Legislature(1999 - 2000)
04/08/1999 03:06 PM House HES
| Audio | Topic |
|---|
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
HOUSE HEALTH, EDUCATION AND SOCIAL
SERVICES STANDING COMMITTEE
April 8, 1999
3:06 p.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Representative Fred Dyson, Co-Chair
Representative John Coghill, Co-Chair
Representative Jim Whitaker
Representative Joe Green
Representative Carl Morgan
Representative Tom Brice
Representative Allen Kemplen
MEMBERS ABSENT
All members present
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
PRESENTATION BY DIVISION OF FAMILY AND YOUTH SERVICES ON GROUP
FOSTER HOMES
- CANCELED
* HOUSE BILL NO. 175
"An Act requiring the Department of Health and Social Services to
provide notice to a community council on receipt of an application
for a license to operate a certain kind of foster group home."
- HEARD AND HELD
* HOUSE BILL NO. 149
"An Act relating to insurance coverage for treatment of mental
illness and substance abuse; repealing provisions of ch. 8, SLA
1997, that terminates required mental health benefit coverage; and
providing for an effective date."
- HEARD AND HELD
* HOUSE BILL NO. 142
"An Act relating to the education credit for the fisheries business
tax and the fisheries resource landing tax; and providing for an
effective date."
- HEARD AND HELD
(* First public hearing)
PREVIOUS ACTION
BILL: HB 175
SHORT TITLE: LICENSING OF FOSTER GROUP HOMES
SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVES(S) GREEN, Dyson, Halcro
Jrn-Date Jrn-Page Action
3/31/99 628 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRAL(S)
3/31/99 628 (H) HES, CRA
4/06/99 661 (H) COSPONSOR(S): HALCRO
4/08/99 (H) HES AT 3:00 PM CAPITOL 106
BILL: HB 149
SHORT TITLE: INSURANCE: MENTAL HEALTH & SUBSTANCE ABUSE
SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVES(S) DAVIS BY REQUEST
Jrn-Date Jrn-Page Action
3/19/99 516 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRAL(S)
3/19/99 516 (H) HES, L&C, FIN
4/08/99 (H) HES AT 3:00 PM CAPITOL 106
BILL: HB 142
SHORT TITLE: EDUCATION CREDIT FOR FISHERY TAXES
SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVES(S) DAVIS
Jrn-Date Jrn-Page Action
3/19/99 514 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRAL(S)
3/19/99 514 (H) HES, FINANCE
4/08/99 (H) HES AT 3:00 PM CAPITOL 106
WITNESS REGISTER
JEFF LOGAN, Legislative Assistant
to Representative Joe Green
Alaska State Legislature
Capitol Building, Room 214
Juneau, Alaska 99801
Telephone: (907) 465-3727
POSITION STATEMENT: Presented sponsor statement for HB 175.
SONIA VASCONI
140 Bree Avenue
Anchorage, Alaska 99515
Telephone: (907) 345-8830
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in favor of HB 175.
GAIL IGO, Co-President
Anchor Foster Care Association
1922 Logan
Anchorage, Alaska 99508
Telephone: (907) 272-4948
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 175.
MARBETH JOHNS, Advocate
Disability Law Center of Alaska
615 East 82nd, Number 101
Anchorage, Alaska 99518
Telephone: (907) 344-1002
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 175.
CHERYL SHROYER
220 Bree Avenue
Anchorage, Alaska 99515
Telephone: (907) 345-0859
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 175.
HEIDI POLLARD
220 Bree Avenue
Anchorage, Alaska 99515
Telephone: (907) 345-3152
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 175.
BOB BELL, Assemblyman
Anchorage Assembly
2610 Curlew Circle
Anchorage, Alaska 99515
Telephone: (907) 343-2430
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 175.
JEFF JESSEE
13030 Back Road
Anchorage, Alaska 99515
Telephone: (907) 269-7960
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 175.
JAY BUSH, Administrator
Customer Satisfaction and Quality Assurance
Hope Community Resources
540 West International Airport Road
Anchorage, Alaska 99518
Telephone: (907) 564-7434
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified against HB 175.
JOHN VOTE
311 Bree Avenue
Anchorage, Alaska 99515
Telephone: (907) 348-0209
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 175.
KRISTAN JEZ, Development Director
Hope Community Resources
540 West International Airport Road
Anchorage, Alaska 99518
Telephone: (907) 564-7434
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified against HB 175.
RACHEL FARALAN
Alternative Community Mental Health Center
11644 Eagle River Loop Road Spur
Eagle River, Alaska 99577
Telephone: (907) 694-7644
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified against HB 175.
KARIN ST. CLAIR
5904 Buckner Drive
Anchorage, Alaska 99504
Telephone: (907) 338-8716
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified against HB 175.
PELTON GOUDEY
1922 Logan Street
Anchorage, Alaska 99508
Telephone: (907) 272-4948
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 175.
RITA BARRAS
4261 Chelsea Way
Anchorage, Alaska 99504
Telephone: (907) 333-6220
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified against HB 175.
STEPHANI SOCK
9763 Newhaven Loop
Anchorage, Alaska 99507
Telephone: (907) 349-0380
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified against HB 175.
RUSS WEBB, Deputy Commissioner
Department of Health and Social Services
P.O. Box 110650
Juneau, Alaska 99811
Telephone: (907) 465-3030
POSITION STATEMENT: Provided information on HB 175.
THERESA TANOURY, Administrator
Family Services
Division of Family and Youth Services
Department of Health and Social Services
P.O. Box 110650
Juneau, Alaska 99811
Telephone: (907) 465-3191
POSITION STATEMENT: Provided information on HB 175.
ACTION NARRATIVE
TAPE 99-31, SIDE A
Number 0001
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON called the House Health, Education and Social
Services Standing Committee meeting to order at 3:06 p.m. Members
present at the call to order were Representatives Dyson, Coghill,
Green, Morgan, Brice and Kemplen. Representative Whitaker joined
the meeting at 3:13 p.m.
