Legislature(1997 - 1998)
02/05/1997 03:21 PM House L&C
| Audio | Topic |
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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
HOUSE LABOR AND COMMERCE STANDING COMMITTEE
February 5, 1997
3:21 p.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Representative Norman Rokeberg, Chairman
Representative John Cowdery
Representative Bill Hudson
Representative Jerry Sanders
Representative Joe Ryan
Representative Tom Brice
Representative Gene Kubina
MEMBERS ABSENT
All members present
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
HOUSE BILL NO. 68
"An Act relating to the exemption from the requirement for payment
for overtime under a voluntary work hour plan; and providing for an
effective date."
- MOVED CSHB 68(L&C) OUT OF COMMITTEE
HOUSE BILL NO. 31
"An Act relating to civil liability for certain false allegations
or material misstatements of fact in a civil pleading or
proceeding, for certain improper acts relating to signing a civil
pleading, for certain improper acts relating to civil pleadings or
proceedings, for making an intentional false statement of a
material fact, for acting on a civil claim or defense without
probable cause, or for acting for a purpose other than proper
adjudication of a civil claim; amending Rules 13(e) and 82(b),
Alaska Rules of Civil Procedure; and providing for an effective
date."
- REMOVED FROM AGENDA
(* First public hearing)
PREVIOUS ACTION
BILL: HB 68
SHORT TITLE: VOLUNTARY FLEXIBLE WORK PLAN: OVERTIME
SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S) THERRIAULT, Kelly, Vezey
JRN-DATE JRN-PG ACTION
01/15/97 67 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRAL(S)
01/15/97 67 (H) LABOR & COMMERCE
01/27/97 (H) L&C AT 3:00 PM CAPITOL 17
01/27/97 (H) MINUTE(L&C)
01/29/97 (H) L&C AT 3:00 PM CAPITOL 17
01/29/97 (H) MINUTE(L&C)
01/29/97 175 (H) COSPONSOR REMOVED: JAMES
02/03/97 (H) L&C AT 3:15 PM CAPITOL 17
02/03/97 (H) MINUTE(L&C)
02/05/97 (H) L&C AT 3:15 PM CAPITOL 17
WITNESS REGISTER
MILT BEHR, District Representative
International Union of Operating
Engineers Local 302
P.O. Box 71938
Fairbanks, Alaska 99707
Telephone: (907) 452-8131
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified against HB 68.
DAN SIMIEN
Laborers Union Local 942
315 Barnette
Fairbanks, Alaska 99701
Telephone: (907) 456-4584
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified against HB 68.
TIM SHARP
Laborers Union Local 942
1284 Lois Lane
Fairbanks, Alaska 99712
Telephone: (907) 456-4584
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified against HB 68.
PETE BLAIR
International Brotherhood of
Electrical Workers
P.O. Box 72204
Fairbanks, Alaska 99707
Telephone: (907) 456-1547
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified against HB 68.
REPRESENTATIVE GENE THERRIAULT
Alaska State Legislature
Capitol Building, Room 517
Juneau, Alaska 99701
Telephone: (907) 465-4797
POSITION STATEMENT: Sponsor of HB 68.
DWIGHT PERKINS, Special Assistant
Office of the Commissioner
Department of Labor
P.O. Box 21149
Juneau, Alaska 99802-1149
Telephone: (907) 465-2700
POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions on HB 68.
ACTION NARRATIVE
TAPE 97-8, SIDE A
Number 001
CHAIRMAN NORMAN ROKEBERG called the House Labor and Commerce
Standing Committee to order at 3:21 p.m. All members were present
at the call to order.
HB 68 - VOLUNTARY FLEXIBLE WORK PLAN: OVERTIME
Number 050
CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG announced the committee would continue the
hearing on HB 68, "An Act relating to the exemption from the
requirement for payment for overtime under a voluntary work hour
plan; and providing for an effective date."
REPRESENTATIVE TOM BRICE indicated there are some people who wish
to testify via teleconference.
Number 139
MILT BEHR, District Representative, International Union of
Operating Engineers Local 302, testified via teleconference from
Fairbanks. He said his organization would like to make it clear
that they support the mining industry in the state, hope that their
ventures return large profits for their investors and provide good
paying and safe jobs for workers. He said they do not think HB 68
is a very good bill as there are several issues that need to be
addressed. The employees of the mine who want a 12-hour rotation
so they can have more time off in a month. An employer who says,
"Okay, in trade for this we want you to give up your overtime
compensation or we will keep you on this current schedule which is
the worst we could possibly arrange for."
