Legislature(2017 - 2018)GRUENBERG 120

02/07/2018 01:00 PM JUDICIARY

Note: the audio and video recordings are distinct records and are obtained from different sources. As such there may be key differences between the two. The audio recordings are captured by our records offices as the official record of the meeting and will have more accurate timestamps. Use the icons to switch between them.

Download Mp3. <- Right click and save file as
Download Video part 1. <- Right click and save file as

* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
-- Delayed to 1:45 PM --
+= HB 312 CRIMES AGAINST MEDICAL PROFESSIONALS TELECONFERENCED
Moved HB 312 Out of Committee
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
+= HB 129 FISH & GAME: OFFENSES;LICENSES;PENALTIES TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
                    ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE                                                                                  
               HOUSE JUDICIARY STANDING COMMITTEE                                                                             
                        February 7, 2018                                                                                        
                           1:53 p.m.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Representative Matt Claman, Chair                                                                                               
Representative Jonathan Kreiss-Tomkins, Vice Chair                                                                              
Representative Gabrielle LeDoux                                                                                                 
Representative David Eastman                                                                                                    
Representative Chuck Kopp                                                                                                       
Representative Lora Reinbold                                                                                                    
Representative Louise Stutes (alternate)                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Representative Zach Fansler, Vice Chair                                                                                         
Representative Charisse Millett (alternate)                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 312                                                                                                              
"An Act relating  to arrest without a warrant for  assault in the                                                               
fourth  degree at  a health  care  facility; and  relating to  an                                                               
aggravating factor at  sentencing for a felony  offense against a                                                               
medical professional at a health care facility."                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     - MOVED HB 312 OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 129                                                                                                              
"An  Act   relating  to  sport  fishing,   hunting,  or  trapping                                                               
licenses,  tags, or  permits; relating  to penalties  for certain                                                               
sport   fishing,  hunting,   and  trapping   license  violations;                                                               
relating  to  restrictions  on the  issuance  of  sport  fishing,                                                               
hunting, and trapping licenses;  creating violations and amending                                                               
fines  and  restitution  for  certain  fish  and  game  offenses;                                                               
creating  an exemption  from payment  of restitution  for certain                                                               
unlawful  takings of  big game  animals;  relating to  commercial                                                               
fishing  violations; allowing  lost federal  matching funds  from                                                               
the  Pittman  -  Robertson,  Dingell -  Johnson/Wallop  -  Breaux                                                               
programs  to be  included in  an order  of restitution;  adding a                                                               
definition of  'electronic form'; and providing  for an effective                                                               
date."                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     - HEARD & HELD                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HB 312                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: CRIMES AGAINST MEDICAL PROFESSIONALS                                                                               
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) CLAMAN                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
01/26/18       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
01/26/18       (H)       JUD                                                                                                    
02/05/18       (H)       JUD AT 1:30 PM GRUENBERG 120                                                                           
02/05/18       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
02/05/18       (H)       MINUTE(JUD)                                                                                            
02/07/18       (H)       JUD AT 1:00 PM GRUENBERG 120                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HB 129                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: FISH & GAME: OFFENSES;LICENSES;PENALTIES                                                                           
SPONSOR(s): RULES BY REQUEST OF THE GOVERNOR                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
02/15/17       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
02/15/17       (H)       RES, JUD                                                                                               
03/29/17       (H)       RES AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
03/29/17       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
03/29/17       (H)       MINUTE(RES)                                                                                            
03/31/17       (H)       RES AT 1:00 PM CAPITOL 106                                                                             
03/31/17       (H)       Scheduled but Not Heard                                                                                
04/03/17       (H)       RES AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
04/03/17       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
04/03/17       (H)       MINUTE(RES)                                                                                            
04/05/17       (H)       RES AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
04/05/17       (H)       Moved CSHB 129(RES) Out of Committee                                                                   
04/05/17       (H)       MINUTE(RES)                                                                                            
04/07/17       (H)       RES RPT CS(RES) 6DP 3NR                                                                                