HB 175 - LICENSING OF FOSTER GROUP HOMES
Number 0052
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON announced the first order of business as House
Bill No. 175, "An Act requiring the Department of Health and Social
Services to provide notice to a community council on receipt of an
application for a license to operate a certain kind of foster group
home."
JEFF LOGAN, Legislative Assistant to Representative Joe Green, came
forward to present the sponsor statement. He said HB 175
establishes a notification requirement as AS 47.35.018, so that
community councils will have information about new facilities going
in their area, and it establishes a definition for a foster group
home. The need for HB 175 became apparent to Representative Green,
the sponsor, and his constituents after a group foster home was
established in his district with no notification, high barriers to
information for citizens, and long delays in response times by the
Division of Family and Youth Services (DFYS). While it may be true
that some local governments may choose to require certain types of
notification through the zoning process, other local governments
may choose not to. After some consideration, Representative Green
decided that all Alaskans, not just those in municipalities or
boroughs with tight zoning restrictions, should have the benefits
of notification.
MR. LOGAN stated that it is important to note that HB 175 does not
do anything to empower a community council to slow down, stop or
prohibit a residential care facility. There might be testimony
today that this will be the eventual result, but they believe that
informing citizens of what their government is doing in their
neighborhood is good public policy and a legitimate function of
this legislative body. The sponsor fully understands that the
state has a responsibility for the children being cared for in
these facilities. He also understands that Alaskans have a right
to know what their government is doing and believes HB 175 is a
good balance between the two.
Number 0305
SONIA VASCONI came forward to testify. She read the following
testimony:
Good afternoon Mr. Chairman and members of the committee.
I'd like to thank you for providing me with the
opportunity to testify in favor of HB 175, which will
allow communities all throughout the state to be notified
of the establishment of foster group homes in their
neighborhoods.
My name is Sonia Vasconi. I come before you as a parent,
as a neighbor and as a concerned citizen.
Let me start this testimony by giving you some basic
background regarding foster group homes as I see it.
The idea behind the establishment of foster group homes
was well intended. Keeping large group of siblings
together was logical and thoughtful.
However, what foster group homes have become resembles
little of what they were intended to be.
Today, a single foster group home parent can care for up
to eight or more unrelated children in a home. These
children can potentially present severe mental
dysfunctions such as sexual predatory behaviors, arsonist
tendencies and aggressive behaviors. Some or perhaps all
of them have "wrap around services" which provide these
children with psychological and social services at home
or at other facilities.
These facts and the increased traffic from social
workers, relatives, friends and the police have a
tremendous impact in neighborhoods surrounding foster
group homes.
This situation creates frustration among those of us who
try to do the right thing. We abide by the laws,
faithfully pay our taxes and try to raise our children
the best we can by, among other things, living in the
safest neighborhood we can possibly afford, sometimes
with sacrifices.
Suddenly, we find ourselves dealing with safety issues we
didn't previously have, and nobody took the time to
inform us about. And when we tried to inform ourselves
we found that the system is arrogant and answers are
vague and misleading.
We are expected to embrace these programs in our
neighborhoods when we don't even know what they are all
about.
Additionally, foster parents find themselves in a bind as
well. Sometimes, they, themselves, don't know enough
about the children they are supposed to are for. And
when safety issues arise they are limited by what they
can do or say. This adds more confusion to the whole
situation.
Ignorance creates suspicion. Let's put the issues on the
table at our community councils. That's what they were
created for.
House Bill 175 is the least a community should be
entitled to have; the right to be notified.
This bill encourages communication and creates a balance
between the needs of foster group homes and the
communities that they so depend on for the success of
these programs.
Thanks again Mr. Chairman and members of this committee
for introducing legislation that assists both foster
parent and the communities in addressing the needs of
foster children.
I respectfully encourage you to support and help this
bill be enacted into law.
If you have any questions, I'll be glad to answer.
Number 0545
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked if it would make a difference about the
concern about danger if the children were all infants for instance.
MS. VASCONI said it wasn't even if they were teenagers; it is the
kinds of problems that they have. People cannot avoid having these
children in their communities. She believes open communication
would be better than suddenly realizing next door is a foster group
home with severely emotionally disturbed children living there.
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON agreed that communication is important, but his
question was, if all the children in that home were infants, would
she still be afraid.
MS. VASCONI answered no.
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked if there was an age group which starts to
be a safety issue in the neighborhood.
MS. VASCONI responded that it depends on the issues of the
children. In this case, they are teenagers labeled severely
emotionally disturbed; that worries her.
Number 0760
GAIL IGO, Co-President, Anchor Foster Care Association, testified
via teleconference from Anchorage. She informed the committee that
she is concerned about the confidentiality and information that
would be shared with the community council for those foster parents
who have four or more children. Foster parents are members of the
public record, and anyone can go to DFYS and find out whatever they
need to know. She is concerned about the tenor of this, and said
it begins to feel like a police state. She tries to teach respect
to her foster children. In order to teach respect, they need to
show respect. She doesn't believe that HB 175 is respecting the
rights of the children.
Number 0827
REPRESENTATIVE BRICE asked Ms. Igo if the kind of children
generally in foster care are awaiting adjudicatory hearings through
the DFYS juvenile justice system.
MS. IGO answered that she didn't have any statistics on that.
There is full range of children as well as problems.
REPRESENTATIVE BRICE commented that group homes provide services to
a wide variety of children.
MS. IGO agreed and said different foster homes provide different
services to different children.
Number 0922
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked Ms. Igo to show him where in the bill it
implied that it would show no respect to the children.
MS. IGO responded that if she were running a group home she would
have to tell the community council. These children do not need
attention brought to them. Foster parents are integrating the
children back into society; to have their homes the focus of public
attention is difficult and is not showing the children respect.