MR. BEHR said there are 250 people who have signed a petition to
give away their overtime if the legislature sees fit to change
state statute. Not being heard from are hundreds of other Alaskan
mine workers who don't even know HB 68 exists. He said his
organization feels there are many solutions. In speaking with
workers from the mine, they feel that there is only one solution
because they are not aware of the other options to resolve this
issue. The employees have been presented with one solution by the
company and that is to change the state's overtime statutes. Mr.
Behr urged the committee members not to pass HB 68 as there are
many ways to achieve the goals of both workers and the mine company
without changing state statute. He stated HB 68 will negatively
affect a great number of workers throughout the state.
Number 330
DAN SIMIEN, Laborers Union Local 942, was next to address the
committee via teleconference from Fairbanks. He referred to the
issue of a 12-hour day for straight time pay as a "thin edge of the
wedge." The argument of what is considered a work day is
intensifying across the nation. It has become an issue of politics
and of what party you belong to. He noted there was a recent
article in the Fairbanks Daily New Miner which outlined a movement
to change workers' hours across the nation. It is basically being
driven by the business executives and the Republican Party. He
urged the committee not to use party politics to ignore the working
man's rights. Alaska was recently listed as number one in the
nation as far as the ability to earn a decent wage and live. He
said he believes we need fight to maintain that.
MR. SIMIEN explained an example that this is not something new as
his organization has some people working for Aleyska at Pump
Station 8 who have a 75-mile daily commute to go to work. They
work within the confines of the law and no effort has been made to
change the law to make it any easier for them. They are aware of
their situation and they move forward with no loss of pay. Of
course they had time taken away from their family life, but that is
part of the game. He urged the committee not to make this an issue
of politics and to look at what is good for the workers across the
state. He urged the committee to put an end to HB 68. He
requested that Amax and their employees to get together and try to
find a viable alternative.
Number 540
REPRESENTATIVE JOHN COWDERY asked Mr. Simien if he is against any
12-hour work days, including any that might be negotiated by
organized labor.
MR. SIMIEN explained in their negotiations, representing the
laborers, they don't have any 12-hour days that allow their
employees to be paid straight time. He noted they have nothing
against 12-hour days, but their contracts require premium pay for
anything over 8 hours.
Number 642
TIM SHARP, Laborers Union Local 942, testified via teleconference
from Fairbanks. He referred to the 1920s when miners were striking
for an 8-hour day and said the more things change, the more they
remain the same. Mr. Sharp referred to the question Representative
Cowdery asked Mr. Simien regarding the 12-hour day and said he
would say, "Get rid of them for everybody if that's choice we're
offered here instead of going with this bad House bill." Mr. Sharp
said he is already on record supporting more time off for the Fort
Knox employees, better conditions and a real retirement program for
them, but not at the expense of all other Alaskan workers. He said
he can't understand how anyone can be so naive as to believe that
this bill will not have far reaching affects to other industries as
time goes on. As most state legislators should be aware, a large
percentage of Alaskan workers, union and nonunion, make the
majority of their yearly income during the summer months working
long hours. This is because of the unique and harsh winter
conditions we have here. How will they be effected next year or
the year after due to the next round of excuses, such as global
competition, industry appeals for relief or new worker driven
petitions where they're asked to give back even more of their
earning power. Mr. Sharp referred to the comparison made between
nurses and cab drivers. He said, "Most of you are very much aware
nurses were considered professional and, therefore, exempt under a
lot of the wage and hour standards." People should ask themselves
why so many union and nonunion workers, who do not traditionally
represent mine workers and have nothing to gain or lose directly by
this bill's passage, could be so adamantly opposed to it. He said
it is not because Fort Know is a nonunion operation. It is because
they see the same thing he does which is how this bad legislation
will be used as the thin edge of the wedge to further (indisc.)
workers hard earned gains. Mr. Sharp said let industry come when
the standardized price of doing business can be paid to our workers
based on the price of gold per ounce. Let the gold stay in the
ground or pay the employees what they deserve in time and a half
for hours worked over eight or ten, with the exemption that Fort
Knox has not even applied for.
