01/28/2008 03:00 PM House LABOR & COMMERCE
| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| HB315 | |
| HB320 | |
| Adjourn |
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| *+ | HB 315 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| *+ | HB 320 | TELECONFERENCED | |
ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE
HOUSE LABOR AND COMMERCE STANDING COMMITTEE
January 28, 2008
3:02 p.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Representative Kurt Olson, Chair
Representative Mark Neuman, Vice Chair
Representative Carl Gatto
Representative Gabrielle LeDoux
Representative Jay Ramras
Representative Robert L. "Bob" Buch
Representative Berta Gardner
MEMBERS ABSENT
All members present
OTHER LEGISLATORS PRESENT
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
HOUSE BILL NO. 315
"An Act extending the termination date of the Big Game
Commercial Services Board; and providing for an effective date."
- MOVED HB 315 OUT OF COMMITTEE
HOUSE BILL NO. 320
"An Act relating to certification of search and rescue personnel
and organizations; requiring certain search and rescue personnel
to be considered state employees for purposes of workers'
compensation coverage; and allowing municipalities to elect to
provide workers' compensation insurance coverage for search and
rescue personnel."
- HEARD AND HELD
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION
BILL: HB 315
SHORT TITLE: EXTEND BIG GAME COMMERCIAL SERVICES BOARD
SPONSOR(s): RULES BY REQUEST OF LEG BUDGET & AUDIT
01/15/08 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
01/15/08 (H) L&C, FIN
01/28/08 (H) L&C AT 3:00 PM CAPITOL 17
BILL: HB 320
SHORT TITLE: SEARCH & RESCUE: CERTIFICATION/WORK.COMP
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) MEYER
01/15/08 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
01/15/08 (H) L&C, FIN
01/28/08 (H) L&C AT 3:00 PM CAPITOL 17
WITNESS REGISTER
LINDA HAY, Staff
To Representative Ralph Samuels
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Presented HB 315 to the committee.
PAT DAVIDSON, Legislative Auditor
Division of Legislative Audit
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Provided comments on the audit for the Big
Game Commercial Services Board (BGCSB) during the discussion of
HB 315.
PAUL JOHNSON, Chair
Big Game Commercial Services Board (BGCSB)
Elfin Cove, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Provided comments and responded to
questions during discussion of HB 315.
JENNIFER STRICKLER, Chief
Professional Licensing, Juneau Office
Department of Commerce, Community, & Economic Development
(DCCED)
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Provided comments and responded to
questions during discussion of HB 315.
RICHARD ROHRER, Guide-Outfitter Member
Big Game Commercial Services Board (BGCSB)
Kodiak, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Provided comments and responded to
questions during discussion of HB 315.
REPRESENTATIVE KEVIN MEYER
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: As sponsor of HB 320, presented the bill
and responded to questions.
MIKE PAWLOWSKI, Staff
To Representative Kevin Meyer
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions on behalf of
Representative Kevin Meyer on HB 320.
RODNEY DIAL, Lieutenant; Deputy Commander
A Detachment
Division of Alaska State Troopers (AST)
Department of Public Safety (DPS)
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Responded to questions on HB 320.
CORY AIST, President
Alaska Search and Rescue Association (ASARA)
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Provided comments during discussion of HB
320.
CHUCK SPRINGER, Past President
Alaska Search and Rescue Association (ASARA)
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Provided comments during discussion of HB
320.
PAUL LISANKIE, Director
Central Office
Division of Workers' Compensation
Department of Labor & Workforce Development
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions during discussion of HB
320.
ACTION NARRATIVE
CHAIR KURT OLSON called the House Labor and Commerce Standing
Committee meeting to order at 3:02:48 PM. Representatives Buch,
Neuman, Ramras, and Olson were present at the call to order.
Representatives Ledoux, Gardner, and Gatto arrived as the
meeting was in progress.
HB 315-EXTEND BIG GAME COMMERCIAL SERVICES BOARD
3:03:00 PM
CHAIR OLSON announced that the first order of business would be
HOUSE BILL NO. 315, "An Act extending the termination date of
the Big Game Commercial Services Board; and providing for an
effective date."
