Legislature(1993 - 1994)

02/26/1993 12:00 PM JUD

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
txt
                                                                               
               HOUSE JUDICIARY STANDING COMMITTEE                              
                        February 26, 1993                                      
                           12:00 p.m.                                          
                                                                               
                                                                               
  MEMBERS PRESENT                                                              
                                                                               
  Rep. Brian Porter, Chairman                                                  
  Rep. Pete Kott                                                               
  Rep. Gail Phillips                                                           
  Rep. Jim Nordlund                                                            
                                                                               
  MEMBERS ABSENT                                                               
                                                                               
  Rep. Jeannette James, Vice-Chair                                             
  Rep. Joe Green                                                               
  Rep. Cliff Davidson                                                          
                                                                               
  COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                           
                                                                               
  HB 69:    "An Act relating to registration of and                            
            information about sex offenders and amending                       
            Alaska Rules of Criminal Procedure 11(c) and                       
            32(b)."                                                            
                                                                               
            CS MOVED OUT OF COMMITTEE                                          
                                                                               
  HB 64:    "An Act creating the crimes of stalking in the                     
            first and second degrees and providing penalties                   
            for their violation; providing a peace officer                     
            with the authority to arrest without a warrant a                   
            person the peace officer has reasonable cause to                   
            believe has committed stalking; relating to the                    
            release before trial of a person accused of                        
            stalking; and prohibiting the suspension of                        
            imposition of sentence of a person convicted of                    
            stalking."                                                         
                                                                               
            CS MOVED OUT OF COMMITTEE                                          
                                                                               
  HB 100:   "An Act relating to criminal charges brought                       
            against minors."                                                   
                                                                               
            HEARD AND HELD OVER                                                
                                                                               
  WITNESS REGISTER                                                             
                                                                               
  GAYLE HORETSKI                                                               
  Committee Counsel                                                            
  House Judiciary Committee                                                    
  State Capitol, Room 120                                                      
  Juneau, Alaska 99801-1182                                                    
  Phone:  465-4990                                                             
  Position Statement:  Discussed HB 69, HB 64, and HB 100                      
                                                                               
  JEN TUCCI                                                                    
  4405 Portage Boulevard                                                       
  Juneau, Alaska 99801                                                         
  Phone:  789-3726                                                             
  Position Statement:  Supported HB 69                                         
                                                                               
  MARGOT KNUTH                                                                 
  Assistant Attorney General                                                   
  Criminal Division                                                            
  Department of Law                                                            
  P.O. Box 110300                                                              
  Juneau, Alaska 99811-0300                                                    
  Phone:  465-3428                                                             
  Position Statement:  Discussed HB 69                                         
                                                                               
  RANDALL HINES                                                                
  Youth Corrections Specialist                                                 
  Division of Family and Youth Services                                        
  Department of Health and Social Services                                     
  P.O. Box 110630                                                              
  Juneau, Alaska 99811-0630                                                    
  Phone:  465-3191                                                             
  Position Statement:  Answered questions on HB 100                            
                                                                               
  JENNY MURRAY                                                                 
  Legislative Aide                                                             
  Rep. Con Bunde                                                               
  Alaska State Legislature                                                     
  State Capitol, Room 112                                                      
  Juneau, Alaska 99801-1182                                                    
  Phone:  465-4843                                                             
  Position Statement:  Supported HB 100                                        
                                                                               
  PREVIOUS ACTION                                                              
                                                                               
  BILL:  HB  69                                                                
  SHORT TITLE: SEX OFFENDER REGISTRATION                                       
  BILL VERSION:                                                                
  SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S) BARNES,Ulmer,Phillips,                         
  Nordlund,Porter,Olberg,James,B.Davis,Green,Sanders,                          
  Toohey,Mackie                                                                
                                                                               
  TITLE: "An Act relating to registration of and information                   
  about sex offenders and amending Alaska Rules of Criminal                    
  Procedure 11(c) and 32(b)."                                                  
                                                                               