04/07/17       (H)       DP: BIRCH, PARISH, WESTLAKE, DRUMMOND,                                                                 
                        TARR, JOSEPHSON                                                                                         
04/07/17       (H)       NR: TALERICO, JOHNSON, RAUSCHER                                                                        
01/29/18       (H)       JUD AT 1:30 PM GRUENBERG 120                                                                           
01/29/18       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
01/29/18       (H)       MINUTE(JUD)                                                                                            
01/31/18       (H)       JUD AT 1:30 PM GRUENBERG 120                                                                           
01/31/18       (H)       -- MEETING CANCELED --                                                                                 
02/05/18       (H)       JUD AT 1:30 PM GRUENBERG 120                                                                           
02/05/18       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
02/05/18       (H)       MINUTE(JUD)                                                                                            
02/07/18       (H)       JUD AT 1:00 PM GRUENBERG 120                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
WITNESS REGISTER                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
SYLVAN ROBB, Deputy Commissioner                                                                                                
Department of Administration                                                                                                    
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:   During  the hearing  of CSHB  129, answered                                                             
questions.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
KELLY HOWELL, Director                                                                                                          
Administrative Services                                                                                                         
Department of Public Safety                                                                                                     
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:   During  the hearing  of CSHB  129, answered                                                             
questions.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MAJOR BERNARD CHASTAIN, Deputy Director                                                                                         
Division of Wildlife Troopers                                                                                                   
Department of Public Safety (DPS)                                                                                               
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:   During  the hearing  of CSHB  129, answered                                                             
questions.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
ACTION NARRATIVE                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
1:53:22 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR MATT  CLAMAN called the House  Judiciary Standing Committee                                                             
meeting  to order  at 1:53  p.m. Representatives  Claman, Kreiss-                                                               
Tomkins, LeDoux, Eastman, Reinbold, and  Kopp were present at the                                                               
call   to  order.      Representatives   Stutes  (alternate   for                                                               
Representative Fansler) arrived as the meeting was in progress.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
          HB 312-CRIMES AGAINST MEDICAL PROFESSIONALS                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
1:54:00 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR CLAMAN announced that the  first order of business would be                                                               
HOUSE BILL NO. 312, "An Act  relating to arrest without a warrant                                                               
for assault in  the fourth degree at a health  care facility; and                                                               
relating  to an  aggravating factor  at sentencing  for a  felony                                                               
offense  against   a  medical  professional  at   a  health  care                                                               
facility."                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR CLAMAN recapped that during  the 2/5/18 meeting, as members                                                               
reviewed the bill  and heard public testimony.   Since that time,                                                               
he  advised that  the Department  of Health  and Social  Services                                                               
(DHSS) submitted  an amended  Alaska Psychiatric  Institute (API)                                                               
zero fiscal note.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR CLAMAN, in response to the  questions as to why the Pioneer                                                               
Homes and the  Alaska Veterans Home was excluded  from the health                                                               
care  facility  definition,  he explained  that  there  are  many                                                               
different  statutes  defining  health   care  facility.    (Audio                                                               
difficulties)  past the  deadline, "I've  ruled and  we won't  be                                                               
taking it up in the committee," he said.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
1:57:37 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX  asked Chair Claman to  re-state his answer                                                               
as to the Pioneer Homes and the Alaska Veterans Home.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR CLAMAN explained that in  reviewing the statutes, there are                                                               
many  different definitions  as  to health  care  facility.   The                                                               
sponsors  did  not  include  the Pioneer  Homes  and  the  Alaska                                                               
Veterans  Home  because  those entities  are  primarily  assisted                                                               
living   homes  and   senior  living   facilities.     While,  he                                                               
acknowledged, these  entities provide  medical care  services, it                                                               
is  not their  primary duty  to  provide medical  care for  those                                                               
people coming in and seeking medical care.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR CLAMAN further  explained that within the  reports heard by                                                               
this  committee  as  to  where these  abuses  are  issues,  those                                                               