Children who are placed in a group home are selected because they
are a lower risk for reoffending or causing trouble in the
community. They also need to protect the children's
confidentiality.
Number 0981
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN said he appreciated what she is saying, but
asked if she really believes where they have foster group homes
that the neighborhood doesn't become aware of them. "You're saying
there should be no discussion with the neighbors who have children
of their own about what's going to happen in this foster group
home, I think works against the very principle that you're trying
to establish, in that they are trying to be rehabilitated into the
community, the people in this particular case I know, would welcome
them with open arms, to be part of the neighborhood. What they
object to is to have it put upon them without any notification at
all. Had DFYS come to these people and said, 'We are considering
buying house X over here because we want to establish a group home
for children, what can we do, how can you help us, will you help
us?' I think there would have been no problem whatsoever." The
neighborhood would have welcomed them; they would have helped them
adjust. The problem is that they first weren't told, and then when
they finally began to find out, then they were not given
information. He had two different meetings with DFYS and several
letters trying to get information about what was going on, and he
still got no information. They don't want to know the background
of each child; what they want to know is what is going to happen.
MS. IGO responded that her neighbors know she is a foster parent;
she did not give them any details. They don't have a large number
of children usually. They did approach the community council and
told them they were experienced foster parents. She and her
husband moved to Alaska from Vermont and have over 20 years of
experience fostering children.
Number 1125
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN appreciated her comment and noted that would
have gone a long way. In her case she and her husband went to the
neighbors and told them what their plan was. In this case, it was
a single man and the neighbors questioned if this was the best
approach to have four children being supervised by a single person
who is frequently out of the house. He doesn't believe that is an
invasion of the privacy of the children; it is a protection for
them.
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON respectfully reminded Representative Green that
he is debating the issue and maybe with the wrong person.
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN said he was trying to find out why Ms. Igo
asked that question. His point is information exchange. He said
he was agreeing with her now, not debating with her.
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked what does she have to do to protect the
confidentiality of the children at her home.
MS. IGO said she cannot even say that she is a foster parent. They
went to the community council and announced that they were foster
parents moving here from Vermont. She is not allowed to give any
information about any particular child or the reasons the child is
with them.
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked for confirmation if she had said she
couldn't even say she is a foster parent.
MS. IGO answered that is correct.
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON questioned that; they will pursue that later.
Number 1238
MARBETH JOHNS, Advocate, Disability Law Center of Alaska, testified
via teleconference from Anchorage. She told the committee the
reasons they are interested in HB 175 are because many of the
children in foster care have disabilities. They are concerned that
notice to community councils suggest that some communities may try
to exclude some children with disabilities. In AS 47.35.105 there
already is a process for complaints if a community member believes
a foster home has violated their condition of license. The
alternatives to Alaska's system of foster group homes are out-of-
state placement or institutional placement, which are both
expensive. They find very little support for this bill and urged
the committee to find ways to increase the availability of
therapeutic foster care, not decrease it as this bill could do.
Number 1294
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked in addition to decreasing availability of
homes, are they concerned about the children being stigmatized in
the neighborhood.
MS. JOHNS answered yes they are.
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked her to speak about her concern.
MS. JOHNS explained that a regular family can move into a
neighborhood without having to give notice. If individuals with
disabilities have to give notice, that does stigmatize them and
points them out to everybody in the neighborhood. It is treating
them differently from everybody else.
REPRESENTATIVE BRICE asked if, from a legal view, she is aware of
any other class or group that have to post notice of moving into a
community.
MS. JOHNS answered sexual assaulters.
Number 1366
CHERYL SHROYER, testified via teleconference from Anchorage. She
stated her support of HB 175, and she encourages resident
involvement in neighborhood and community-wide planning. The
community council is the forum that provides opportunities for all
the residents to be thoughtful and active participants. They can
discuss community issues that affect the neighborhood like speeding
in front of the park, snowmobiles in the street and a foster group
home. A foster group home creates traffic and safety problems, and
difficulty communicating with DFYS. She would hope that
notification to the community council regarding application for a
license for a foster group home would help educate the community,
increase public knowledge, and ensure that all persons and
community groups have an opportunity for a fair voice in decisions
affecting their neighborhood.
Number 1430
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked if Ms. Shroyer lives in the neighborhood
where the problem arose.
MS. SHROYER answered that is correct.
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked if her family had been harassed or had
property damage or anything from the children in the foster home.
MS. SHROYER answered no.
Number 1448
REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN asked if there was a mechanism in place to
remedy situations with conflict between a group home and the
neighborhood, would that make Ms. Shroyer more comfortable about a
group foster home being located in her neighborhood.
MS. SHROYER answered of course. The idea of an ombudsman is
perfect. Their problem is that the neighbors never know what is
going on or why. They see police cars going by, they hear rumors
and that could all be ended if there were someone as Representative
Kemplen described.
Number 1544
HEIDI POLLARD, testified via teleconference from Anchorage. She
testified on behalf of Ev Irvin and herself. She supports HB 175
because it is the basic communication a community should hear.
Additionally, she would like to support an amendment to specify how
many children are in the care of a foster group home, and what
level of care is in that home. Neighbors should be aware of the
impact in their neighborhood. She lives on the same street as the
foster group home and is aware of how the traffic situation and the
constant police visits have impacted the neighborhood.
MS. POLLARD participated in a neighborhood group who researched
foster group homes. They have been at it for over a year, and they
have learned who to ask, how to ask, how to beg for information and
find out who to call. They have had bad luck at getting anything
out of DFYS and the Department of Health and Social Services
(DHSS). They have called or had meetings with DFYS staff: Gwen
McAlpine, Steve McComb, Karl Brimmer, Russ Webb, Leonard Abel,
Daryl Johnson and Jane Steele; Department of Health and Development
Disabilities Foster Care Review panel, the Anchorage Police
Department, probationary officers and planning and health
departments, the assembly people, Jeff Jessee, the mental health
association director, the Oceanview/Old Seward Community Council
and Representatives Joe Green and Pete Kelly. One year of phone
calls and meetings has resulted in HB 175.