3:03:15 PM
LINDA HAY, Staff to Representative Ralph Samuels, Alaska State
Legislature, explained that HB 315 was introduced by the
Legislative Budget and Audit Committee and would extend the
sunset date of the Big Game Commercial Services Board (BGCSB)
until June 30, 2012, which complies with the Division of
Legislative Audit which recently reviewed the activities of the
BGCSB. She said that Pat Davidson, Legislative Auditor, will
walk the committee through the findings and recommendations of
the audit.
3:03:40 PM
PAT DAVIDSON, Legislative Auditor, Division of Legislative
Audit, Alaska State Legislature, explained that the audit report
recommended the following statutory change: to extend the
termination date to 2012, which is a four-year extension of the
BGCSB. She noted that oftentimes an audit will recommend
extending a board for eight years, but since the BGCSB was
reconstituted only a couple of years ago, the auditor
recommended extending the board only four years. That
recommendation allows the auditors to review how well the BGCSB
is functioning in four years and to address any issues earlier.
The other issues identified in the audit were administrative
issues that needed to be dealt with by the Division of
Occupational Licensing, Department of Commerce, Community, &
Economic Development (DCCED). She said that no deficiencies
surfaced with the BGCSB.
3:04:37 PM
REPRESENTATIVE BUCH asked Ms. Davidson to review the first three
finding and recommendations as listed on page 9 of the audit.
MS. DAVIDSON reviewed the findings and recommendations and
stated that the audit recommends that the Division of
Corporations, Business, and Professional Licensing should be
certain that its staff assigned to the BGCSB adheres to statute,
regulations, and policy and procedures for efficient support of
the BGCSB's day-to-day operations. She noted that some of the
licensing files were missing certain documents. She explained
that generally the auditor examines files for completeness and
follows-up on any deficiencies. In this case, the audit
identified that the licensing examiner needs to gather and
compile additional information for the individual licensing
files. With regard to the second recommendation, the audit
revealed that one examination did not have adequate public
notice. While the aforementioned is a problem, if a person is
sitting for an exam, he/she is not generally going to rely
solely on the public notice of the examination for information.
Although the audit revealed public noticing as a deficiency that
should be addressed, it was not of substantial concern to the
auditor, she related. The third finding was that the proposed
regulations issued by the BGCSB were not issued in a timely
manner. She said the auditor found that the licensing support
for this board was not "up to snuff". Although staff attempted
to public notice the regulations and put them in draft form,
they did not follow the right sequence. Normally these items
individually would not warrant a recommendation, but taken as a
whole, the auditor found the deficiencies were significant
enough to warrant a recommendation to DCCED.
3:07:49 PM
REPRESENTATIVE BUCH inquired as to whether these issues have
been resolved to the auditor's satisfaction.
MS. DAVIDSON answered that DCCED responded that it would address
the issues, and did make some staff changes.
REPRESENTATIVE NEUMAN requested that Ms. Davidson explain the
recommendation to review licensing fees.
MS. DAVIDSON explained that the BGCSB is required to be
financially supported by its fees. The auditor found that the
costs of operating the board exceeded its incoming revenues.
While the auditor does not recommend which particular fee should
be addressed, the auditor does identify that the revenues need
to be increased. She explained that is up to the division to
ensure that the fees are sufficient; however, the division
usually works with the board to determine which fees should be
increased.
3:09:14 PM
REPRESENTATIVE NEUMAN inquired as to whether fee increases will
mean an increase in hunting license fees.
MS. DAVIDSON said that the fees are license fees generated by
master guide-outfitters, registered guide-outfitters, Class A
assistant guide-outfitters, and assistant guide-outfitters. The
sport hunting and fishing license fees and do not support the
BGCSB, but are deposited into the Fish and Game Fund.
REPRESENTATIVE NEUMAN asked who currently serves on the state
lands subcommittee of the BGCSB.
MS. DAVIDSON said she did not know.