  JRN-DATE    JRN-PG                     ACTION                                
  01/15/93        89    (H)   READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S)                  
  01/15/93        90    (H)   STATE AFFAIRS,JUDICIARY,FINANCE                  
  01/27/93       169    (H)   COSPONSOR(S): NORDLUND                           
  01/29/93       183    (H)   COSPONSOR(S): PORTER                             
  02/01/93       202    (H)   COSPONSOR(S): OLBERG, JAMES,                     
                              B.DAVIS                                          
  02/02/93              (H)   STA AT 08:00 AM CAPITOL 102                      
  02/02/93              (H)   MINUTE(STA)                                      
  02/03/93       223    (H)   COSPONSOR(S): GREEN, SANDERS,                    
                              TOOHEY                                           
  02/04/93              (H)   STA AT 08:00 AM CAPITOL 102                      
  02/06/93              (H)   STA AT 08:00 AM CAPITOL 102                      
  02/06/93              (H)   MINUTE(STA)                                      
  02/08/93       250    (H)   STA RPT  CS(STA)  4DP                            
  02/08/93       251    (H)   DP: VEZEY,SANDERS,ULMER,G.DAVIS                  
  02/08/93       251    (H)   -2 ZERO FNS (LAW, CORR)  2/8/93                  
  02/10/93              (H)   JUD AT 01:00 PM CAPITOL 120                      
  02/10/93              (H)   MINUTE(JUD)                                      
  02/18/93       383    (H)   COSPONSOR(S): MACKIE                             
  02/24/93              (H)   JUD AT 01:00 PM CAPITOL 120                      
  02/26/93              (H)   JUD AT 12:00 PM CAPITOL 120                      
                                                                               
                                                                               
  BILL:  HB  64                                                                
  SHORT TITLE: ANTI-STALKING LAW                                               
  BILL VERSION: CSHB 64(FIN)                                                   
  SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S) TOOHEY,Phillips,Olberg,                        
  Ulmer,Hudson,Porter,B.Davis,Mackie,Carney,Nordlund,Parnell                   
                                                                               
  TITLE: "An Act creating the crimes of stalking in the first                  
  and second degrees and providing penalties for their                         
  violation; providing a peace officer with the authority to                   
  arrest without a warrant a person the peace officer has                      
  reasonable cause to believe has committed stalking; relating                 
  to the release before trial of a person accused of stalking;                 
  prohibiting the suspension of imposition of sentence of a                    
  person convicted of stalking; relating to the crime of                       
  assault in the third degree; and providing for an effective                  
  date."                                                                       
                                                                               
  JRN-DATE    JRN-PG                     ACTION                                
  01/15/93        74    (H)   READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S)                  
  01/15/93        74    (H)   JUDICIARY, FINANCE                               
  01/29/93       183    (H)   COSPONSOR(S): PORTER                             
  02/01/93       201    (H)   COSPONSOR(S): B.DAVIS                            
  02/03/93       223    (H)   COSPONSOR(S): MACKIE                             
  02/15/93       351    (H)   COSPONSOR(S): CARNEY                             
  02/19/93              (H)   JUD AT 01:00 PM CAPITOL 120                      
  02/19/93              (H)   MINUTE(JUD)                                      
  02/24/93       445    (H)   COSPONSOR(S): NORDLUND, PARNELL                  
  02/26/93              (H)   JUD AT 12:00 PM CAPITOL 120                      
                                                                               
                                                                               
  BILL:  HB 100                                                                
  SHORT TITLE: PROSECUTION OF JUVENILE FELONS                                  
  BILL VERSION:                                                                
  SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S) BUNDE,Green                                    
                                                                               
  TITLE: "An Act relating to criminal charges brought against                  
  minors."                                                                     
                                                                               