Number 854
REPRESENTATIVE COWDERY indicated he has received a list of all the
companies that come under the exempt rating. He said he believes
there are 83 pages of different entities/companies. Representative
Cowdery gave committee members a copy of the information.
Number 935
PETE BLAIR, International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers,
testified via teleconference from Fairbanks. He said it would be
very difficult to embellish on any of the words that have been
spoken in the hearings on HB 68. He said it is important that it
is understood that a fight for the 8-hour day is a demand to
receive compensation for those hours worked over the 8 hours. He
stated he does not support HB 68.
Number 955
REPRESENTATIVE GENE THERRIAULT, sponsor of HB 68, said he
appreciates the time the committee has taken to review the bill and
he also appreciated working with the Chair on the draft that is
before the committee. He stated in coming up with the language for
the draft, they have tried to address many of the concerns that
have been expressed as far as the bill having far reaching impacts
on other sections of our society that he had not intended. He
indicated the impact would now be restricted to those people
employed by surface metal mining operations operating year-round.
Representative Therriault said he thinks the scope of the bill is
fairly narrow. It wasn't his intent to impact seasonal
construction workers on the road projects and people of that
nature. He said he gave committee members the most recent
information he has received with regards to how other states treat
the provisions for overtime pay. He referred to there being a
number of people who have testified about Hay Market riots and hard
fought concessions won by organized labor and said he thinks what
they're referring to is the federal statute that mandates that
overtime be paid after 40 hours, not after 8 hours per day, but
after 40 hours. If you take the 40 hours and divide it into the
standard five day workweek, it comes out to 8 hours a day, but the
law of the land, with regards to the provision of overtime, is that
you're paid overtime after 40 hours worked in a consecutive week.
That is exactly what is being asked for in the bill. If the miners
worked the 12-hour shifts and more than 40 hours in any given week,
they would be paid overtime. Representative Therriault said there
are only three states in the nation that deviates from this federal
standard, Alaska, California and Nevada. He explained Colorado
actually pays overtime after 12 hours. California is currently
discussing adopting the federal standard. When people talk about
the labor riots in the 1800s, the concessions that were won was the
40-hour workweek and that the overtime would be paid after 40 hours
and not after 8 hours in a given day.
REPRESENTATIVE THERRIAULT referred to the information
Representative Cowdery gave committee members and said it makes
reference to the contract under which the current Department of
Correction employees work. He said the municipal workers who work
at the Fairbanks power plant, running the power generation, are
organized by Local 302 and work 12-hour days. They aren't paid for
overtime until they go past 40 hours in a given workweek. He said
he believes they are working the same shift that the miners at Fort
Knox want, nothing more or nothing less. Representative Therriault
indicated there are provisions that it must be voluntary so there
shouldn't be an impact to other miners of surface metal mining
operations because this provision wouldn't be able to kick in
unless they entered into a voluntary agreement with their employer.
If the commissioner suspects any coercion or that signing a
petition was a condition of employment, he could turn down the
application.
REPRESENTATIVE THERRIAULT said there was a reference made to the
bill that went through the system last year which dealt with the
number of hours that could be worked at the face of a hard rock
mine. It had nothing to do with the provisions to pay overtime.
He referred to the Fairbanks Daily News Miner article which spoke
about a debate that is taking place at the national level and said
in looking over the article, there was an indication from the
President that he is willing to discuss some possible changes. He
said that is a realization where perhaps there will be a bipartisan
move that will give workers flexibility.
Number 1297
REPRESENTATIVE COWDERY explained he had received a facsimile which
included information he had requested from the Department of
Corrections relating to their work schedule. He explained the
information says that of the 1,014 institutional staff,
approximately 80 percent or 818 work 84-hour workweeks. That is 7
/ 12s, week on, week off schedule. He noted it doesn't include any
of the supervisors that work there. Representative Cowdery gave
committee members a copy of the facsimile for their files.
CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG questioned whether the employees are paid for
overtime.
REPRESENTATIVE COWDERY said he had asked that question and didn't
receive an answer. He indicated he would inquire further.