3:10:29 PM
PAUL JOHNSON, Chair, Big Game Commercial Services Board (BGCSB),
stated that the primary member of the BGCSB State Lands
subcommittee is Robert Fithian. The State Lands subcommittee
was formed by the BGCSB to identify and address problems guide-
outfitters had encountered on state lands and to make
recommendations to the board. He said the subcommittee
identified some ethical issues that the BGCSB dealt with and Mr.
Fithian has been working with the Department of Natural
Resources (DNR) to resolve other issues.
MR. JOHNSON, in response to a question by Representative Neuman,
said that the State Lands Subcommittee was established by the
BGCSB and is charged to identify problems and coordinate its
efforts with state agencies. He noted that Mr. Fithian has had
major discussions with the Department of Natural Resources
(DNR).
3:12:17 PM
REPRESENTATIVE NEUMAN asked more specifically about the work
done by the state lands subcommittee.
MR. JOHNSON further responded that when the BGCSB was
reactivated a couple of years ago, a number of guide-outfitters
who guide-outfit on state lands complained that the permitting
process and rules are complex. He added that while the BGCSB
would like to take action to address the issues identified, the
BGCSB lacks the statutory authority to do so.
3:13:18 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GATTO asked for clarification of the
recommendation that recommends that the board cease the
electronic accumulation of information gathered from hunt
records and transporter reports. He opined that sometimes it is
best to not collect information because it is just stored and is
unusable information.
MS. DAVIDSON explained that the auditor's role is to control and
verify data, and therefore the recommendation was highly
unusual. However, prior to the reinstatement of the BGCSB, the
Division of Legislative Audit found that DCCED was keeping
enormous amounts of records that only the auditor ever asked to
use. She said that the auditor reviewed the amount of effort
involved to compile the data, and while many people thought
[certain individuals] were using the data, it seemed that no one
was using the data. She noted that DCCED disagrees with this
recommendation, and therefore the recommendation is designed to
have DCCED identify its users to ensure that the data is
maintained in a useable format for the users. She related that
the auditor found BGCSB staff in the process of keypunching very
old hunt records. While that data might not have been used
because it was not previously available, considerable efforts
were being taken to enter the data. She suggested that perhaps
a digitized hunt record with a searchable data base might be
used. However, until the users are identified, DCCED staff
should not invest a lot of time and energy into the data entry
effort, she opined.
3:15:54 PM
REPRESENTATIVE BUCH referred to a letter in the committee packet
and asked whether someone was present to speak to the request by
Commissioner Notti that DCCED be allowed to retain the
information [contained in hunt records].
MS. DAVIDSON reiterated that the recommendation is based on the
fact that no one uses the records. If users can be identified,
the division is not opposed to the data being collected.
3:16:42 PM
JENNIFER STRICKLER, Chief, Professional Licensing, Juneau
Office, Department of Commerce, Community, & Economic
Development (DCCED), related that the specific requirement to
collect the data has been a statutory requirement for many
years. She explained that guide-outfitters must submit a
financial remuneration form for each hunt, which is by statute a
confidential report that represents the guide/client contract.
She explained that the requirement for the report remains in
statute, and thus DCCED continues to collect the data. The data
is used primarily by law enforcement agencies, particularly by
the Department of Public Safety enforcement officers. There
does not seem to be widespread interest outside law enforcement
agency requests for the hunt records, she noted. She outlined
the process a licensing examiner follows when a trooper requests
copies of hunt data, and that the Division of Corporations,
Business, and Professional Licensing (DCBPL) has been short
staffed so that only one licensing staff assigned to the BGCSB
is available to compile and certify copies of the hunt data.
Since staff's primary duties include issuing licenses and
preparing for examinations, the BGCSB staff has not been able to
provide hunt record information in a timely manner. She said
that the division is in the process of entering the data in an
electronic format so that troopers and other enforcement
agencies will be able to do their own queries and download the
specific reports. She explained that the DCCED has reduced its
backlog and has completed the data entry for transporter
activity forms from 1993 to 2007. She noted that the division
is currently entering guide-outfitter hunt records for 2007, and
will work backwards year-by-year to capture the earlier data.