  JRN-DATE    JRN-PG                     ACTION                                
  01/29/93       178    (H)   READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S)                  
  01/29/93       178    (H)   HES, JUDICIARY                                   
  02/03/93       224    (H)   COSPONSOR(S): GREEN                              
  02/05/93       240    (H)   HES WAIVED 5-DAY  HEARING                        
                              NOTICE,RULE 23                                   
  02/08/93              (H)   HES AT 03:00 PM CAPITOL 106                      
  02/08/93              (H)   MINUTE(HES)                                      
  02/10/93       289    (H)   HES RPT  5DP  1DNP  2NR                          
  02/10/93       289    (H)   DP:  KOTT,VEZEY,BUNDE,TOOHEY,                    
                              OLBERG                                           
  02/10/93       289    (H)   DNP: NICHOLIA                                    
  02/10/93       289    (H)   NR:  G.DAVIS, BRICE                              
  02/10/93       289    (H)   -2 FNS (ADM, ADM)  2/10/93                       
  02/10/93       289    (H)   -2 ZERO FNS (DPS, DHSS)  2/10/93                 
  02/10/93       289    (H)   REFERRED TO JUDICIARY                            
  02/17/93              (H)   JUD AT 01:00 PM CAPITOL 120                      
  02/17/93              (H)   MINUTE(JUD)                                      
  02/17/93              (H)   MINUTE(JUD)                                      
  02/22/93              (H)   JUD AT 01:00 PM CAPITOL 120                      
  02/26/93              (H)   JUD AT 12:00 PM CAPITOL 120                      
                                                                               
                                                                               
  ACTION NARRATIVE                                                             
                                                                               
  TAPE 93-24, SIDE A                                                           
  Number 000                                                                   
                                                                               
  The House Judiciary Committee meeting was called to order at                 
  12:15 p.m. on Friday, February 26, 1993.  A quorum was not                   
  initially present; therefore, the committee meeting was                      
  convened as a work session until a quorum was obtained.                      
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER announced that the committee would take up                   
  HB 69 first.                                                                 
  HB 69 - SEX OFFENDER REGISTRATION                                            
                                                                               
  Number 039                                                                   
                                                                               
  GAYLE HORETSKI, COMMITTEE COUNSEL TO THE HOUSE JUDICIARY                     
  COMMITTEE, outlined the changes included in the draft                        
  committee substitute for HB 69, dated 2/26/93.  She noted                    
  that the first change appeared in section 2, at the bottom                   
  of page 1.  She said that section 2 would take effect                        
  immediately upon passage of the bill and then be repealed on                 
  January 1, 1997, and replaced with section 3 of the bill.                    
  Sections 2 and 3 were identical, except that section 3                       
  included the requirement that offenders submit a blood                       
  sample.                                                                      
                                                                               
  Number 095                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. PHILLIPS asked why there was not an immediate effective                 
  date on the rest of the bill's provisions.                                   
                                                                               
  Number 102                                                                   
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI said that she did not recall any committee                      
  members suggesting an immediate effective date before.  She                  
  said that the Department of Public Safety would need to gear                 
  up for the sex offender registration program and adopt                       
  regulations for its implementation.                                          
                                                                               
  Number 109                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. PHILLIPS asked if the effective date of the bill could                  
  be researched.                                                               
                                                                               
  Number 112                                                                   
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI indicated that Doug Wooliver from the speaker's                 
  office was present and could comment on that point later.                    
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI continued to outline changes in the draft                       
  committee substitute for HB 69.  Research showed that                        
  "municipal" was a better term than "local" when used to                      
  refer to police departments within Alaska; therefore, she                    
  said, all references to "local" police departments had been                  
  changed to "municipal" police departments.                                   
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI called the members' attention to page 3, line                   
  15, of the draft committee substitute.  She stated that the                  
  biggest changes made to HB 69 were in this section of the                    
  bill.  The new draft committee substitute contained a                        
  lifetime registration requirement for offenders convicted of                 
  unclassified or class A felony sex offenses, a 20-year                       
  registration requirement for offenders convicted of class B                  
  or class C felony sex offenses, and a 10-year registration                   
  requirement for offenders convicted of a class A misdemeanor                 
  sex offense.                                                                 
                                                                               