reports  did not  come from  these  two entities.   The  sponsors                                                               
tried  to narrowly  tailor the  legislation to  the concerns  the                                                               
community brought to the sponsors, he said.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX  surmised that  the legislature  would wait                                                               
until the Pioneer  Homes or the Alaska  Veterans Home communities                                                               
comes in with  a problem, and the legislature will  just add that                                                               
to one more of the exceptions.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  CLAMAN opined  that that  would be  one approach,  and the                                                               
committee  can  certainly  continue discussions  after  finishing                                                               
with the  bill.   In the  event there  was a  sense the  body was                                                               
interested in  that type of  change, it  could be amended  on the                                                               
floor of the House of Representatives, he offered.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
1:58:14 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  LEDOUX  pointed  out   that  there  are  so  many                                                               
exceptions,  perhaps it  is time  to actually  revisit the  whole                                                               
issue.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  CLAMAN said  that  Representative  LeDoux's concerns  were                                                               
well noted.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
1:58:30 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
[CHAIR   CLAMAN  and   Representative   Reinbold  discussed   the                                                               
amendment process.]                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
1:59:27 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   KREISS-TOMKINS   related   that   after   public                                                               
testimony,  discovery,   and  the  committee's   questions,  this                                                               
legislation appears  to be on point  and that he now  has greater                                                               
awareness of some  of the negative externalities of  the drug and                                                               
alcohol problems ravaging many of  Alaska's communities.  He said                                                               
that  he has  enhanced curiosity  about the  relationship between                                                               
law  enforcement  and  the  response  to  these  social  economic                                                               
problems in the  health care system and the role  the health care                                                               
system is  being drafted  into, to  some extent.   He said  he is                                                               
excited to support HB 312.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
2:00:58 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE REINBOLD  related that this bill  is important and                                                               
that it  is sad post-Senate  Bill 91 [passed in  the Twenty-Ninth                                                               
Alaska  State  Legislature]  that   there  has  been  a  dramatic                                                               
increase  in assaults  to health  care workers.   She  noted that                                                               
"many  other states"  have felony  fourth-degree assault  against                                                               
health care  workers in a health  care facility.  It  is critical                                                               
to address  the issues in the  bill, which is a  good first step,                                                               
but something is missing, she said.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
2:01:54 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  EASTMAN commented  on  the discussion  procedure.                                                               
He  then noted  that  the committee  heard  from law  enforcement                                                               
regarding a desire for the  ability to arrest someone engaging in                                                               
abusive behavior  at the  hospital, a  soup kitchen,  or wherever                                                               
that assault might take place.   In his opinion, he said, assault                                                               
is assault no  matter where it takes place because  the victim is                                                               
just  as injured,  and  the public  is just  as  violated by  the                                                               
crime.   He offered an interest  in an amendment that  would deal                                                               
with the assault  itself and give law enforcement  the ability to                                                               
arrest someone,  if necessary, without  tailoring it  to specific                                                               
exceptions such as health care facilities.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
2:04:05 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  KOPP  addressed  the comments  of  Representative                                                               
Eastman and  advised that  "speeding is speeding,"  it can  be 20                                                               
miles  outside of  Cantwell on  a 10-mile  stretch of  road or  a                                                               
person  speeding through  an elementary  zone  with 300  students                                                               
getting  onto the  bus, yet  those  circumstances are  especially                                                               
different.  This legislation is not  an attempt to remove all due                                                               
processes  from the  law, it  respects a  person's constitutional                                                               
right as  a high priority, thereby,  going out of its  way to not                                                               
remove due  process of arrest  warrants in all misdemeanors.   He                                                               
explained that  this legislation looks at  high risk environments                                                               
where  patients, health  care workers,  and visitors  of patients                                                               
absolutely need  to know they  are safe.  Health  care facilities                                                               
must  be a  place where  care can  be performed  safely, and  the                                                               