3:19:46 PM
REPRESENTATIVE BUCH inquired as to whether other states maintain
detailed hunt records.
MS. STRICKLER said she was not sure. The state and federal
wildlife officers support the division's efforts to maintain the
hunt records, she related.
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX pointed out that whether to extend the
BGCSB is the matter before the committee. She expressed support
to extend the BGCSB.
CHAIR OLSON noted that the only the only matter before the
committee with respect to HB 315 is to extend the BGCSB until
2012.
MS. DAVIDSON explained that extending the sunset date in HB 315
is only matter that currently requires a statutory change. The
auditor's report provided meets a statutory requirement for the
Division of Legislative Audit, which examines a variety of
issues pertaining to the BGCSB. She noted that if the auditors
had found substantial ongoing problems, they would make
recommendations for statutory changes as remedies. In this
instance, the recommendations are more for the committee's
information to better understand how the board functions and how
well the staff supports the board functions. She noted the
audit recommends a four-year extension of the board, and it also
highlights some areas that are necessary to improve the
administrative activities of the board.
3:22:44 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER asked if anyone has requested the data
now that it is accessible. She further asked whether requests
are for data in the 1980s or for more recent year's hunts.
MS. STRICKLER responded that other agencies have expressed
interest in hunt records. In fact, there are a few pending
requests, including ones from federal enforcement officers and
the DPS officers in Fairbanks. She highlighted that any agency
requesting the information must have a secure web site in order
to access the information. As far as the data entry, DCCED has
asked the BGCSB whether it can cut off at a certain date. Some
agencies have also offered to offset the costs of data entry,
but thus far the division has yet to formulate a specific fee
for accessing the data, although it remains a possibility.
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER added that perhaps charging a fee would
help to offset the $55,000 deficit of the BGCSB, and inquired as
to whether the records need to go back as far as 15-20 years.
3:25:02 PM
MS. DAVIDSON, responded to a question by Representative Gatto
whether the board membership was lopsided, answered that with
respect to the number of public members on the board vis-à-vis
the number of guide-outfitters serving on the board, that most
occupational licensing boards have a majority membership of
licensed professionals to represent the board.
3:25:58 PM
MR. JOHNSON stated that, in his view, the 10-year gap without a
board did not help the industry, although in some ways it was a
healthy process. He noted that guide-outfitting is a $200
million industry for the state. In response to an earlier
question about hunt records, he recommended that the division
maintain at least three years of back records. He offered that
the nine-member board consists of two members who are private
landholders, two members who are transporters, two members who
are registered guides, [two] who are public members, and one
member who serves on the Board of Game and functions as a
liaison between the BGCSB and the Board of Game. He asked the
committee to support extending the BGCSB until 2012.
3:27:45 PM
REPRESENTATIVE NEUMAN inquired as to whether a person needs a
transporter's license to transport game by air. For instance,
would a constituent who lives near Skwentna and hunts, need a
transporter's license.
MR. JOHNSON answered that there is not a specific requirement
for a transporter's license in order to transport game by air.
However, if the person who is transporting game is compensated,
then he/she must hold a commercial operator's certificate issued
by the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) under Part 135,
which allows an operator to charge more than a point-to-point
fee. The operator would also have to have a transporter's
license. He noted there have not been any recent changes to the
transporter requirements. He gave a history of the BGCSB, which
he said stemmed from a task force chaired by Henry Springer that
was created in 1991, when the Guide Board was changed to the
BGCSB. The BGCSB sunset happened in 1995 over a litany of
issues, but nothing has changed since 1991 in terms of
qualifications, he stated.
3:29:46 PM
REPRESENTATIVE NEUMAN posed an example in which he hunted with
his friend in Skwentna. He asked whether the friend would be
required to have a transporter's license in order to haul his
gear or transport his moose.
MR. JOHNSON specified that if the constituent is paid for his
services, he would be required to have a transporter's license.