MS. POLLARD supports HB 175 because getting this kind of
information should not be this difficult, and these meetings would
not have taken place without the intervention of the Oceanview/Old
Seward Community Council and Representative Green. It has been
like pulling teeth to get DFYS and DHSS to listen to their
concerns. She encouraged the committee to support HB 175.
Number 1697
BOB BELL, Assemblyman, Anchorage Assembly, testified via
teleconference from Anchorage. He has been working with the
neighborhood for quite some time. It seems to him that they should
be able to find some kind of balance. The discussion here is about
group foster homes, not just foster homes. It is important to try
to maintain a neighborhood identity and environment. Maybe in some
cases a group home doesn't fit into that environment very well. In
all his discussions, no one has said they need less opportunity for
foster homes. The programs are necessary, and no one is trying to
restrict it; but the neighbors shouldn't be impacted too much
either.
MR. BELL suggested the idea of a citizen's committee with staff
support from DFYS, that would look at the applications for group
foster homes to see if they fit in the community. If they end up
in a community that doesn't want them there, that has a negative
impact on the foster home, as well as the community. He believes
that HB 175 starts in the direction of finding a balance. He
doesn't think there is any intent for the community council to
interrogate the foster parents or children. It is more a "let us
know what you're doing there, and let's see if we can find some way
to fit into our community in the best way possible."
Number 1788
REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN asked if Mr. Bell believes that every
neighborhood had the responsibility to share in the burden of
dealing with community issues.
MR. BELL responded absolutely.
REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN asked Mr. Bell if he would support a
feedback mechanism being established in the neighborhoods.
MR. BELL replied that he wasn't sure where he was going with that.
It strikes him that HB 175 sort of accomplishes that because once
the community council is notified that there is an application,
they would start providing feedback. He asked Representative
Kemplen if he was talking about before or after the fact.
Number 1868
REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN answered both. He continued that the bill
doesn't have a system to develop a set of rules for a stronger
sense of partnership between the neighborhood and the group foster
home, or other social agency. When there are instances when
someone steps over the line, that person will be dealt with in a
swift fashion. By changing the legislation to require that set of
rules to be developed between the agency and the neighborhood
represents that feedback mechanism.
MR. BELL assumed that notification to the community council would
infer that the DFYS and the foster parents who were planning to
bring a group foster home into the neighborhood would be doing that
maybe on a less formal basis. After the fact, if it turns out that
the foster home is causing problems beyond what would normally be
anticipated, he would assume that DFYS would have the mechanism to
deal with that.
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked Mr. Bell if they thought about dealing with
this on a local zoning basis.
Number 1998
MR. BELL replied that they were having a meeting next week with the
municipal attorney to look at that. They have two concerns with
that, one the state doesn't have to comply with local zoning
requirements and two, it might be a bit more draconian than they
want.
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked Mr. Bell why they haven't dealt with this
issue in municipal code as opposed to bringing it to the
legislature.
MR. BELL reiterated that the state isn't obligated to abide by
municipal code. The municipality can't overrule the state. It
also gets into the U.S. Federal Fair Housing Act and the Americans
with Disabilities Act (ADA) and gets complicated. They are looking
at that to make sure there is a fair balance.
Number 2069
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked Mr. Bell how quickly he thought they would
get through that process locally.
MR. BELL anticipated several months.
Number 2099
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN confirmed that Mr. Bell has been working with
them on the issue and did advise them last year that rezoning
probably wouldn't be effective.
MR. BELL agreed he did, and he got back a letter from an attorney
who expressed a lot of reservations of what they could do legally
with zoning considering the Fair Housing Act and ADA. The only
place he thought there was an opportunity to deal with it on zoning
would be on public safety issues.
Number 2149
MIKE KEECH, President, Foster Care Providers Association, testified
from Anchorage via teleconference. He noted some of the issues
that HB 175 raises for him on a personal level and as a
representative of the Foster Care Providers Association. If he can
afford to live in a neighborhood and has to go to a community
council, that seems in direct violation of the Fair Housing Act.
He should not be segregated because he is a foster family. A group
home is a family, it is not a business. He asked if he had
biological children with problems, would he also be required to let
the community council know he was moving into a neighborhood.
MR. KEECH went to two meetings at Oceanview, but he went to get
involved in trying to understand where foster families come from.
They are a ministry to children for the state; they desire to help
the children, but where they live should be deemed by what they can
afford and where they choose to live, not out a community council
saying "We don't want you in our neighborhood." He asked if this
would be grandfathered, and would he be forced to move because his
neighborhood decides they don't want foster families.
MR. KEECH added that confidentiality would also be an issue not
only for the children, but for his family. What they choose to do
as a family, as long as they are controlling the foster children
the same as their own, should not be an issue, and should not need
the community council's approval.
Number 2232
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON indicated he didn't think there was anything in
the bill that gives a community council any kind of approval
process at all.
MR. KEECH mentioned that the situation in Oceanview has forced that
gentleman to put his house up for sale, and he will more than
likely take a loss on it, because of the pressures put on him
because of all of this. He doesn't want to see that happen to
other foster parents. The city desperately needs foster parents.
Number 2283
REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN asked if Mr. Keech heard the conversation
with Mr. Bell about balance and feedback mechanism.
MR. KEECH answered he had. He noted most of his neighbors know he
does foster care, and he understands the traffic issue. Most of
the children running the streets are not his children. Most foster
families keep their children in a controlled environment. He has
training to deal with foster children, and most families do. He
sees the checks and balances, but most communities don't get
involved. In fact, Oceanview didn't get involved until they saw
something that they didn't like.
REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN asked Mr. Keech where the accountability
mechanism is in a neighborhood with a foster home.
