Legislature(2025 - 2026)GRUENBERG 120
03/04/2025 10:30 AM House FISHERIES
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| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| HB117 | |
| HB116 | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| *+ | HB 117 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| *+ | HB 116 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | TELECONFERENCED |
ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE
HOUSE SPECIAL COMMITTEE ON FISHERIES
March 4, 2025
10:30 a.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Representative Louise Stutes, Chair
Representative Bryce Edgmon, Vice Chair
Representative Rebecca Himschoot
Representative Chuck Kopp
Representative Kevin McCabe
Representative Sarah Vance
Representative Bill Elam
OTHER LEGISLATORS PRESENT
Representative Ky Holland
MEMBERS ABSENT
All members present
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
HOUSE BILL NO. 117
"An Act relating to commercial set gillnet fishing; and
providing for an effective date."
- HEARD & HELD
HOUSE BILL NO. 116
"An Act exempting from insurance regulation cooperative
agreements entered into by two or more persons engaged in
commercial fishing for the purpose of paying claims or losses."
- HEARD & HELD
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION
BILL: HB 117
SHORT TITLE: COMMERCIAL FISHING; SET GILLNET COOP
SPONSOR(s): FISHERIES
02/26/25 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
02/26/25 (H) FSH, RES
03/01/25 (H) FSH AT 11:00 AM GRUENBERG 120
03/01/25 (H) -- MEETING CANCELED --
03/04/25 (H) FSH AT 10:30 AM GRUENBERG 120
BILL: HB 116
SHORT TITLE: COMMERCIAL FISHING INSURANCE CO-OP
SPONSOR(s): FISHERIES BY REQUEST OF TASK FORCE EVAL ALASKA
SEAFOOD INDUSTRY
02/26/25 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
02/26/25 (H) FSH, L&C
03/01/25 (H) FSH AT 11:00 AM GRUENBERG 120
03/01/25 (H) -- MEETING CANCELED --
03/04/25 (H) FSH AT 10:30 AM GRUENBERG 120
WITNESS REGISTER
MATT GRUENING, Staff
Representative Louise Stutes
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: On behalf of Representative Stutes, prime
sponsor, introduced HB 117.
KEVIN FISCHER, President
Allakaket District Setnetters
Kodiak, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Gave an invited testimony in support of HB
117.
ERIC O'BRIAN, representing self
Kodiak, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Gave invited testimony in support of HB
117.
ADELIA MYRICK, President
Northwest Setnetters Association
Kodiak, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Gave invited testimony in support of HB
117.
ROBERT MURPHY, Area M Setnetter
Kodiak, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Gave invited testimony in support of HB
117.
LISA GABRIEL, representing self
Kenai, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Gave invited testimony in support of HB
117.
DAVID FLEMING, Setnet Fisherman
Prince William Sound, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Gave invited testimony in support of HB
117.
KIRSTYN STERLING, representing self
Pilot Point, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Gave an invited testimony in support of HB
117.
TRACY WELSH, Executive Director
United Fishermen of Alaska
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Gave invited testimony in support of HB
117.
LORI WING-HEIER, Director
Division of Insurance
Department of Commerce, Community, and Economic Development
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions pertaining to HB 116.
BOB KEHOE, Executive Director
Purse Seine Vessel Owners Association
Seattle, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions pertaining to HB 116.
ACTION NARRATIVE
10:30:10 AM
CHAIR LOUISE STUTES called the House Special Committee on
Fisheries meeting to order at 10:30 a.m. Representatives Kopp,
McCabe, Vance, Himschoot, Elam, Edgmon, and Stutes were present
at the call to order.
HB 117-COMMERCIAL FISHING; SET GILLNET COOP
[Contains discussion of HB 31.]
10:31:35 AM
CHAIR STUTES announced that the first order of business would be
HOUSE BILL NO. 117, "An Act relating to commercial set gillnet
fishing; and providing for an effective date."
10:31:57 AM
MATT GRUENING, Staff, Representative Louise Stutes, Alaska State
Legislature, on behalf of Representative Stutes, prime sponsor,
introduced HB 117. He said this legislation would preserve the
traditional model for salmon setnet operations by continuing to
allow small groups (often families in rural Alaska) to work
cooperatively, comingle their fish, and allow one permit holder
to deliver fish on behalf of their group. He said this bill was
brought forward by concerned stakeholders to address a newly
applied legal interpretation by law enforcement that has
disrupted the way set-net operators have functioned since pre-
statehood. The current legal interpretation requires that fish
are not comingled and are delivered by each individual permit
holder; this legislation would address this interpretation. He
remarked that set-netting is unique in Alaska and was Alaska's
only commercial shore-based fishery. Historically, fisherman
have delivered their fish cooperatively, picked their nets
cooperatively, comingled fish, and operated as a group. He said
that this model of fishing has existed since statehood.
MS. GRUENING said that after a brief presentation, committee
members would hear invited testimony about the issues associated
with the new legal interpretation. He pointed members to a
letter of support from the Northwest Setnetters Association
[copy in committee file] because it illustrates the matter of
concern. He said that every set-net fishery is different
depending on the region and said the new legal interpretation
would be particularly burdensome to offroad rural fishermen. He
said that in many operations the only option for deliveries is
in small skiffs and often travel in rough waters, with limited
hold space. Permit holders often include family members who are
mending nets or cooking and have always been included as part of
the group. He said HB 117 only aims to allow a continuation of
set-net operations to participate in the fishery as they always
have. He said that language was left intentionally broad to
allow law enforcement, the Commercial Fisheries Entry Commission
(CFEC), the Alaska Department of Fish & Game (ADF&G), and other
stakeholders to have maximum input into how the fish would be
delineated. He said that this bill is not only about
maintaining the status quo but to support fishing operations in
rural communities. He concluded by reiterating that setnetters
should be able to work together and maintain their operating
methods.