state must  recognize that health  care facilities are  much more                                                               
sensitive to  assaultive conduct  occurring within  the facility.                                                               
This legislation gives  law enforcement a tool to  "not just cite                                                               
and release" but to "hook and book," he said.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
2:05:47 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE STUTES  commented that  having been in  the health                                                               
care  industry  many  years  ago,  she  could  not  be  any  more                                                               
supportive than  she is of this  bill.  She stressed  that, "This                                                               
is just a terrific bill,  it's really needed" because the state's                                                               
health  care workers  are at  risk enough  in other  manners that                                                               
they do not  need to be at  risk with assaults and  being beat up                                                               
by the people they are trying to help.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
2:06:23 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR CLAMAN, in response to  the issues raised by Representative                                                               
Eastman,  remarked   that  he  takes  very   seriously  the  oath                                                               
legislators take  to uphold  the constitution.   Part of  that is                                                               
due to the  Constitution of the United  States and constitutional                                                               
rights, the  United States Bill  of Rights, and  the Constitution                                                               
of the  State of Alaska  and not being arrested  without probable                                                               
cause,  he  explained.    When  taking  a  step  to  loosen  that                                                               
requirement,  he said  that he  believes  it must  be taken  with                                                               
tremendous  caution  for  the same  reasons  Representative  Kopp                                                               
expressed, yet  he has heard  some police officers  indicate that                                                               
they would like  to have greater authority to  arrest for assault                                                               
without a  warrant under any  circumstance.  He pointed  out that                                                               
the Department  of Law (DOL) is  not here because, he  opined, if                                                               
asked,  the Department  of  Law  (DOL) would  advise  to go  very                                                               
cautiously when taking away a person's constitutional rights.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
For those reasons,  he advised, he will not  support an amendment                                                               
that broadens the authority to  arrest other than the narrow step                                                               
taken in this  legislation.  This legislation  is consistent with                                                               
the   legislature's   obligation   to   protect   the   important                                                               
constitutional rights of every single Alaskan, he stated.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
2:07:37 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX  commented that this is  an important bill,                                                               
except  she is  concerned that  whenever the  legislature singles                                                               
out one group  of people, such as medical health  care workers or                                                               
any  other group,  and decides  that if  a person  assaults those                                                               
people then there  is an exception to  the presumptive sentencing                                                               
and the sentence moves higher.   Therefore, if the legislature is                                                               
willing  to  go higher  for  the  policeman, fireman,  nurse,  or                                                               
doctor, then the  legislature needs to revisit  the whole concept                                                               
of  the presumptive  sentencing, she  remarked.     In the  event                                                               
anyone  on the  committee was  assaulted or  their children  were                                                               
assaulted, she  opined that the  sentences should  conceivable be                                                               
as high as if a  doctor, nurse, or first-responder was assaulted.                                                               
That is her  concern, and she suggested possibly  doing away with                                                               
those presumptive maximums when it comes to everyone.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
2:09:49 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  KREISS-TOMKINS moved  to report  HB 312,  Version                                                               
30-LS1225\O out of committee  with individual recommendations and                                                               
the accompanying fiscal notes.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN objected.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
2:10:11 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
A  roll  call vote  was  taken.   Representatives  Kopp,  Kreiss-                                                               
Tomkins, LeDoux, Stutes,  and Claman voted in favor  of moving HB                                                               
312,  Version  30-LS1225\O  out of  committee.    Representatives                                                               
Eastman and  Reinbold voted  against it.   Therefore, HB  312 was                                                               
reported out of the House  Judiciary Standing Committee by a vote                                                               
of 5-2.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:10:41 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
The committee took an at-ease from 1:10 p.m. to 2:15 p.m.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
        HB 129-FISH & GAME: OFFENSES;LICENSES;PENALTIES                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
2:15:59 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR CLAMAN announced that the  final order of business would be                                                               
HOUSE BILL NO.  129, "An Act relating to  sport fishing, hunting,                                                               
or  trapping licenses,  tags, or  permits; relating  to penalties                                                               