TAPE 99-31, SIDE B
Number 2349
MR. KEECH answered he didn't know. He asked how someone is held
accountable when their biological child does something. In the
case of children the foster parents can't control, they call DFYS
and say this child needs to move for whatever reason; they need
more care than what is provided. If his neighbors report that his
foster child is doing something outside the realm, he will deal
with like any parent would.
REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN asked if the Foster Care Providers
Association have any policies that address the issue of
accountability. It seems to him there needs to be a mechanism
established when there is a violation of community norms, action
will be taken. He asked if they had thought about establishing
some self-policing rules for group foster homes.
MR. KEECH answered they hadn't at this point. The association is
just now getting back on its feet. It has been inactive for about
three years. The purpose is to establish more foster care
associations in the local areas, have strong voice with the
legislature, and to give support to each other. Accountability
hasn't been looked simply because it is too new of an organization.
Number 2216
REPRESENTATIVE BRICE asked if Mr. Keech owns his own home or does
an agency have title to it.
MR. KEECH answered he owns his home.
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked about training Mr. Keech has received as
a foster parent.
Number 2175
MR. KEECH answered he has had Mandt training, which is a way to
control a child physically without harming them; training for fetal
alcohol and drug addiction, emotional problems and sexual
molestation. He has had recurring training on how to deal with all
those problems, and there is information available on the Internet.
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked if Mr. Keech thought foster parents
would be able to handle the variety of children without that
training.
MR. KEECH said he didn't feel they would, especially initially, but
as time goes on, foster parents do learn more.
Number 2111
JEFF JESSEE testified via teleconference from Anchorage. He is a
resident of the Oceanview community council area and was a
participant on the work group the community council formed to look
into the issue of this particular group home. He believes this
bill is an example of "hard cases make bad law." He understands
the concerns for safety, their frustration in terms of getting
adequate, timely answers from DHSS, but he can't understand how
this bill is going to solve the problem; he believes it will make
the problem worse. Much of the information the neighbors really
want is confidential, and they won't be able to get it.
MR. JESSEE agreed there needs to be some mechanism to answer
concerns. One of the recommendations of the community group, which
many agreed with, was an independent review group. The Foster Care
Review Board might have been that kind of organization; it recently
was defunded. He encouraged them to look at those kinds of options
rather than this bill.
Number 1943
JAY BUSH, Administrator, Customer Satisfaction and Quality
Assurance, Hope Community Resources, testified via teleconference
from Anchorage and is against HB 175. He noted it seemed to be a
restriction on the rights of individuals who experience
disabilities for fair housing and rights protected under the ADA.
He appreciates the concerns he has heard in support of the bill.
He agrees that foster children should have a safe, caring
environment that meets their needs, as well as protects them, and
provides for their furthering education and acquiring life skills.
MR. BUSH is concerned any time another hoop to jump through is
created which is not a hoop anyone else moving into a neighborhood
would be forced to jump through. If he had children with special
needs and moved into a neighborhood, he wouldn't have to go to the
community council to seek their permission. He believes that this
bill infers that permission has to be granted. It is incumbent
upon any foster parent to reach out to the neighborhood because
children are raised by the neighborhood. They are not raised only
by the single family. It really does take a village to raise a
child. It is important to have good supportive neighbors because
everyone is involved in the parenting of a child.
MR. BUSH doesn't see this bill as building community; he sees it
building walls and barriers and providing for more gated-controlled
communities in America. The needs for foster children in Alaska
are great, and bills are needed to support more good foster parents
and more good opportunities for children who can't be supported in
their natural family.
Number 1826
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN disagreed with Mr. Bush's conclusions. He
doesn't think there is anything in the bill that impairs the
ability to establish a group home in the neighborhood;
notification certainly isn't a restriction. People are far more
willing to accept things when they are informed instead of finding
out after the fact. The neighbors are only asking that they be
informed.
MR. BUSH said his concern about the bill is that it doesn't require
a natural family who may have four or more children with special
needs to jump through the same hoop. If they are making a special
class of people who have to go through one more hoop to live in a
neighborhood, he is concerned and it smacks of civil rights. If
they were taking out the clause that says "disability" and putting
in "person of color," they would not even be having this
discussion.
REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN said he is quite familiar with these type of
issues at the neighborhood level. He has seen agencies come in and
work with the community council and be accepted by the
neighborhood. The notion of "after-the-fact" is a key concern of
neighborhoods. He asked Mr. Bush why he feels group foster homes
can't be up-front with neighborhoods.
Number 1602
MR. BUSH said he is not saying foster group homes should not be up-
front with the neighborhood. He is concerned that the legislation
requires notification to a body, which may or may not be able to
make a comment or restrict moving into a neighborhood. People
should reach out to their neighbors and become a society of people
who sit on their porches and say "hello" to people as they walk by;
but it shouldn't be legislated. He believes the legislation sets
a tone that may not be intended.
Number 1532
JOHN VOTE testified via teleconference from Anchorage. He is the
foster group home that resulted in HB 175. He responded to
Representative Green's remarks about his Oceanview neighbors
wanting to welcome him with open arms. "Within a short period of
time after I moved into this neighborhood, they did, I don't know
how, but they were made aware of that I was here, and they were
also given a bunch of false information as far as what type of kids
I was working with. When they were asked to come down and meet me,
... one of the comments from one of the neighbors which actually
testified, I believe, was 'When hell freezes over.' You'll find
that also in the newspaper comments because that comment was even
made to--well actually it was overheard by--Lisa Demer from the
Daily News because she was standing there when the comment was
made. I feel that this bill comes out of bigotry. Do we pass laws
because of bigotry? That is my feeling because I'm the one that's
had to put up with this for one year."
Number 1431
MR. VOTE continued that as a foster parent, he is restricted by
regulations as far as what information he can relate to others.
One would be telling people he is moving in, and he has foster
children. In some ways he is not supposed to tell people he is a
foster parent. The fact that he is a foster parent isn't a secret
but how it is said or where, could end up letting people know that
the children are foster children, and that is against regulation.
