at age 50 if they have 20 years of service.
4:23:49 PM
MATTHEW PRESSER, Officer, Ted Stevens Anchorage International
Airport Police and Fire Department, Department of Transportation
and Public Facilities (DOT&PF), noted that he belongs to the
Tier 4 retirement system. He said that most of his statement
had been covered by other testifiers but wanted to offer his
belief that defined benefits work to keep quality people working
in Alaska and to provide a sense of long-term financial
stability. He pointed out that a large age disparity exists
within the department. He explained that the age gap that
generally exists between Tier 3 and Tier 4 can be explained by
Tier 4 officers leaving employment at the 5-year mark, which
also tends to put a strain on those who stay. He concluded by
reiterating his support for the current bill.
4:26:24 PM
JUSTIN MCGINNIS, State Trooper, Alaska Wildlife Troopers,
Department of Public Safety (DPS), remarked that he has been a
trooper for 9-years with the Tier 4 system. He emphasized the
difficulty of his job, both physically and mentally, which is
the crux of his concerns with the bill in its current form. He
directed attention to the age requirement to retire, adding that
some employees will have worked 20 years well before the age of
55 years old. Additionally, he expressed concern with how to
implement "a fair and equitable" way to buy in to the proposed
system and urged the committee to revisit these issues before
passing the current bill.
4:28:00 PM
RUSSELL DENNIS, Firefighter/Paramedic, Fairbanks Fire
Department, briefly discussed the Fairbanks Fire Department's
recruitment and retention problems, adding that if HB 79 passes
it might encourage people to stay.
4:30:18 PM
MATTHEW DUBOIS, Sergeant, Juneau Police Department;, Member,
Public Safety Employee Association (PSEA), stated that the
average officer at his agency lasts for about 4.4 years of
service, adding that in the last 8 years, 18 qualified and
exceptional law enforcement officers were lost to the Lower-48.
Some, he said, even refer to Alaska as the "farm system" for the
Lower-48, as the state of Alaska pays for the training of
officers who end up leaving and going to work down south for
departments that reap the benefits at Alaska's expense. He
mentioned witnessing individuals from out of state agencies
coming to Juneau to recruit officers by offering better
benefits, better housing markets, and a lower cost of living.
He concluded by urging the committee to take care of public
safety workers who sacrifice for the state of Alaska by
considering HB 79.
4:32:50 PM
ELIAS LAMB, Firefighter/Paramedic, Fairbanks Fire Department;
Member, Alaska Professional Fire Fighters Association, noted
that he is a Tier 4 employee and is excited by what HB 79 could
potentially offer. He informed the committee that he is a
lifelong, multigenerational Alaskan and would find it tragic if
he was forced to leave the state in search of a DB retirement
system; however, with the current DC system he can't afford to
stay here and retire at a "reasonable" age. He opined that the
current system creates a lack of incentive to stay in Alaska for
Tier 4 employees like himself, adding that he has seen most
people leave his department after 2 or 3 years.
4:35:16 PM
CODY CARVER, Firefighter, Bellingham Fire Department, informed
the committee he was born in Soldotna, Alaska and gave a short
description of his experience working across the state as a
firefighter, eventually ending up at the AFD for nearly 4 years
before he moved to Washington. He said after educating himself
on what the Tier 4 retirement system has to offer for a pension
and disability, he decided to explore his options in the
Washington area for two reasons: one, the uncertainty of a DC
retirement plan; and two, the possibility of getting injured on
the job and not being able to return to work. He pointed out
that many departments in Washington state offer comparable pay,
good benefits, and a pension with disability, which is why he
moved there. He further noted that if Alaska offered a pension
for Tier 4 members he would never have left.
4:37:35 PM
EDWIN ANDERSON, State Trooper, Alaska State Troopers (AST),
Department of Public Safety (DPS), informed the committee he has
worked as a state trooper for the last 6 years and is a Tier 4
employee. He encouraged the state to move towards a sustainable
and adequate DB retirement [system] for state troopers. He
opined that such a system would increase retention and
recruitment among his division. Nonetheless, he expressed
several reservations about HB 79 in its current form. He
offered his belief that with Tier 5, members may end up
contributing more money from their salary to retirement. Also,
members who switch over would have to wait until at least age 55
with 20 years of service to start receiving a pension while Tier
4 allows for withdrawing from accounts penalty free at age 50.