  Number 139                                                                   
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI also noted that new language appeared on page                   
  3, line 24.  The draft committee substitute said that the                    
  Department of Public Safety would adopt regulations                          
  outlining the procedure by which the department would notify                 
  offenders who were convicted of a sex offense that was a                     
  violation of a former law, or a law outside the state of                     
  Alaska.  Ms. Horetski said that this provision was added to                  
  the bill by the drafters, as a person convicted of a sex                     
  offense outside of Alaska might not be aware of the Alaska                   
  classification level to which his or her offense was                         
  equivalent, for the purposes of registering.                                 
                                                                               
  Number 175                                                                   
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI said that she had discovered that 21 states had                 
  adopted laws requiring offenders to provide blood samples                    
  for DNA analysis.  She added that at least seven of those                    
  states also had constitutional rights to privacy, as Alaska                  
  did.  She said this was not a guarantee that such a                          
  provision in HB 69 would be upheld; however, she noted that                  
  it was encouraging to know that other states with                            
  constitutional rights to privacy had adopted DNA sample                      
  laws.                                                                        
                                                                               
  Number 198                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. PHILLIPS said she had noticed another change between                    
  the most recent committee substitute and its predecessor, in                 
  that the sections were numbered differently.                                 
                                                                               
  Number 203                                                                   
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI indicated that because sections 2 and 3 were                    
  now identical, except for the dates on which they would take                 
  effect, the numbering of all subsequent sections of the bill                 
  was altered.                                                                 
                                                                               
  Number 217                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER stated that the inclusion of both sections 2                 
  and 3 was seen as the "cleanest" way to enact the law                        
  without having to come back several years down the road and                  
  enact a section relating to DNA samples.                                     
                                                                               
  Number 236                                                                   
                                                                               
  JEN TUCCI, from Juneau, testified in support of HB 69.  She                  
  said that sex offenders paid for their actions by serving                    
  jail sentences, but their victims paid for the rest of their                 
  lives.  She noted the emotional upheaval, inability to                       
  function, psychological damage, and fear were experienced by                 
  victims of sex offenses.  She added that sex offenders                       
  tended to display predatory behavior, and violent sex                        
  offenders often escalated the level of violence in each                      
  subsequent offense.  For those reasons, she said, HB 69                      
  would help to protect the innocent and convey a message that                 
  society would no longer tolerate the behavior of sex                         
  offenders.  She said there was no proof that sex offenders                   
  could be cured.                                                              
                                                                               
  Number 277                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. KOTT asked Ms. Tucci if she was testifying on her own                   
  behalf or if she was representing an organization.                           
                                                                               
  Number 279                                                                   
                                                                               
  MS. TUCCI indicated that she was representing herself.                       
                                                                               
  (Rep. Nordlund arrived at 12:25 p.m.)                                        
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER summarized for Rep. Nordlund the changes                     
  contained in the current committee substitute for HB 69.                     
                                                                               
  Number 307                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. NORDLUND moved to report out the Judiciary committee                    
  substitute for HB 69, with individual recommendations and a                  
  zero fiscal note from the Department of Public Safety.                       
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI noted that the Department of Public Safety had                  
  offered a fiscal note showing impact on that department's                    
  operating costs.                                                             
                                                                               
  REP. NORDLUND amended his motion to include the fiscal note                  
  from the Department of Public Safety.                                        
                                                                               
  Number 316                                                                   
                                                                               
  MARGOT KNUTH, from the DEPARTMENT OF LAW, stated that she                    
  had noticed a technical problem with the draft committee                     
  substitute.  She pointed out a "local" police department                     
  reference on page 3, line 8.                                                 
                                                                               
  Number 327                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER asked if Rep. Nordlund would consider an                     
  amendment changing the "local" police department language on                 
  page 3, line 8, to be a friendly amendment.                                  
                                                                               
  Number 329                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. NORDLUND said that would be a friendly amendment.  He                   
  amended his motion to ask that a new committee substitute be                 
  prepared, including the change on page 3, line 8.                            
                                                                               
  Number 340                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER, hearing no objection, ordered that the new                  
  committee substitute for HB 69 move out of committee.                        
                                                                               
  The committee took a brief "at ease" at 12:31 p.m.  The                      
  committee resumed its business at 12:34 p.m.                                 
                                                                               