A group home means there are more than three children in care.
This bill seems to be directed at homes that have more than three
children. He doesn't see why more than three children is the
issue. He believes that this bill could lead to restriction of
free movement. Most DFYS group homes are for sibling groups. As
soon as there are more than three children, it becomes a group
home. These are mostly specific group homes meaning that they are
living with grandparents or a friend who has agreed to take these
children. If this bill were to pass, then these people would now
have to report to the community council that they were a group home
for their relatives
MR. VOTE noted that he has put his home up for sale due to the
near-constant harassment that he has felt since he has been there.
He has not harassed his neighbors to his knowledge. His close
neighbors have never had any problems; they have been supportive.
The fact that his neighbors know that he is a group home, they
start developing rumors, jumping to conclusions, and that causes
them not be able to live there and feel comfortable. They are
being watched constantly; he can't even have a meal in his home
without a neighbor driving by, stopping and watching them. It
creates harassment when people find out, and he doesn't see how
this bill will help; it will target other people who are going to
do this.
Number 1248
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN wondered since Mr. Vote's adjacent neighbors
were congenial, where is the harassment.
MR. VOTE replied that the harassment comes from the people on the
street, most of whom testified today.
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked if Mr. Vote thought it was harassment
when several state cars drove by the neighbors' houses.
MR. VOTE asked if they were stopping and looking in their windows
at them.
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked if people were looking in Mr. Vote's
windows.
MR. VOTE answered yes they are and taking down license plate
numbers. He believes his neighbors called Representative Green
when one of his children was brought home by a worker who had to
use her limousine to drive him home. "That made it all the way to
the Governor, I think."
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN commented that what he had learned about some
of the children was in the newspaper. He mentioned since Mr.
Vote's house is up for sale, there will be a lot more people
stopping to look in the house.
MR. VOTE commented that they won't be his neighbors.
Number 1141
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked Mr. Vote if he had a job besides being a
foster parent.
MR. VOTE acknowledged he did up until the time he had six children.
His children do have special needs and as a result, he has a
tremendous number of appointments and commitments that he responds
to.
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked Mr. Vote the age group of his children.
MR. VOTE said they are between sixth grade and ninth grade; he has
had children as young as nine and as old as 16.
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked Mr. Vote if he pays anyone to help him with
the children.
Number 1074
MR. VOTE answered that he hires respite people to give him a break
or cover situations he can't.
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked if any of the children in Mr. Vote's care
had been arrested during the time he has been in the neighborhood.
MR. VOTE answered one had been arrested.
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked if it was a crime in the neighborhood.
Number 1042
MR. VOTE answered it wasn't a crime toward the neighborhood.
REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN asked Mr. Vote if he thought any community
norms on accountability would work for him as a foster parent.
MR. VOTE asked if it were for things like noise levels.
Number 0975
REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN answered noise level, or a foster parent
letting their children play out on the street at 1 a.m. in a
boisterous fashion.
MR. VOTE replied that would be great. He questioned that it would
be necessary because he is not aware of foster parents letting
their children cause problems. However, they are held very
accountable; they are bound by licensing regulations. If the
neighborhood has a problem with either the children or the foster
parents, all they have to do is call DFYS with their concern or
report of harm. It is immediately acted upon.
Number 0878
REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN commented that the people who testified
earlier in favor of this legislation indicated that accountability
is not there, and the department is not able to address their
concerns in a timely manner. He asked Mr. Vote if he agreed that
it is better for neighbors to work with neighbors to produce
solutions rather than going to government as a mediator.
MR. VOTE replied certainly but in this instance, the department
does have authority and power over the foster parents. The
department can require and enforce change. As far as the comments
from people who testified in support of HB 175, his interpretation
was that they were not able to get their questions answered, not
that they had particular issues. To his knowledge they have had no
problem with his home, except that they have concerns about the
amount of traffic, which he has detailed.
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked Mr. Vote if he has undergone training
for foster parents.
MR. VOTE answered in the four years that he has been a foster
parent, he has 43 hours of documented training for the past 12
months and about the same amount of undocumented training to total
about 80 hours of actual training. He is only required to turn in
ten hours; he seeks out much more than that because it is helpful.
Number 0553
KRISTAN JEZ, Development Director, Hope Community Resources,
testified, via teleconference from Anchorage, in opposition to HB
175. She believes HB 175 invades the privacy and confidentiality
of the children they are trying to help and protect. "Foster
parents are licensed care givers and that should be the important
issues, not whether or not the community is aware of them.
Children deserve a chance, a safe home and a community to live in.
It appears that this bill would automatically single out these
children and their foster homes. Foster homes shouldn't be treated
any differently than you or I and our families." There shouldn't
be segregation between them and their community members. Once they
are in a community, it should be up to them and their community
around them, to become involved with each other. Foster care homes
are a fact of life; with open-mindedness, they should welcome
diversity in their communities.
Number 0469
RACHEL FARALAN, Alternative Community Mental Health Center,
testified via teleconference from Anchorage. She commented that
the nation has worked hard on the fair treatment of children
getting away from orphanages, institutions and going out-of-state.
She said she believes this bill is a step backward. Foster
children are not criminals, and being foster children does not make
them unsafe people. She cited examples of crimes biological
children have made upon their biological parents.
MS. FARALAN reiterated the crisis in Alaska of needing more foster
homes, and sometimes they do need to create group homes to
accommodate the children. Her solution is if people don't want
group foster homes in their neighborhood, they should sign up to be
foster parents and take one or two children into their homes. She
agrees with neighbors supporting each other. She agreed that Mr.
Vote has been harassed. She has been in his home and watched his
neighbors drive up, stop and peer into his windows, and "we waved
at them" and they continued to stare. That is harassment; no one
does that to her in her neighborhood. It is true that HB 175
doesn't say people have to get permission to move into a
neighborhood, but it infers it. She believes once someone does
move into a neighborhood, they will get harassed and have to move
out, so it is segregation. She stated she does not support this
bill; it is a step backward.