He pointed out that medical benefits are no better in Tier 5
than Tier 4. He said he is currently eligible to withdraw from
Tier 4 when he turns 50, whereas Tier 5 would offer a later
retirement, no better medical coverage, and possibly increase
contributions from his salary. He recommended that at a
minimum, HB 79 be amended to include medical coverage on par
with Tier 3 and retirement at any age with 20-25 years of
service.
4:39:43 PM
SHEA HALLETT, Officer, Fairbanks International Airport Police
and Fire, Department of Transportation & Public Facilities
(DOT&PF);, Member, Public Safety Employees Association (PSEA),
expressed her support for HB 79, adding that she is a Tier 3
employee which is the only reason she has not left the state to
pursue employment elsewhere. She revealed that her division is
"operating at 27 percent down," noting that it costs 262,000
dollars the first year to train an officer in her department
because of the multiple certifications a trainee must obtain.
She further noted that losing employees after a year or two is
common and it's at the cost of the state.
4:41:48 PM
LANE WRAITH, State Trooper, Alaska State Troopers (AST),
Department of Public Safety (DPS), opined that with a DB system
it would be possible to both recruit and retain experienced law
enforcement officers. He reflected on seeing many fellow
troopers leave for different agencies and be recruited by out of
state departments because Alaska lacks a DB program. He said
that HB 79 is a step in the right direction and would create
incentive for troopers to stay in state.
4:44:40 PM
PETER HAWBAKER, Officer, Fairbanks International Airport Police
and Fire, Department of Transportation & Public Facilities
(DOT&PF), informed the committee he is a Tier 4 employee who has
been part of the Public Employees' Retirement System (PERS) for
12 years. He reflected on a several officers who left the state
because of the retirement plan and as a field training officer
himself, expressed frustration at watching them leave. He
pointed out that it takes about 5 years to become a truly
competent police officer, which is problematic because it's also
the same time employees become fully vested as Tier 4 and can
move on.
4:47:33 PM
SAMUEL WEBBER, State Trooper, Alaska State Troopers (AST),
Department of Public Safety (DPS); Member, Public Safety
Employees Association (PSEA), expressed his belief that HB 79 is
a great step forward and has a low chance of creating unfunded
liabilities for the state. Ultimately, he said, the goal for
public safety personnel is increased recruitment and retention
and the current bill is a "fantastic" start.
4:49:18 PM
ROBERT BENTLER, Officer, Ted Stevens Anchorage International
Airport Police and Fire Department, Department of Transportation
and Public Facilities (DOT&PF); Member, Public Safety Employees
Association (PSEA), said he has noticed a reduction in steady
employees as people leave the state in search of better
benefits. He stated that as a recruitment officer, he has seen
many potential applicants walk away when they learn there is no
DB plan. He offered his belief that without solid retirement,
benefits it will just keep getting worse.
4:51:46 PM
SHAYNE WESTCOTT, Firefighter/Paramedic, Anchorage Fire
Department (AFD), informed the committee he is a longtime
Alaskan and has worked for multiple fire departments across the
state. He stated that his lifelong goal was to work for the AFD
until retirement, however, due to the current Tier 4 system he
is being forced to look for work outside the state. He added
that with his 3 years of experience as a trained
firefighter/paramedic he has received multiple letters in the
mail regarding lateral positions at departments in the Pacific
Northwest that offer DB plans and better healthcare with similar
pay. He said passing the current bill would help fix the
retention issue and make him a happier employee.
4:53:12 PM
CODY FENTON, officer, Ted Stevens Anchorage International
Airport Police and Fire Department, Department of Transportation
and Public Facilities (DOT&PF); Member, Public Safety Employees
Association (PSEA), expressed his support for HB 79 to further
provide defined benefits to his fellow employees. He said he
would like to see the state take a proactive approach in
assisting officers and recruiting well-qualified people by
offering a DB program.