  Number 360                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER announced that HB 64 was the next item of                    
  business before the committee.                                               
  HB 64 - ANTI-STALKING LAW                                                    
                                                                               
  Number 364                                                                   
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI outlined the changes that had been made in the                  
  new committee substitute for HB 64.  She noted that the most                 
  recent committee substitute was dated 2/26/93.  She said                     
  that the title of the bill had been changed to reflect                       
  changes made in the body of the bill.  She stated that new                   
  language appeared on page 2, line 26, of the committee                       
  substitute.  A technical change had been made, she                           
  indicated, to make the language less wordy.                                  
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI pointed out additional new language on page 2,                  
  line 6.  At the request of the committee, the altered                        
  language provided that a stalker who possessed a deadly                      
  weapon would be guilty of a felony rather than a                             
  misdemeanor.  At the bottom of page 2 and continuing on to                   
  page 3, Ms. Horetski noted the expanded definition of                        
  "family member."  She indicated that the new language added                  
  "uncle, aunt, nephew, or niece" to other family members                      
  already mentioned.  She noted that the language had been                     
  taken from elsewhere in existing law.                                        
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI called the members' attention to page 3, lines                  
  4 and 5, where former spouses and past or present romantic                   
  partners were also added to the definition of "family                        
  member."  She noted that the language changes regarding                      
  family members were an effort to include anyone who                          
  conceivably might be the target of a stalker.                                
                                                                               
  Number 445                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. NORDLUND asked if all of the language changes were                      
  really necessary.                                                            
                                                                               
  Number 448                                                                   
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI called Rep. Nordlund's attention to the                         
  elements of stalking on page 2, line 21.  She said that a                    
  person committed the crime of stalking if that person                        
  knowingly engaged in a course of conduct that placed another                 
  person in fear for themselves or in fear of death or                         
  physical injury to a family member.  She gave an example of                  
  a woman breaking up with her boyfriend, and the boyfriend                    
  making threats toward her child; which would be a form of                    
  stalking.                                                                    
                                                                               
  Number 456                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. NORDLUND asked if in that instance the stalker would be                 
  stalking another individual (the child) and not the child's                  
  mother.                                                                      
                                                                               
  Number 458                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER clarified the point by saying that if the                    
  action were directed at the child, then the child would be                   
  the victim.  However, in other instances, the action was                     
  directed at a mother by making threats toward her child.                     
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI pointed out a change on page 4, lines 3 and 4,                  
  which she said was an alteration to the assault statutes,                    
  not the stalking law.  She said section 3 was also new,                      
  describing what "family member" meant, in the assault                        
  statutes.  This was a technical amendment, she noted.                        
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI pointed out that language on page 4, lines 23                   
  to 26, was being moved to another section of the bill, on                    
  page 4, lines 3 to 5.                                                        
                                                                               
  Number 485                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER explained that there was a relationship                      
  between the crimes of stalking, assault, and terroristic                     
  threatening.  He said the changes that Ms. Horetski was                      
  delineating were an attempt to make the elements of all                      
  three of the crimes logical and consistent with each other.                  
                                                                               
  Number 494                                                                   
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI said that on the last page of the bill, section                 
  8, there was a change to the maximum allowable probationary                  
  period, extending it for all crimes from five to up to ten                   
  years.  Earlier versions of the bill had only changed the                    
  maximum probationary period for the crime of stalking, she                   
  said, and not for other crimes.                                              
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI stated that there was new language in the                       
  applicability section stating that criminal convictions                      
  which occurred before the effective date of HB 64 would be                   
  considered "previous convictions" under the bill.  She said                  
  an immediate effective date had been added to the bill, in                   
  section 11.                                                                  
                                                                               
  Number 516                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. KOTT mentioned a Senate bill which extended the period                  
  of probation from five to ten years.  He said that if he                     
  were opposed to the Senate bill, he would also be opposed to                 
  HB 64.  He stated that a recent report had indicated that                    
  the majority of new correctional system clients were in the                  
  system due to probation violations.  He added that he was                    
  not sure if he would be willing to extend probation to ten                   
  years for every crime.                                                       
                                                                               