Number 0220
KARIN ST. CLAIR testified via teleconference from Anchorage. She
is a foster parent, doesn't have a group home, but she would if her
house were big enough. Her mother was a foster parent, and she has
been involved in foster care her entire life. She stated, "I agree
that this is harassment. We need to be here for our children as a
community." She said she felt that Oceanview is not there for the
children. If they were, they would take some of these children
into their homes, and then there wouldn't be any need for group
homes. There is a great need for homes in the entire state. These
children need love, and they cannot get that in orphanages and
institutions. The group homes are families; not businesses. They
are there to love those children.
MS. ST. CLAIR added the neighbors like to know exactly what kind of
children are in these homes, but these children have a right to
privacy. The foster parents are not allowed to tell why the
children are in their homes and what has happened to them. She is
against HB 175 and agrees with the previous testifier about people
getting involved and taking these children into their homes.
TAPE 99-32, SIDE A
Number 0009
PELTON GOUDEY testified via teleconference from Anchorage. He
believes that there needs to be a solution to the problem, but that
HB 175 is not necessarily the solution. He concurred with the
statement "It takes a village to raise a child." This means
society is responsible as a group for the children. The children
are the most valuable resource. They need to be loved shown
respect no matter what. He described some of the awful problems of
two children that he cared for. Since his working with them and
having a supportive community, now they are productive members of
society. He agreed that communities do have a right to have
community norms, but he doesn't think a foster home would go out of
its way to violate those norms. He tries to be sensitive in his
community and teach the children he works with to understand the
norms. Being a good neighbor is very important to him. He
indicated that the tenor of HB 175 is negative. He would like to
see them work in the direction of finding solutions. Coming back
to accountability to the community support, he also believes
communities need to be accountable to the children.
Number 0272
RITA BARRAS testified via teleconference from Anchorage. She
stated her opposition to HB 175. She made the following statement:
"I have been a foster parent since 1982, and I do have a group
home, and I have taken all kinds of children. I am in the same
neighborhood I have been in since I started and I have not had any
problems with my neighbors. ... My children do not cause any
problems in the neighborhood and I have a real problem with this
having to disclose information about my foster children, which I
have not ever had to do. ... I hope that this does not come to
pass. My foster children are not labeled foster children. I have
several here today. They tell everybody that they are
'godchildren,' that they are my godchildren that they were sent to
me by God. I take care of them and I am real opposed to putting
labels on people because I have been labeled myself since birth.
So that is where I'm coming from. If the people would take the
time to walk where we walk, and to experience some of the things
we're experiencing, perhaps maybe to apply to become a foster
parent and try to help some of these children instead of trying to
find reasons to get them out of their community."
Number 0408
STEPHANI SOCK testified via teleconference from Anchorage. She
informed the committee that she runs a group home and believes this
bill is an issue of segregation. She asked if she were a single
mother with children with disabilities or problems, would she be
under scrutiny from a neighborhood council and not allowed to
purchase a home because they didn't like the fact that her children
had problems, or were afraid they might be a problem to the
neighborhood. She believes they are invading the privacy of her
family and taking away a home atmosphere by doing this. She has
been threatened and harassed by angry parents. She believes the
safety of her family and those staying with her will be jeopardized
by announcing their presence in a neighborhood. She wondered if
other people would be willing to be required to put their names
before a council and be pointed out so all the neighbors knew who
they were.
MS. SOCK addressed the issue of the neighbor children being safe.
She asked, "Do I know if my children are safe from their children?
I don't think so. I don't think that we're always self-assured by
how anybody's children are going to behave in the neighborhood. We
have to sometimes have a little bit of trust. We are a family
setting and we're here to set an example to these children that
come in who have had no example."
MS. SOCK noted that foster parents are more protective of their
children, and they do not let their children run around the
neighborhood. They keep a close eye on them since they are
constantly under a magnifying glass because of what they do. She
believes her children are better behaved than a lot of the children
in the neighborhood; she has never had any problems with her
children. She has had many hours of training; she worked eight
years in mental health even before she became a foster parent. She
summarized that this bill is wrong, and they need to look for other
ways to deal with this problem.
HB 149-INSURANCE: MENTAL HEALTH & SUBSTANCE ABUSE
Number 0679
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON announced the next order of business as House
Bill No. 149, "An Act relating to insurance coverage for treatment
of mental illness and substance abuse; repealing provisions of ch.
8, SLA 1997, that terminates required mental health benefit
coverage; and providing for an effective date." He indicated that
HB 149 would be held over for further hearing.
HB 142 - EDUCATION CREDIT FOR FISHERY TAXES
Number 0682
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON announced the next order of business as House
Bill No. 142, "An Act relating to the education credit for the
fisheries business tax and the fisheries resource landing tax; and
providing for an effective date." He indicated that HB 142 would
be held over for further hearing.
The committee took an at ease 4:53 - 4:54 p.m.
HB 175 - LICENSING OF FOSTER GROUP HOMES
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON announced the committee will return to the
hearing on HB 175.
Number 0746
RUSS WEBB, Deputy Commissioner, Department of Health and Social
Services (DHSS), Acting Director, Division of Family and Youth
Services (DFYS), came forward to testify. He apologized for
missing the earlier testimony, so he is not clear about all of the
issues that were raised. He referred to the difficulty in getting
information from the department. It has been about a year since
the department began meeting with the community council and
neighborhood. The DHSS answered some 60 questions, and doubtless
they have not given everybody all the answers that they want. He
said he is accountable for that, but they have made a good faith
effort.
MR. WEBB continued in terms of their licensing procedures, he has
heard people say they want the department to meet its mandate to
provide safe, appropriate placements for children in family and
community settings with well-trained foster parents who provide
supervision and nurturing care, monitoring and correction for
children that everyone would want for their own children. Many
folks have pointed out that DHSS is in a bit of a box in trying to
meet that mandate and responsibility; that is simply because they
don't have enough foster parents. Clearly recruitment, retention,
training and reimbursement support are essential; there is a need
to develop a full continuum of care in foster care is critical.