4:54:20 PM
ERNIE BRENT informed the committee that he was a lifelong
Alaskan and a state trooper until two years ago when he accepted
a position with the King County Sheriff's Office in Washington
state. After working as a police officer elsewhere, he
maintained that Alaska's public safety personnel are some of the
best trained and most professional men and women that one could
find. He reflected on several well-trained troopers that have
left or are leaving the state, citing retirement as the largest
driving factor.
4:56:53 PM
AMANDA WRAITH, stated her strong support for HB 79, noting that
her husband has served as a trooper since 2009. She expressed
increasing concern with the level of crime in the state and what
she sees as a lack of adequate support to recruit and retain
well-qualified officers. She said that she and her husband are
apprehensive as they plan for their future and for retirement,
adding that they have watched many troopers leave Alaska for
Lower-48 jobs because those jobs offer a DB plan. She concluded
by urging committee members to support HB 79.
4:59:57 PM
WESLEY MCQUILLIN, Officer, Ted Stevens Anchorage International
Airport Police and Fire Department, Department of Transportation
and Public Facilities (DOT&PF), noted that he is a lifelong
Alaskan and has been a Tier 4 employee since 2007. He said he
finds it difficult not to explore private sector and out-of-
state options that offer competitive alternatives regarding
retirement and benefits. The constant turnover he's experienced
in the department resulted in limited experience and
compromising situations. He offered his belief that HB 79 is a
sustainable option.
5:01:10 PM
BEN ENDRES, State Trooper, Alaska State Trooper (AST),
Department of Public Safety (DPS), noted that he is a Tier 4
employee and wanted to share some of his personal experience
working as a trooper. He reflected on troopers who left the
state for jobs that offered better health benefits and a DB
system. He concluded by urging the committee to support the
current piece of legislation.
5:03:46 PM
CO-CHAIR WOOL closed public testimony and thanked all the
testifiers for highlighting the urgency and need for HB 79.
REPRESENTATIVE KOPP offered his understanding from hearing the
testimony that Alaska's public safety workers "are getting
ground down in the current system that we have." He referenced
"finance numbers" that show Alaska turning over "tens of
millions of dollars in training on a regular basis that is going
out of state." He concluded by thanking the testifiers in the
room for coming.
CO-CHAIR WOOL announced that HB 79 was held over.
5:06:01 PM
ADJOURNMENT
There being no further business before the committee, the House
Labor and Commerce Standing Committee meeting was adjourned at
5:06 p.m.
| Document Name | Date/Time | Subjects |
|---|---|---|
| Charles Cross_Redacted.pdf |
HL&C 3/22/2019 3:15:00 PM |
|
| HB79 version U.pdf |
HL&C 3/20/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 3/22/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 3/25/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 4/1/2019 3:15:00 PM |
HB 79 |
| HB79 Sponser Statement ver U.pdf |
HL&C 3/20/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 3/22/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 3/25/2019 3:15:00 PM |
HB 79 |
| HB79 Sectional Analysis ver U 3.12.2019.pdf |
HL&C 3/20/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 3/22/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 3/25/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 4/1/2019 3:15:00 PM |
HB 79 |
| HB79 Additional Information APFO Recruitment Retention Report 3.11.2019.pdf |
HL&C 3/20/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 3/22/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 3/25/2019 3:15:00 PM |
HB 79 |
| HB79 Additional Information DPS Commissioned Employee Engagement Survey Results Overview December 2017 3.11.2019.pdf |
HL&C 3/20/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 3/22/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 3/25/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 4/1/2019 3:15:00 PM |
HB 79 |
| HB79 PERS Tier Comparisons for Bill 3.18.2019.pdf |
HL&C 3/20/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 3/22/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 3/25/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 4/1/2019 3:15:00 PM |
HB 79 |
| HB 79. Backup. Letter of Opposition.pdf |
HL&C 3/20/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 3/22/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 3/25/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 4/1/2019 3:15:00 PM |
HB 79 |
| HB 79. Backup. Letters of Support.pdf |
HL&C 3/20/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 3/22/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 3/25/2019 3:15:00 PM |
HB 79 |
| HB79 Additional Information DPS Recruitment-Retention Plan Overview 3.11.2019.pdf |
HL&C 3/20/2019 3:15:00 PM HL&C 3/22/2019 3:15:00 PM |
HB 79 |