REPRESENTATIVE THERRIAULT noted he wanted to make the point that
passage of the legislation in no way impacts any group of workers
from unionizing at any time that they feel like their pay or
benefit package is not adequate or if they feel their employer
isn't addressing grievances in a timely fashion. He noted that
currently, the workers don't feel a compulsion to unionize because
the relationship they have with their employer is very good. They
feel frustrated that the only way they would be able to get
flexibility to structure the workweek in the way they desire is to
unionize.
Number 1426
REPRESENTATIVE BRICE noted that on the facsimile cover sheet there
might be a problem. He said according to the Department of
Corrections, the information is confidential and should not be
disseminated or given out to anyone other then the person listed on
the facsimile sheet. Representative Brice asked if there was a
problem.
REPRESENTATIVE COWDERY said the information was requested by his
office and he thinks the cover sheet is standard for their
transmissions.
REPRESENTATIVE BRICE said if it's boiler plate, just ignore it.
REPRESENTATIVE COWDERY indicated he didn't say that. He said he
thinks the language on the cover sheet is fairly standard language.
Representative Cowdery indicated he would phone the department for
clarification.
Number 1491
CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG noted Representative Cowdery distributed a list
to the committee members of a large number of companies. He asked
Representative Cowdery to provide a cover letter for that
information.
REPRESENTATIVE COWDERY noted the information is a flex plan list
that was provided by the Department of Labor.
CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG said the information is a list of existing flex
plans that have been approved by the commissioner.
Number 1561
REPRESENTATIVE BILL HUDSON asked Representative Therriault if he
knows how the overtime is applied to last year's 10-hour situation.
He asked if the 40-hour overtime provision apply.
REPRESENTATIVE THERRIAULT indicated he couldn't answer that
question.
Number 1584
REPRESENTATIVE JOE RYAN indicated he had drafted the legislation as
a staff person for Representative Vezey. He stated, "It allowed 10
hours at the work face which portal to portal provided actually 12
hours - time to get to the work face, work 10 hours, time to get
back up to the (indisc.). Anything over 8 hours a day was
overtime, time and a half."
Number 1631
REPRESENTATIVE JERRY SANDERS asked if he is misunderstanding
Representative Therriault or did he hear him say that the workers
are unhappy with not being able to work the 12-hour shifts and that
they're thinking about joining the union as that is the only option
they have other than the legislature changing the law in the state
for everybody.
REPRESENTATIVE THERRIAULT explained the current law exempts anyone
who is operating under a collective bargaining agreement from this
section of the statutes. There is no requirement that overtime be
paid after 8 hours if you are operating under a collective
bargaining agreement. He said if you want flexibility to work with
an employer, you have to unionize. Passage of the legislation
wouldn't preclude the workers at Fort Knox from unionizing,
however, the current relationship between the employee and employer
is very good. They see no need to unionize as they feel they can
negotiate directly with their employer and don't need the services
of a middle man at this point.
REPRESENTATIVE SANDERS said if the legislation isn't passed, the
workers can still organize and achieve this goal without the help
of the state and without affecting the other laborers in the state.
REPRESENTATIVE THERRIAULT explained if the bill isn't passed and
the workers wanted to exercise flexibility, they would have to
unionize.
Number 1725
REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON said the workers have the right to organize,
bargain collectively and then it gets to be a matter of the
bargaining process. It doesn't necessarily mean that you succeed
in getting what you want.
CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG asked if the workers could work a 10-hour flex
work plan under the existing statute.
REPRESENTATIVE THERRIAULT indicated the lab workers at Fort Knox
have submitted and have approved a 10-hour flex plan. He said the
testimony from Mr. Flanagan, Department of Labor, is that you
couldn't get a 10-hour exemption and then work the additional 2
hours and get paid overtime. The language is such that the
Department of Law says that if you get a waiver to work 10 hours,
that's all you can work.
CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG asked Mr. Perkins if there was an approved
flexible work plan in existing statute, it could only go to 10
hours, therefore, you couldn't work 12 hours and be paid for 2
hours of overtime under the existing statute.
Number 1800
DWIGHT PERKINS, Special Assistant, Office of the Commissioner
Department of Labor, said that is his understanding.
Number 1814
REPRESENTATIVE COWDERY asked if the legislation would apply to the
one mine or all of the mines.