  Number 540                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER noted that Rep. Kott had brought up a                        
  legitimate point.  He emphasized that the provision in the                   
  original bill extended the potential probation period to 99                  
  years.  He noted that the idea behind that provision was                     
  that there were people who fell into patterns of committing                  
  this type of crime who needed to be deterred from committing                 
  the same type of crime once released from incarceration.                     
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER said the Department of Law found the 99-year                 
  probation period difficult to justify for stalking, in light                 
  of the fact that other severe crimes had shorter maximum                     
  probation periods.  He said that in that light, it was                       
  decided to change the maximum period of probation from 99                    
  years to ten years, and to extend the change to all crimes.                  
                                                                               
  Number 595                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. PHILLIPS asked if the title of HB 64 were tight enough.                 
                                                                               
  Number 602                                                                   
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI replied that the title was accurate, but could                  
  be tightened.                                                                
                                                                               
  Number 610                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. PHILLIPS said that the title seemed all right to her,                   
  but she had wanted to raise the issue.                                       
                                                                               
  Number 614                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER commented that he did not anticipate the                     
  bill experiencing any problems in the Senate, as a result of                 
  a non-restrictive title.                                                     
                                                                               
  Number 621                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. KOTT asked if the Department of Corrections had                         
  submitted a more recent fiscal note than the one dated                       
  February 19.                                                                 
                                                                               
  REP. PHILLIPS commented that the committee should alert the                  
  Finance Committee that the Department of Corrections needed                  
  to submit another fiscal note.                                               
                                                                               
  Number 651                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER said that the Finance Committee would be an                  
  appropriate place to discuss the Department of Corrections'                  
  fiscal note.  He suggested that HB 64 be held until the                      
  Department of Corrections could address its fiscal note.                     
                                                                               
  REP. NORDLUND indicated that he had to leave.                                
                                                                               
  Number 661                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. PHILLIPS moved to pass CSHB 64 out of the Judiciary                     
  Committee with individual recommendations, and that the                      
  committee request that the Department of Corrections submit                  
  an amended fiscal note to the Finance Committee.  She noted                  
  that the second part of her motion could be included in a                    
  letter of intent.                                                            
                                                                               
  Number 671                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER, hearing no objection, ordered that CSHB 64                  
  (JUD) be moved out of committee with individual                              
  recommendations.                                                             
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER announced that HB 100 was the next item of                   
  business before the committee.                                               
  HB 100 - PROSECUTION OF JUVENILE FELONS                                      
                                                                               
  Number 675                                                                   
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI explained that a draft committee substitute for                 
  HB 100 had been prepared for the members' discussion.  She                   
  went over changes that had been made to the original bill,                   
  which set up a scheme to transfer juveniles into adult court                 
  for certain offenses, but allowed for juveniles to transfer                  
  back to the juvenile system if the juvenile could show that                  
  she or he was "amenable to treatment."  She noted that under                 
  HB 100, the burden of proof of treatability was on the                       
  juvenile.                                                                    
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI commented that the proposed committee                           
  substitute contained an "automatic" waiver.  If a juvenile                   
  aged 16 or older were charged with an unclassified or class                  
  A felony, he or she would be moved into adult court, she                     
  said.                                                                        
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI mentioned a similar bill, SB 54, which had been                 
  reported out of the Senate Judiciary Committee.  She noted                   
  that the present version of SB 54 was not identical to                       
  either HB 100 or the proposed committee substitute.                          
  However, she noted, it was closer in content to HB 100.                      
                                                                               
  Number 710                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER commented that SB 54 had, when introduced,                   
  looked just like the proposed committee substitute for HB
  100.  The chairman noted that the idea behind HB 100 was to                  
  have juveniles of a certain age who were charged with                        
  serious offenses treated like adults.  He said it was hoped                  
  that HB 100 would serve as a deterrent to some degree.                       
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER noted that two approaches could be taken to                  
  accomplish the goal of HB 100.  One approach, set out in the                 
  proposed committee substitute, would be to automatically                     
  waive certain juvenile offenders to adult court.  Under                      
  another approach, set out in the original HB 100, juveniles                  
  would be automatically waived into adult court, but could                    
  petition to have their cases moved back to juvenile court.                   
                                                                               