for  certain   sport  fishing,  hunting,  and   trapping  license                                                               
violations;  relating to  restrictions on  the issuance  of sport                                                               
fishing, hunting, and trapping  licenses; creating violations and                                                               
amending  fines  and  restitution   for  certain  fish  and  game                                                               
offenses; creating  an exemption from payment  of restitution for                                                               
certain  unlawful  takings  of  big  game  animals;  relating  to                                                               
commercial  fishing violations;  allowing  lost federal  matching                                                               
funds from  the Pittman -  Robertson, Dingell -  Johnson/Wallop -                                                               
Breaux  programs  to be  included  in  an order  of  restitution;                                                               
adding a  definition of 'electronic  form'; and providing  for an                                                               
effective date."                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  CLAMAN  reminded the  committee  that  this is  the  third                                                               
hearing in  the House  Judiciary Standing  Committee on  CSHB 129                                                               
and there had been questions  during the 2/5/18 committee meeting                                                               
regarding  fiscal notes.   He  advised that  Sylvan Robb,  Deputy                                                               
Commissioner,  Department  of  Administration and  Kelly  Howell,                                                               
Administrative  Services Director,  Department  of Public  Safety                                                               
are  available  to testify  regarding  "your  fiscal notes,"  and                                                               
explain the process of preparing fiscal notes.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
2:16:55 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SYLVAN ROBB,  Deputy Commissioner, Department  of Administration,                                                               
[Available to testify.]                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:16:59 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
KELLY  HOWELL, Director,  Administrative Services,  Department of                                                               
Public Safety, [Available to testify.]                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  CLAMAN  asked  Ms.  Robb to  describe  the  Department  of                                                               
Administration's  fiscal  note,  provide more  insight  into  the                                                               
preparation of fiscal notes, and when they are prepared.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
2:17:20 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS. ROBB  responded that the  Department of  Administration (DOA)                                                               
is in  the process of  preparing an indeterminate fiscal  note on                                                               
CSHB 129,  and that Shared  Services of Alaska (SSOA)  deals with                                                               
collections  for the  Alaska Court  System.   Once the  court has                                                               
transferred those fines  and fees, those collections  are sent to                                                               
the DOA  in an aggregate  format and it has  no way to  parse out                                                               
what percentage  or amount  from past fines  are related  to fish                                                               
and  game offenses  versus  other  types of  offenses.   At  this                                                               
point, until  there is  more data in  the future,  the department                                                               
could not  determine the  impact of this  bill, she  pointed out.                                                               
She  said  that she  could  only  speak  in general  terms  about                                                               
preparing a fiscal  note because she is not an  attorney.  In the                                                               
terms of the way fiscal notes  have been handled in the past, she                                                               
offered that  a fiscal note  was required  when there would  be a                                                               
positive or  negative impact  on a department's  budget.   In the                                                               
absence of  an impact  taking place  on a  department, generally,                                                               
there would  be a zero-fiscal note  in the event a  committee was                                                               
likely to  wonder why there  was not  be a fiscal  note, thereby,                                                               
giving  the  department  a  chance to  explain  the  reason,  she                                                               
explained.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
2:18:49 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  LEDOUX   surmised  that  when   something  merely                                                               
affects  the  general fund  for  the  entire  state and  not  one                                                               
particular department, no fiscal note is prepared.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
MS. ROBB  reminded Representative LeDoux that  when revenue bills                                                               
have come  up over the past  couple of years and  were definitely                                                               
intended to impact the general  fund, those have shown the change                                                               
in revenue.  She differed to the Legislative Finance Division.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
2:19:36 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR CLAMAN commented that Ms.  Robb understood, at least as the                                                               
Deputy Commissioner  of the  Department of  Administration (DOA),                                                               
that if a  fiscal note would raise revenue and  those funds would                                                               
go  directly to  the  DOA,  that there  would  be  a fiscal  note                                                               
showing the  positive effect  of the legislation.   In  the event                                                               
the funds were going to the  general fund and not specifically to                                                               
the DOA,  that would not  cause the  department to have  a fiscal                                                               