REPRESENTATIVE THERRIAULT said there was a headline last week that
it would impact two mines. The surface metal mining operation that
this may apply to is Cominco. He noted in discussions with
representatives from Cominco the previous week, they indicated they
see absolutely no impact on their workforce from the legislation.
He said with their operation, people travel to the mine and live at
the mine for an extensive period of time. They're currently paying
the overtime and they do not feel like their employees would be
agreeable to enter into this voluntary agreement. They felt like
if the company, in any form, tried to coerce them to enter into a
voluntary agreement, the workers would likely unionize.
Representative Therriault said the language in the committee
substitute makes it very clear that it doesn't impact those people
who are covered by collective bargaining. It doesn't impact those
people who are currently under a voluntary 10-hour work plan. It
only applies to employees at surface metal mining operation that
operates year-round. He said seasonal placer mining operations,
coal mines, gravel pits and accompanying construction will not be
impacted.
Number 1903
REPRESENTATIVE BRICE said he thinks that unfortunately it will
establish a standard for upcoming mines and developments to
establish a 12-hour work day without overtime. Unfortunately, we
can't narrow this down specifically to Fort Knox as it would become
a specialty issue, very localized legislation and, therefore,
unconstitutional. He said he doesn't think that the workers at
Fort Knox haven't been given all the options available to them.
His understanding is that there hasn't been negotiations between
the workers and the managers of the mine to develop alternative
schedules. Representative Brice said it hasn't been brought up in
testimony that there was an organized effort to have any type of
in-depth negotiations. He said he believes this would impact the
workers of today and will impact the workers of the future in this
state. He asked, "How are we going to protect against the use of
`you sign the petition or you don't go to work'." That still
hasn't been adequately addressed. Representative Brice noted the
Department of Labor is vastly underfunded. He said he has concerns
that the legislature is being asked to do something with very
little overview and not adequate time and discussion on some of the
more futuristic impacts that the bill will have.
Number 2043
REPRESENTATIVE THERRIAULT explained the workers did go to
management with a request to go to the 12-hour day. Unfortunately,
management had to tell them that state law precluded them from
doing that. He said it was his understanding in speaking with the
workers that it was not a proposal from management to the workers,
the workers went to management. With regards to the funding of the
Department of Labor budget, all departments are feeling our current
financial pinch. He said the way that the bill has been narrowed,
there won't be too many more names added to the list that is being
reviewed and produced on a yearly basis.
REPRESENTATIVE BRICE said there is no state law precluding a 12-
hour day, particularly as it applies mines. There are plenty of
gold mining operations in Alaska that work on the same margins at
Fort Knox and pay their employees overtime. If the employees still
want to give up their overtime out of the goodness of their hearts,
then there needs to be a recognized process. He stated there is no
recognized process by which those employees have asked for that.
Number 2120
REPRESENTATIVE RYAN referred to AS 23.10.410, paragraph (a), and
said it delineates what the 10 hours at the mine face is. He read
from the statute, "applies only to work actually performed at the
mine face or other place where the work is actually carried on and
excludes time for meals, travel to or from the mine site, and
travel between the mine portal and the mine face, whether in going
on or off shift, or in going to or returning from meals. However,
an employer shall pay wages for the time worked from the time the
miner enters the mine at the mine portal, whether or not work is
preformed at the mine face or other place where the work is
actually carried out, until the miner leaves the mine."
Representative Ryan then read from AS 23.10.060, "Payment for
overtime. (a) An employer who employs employees engaged in
commerce or other business, or in the production of goods or
materials in the state may not employ an employee for a workweek
longer than 40 hours or for more than eight hours a day. This
section does not apply to the employment of a person acting in a
supervisory capacity. If an employer finds it necessary to employ
an employee in excess for 40 hours a week or eight hours a day,
compensation for the overtime at the rate of one and one-half times
the regular rate of pay shall be paid."
Number 2179
REPRESENTATIVE THERRIAULT said the bill that passed last year dealt
with the hours of actual work, but did not impact the current
statutes with regards to compensation for the hours worked.
REPRESENTATIVE RYAN said, "No, because the current statutes covered
that. They said if you work more than eight hours, you get --
(indisc.) 10 hours at the work face, but two hours of overtime."
REPRESENTATIVE THERRIAULT said the issue discussed last year was
the actual number of hours that could be worked.
CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG stated that is correct. He said the overtime
factor wasn't addressed as it wasn't on the table.