  Number 770                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. PHILLIPS asked the chairman if he had discussed the                     
  approach taken in the proposed committee substitute with the                 
  sponsor of HB 100.                                                           
                                                                               
  Number 771                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER indicated that HB 100's sponsor would not                    
  object to the adoption of the committee substitute.  He                      
  speculated that the Senate bill had been amended the way                     
  that it was to gain enough support for the committee to                      
  report it out.                                                               
                                                                               
  Number 785                                                                   
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI stated that, as originally drafted, HB 100                      
  applied to 15- 16- and 17-year-olds who had been charged                     
  with murder or attempted murder, or who had committed an                     
  unclassified or class A felony and had been previously                       
  adjudicated for a felony, or who had been charged with a                     
  felony and had been previously adjudicated as an adult for a                 
  felony.  If any of those situations were true, she said, a                   
  minor would be treated as an adult.  However, a juvenile                     
  could petition to be returned to juvenile court.                             
                                                                               
  TAPE 93-24, SIDE B                                                           
  Number 000                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. PHILLIPS asked Ms. Horetski to clarify some of the                      
  provisions of the proposed committee substitute.                             
                                                                               
  Number 009                                                                   
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI responded that the proposed committee                           
  substitute contained an automatic waiver for 16- and 17-                     
  year-olds, whereas the original bill had an automatic waiver                 
  for 15-, 16-and 17-year-olds.  The original bill applied to                  
  all unclassified and class A felonies, she said.  The                        
  proposed committee substitute provided that 16- and 17-year-                 
  olds charged with murder would be waived into adult court,                   
  where they would stay.                                                       
                                                                               
  Number 033                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. KOTT asked about allowing a juvenile to petition the                    
  court to be tried in juvenile court, due to mitigating                       
  circumstances.                                                               
                                                                               
  Number 045                                                                   
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI said that the screening and charging of adult                   
  offenders was performed by the Department of Law (DOL).  The                 
  screening and charging of juvenile offenders was conducted                   
  by the Department of Health and Social Services (DHSS), she                  
  added.  She said that DHSS, in consultation with DOL,                        
  determined the offense with which the juvenile offender                      
  would be charged.  But, she said, if a juvenile was not                      
  charged with either an unclassified or a class A felony, HB
  100 would not apply.  She noted that mitigating                              
  circumstances would be taken into consideration during the                   
  screening and charging process.  HB 100 would not affect                     
  that process, she said.                                                      
                                                                               
  Number 094                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. NORDLUND noted that all of the facts of a case might                    
  not be known until a trial occurred.  However, he said, by                   
  that time, a juvenile would already have been transferred                    
  into the adult justice system.                                               
                                                                               
  Number 118                                                                   
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI commented that an investigation was conducted                   
  in all criminal cases.  She said that no charges would be                    
  filed prior to an investigation.                                             
                                                                               
  Number 131                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER asked at what stage of the proceedings an                    
  attorney was assigned to a juvenile defendant.                               
                                                                               
  Number 136                                                                   
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI said that an attorney would be assigned at the                  
  juvenile court's equivalent of an arraignment.                               
                                                                               
  Number 143                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER asked, When during the process would the                     
  decision be made to charge a juvenile with an offense?  He                   
  said that it was his assumption that law enforcement                         
  officers would treat a juvenile as a juvenile until a                        
  decision was made to charge the individual with an adult                     
  offense.                                                                     
                                                                               
  MS. HORETSKI stated that the chairman's assumption was                       
  correct.                                                                     
                                                                               
  Number 190                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER commented that the automatic waiver                          
  procedure would not go into effect until the decision to                     
  charge a juvenile offender with an adult offense had been                    
  made.                                                                        
                                                                               
  Number 197                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. KOTT commented that often criminal charges were brought                 
  in an expeditious manner.                                                    
                                                                               