He outlined the requirements for a transporter license, which
include: an application, fees, activity reports, and
documentation whether he/she provides air services and holds a
commercial operator's certificate issued by the Federal Aviation
Administration (FAA) under Part 135, and proof of insurance.
3:30:50 PM
REPRESENTATIVE NEUMAN inquired as to whether someone would be
issued a citation for transporting game without a license.
MR. JOHNSON answered yes, and added that several people have
been cited for not following the reporting requirements under
state statute.
3:31:37 PM
RICHARD ROHRER, Big Game Commercial Services Board (BGCSB)
Guide-Outfitter board member, encouraged the committee to
reauthorize the BGCSB. He explained that the BGCSB members work
well together and that he is available to answer questions.
3:32:13 PM
CHAIR OLSON upon determining no one else wished to testify on HB
315 closed the public testimony.
3:32:34 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER moved to report HB 315 out of the House
Labor and Commerce Standing Committee with individual
recommendations and the accompanying fiscal notes. There being
no objection, HB 315 was reported from the House Labor and
Commerce Standing Committee.
3:32:46 PM
The committee took an at-ease from 3:32 p.m. to 3:35 p.m.
HB 320-SEARCH & RESCUE: CERTIFICATION/WORK.COMP
3:35:31 PM
CHAIR OLSON announced that the next order of business would be
HOUSE BILL NO. 320, "An Act relating to certification of search
and rescue personnel and organizations; requiring certain search
and rescue personnel to be considered state employees for
purposes of workers' compensation coverage; and allowing
municipalities to elect to provide workers' compensation
insurance coverage for search and rescue personnel."
REPRESENTATIVE KEVIN MEYER, Alaska State Legislature, speaking
as the prime sponsor, explained that HB 320 addresses providing
workers' compensation for search and rescue volunteers.
Alaskans live here to enjoy and explore the wilderness, although
exploring can be a bit dangerous and sometimes people needed to
be rescued, he remarked. He highlighted that search and rescue
volunteers are often the first responders. In the past six
years, search and rescue volunteers and the Alaska State
Troopers (AST) rescued more than 2,300 people. Since many
search and rescue personnel are volunteers and are not
compensated for their efforts, it seems that the least the
legislature can do is to provide them with workers' compensation
in case they are injured in the course of rescuing or attempting
to rescue others, he opined. He noted that currently volunteer
emergency medical technicians (EMTS) are covered under workers'
compensation and HB 320 would extend the same workers'
compensation coverage to search and rescue volunteers. Since it
is important to make sure these are legitimate organizations, he
relayed that he asked the Department of Public Safety (DPS) to
oversee and certify the organizations and to set the standards
for certification in regulation. Through that process the
groups will have an opportunity to provide input.
3:38:14 PM
MIKE PAWLOWSKI, Staff to Representative Kevin Meyer, Alaska
State Legislature, in response to a question by Representative
Ramras, confirmed that the State of Alaska is self-insured.
3:38:34 PM
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX inquired as to whether there have been
many instances of volunteer workers suing the state. She
explained that although it is not explicitly specified in the
bill, providing workers' compensation services would remove the
search and rescue volunteer's right to sue the state for civil
damages. She inquired as to whether the bill stemmed from a
lawsuit.
REPRESENTATIVE MEYER explained that a constituent requested the
bill because the constituent participates in a search and rescue
organization. He noted that a lawsuit has not yet arisen.
MR. PAWLOWSKI further responded that AS 18.60.125 specifically
provides civil immunity to the state. He offered to provide the
committee with a copy of the statute. He said that the
discussion for HB 320 is about being proactive and acting prior
to a search and rescue person being involved in an accident.
Furthermore, the bill may curb what might happen to the
volunteer pool if volunteers were to realize they are not
covered by workers' compensation if injured while performing
search and rescue volunteer work.
3:40:43 PM
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX surmised that since there is already civil
immunity, HB 320 would not have a negative impact to the state.
MR. PAWLOWSKI answered that he believes that's the case.
3:40:53 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GATTO inquired as to whether volunteers are
considered state employees while on search and rescue missions.