note representing the revenue, he questioned.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MS.  ROBB responded  that that  has  been the  convention in  the                                                               
past.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR CLAMAN related that, in contrast,  if it would cost the DOA                                                               
more  money to  do whatever  is in  the bill  causing a  negative                                                               
fiscal note, then  it would be looking solely at  the DOA and not                                                               
beyond the department.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MS. ROBB  answered that Chair Claman  was correct in that  if the                                                               
funds  to be  raised were  to be  retained by  the Department  of                                                               
Administration, the change in revenue would be reflected.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
2:20:29 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR CLAMAN acknowledged that the  indeterminate fiscal note has                                                               
not  been completed  and asked  whether it  reflected that  there                                                               
might   be  revenue   going  directly   to   the  Department   of                                                               
Administration (DOA), or  rather, if that revenue  comes in, that                                                               
it is  going to the general  fund.  In  the event it is  going to                                                               
the  general fund,  he  asked why  an  indeterminate fiscal  note                                                               
would  be prepared  if Ms.  Robb did  not believe  there was  any                                                               
reason   this  would   bring  revenue   to   the  Department   of                                                               
Administration separately.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MS. ROBB  explained that  the way  the collections  process works                                                               
for the  Alaska Court System  (ACS) is  that once funds  had been                                                               
transferred  to   collections,  if   it  had   been  successfully                                                               
collected by  a vendor,  that the department  employed to  try to                                                               
increase collections  for the state, SSOA  receives a percentage.                                                               
In  the event  fines  were  increased, the  amount  of money  the                                                               
department had the percentage to collect on, would increase.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
2:21:27 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX noted  that she unsure what  Ms. Robb meant                                                               
by "shared services"  and asked whether the fiscal  note is being                                                               
prepared by SSOA or by the Department of Fish and Game.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MS. ROBB clarified  that she was speaking to the  fiscal note for                                                               
the DOA and its division of  Shared Services of Alaska (SSOA), as                                                               
it relates to its collections portion.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  CLAMAN  surmised  that the  Department  of  Administration                                                               
(DOA) has  different contractors to  try to collect debt,  and in                                                               
that instance  if they collect $100,  the DOA may receive  3 or 4                                                               
percent of  the $100, and the  other $96 would go  to the general                                                               
fund.   Therefore, the indeterminate role  is whatever percentage                                                               
the  department may  receive  from  contractors collecting  these                                                               
debts on behalf of SSOA, he offered.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MS. ROBB  advised that  Chair Claman was  mostly correct  in that                                                               
the contractor  employed to perform  the collections,  receives a                                                               
percentage of  the money as  incentive to collect for  the state.                                                               
In the event the amount of  the fees does not change, the state's                                                               
ability  to receive  more or  less money  is not  impacted.   For                                                               
example, a  $100 fine for a  criminal offense that now  becomes a                                                               
$100  violation  that  would  have  no impact  for  SSOA  in  the                                                               
potential collection.   The primary reason the  DOA's fiscal note                                                               
will be indeterminate  is that the debts that  are transferred to                                                               
collections from  the court  system arrive  in the  aggregate and                                                               
they are inclusive of all types of debts.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
2:23:28 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE KREISS-TOMKINS  said he was not  concerned so much                                                               
about  which agency  has  the fiscal  note.   He  then offered  a                                                               
scenario wherein on  average data showed that 10  black bears had                                                               
been  illegally  harvested  over   the  last  10-years,  and  the                                                               
legislature  doubled  restitution  to,  for  example,  $1,000  to                                                               
$2,000.  Thereby, causing a  positive fiscal note associated with                                                               
that  increased   restitution  of   $10,000,  of   which  happens                                                               
approximately 10  different times in this  bill with restitution,                                                               
he  advised.   Representative Kreiss-Tomkins  questioned why  the                                                               
number is indeterminate, and why there  is not an estimate of the                                                               
revenue raised from the increased restitution.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MS. ROBB  clarified that  SSOA does  not collect  restitution, it                                                               