REPRESENTATIVE RYAN said it wasn't taken out.
CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG said it was consistent with existing statute.
Number 2212
CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG closed the public hearing on HB 68.
Number 2220
REPRESENTATIVE GENE KUBINA asked if there was a committee
substitute.
CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG indicated there is a committee substitute,
Version F. Chairman Rokeberg indicated the Department of Labor has
submitted a zero fiscal note. He also noted the committee
substitute has been adopted.
Number 2247
REPRESENTATIVE COWDERY indicated that the information contained in
the facsimile is public information and isn't confidential.
REPRESENTATIVE ROKEBERG said he would verify that most businesses
use a disclaimer on all their facsimile transmittal sheets because
there is a face law that has come down on it.
Number 2286
REPRESENTATIVE KUBINA said he would state his opposition to the
passage of the bill. He said he isn't supportive of the concept of
the bill and he doesn't believe that all the options have been
reviewed. Representative Kubina said he thinks there are ways
employees can work with their employer so they could work out a pay
and salary schedule so our laws don't have to be changed. He said
he also believes that it is possible for the employees to organize
as a group, not tied with any recognized collective bargaining
unit. If the workers all signed an agreement saying they want to
bargain collectively with their employer without being part of the
Laborers or Teamsters, etc., there isn't nothing prohibiting them
from that. If people are saying they can't do this without
collective bargaining, he doesn't believe there is anything saying
they have to join the Laborers, Teamsters or United Mine Workers.
Number 2344
CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG asked Mr. Perkins if the workers at the mine
could organize themselves as an independent union, would that be
legal under federal and state statute.
MR. PERKINS said he didn't have that knowledge with him.
REPRESENTATIVE KUBINA said he hasn't ever seen anything that says
they have be part of the Laborers. There are independent unions
within the state. He noted he once negotiated a teaching contract
and he wasn't part of NEA-Alaska at the time. Representative
Kubina said even if they didn't do that, he believes the employees
could sit down with their employer and work out a wage and salary
schedule that would not cost the employer money and would not cost
the employees money. He said he believes there are other options
rather than changing the law for a small group of people.
Representative Kubina said since the hearings on the bill have
started, he has heard that there are people who signed the
petitions that no longer support the petition. He said he is
totally appalled at the schedule the employees are currently
working under. He said, "How anybody can work and go from a night
shift with two days off and then to a day shift or visa versa, your
body cannot adjust that fast. Half the people in Valdez work on
these shifts 12 on, 12 off and they go from day to night, day to
night, the Alyeska ones. And it's really hard on your body to keep
changing from one to the next."
Number 2471
CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG referred to the comment by Representative Brice
that there has been little overview and not adequate discussion on
the bill and said the committee has had over seven hours of
hearings and two weeks of time for people to provide input.
TAPE 97-8, SIDE B
Number 001
CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG said he hopes Representative Brice wasn't
implying the committee wasn't doing its job.
REPRESENTATIVE BRICE said the committee has done a very good job in
reviewing the bill. He said he would question the fact that there
is only one committee of referral.
Number 019
REPRESENTATIVE COWDERY referred to Representative Kubina's comment
regarding the 12-hour shifts and said he doesn't think it is the
same thing as the Fort Knox operation which has to go in 24-hour
periods. There are chemicals that are involved in the processing
of the gold, etc., and you can't stop. There is different training
for different employees. He said he believes this is a unique
situation.
REPRESENTATIVE KUBINA said he was referring to the Aleyska terminal
which is very similar. They can't stop either. They're not going
to stop the flow.
Number 063
REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON pointed out that the Alaska Marine Highway
System has operated 12 hours on and 12 hour off, week on and week
off, for at least the last 20 years. He said there are other
compensations. There is no overtime until it goes over 84 hours a
week. He said, "I think what we got to be careful of here is that
we don't establish a state with some sort of exclusive
opportunities to meet our operational requirements, but preclude
some small operator from having some exclusives." Representative
Hudson indicated concern with where does the overtime apply. It
sounds like the bill says it would apply over 40 hours. So once
they've got three 12-hour shifts in, they would start getting
overtime on their fourth shift.
REPRESENTATIVE THERRIAULT said that is correct.
REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON questioned what is being planned as far as
the number of hours or days they work before they take time off.