REPRESENTATIVE MEYER answered yes, just during the volunteer
work.
3:41:05 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GATTO related a scenario in which a person is a
laborer who earns $50 per hour and hurts his back while
performing search and rescue volunteer activities such that he
can no longer work as a laborer. He asked how that person would
be treated under HB 320.
3:41:39 PM
REPRESENTATIVE RAMRAS referred to page 2, line 15 proposed [AS
23.30.238(b), which refers to the earnings calculation].
REPRESENTATIVE MEYER concurred with Representative Ramras that
there is a method in HB 320 for calculating the state's
exposure.
REPRESENTATIVE GATTO related his belief that the state would be
responsible for rehabilitation and training for a new job. If
it is a situation in which the new job does not pay comparable
to the laborer position, what would happen, he asked.
3:42:59 PM
MR. PAWLOWSKI explained that it is a policy call as to how much
coverage to pay a volunteer injured while participating in a
mission or a training exercise. He said HB 320 puts the injured
volunteer in line with an EMT's salary. He also said there are
volunteer firefighters, disaster volunteers, and several other
places within the workers' compensation statutes that could be
examined to determine the level of coverage. He noted that
there is a representative from the Department of Labor &
Workforce Development that might be able to assist the committee
in making that policy call. In further response to
Representative Gatto, Mr. Pawlowski related his understanding
that death benefits are included in the workers' compensation
statutes.
REPRESENTATIVE GATTO noted his agreement.
3:44:05 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER stated that currently the state covers
EMTs, firefighters, volunteer ambulance attendants, and police
officers under workers' compensation. She asked if volunteer
ambulance attendants receive formal training or certification.
She expressed concern about adding a layer of certification for
volunteers who aren't professionally employed in related fields.
She inquired as to DPS's opinion of HB 320. She also asked if
the Alaska mountain rescue group has been consulted.
REPRESENTATIVE MEYER related the desire for those various
[volunteer] groups to be approved by DPS so that they are
qualified and trained volunteers.
MR. PAWLOWSKI explained that DPS and the Alaska Search and
Rescue Association (ASARA), an umbrella group, have been
contacted. One option being discussed is whether the DPS might
prefer to certify the groups rather than its individual members
and leave the training to the individual members. He noted that
many volunteer groups work in conjunction with the DPS during
search and rescue missions. In further response to
Representative Gardner, Mr. Pawlowski answered that he was not
sure what the specific criteria are for volunteer ambulance
attendants. He offered to get back to the committee on that.
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER inquired as to whether there is a role
for the non-professional citizen volunteer, who is not
interested in a certification program to help. If so, is the
bill an impediment to that activity, she asked.
MR. PAWLOWSKI recalling discussions with different groups said
he didn't believe HB 320 would be an impediment. Coverage
should occur for volunteers participating during a sanctioned
event by the DPS.
3:48:44 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER expressed concern that the layers of
sanctions or certifications might curb a person's natural desire
to help.
REPRESENTATIVE MEYER said that is not the intent, and offered to
clarify that in HB 320. He suggested that perhaps a letter of
intent could help so that when regulations are written, the
regulations will not prohibit the public from engaging in search
efforts.
3:49:29 PM
REPRESENTATIVE NEUMAN noted that the search and rescue
volunteers are generally pretty well trained. He said the
volunteers learn to avoid problems, like being involved in an
avalanche themselves, but inquired as to how many claims have
been filed in the last 20 years by search and rescue volunteers.
REPRESENTATIVE MEYER answered that he was aware of only two
instances of claims, although there may be more.
REPRESENTATIVE NEUMAN explained, to keep this in perspective,
that there are relatively few instances in which search and
rescue volunteers are injured.
3:50:56 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GATTO inquired as to whether the bill included
recovery efforts because those efforts can sometimes be more
dangerous than rescue operations.
MR. PAWLOWSKI answered that when coverage should be triggered is
part of the ongoing discussions with DPS. He said that AS
18.60.120, gives the DPS commissioner the authority to conduct
search and rescue and recovery, but that the coverage should be
linked to the commissioner's decision when search and rescue
efforts actually become a search and rescue operation.