collects fines and fees imposed by the court.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
2:24:56 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   KREISS-TOMKINS   asked  which   agency   handles                                                               
restitution.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS. ROBB answered the Alaska Court System.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
2:25:16 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  KREISS-TOMKINS commented  that  the testimony  of                                                               
Ms.  Meade was  that the  Alaska Court  System (ACS)  passes that                                                               
money  onto  the  general  fund.    He  asked  who  receives  the                                                               
restitution revenue from the court system.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MS. ROBB  responded that  the money flows  into the  general fund                                                               
and  once the  money is  in the  general fund,  it is  up to  the                                                               
legislature  to   allocate  it  as   it  sees  fit.     Ms.  Robb                                                               
acknowledged that  these questions  were moving beyond  her scope                                                               
of expertise.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
2:26:03 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  KREISS-TOMKINS  commented  that  it  is  unlikely                                                               
there is  an open pit  into which dollars  flow and no  one keeps                                                               
track  of the  money.    The court  system  has  to liaison  with                                                               
someone, and  he said  that he  would like to  know who  that is,                                                               
whether that person  keeps track of the  restitution dollars that                                                               
flow into the general fund, and  to offer an estimate of how much                                                               
increased restitution  revenue would  likely be  forthcoming with                                                               
the passage of CSHB 129.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR CLAMAN  noted that  "that seems like  that has  a different                                                               
practice  than  the  legislature's  done when  there  is  revenue                                                               
that's  coming through  the  general  fund."   He  said that  his                                                               
office could look for an answer.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
2:26:59 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  EASTMAN commented  that  it should  be doable  to                                                               
attach a  fund code  to any  funds being  collected by  the court                                                               
system when  transferring the restitution  money to DOR,  DOA, or                                                               
whoever, to  make sure  those funds are  identified based  on the                                                               
categories the  state wants  to keep track  of, if  nothing else.                                                               
In  the  event there  are  specific  crimes  of interest  to  the                                                               
legislature, that might  be something to track  and he encouraged                                                               
finding a way to maintain that information.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MS. ROBB answered that the money  does go to the general fund and                                                               
she would find the answer.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
2:28:09 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN  explained that he  was not looking  for a                                                               
bean counter,  he is  looking for an  economist, someone  who can                                                               
assess there is a supply and demand  curve at play.  He said that                                                               
he assumed  that by  significantly increasing  the penalty  for a                                                               
violation, hopefully there would be fewer violations.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
2:29:21 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS. HOWELL  advised the committee  that the Department  of Public                                                               
Safety (DPS) submitted a zero  fiscal note because the department                                                               
will not  receive an increase  or decrease in  its appropriations                                                               
as  a result  of the  passage  of CSHB  129.   Therefore, a  zero                                                               
fiscal note  is appropriate for  the Department of  Public Safety                                                               
(DPS), she said.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
2:30:26 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  CLAMAN  advised  Major  Bernard  Chastain,  Department  of                                                               
Public  Safety (DPS)  that questions  were  raised regarding  the                                                               
interplay  between   this  bill  and  AS   12.55,  regarding  the                                                               
misdemeanor sentencing  provisions.   He asked Major  Chastain to                                                               
provide the administration's perspective to the committee.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
2:31:02 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MAJOR  BERNARD CHASTAIN,  Deputy Director,  Division of  Wildlife                                                               
Troopers,  Department  of Public  Safety  (DPS),  noted that  the                                                               
question  last week  had to  do  with the  increase in  potential                                                               
fines for  class A misdemeanors.   He advised that this  bill was                                                               
first introduced in 2015, and  during that time frame Senate Bill                                                               
91  and SB  54 had  not yet  gone through  the process  and those                                                               
amounts  have not  changed.   Under  Senate Bill  91, the  actual                                                               
value for  a class A misdemeanor  moved to a maximum  of $25,000;                                                               
part  of the  Senate Bill  91 change  aligned penalties  under AS                                                               
12.55.035  class  A  misdemeanor  and  increased  that  value  to                                                               