  Number 200                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. NORDLUND said that he had to leave the meeting, but                     
  noted that he would be more comfortable with HB 100 if he                    
  knew how thoroughly DHSS initially investigated crimes.                      
                                                                               
  Number 206                                                                   
                                                                               
  RANDALL HINES, YOUTH CORRECTIONS SPECIALIST with the DHSS,                   
  appeared before the committee to answer questions.                           
                                                                               
  Number 209                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER asked if juveniles would be treated as                       
  juveniles until they were formally charged with an adult                     
  offense.                                                                     
                                                                               
  Number 218                                                                   
                                                                               
  MR. HINES replied that when a juvenile was referred to DHSS                  
  by law enforcement officials, a police report normally                       
  accompanied the referral.  He stated that intake personnel                   
  screened the report and determined what information still                    
  needed to be gathered.  Once the information was complete,                   
  he said, DHSS and DOL officials met to decide what crime the                 
  juvenile should be charged with.                                             
                                                                               
  MR. HINES noted that if a juvenile was incarcerated, charges                 
  had to be filed within 48 hours.  If the juvenile was not                    
  incarcerated, he said, there was more time to determine the                  
  appropriate charges.                                                         
                                                                               
  Number 247                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. NORDLUND reiterated his contention that only during a                   
  trial did all the facts of a case come out.  He said that                    
  DHSS' investigation was limited in scope.  He noted that a                   
  limited investigation could result in a juvenile being                       
  improperly placed into the adult system.  By the time all of                 
  the facts were known, he said, it was too late:  the                         
  juvenile was already in the adult system.                                    
                                                                               
  Number 265                                                                   
                                                                               
  JENNY MURRAY, LEGISLATIVE ASSISTANT TO REP. CON BUNDE, noted                 
  that the sponsor favored passage of the original version of                  
  HB 100.  She said that he was concerned about the high                       
  fiscal impact of the proposed committee substitute.                          
                                                                               
  MS. MURRAY noted that there was a "reverse waiver" procedure                 
  in the original HB 100; juveniles who committed certain                      
  crimes would automatically go into the adult justice system,                 
  but could petition to be transferred back into juvenile                      
  court.  She noted that the role of the judge was an                          
  important factor in the process of moving juveniles into and                 
  out of adult court.                                                          
                                                                               
  MS. MURRAY gave an example of a child, who had been abused                   
  for years, murdering his stepfather.  She said that under                    
  the provisions of the committee substitute for HB 100, the                   
  child would probably be automatically waived into adult                      
  court.  Under the original HB 100, she said, if the defense                  
  could prove during a hearing that the juvenile were amenable                 
  to treatment, the juvenile could be transferred back to the                  
  juvenile system.  She noted that the original HB 100                         
  contained a "catch" provision, which was not included in the                 
  committee substitute.                                                        
                                                                               
  Number 329                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER commented that the original HB 100 would                     
  probably require that more hearings be held than were                        
  required under the committee substitute.  In that light, he                  
  asked Ms. Murray why it was felt that the committee                          
  substitute would result in a higher cost to the state.                       
                                                                               
  Number 340                                                                   
                                                                               
  MS. MURRAY noted that the committee substitute was very                      
  similar to the original SB 54.  She said that fiscal notes                   
  accompanying the original SB 54 were much higher than the                    
  fiscal notes for HB 100.                                                     
                                                                               
  Number 366                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER stated that sometimes the philosophies of                    
  the Public Defender Agency and the Office of Public Advocacy                 
  were reflected in their fiscal notes.  He asked Ms. Murray                   
  if it would be fair to say that the original HB 100 would                    
  result in a heavier workload for the court system than would                 
  the committee substitute.                                                    
                                                                               
  MS. MURRAY said that she did not know the answer to the                      
  chairman's question.                                                         
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER announced that HB 100 would be held in                       
  committee, and another hearing would be scheduled for a time                 
  when Rep. Bunde could be present.                                            
                                                                               
  ADJOURNMENT                                                                  
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN PORTER adjourned the meeting at 1:24 p.m.                           

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