3:52:07 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER asked about the genesis of the bill.
MR. PAWLOWSKI answered that a constituent, who is a member of
the ASARA, asked that the state provide workers' compensation
for volunteer search and rescue workers.
3:52:38 PM
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX inquired as to how HB 320 would affect a
firefighter, who works for a municipality as a paid firefighter,
who also volunteers with a search and rescue organization
outside the municipality during his off-duty hours. She then
requested clarification of the level of wages to which the
volunteer would be entitled if he were injured.
REPRESENTATIVE MEYER answered that the bill sets up compensation
based on the gross earnings of a medical technician in the city
or village nearest to the location of the rescue mission.
CHAIR OLSON added that the person would receive full medical
benefits and some compensation, but that currently the volunteer
would not be entitled to any compensation.
3:54:16 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GATTO related that he once worked as an Anchorage
firefighter, but that MOA prohibited its employees from
volunteering in another location because MOA did not want to
train firefighters and lose the training invested in the
individual. He added that there is often a mutual response
agreement between different areas that allow for reciprocity and
mutual response between the firefighter organizations.
Therefore, those individuals working in areas with which there
were reciprocal organizations would be considered on-duty for
the purpose of workers' compensation and injury.
3:56:01 PM
RODNEY DIAL, Lieutenant Deputy Commander, "A" Detachment,
Division of Alaska State Troopers (AST),Department of Public
Safety explained that the DPS is somewhat supportive of the
bill, as amended, because it removes the responsibility for DPS
to set qualifications to certify and maintain a registry.
However, DPS believes the coverage should be limited to actual
missions and not to training. He expressed concern that there
will be an expense for DPS to pay premiums for workers'
compensation coverage, although he was uncertain what the cost
would be.
3:57:17 PM
LIEUTENANT DIAL, in response to Representative Gardner, answered
that if DPS is required to provide these services, it will
result in a substantial fiscal note since it would require
additional staff to create a certification program.
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER inquired as to whether these functions
could be delegated to an existing board or organization that
currently provides similar services.
LIEUTENANT DIAL said that would have to be discussed with the
commissioner.
3:58:14 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GATTO turned attention to the fiscal note for DPS
and asked whether this funding is all for training or if part of
it would cover workers' compensation.
LIEUTENANT DIAL answered that the fiscal note is for personnel
costs only and that premium coverage for workers' compensation
is not included in the fiscal note.
3:58:48 PM
CORY AIST, President, Alaska Search and Rescue Association
(ASARA), said that along with Lieutenant Dial, most search and
rescue organizations efforts would support HB 320 to help offset
costs of its volunteers who might sustain injuries. He said
that numerous search and rescue operations are carried on -
weekly or daily - and are a joint effort by AST, other agencies,
and a lot of volunteers. He said that with some of the changes
HB 320 is moving in the right direction.
4:00:11 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER inquired as to the certification
provisions of HB 320, and asked whether ASARA currently has a
program to certify volunteers. She asked whether Mr. Aist
preferred the certification be done under state authority. She
also asked how many volunteers he estimates would participate
under a proposed state certified program.
MR. AIST explained that certification is a difficult issue
because search and rescue organizations are moving away from
certifications to standards. He said a standard includes a list
of criteria that must be met in order for the volunteer to be
"mission ready". Each organization throughout the state,
depending on its expertise, creates a standard that its members
must meet to become active. Therefore, when AST calls a
mountain rescue group, the mountain rescue group members will
already possess specific training and will have met a standard.
He noted that the standards vary. From his experience with AST,
he opined, the troopers have a good understanding of the rescue
organizations and call on them to supply the volunteers needed
for a particular mission. He said that whether the AST wants to
monitor the standards the organizations are adhering to or to
task that function to an association or other group, is worth
considering.
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER inquired as to whether the
certification/standard language in HB 320 would change the way
the ASARA operates or whether it would be an impediment.