$25,000.   As this bill  has moved  through the process  over the                                                               
last couple of  years, there was a change to  align Title 16 with                                                               
a variety  of misdemeanor offenses and  unclassified misdemeanors                                                               
with specific  penalties for  each section,  he explained.   This                                                               
bill attempted to  go through and align  the misdemeanor offenses                                                               
as all  class A misdemeanors  within Title  16, and it  created a                                                               
secondary  class within  each of  those sections  of a  violation                                                               
offense, he related.   Some of the offenses have  moved up in the                                                               
potential maximum fine a court could  impose, up to $25,000.  All                                                               
of the offenses listed in  this bill have a secondary possibility                                                               
of charging  with a violation offense,  with a maximum of  a $500                                                               
fine.   He noted  that he has  it broken out  by sections  if the                                                               
committee  would  like  him  to  go through  each  section.    In                                                               
general, he  offered, the possible  fine is a maximum  of $25,000                                                               
under a class A misdemeanor,  which was changed under Senate Bill                                                               
91, as a  maximum fine a court  could impose.  It is  rare that a                                                               
fine would  be imposed to  the maximum amount because  it usually                                                               
only happens under the worst circumstances, he advised.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:33:58 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX  noted that  the "huge difference"  in CSHB                                                               
129 between  a $1,000 fine and  a $25,000 fine was  never pointed                                                               
out for the committee.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MAJOR  CHASTAIN  responded  that  in  2015,  when  the  bill  was                                                               
introduced, the difference  in the change had to  do with $1,000,                                                               
and at the time the maximum fine  was $10,000.  The change in the                                                               
maximum penalty  took place  during the changes  to AS  12.55 and                                                               
defining it  as a  class A  misdemeanor automatically  changed it                                                               
under Senate Bill 91, he explained.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
2:35:05 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  LEDOUX said  she understood  what Major  Chastain                                                               
was  saying  except  that  someone   had  testified  before  this                                                               
committee and  basically explained the  bill.  At that  time, she                                                               
said that she would have thought  the change in fines from $1,000                                                               
to $25,000 would have been mentioned.   She pointed out that that                                                               
difference  is not  something a  legislator  would have  realized                                                               
when reading the  bill unless they went back to  the statute, and                                                               
so forth.   She commented that  that difference does not  pop out                                                               
and asked why this issue was not mentioned.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MAJOR CHASTAIN responded  that the initial bill  went through the                                                               
House  and Senate  Resources  Standing  Committees and  penalties                                                               
were  discussed  "pretty robustly"  during  that  timeframe.   He                                                               
related that he  had presented the bill to  this committee during                                                               
its first  hearing this  year, and  he went  step-by-step through                                                               
the sectional  analysis.  He  stressed that it certainly  was not                                                               
his intent to skip over any information.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
[HB 129 was held over.]                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
          HB 312-CRIMES AGAINST MEDICAL PROFESSIONALS                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
2:37:56 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  CLAMAN,  in  granting Representative  Reinbold's  request,                                                               
allowed the committee to return to HB 312.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE REINBOLD  noted that she  wanted to make  it clear                                                               
to this committee that she  absolutely supports the bill and will                                                               
be a yes-vote.   She said that  she wanted it on  the record that                                                               
she supports  this bill and was  a no-vote due to  the amendment.                                                               
Whether the  amendment passed or  not is irrelevant,  she pointed                                                               
out, but  having the  minority voice heard  is important  to her,                                                               
and that is why she was a no-vote.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
2:39:00 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ADJOURNMENT                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
There being no further business before the committee, the House                                                                 
Judiciary Standing Committee meeting was adjourned at 2:39 p.m.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                

Document Name Date/Time Subjects
HB312 ver O 2.5.18.PDF HJUD 2/5/2018 1:30:00 PM
HJUD 2/7/2018 1:00:00 PM
HB 312
HB312 Supporting Document-SEARHC Letter 2.7.18.pdf HJUD 2/7/2018 1:00:00 PM
HB 312
HB312 Public Comment-Supporting 2.7.18.pdf HJUD 2/7/2018 1:00:00 PM
HB 312
HB312 Updated Fiscal Note DHSS-API 2.7.18.pdf HJUD 2/7/2018 1:00:00 PM
HB 312
HB129 ver D 1.29.18.pdf HJUD 2/5/2018 1:30:00 PM
HJUD 2/7/2018 1:00:00 PM
HJUD 2/9/2018 1:00:00 PM
HB 129
Representative Reinbold Document Offered to HJUD Committee- Recidivism Definition 2.7.18.pdf HJUD 2/7/2018 1:00:00 PM