Having kids in community-based settings is important. They are a
long way from where they want to be.
MR. WEBB indicated foster care is in the developmental stage, and
they are trying to develop a system of foster care levels. They
are trying to set in place licensing and training requirements, and
ratios of children in homes, particularly the ones with high needs.
He believes they will have to rewrite their foster care regulations
to fully implement that system. His opinion is many of the issues
that are addressed in the last year can be dealt with in that
process without legislation.
Number 0990
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked if it is true foster parents can't tell
people that they are foster parents.
MR. WEBB answered he didn't believe it is impossible for people to
admit they are foster parents, and frankly they want them to do
that; but it is true that they must be very careful to protect the
rights of the children in their care, protect the confidentiality
of those children and to not compromise the ability of those
children to be in the community. There are restrictions about what
they can share, but it is a matter of public record who is licensed
as a foster parent.
Number 1052
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked if the foster parent can tell anyone the
classification of the foster home and the types of children they
are licensed for and trained to provide services for.
MR. WEBB said yes they can. They can certainly explain that they
are licensed and what the licensing requirements are. They are not
licensed for a specific type of child; they are licensed for age
groups and can talk about age groups.
REPRESENTATIVE BRICE asked what the ages and numbers of the
children in foster care are currently.
MR. WEBB answered that they certainly have that information, but he
doesn't have it off the top of his head. He can make that
information available. He did tell them that about sixty percent
of the children in care are under 12 years old.
REPRESENTATIVE BRICE asked Mr. Webb to answer some questions on the
demographics of the children. He also asked how this legislation
would impact those ages and the classifications of children.
MR. WEBB responded by saying there are approximately 2,000 children
in custody in out-of-home care who are there by virtue of being
abused or neglected. The majority of those children are in either
relative or foster care. He estimated there are 44 delinquent
children who are in foster care, and 75 or fewer in foster care
largely as a result of emotional problems.
Number 1281
THERESA TANOURY, Administrator, Family Services, Division of Family
and Youth Services, Department of Health and Social Services,
informed the committee that there are eight foster group homes in
Anchorage so there are not a lot of them. However, there are homes
that go beyond the licensing regulations of three per home. There
are approximately 30 foster group homes statewide, and the majority
of those are in the northern region.
Number 1306
MR. WEBB said the bill redefines a foster group home by saying that
is a home where there are more than four children, which
potentially could be a good number of homes. The bill would place
some burden on the DHSS when someone applies to be a foster group
home, but he didn't think it would be a great burden. He mentioned
that foster parents already discussed the chilling effect that this
might have on someone's willingness to become a foster parent;
particularly if they felt they might be subject to disapproval or
scrutiny.
REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN asked how many children a foster parent can
have before they become a foster group home.
Number 1380
MS. TANOURY replied that a foster group home is no more than eight.
A foster home by regulation is three. There are variances if it is
a sibling group or emergency, short-term ones. Unfortunately, that
happens quite often due to the shortage of foster homes.
Number 1411
REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN wondered if some foster parents are in it
for the money or treat it as a business.
MR. WEBB responded that he would be happy to provide the rates they
pay foster parents but on review of those rates, it would be
imminently clear that foster care as a business is not a money-
making venture. Foster care is reimbursement for care of the
children; it is not an income to the parent. He thought it would
be very difficult for someone to make a living as a foster parent.
MR. WEBB stated that nationally, foster care is in a transition
period. Years ago most foster homes had one parent who didn't work
outside the home; that is not necessarily the case today, and that
presents some problems. They are trying to develop a system of
care for children that allow them to be present in the community,
hopefully in a family based setting, but with people who are
trained to provide the type of care they require. Maybe later,
they will begin to development professional foster parents.
Number 1531
REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN asked for some background information
explaining the system Mr. Webb is trying to put into place. He
also asked Mr. Webb to address a mechanism to deal with the
concerns of neighbors when community-based services will go into
their neighborhoods.
Number 1663
MS. TANOURY answered that the application for a foster parent
license is public record as is a completed complaint, but there are
pieces of the foster care application that are not public record.
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked what DHSS can tell a neighbor who calls and
asks what is going on at a certain address.
MS. TANOURY explained they would take the information down as a
complaint and go investigate it.
Number 1693
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked Ms. Tanoury if a neighbor calls and asks if
there is a foster group home or foster home there and how many
children it is licensed for, can the department answer that
MS. TANOURY answered yes.
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked if they could tell the age group of the
children.
MS. TANOURY answered yes.
Number 1710
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked Ms. Tanoury if she thought that worked well
in this situation. The neighbors seemed frustrated; and he
wondered if this was a breakdown of one time only.
Number 1720
MR. WEBB answered that question. He explained that they did have
several meetings with the folks in the community, but he doesn't
know what occurred in a specific phone conversation. He does know
that information has certainly been provided to the folks in the
community. They could not answer questions like "What are the
children's problems; do they have records of delinquency; are they
sex offenders?" Those type of questions are confidential. That
proved to be frustrating for people who have high levels of fear of
the danger an unknown group of kids may pose in the neighborhood.
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON confirmed that confidentiality laws preclude them
from releasing that information.
Number 1766
MR. WEBB responded that's correct.
REPRESENTATIVE BRICE asked Mr. Webb if HB 175 will address that
concern.
MR. WEBB answered no.
Number 1779
REPRESENTATIVE BRICE asked if the DHSS requires any private home
owner to notify a third party for any purpose outside of sex
offenders.
MR. WEBB answered he cannot think of a circumstance that the DHSS
requires that.
Number 1817
CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON recessed the meeting at 5:18 p.m. until Saturday
morning. [HB 175 was held over.]
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