MR. AIST replied that the word "certification" does upset
volunteers because "certification" implies a degree. If HB 320
were changed to reflect that organizations must meet certain
standards set by DPS, there would be more interest by search and
rescue organizations around the state, he opined.
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER inquired as to the turnover in search and
rescue organizations.
MR. AIST acknowledged that there is quite a bit of turnover, but
pointed out that a core set of people generally respond to a
large majority of the search and rescue operations. However,
when a particular search develops and grows, the professional
volunteers expand to include spontaneous volunteers, who are
generally people in the community who have no training, but who
want to help. The trained volunteers oversee the community
volunteers involved in any operation.
4:04:25 PM
REPRESENTATIVE RAMRAS said that he is working with Chair Olson
on a steady funding source for the Alaska Fire Standards
Council, and asked whether an organization like that one would
help to standardize and broaden out search and rescue
volunteers' training.
MR. AIST said he was not familiar with that organization, and he
was not sure if ASARA would be part of that training effort.
4:05:16 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GATTO stressed the importance of the work done by
ASARA, and asked who bears the expense of the specialized
equipment, such as a dry suit or climbing gear. He related it
was his understanding that typically the individual volunteer
pays for the initial equipment. He asked whether HB 320 would
help in any way to pay for the replacement equipment.
MR. AIST agreed that most individuals pay for their own
equipment and pay for their own search and rescue training. As
a dog handler, he relayed that he has had an incredible
relationship with AST on search and rescue operations and has
always been treated professionally. He offered his
understanding that AST has a budget for replacement of search
and rescue equipment when a volunteer's equipment has been
damaged or lost on a mission. He suggested that Lieutenant Dial
could speak to that matter.
MR. AIST, in response to a question by Representative Buch,
specified the AST funding would not cover replacement of rescue
dogs.
4:07:27 PM
CHUCK SPRINGER, Past President, Alaska Search and Rescue
Association (ASARA), stated that he is the past president of the
ASARA, a volunteer member of the Anchorage Police Department
(APD) auxiliary search team, and an observer with the AST HELO
1. He explained that the concept of providing workers'
compensation is to protect families of volunteer rescue workers
in the event that a search and rescue volunteer is hurt. He
expressed concern that in the future there may be an instance in
which a search and rescue volunteer is hurt or killed, and that
a family could be dramatically and adversely impacted. He said
that HB 320 could help families by providing financial support
in the form of workers' compensation benefits.
4:09:17 PM
PAUL LISANKIE, Director, Central Office, Division of Workers'
Compensation, Department of Labor & Workforce Development, in
response to an earlier question, stated that death benefits are
provided under the Workers' Compensation Act, which would be
part of the benefits paid out in the event a volunteer search
and rescue worker was killed.
REPRESENTATIVE GATTO inquired as to the amount of the death
benefits.
MR. LISANKIE explained that it depends on the family status. If
single, the death benefit is $5,000, with a one-time payment to
the second injury fund of $10,000, so long as there are no
surviving children or dependent parents. If the volunteer
search and rescue worker had a spouse and children, the
survivors would receive weekly benefits, roughly the equivalent
of total disability, which could be paid out for a significant
period of time. However, benefits are cutoff by remarriage or
after 12 years, unless the spouse is of a certain age. He
reiterated that there is not a specific dollar amount except for
the single person who dies without dependants.
REPRESENTATIVE GATTO inquired as to whether there is a federal
benefit.
MR. LISANKIE responded he was not aware of specific federal
benefits available to search and rescue volunteers who are hurt
or killed during rescue missions.
REPRESENTATIVE GATTO said he was strongly suspicious that there
is a federal death benefit available.
4:11:58 PM
CHAIR OLSON announced that public testimony would be held open
on HB 320 and that he did not intend to take action on the bill
today. He said he anticipates that the committee will have a
committee substitute prepared soon.
4:12:38 PM
ADJOURNMENT
There being no further business before the committee, the House
Labor and Commerce Standing Committee meeting was adjourned at
4:12 p.m.
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