REPRESENTATIVE THERRIAULT noted there is information in the
committee members' files. Under the proposed plan, they would
actually see an increase in the number of overtime hours that they
would be paid in any 4-week period of time.
REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON asked if it would be over and above what they
would have had if they'd received overtime over 8 hours.
REPRESENTATIVE THERRIAULT said no.
REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON said, "So the cost savings to the company in
this negotiated agreement is in the total overtime over say a full
40-hour week basis, because if they'd gotten overtime they could
work them -- if we give them the approval to go ahead and work 12,
which they can't work right now as I understand. Is that right?
They cannot work 12 hours now without -- period."
REPRESENTATIVE THERRIAULT said they can, it is just whether it is
affordable. He noted there was previous testimony that the
economics of the project are predicated on an 8-hour workweek to
try and keep the overtime down. Basically, without the change
they're not going to go to 12-hour shifts. There is a slight
increase in overall salary cost to the company by making the
change. They feel they will be able to make it up in efficiencies.
Number 168
REPRESENTATIVE RYAN said he noticed an interesting article in the
Russian Far East News where Amax has a joint venture in Magadan.
It's a 7-year project where they will have approximately 350,000
ounces of gold a year and 250,000 ounces of silver for a 7-year
period. So considering they have no environmental problems, they
have no unions, and they have slave labor wages. He said he thinks
it's gonna balance out in their overall international operations.
CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG said that is the parent company of the Fort Knox
mine.
REPRESENTATIVE SANDERS indicated he would agree with Representative
Kubina's remarks. He said he thinks there is a better place to
resolve the issue and he doesn't believe it needs to be brought to
the legislature or done by statute. He said he feels this is just
another grain of sand slipping away from what we have in Alaska.
He said it is the only place he has ever been in his life where a
laboring man can work 40 hours a week and make a living. He said
he couldn't support the bill.
Number 266
REPRESENTATIVE KUBINA read from the committee substitute, page 1,
line 10, "the employee and the employer have signed a written
agreement and the written agreement has been filed with the
department;". He said if they want to hire someone, and if the
person won't sign the agreement, they won't get hired.
REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON said that was a specific question he asked of
the general manager. The general manager said they will hire those
people on an 8-hour day and they won't be under that provision.
REPRESENTATIVE BRICE said the general manager did say that. He
said if they are going to hire a shovel hand or a haul truck hand,
you can't make an exemption for that specific person and keep
everybody going that way. In those instances where you're doing a
very specialized job such as working one of those shovels, it's not
a question of being able to say, "No, I'm not going to sign this
work (indisc.)."
REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON said that is precisely what has been entered
into the record.
CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG said he thinks the committee has worked hard on
the bill and he appreciates the interest. He said the bill is a
very difficult bill to vote on as there are competing and
conflicting ideas and philosophies. This is a very important bill
that needs further consideration by the legislature.
Number 368
REPRESENTATIVE RYAN said, "Yes, Mr. Chairman, I hadn't planned on
voting to move this bill out of committee. I was given my marching
orders this morning, I'm not happy about that. I've been coerced
before, it's not the first time. I will have some more further to
say about this at a later time. I'm going to reluctantly vote to
move the bill out of committee, but I will not support it on the
floor. And I don't think it's good public policy to go changing
labor laws that have taken a lot of years to put in effect and a
lot of people's hard work and sweat labor to get. And to just to
change them like this, in this particular circumstances -- and I
agree with Representative Sanders that it's just another chink in
the armor."
Number 407
REPRESENTATIVE COWDERY made a motion to move CSHB 69, Version F, to
the next committee of referral with individual recommendations and
the attached zero fiscal note.
REPRESENTATIVE BRICE objected to moving the bill.
Number 428
REPRESENTATIVE KUBINA noted there isn't another committee referral.
CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG said the bill would move to the Rules Committee
and then to House floor.
A roll call vote was taken. Representatives Ryan, Hudson, Cowdery
and Rokeberg voted in favor of moving the bill. Representatives
Brice, Kubina, Sanders voted against moving the bill. Committee
substitute for HB 68(L&C) moved out of the House Labor and Commerce
Committee.
ADJOURNMENT
CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG adjourned the House Labor and Commerce Committee
meeting at 4:20 p.m.
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