10:36:13 AM
CHAIR STUTES announced that the committee would hear invited
testimony on HB 117.
10:37:10 AM
KEVIN FISCHER, President, Allakaket District Setnetters, gave
invited testimony in support of HB 117. He said that he has
been a set-net fishermen for 35 years and for the entire time
set-net fisherman have comingled fish. He said it is his
understanding that set-netting has been this way even before
statehood. He did not understand the current upheaval in set-
netting practice and the lack of communication with fishermen on
this issue. He said HB 117 would allow set-netters to fish as
they always have. He said if the new legal interpretation that
prevents comingling fish remains then it would negatively impact
Alaska fishermen, particularly the small family operations. He
said that last year one of the fishermen in his district was
issued a felony level citation; the officer did not know the
issue; nor did the judge understand the issue well either. He
said the court offered a plea deal and dropped it to a
misdemeanor and issued a $500 fine. He said that this caused a
great deal of concern amongst fishermen in his district. He
asked why only one citation was issued when everyone practiced
this way and why it was suddenly being enforced now. He asked
what happened to warnings prior to citations, he said it feels
like an attack on small fishing operations. He said that he was
100 percent confident that if someone said there was an issue
then fishermen could have solved it. Issuing a felony level
charge is not acceptable and none of his neighbors want to do
anything illegal. He said it simply is not viable to separate
fish by permit when fishing as a coop. He said that someone,
for some reason, thinks that set-net fishing should be different
than it has been.
10:40:37 AM
ERIC O'BRIAN, representing self, gave invited testimony in
support of HB 117. He said that he echoes the previous
testifier's comments and concerns. He said that he is part of a
multi-generational fishing family. He said the first permit was
purchased in 1977 and the second in 1988. He said that his
brothers and extended family have always been part of fishing
operations. He said in 2002 his parents transferred their
permits to the children, and more were purchased later. He said
that there were seven permits in total, shared by three grown
brothers and three elderly parents. He said they maintain a
single-family fishing operation. He said family members all
work on the permits. He said that they could not operate
without full family support. He said that shore-based support
allows participation in the fishery. He said that it is a
physically hard season and doesn't always fit with concurrent
schedules in the setnet fishery. He said it is not feasible to
consider each permit as a separate business, especially given
the age of some permit holders. In closing, Mr. O'Brian stated
that HB 117 would correct a misinterpretation and allow set-
netters to operate as they always have, as a cooperative
business venture primarily executed along family lines.
10:44:45 AM
ADELIA MYRICK, President, Northwest Setnetters Association, gave
invited testimony in support of HB 117. She said that she is a
second generation setnetter and currently raising the third
generation. She said that the Northwest Setnetters Association
supports the bill. Set-netters operate in a fashion that their
elders and forefathers taught them, this means mingling fish and
operating as a cooperative and often a family unit. She said
that the bill would provide the necessary clarification and
support set-netters. She said that many setnetters are multi-
generational and have a long family history and the bill would
allow both youth and elderly alike to participate in the
industry. She remarked that keeping youth in the fishery is
imperative. She raised concerns about permits exiting the
communities and less opportunities overall. She emphasized that
Alaska set-netters have among the highest proportions of Alaska
resident fishermen and supporting their ability to continue is
very healthy for the state. She said that given the current
market conditions, setnetters are at the highest risk of
extinction. She said that one by one all the smaller processors
have shut down and tendering boats are the only option to
offload the catch. She remarked that comingling fish can help
provide incentives for tendering vessels to continue the
purchase and acquisition of set-netter caught fish and a
struggling fishery would struggle to attract purchasers. She
said that many people who purchase sites often know nothing
about set-netting, are "well off" out-of-town folks, and often
just look for a remote property to purchase. In conclusion, Ms.
Myrick reiterated that the Northwest Setnetter Association
supports the bill and the preservation of the status quo.
10:48:54 AM
ROBERT MURPHY, Area M Setnetter, gave invited testimony in
support of HB 117. He said that this bill would allow set-
gillnet family group permit holders to continue "doing what they
have done" for years. He said that adopting this bill would
have no change on the fishing practices. He remarked that the
seafood industry has faced challenges in the past years and if
the bill was not adopted then it could have detrimental impacts
to set-netters. He said that in his community, salmon fishing
is the main source of income. He remarked on the feasibility of
adhering to the new legal interpretation and the concerns
regarding skiff operation in challenging waters. He urged the
legislature to make the corrections to the legal interpretation
and support fisherman for the upcoming season.
10:52:39 AM
LISA GABRIEL, representing self, gave invited testimony in
support of HB 117. She said that her family has been set
netting in Cook Inlet for 39 years. They have three permits,
one skiff and have always fished as a family group. When
fishing on the east side, using one skiff for up to nine nets is
common practice. She described the process of collecting fish
and loading skiffs for delivery. She said that keeping fish
separated is not practical when dealing with lots of fish and a
skiff boat. She said that balancing the load on the skiff can
be challenging and unsafe when not done appropriately and
emphasized that safety is the number one priority.
10:54:40 AM
DAVID FLEMING, Setnet Fisherman, gave invited testimony in
support of HB 117. He said that he is a third generation set-
net fisherman who has multiple family members involved in the
fishery. He said that the bill would help families that fish as
a unit or partnership. He said that he and his brother both
have permits and comingle fish. With regards to the bill, he
believes the threshold of permits at 10 is too high and a
smaller number would be fair.
10:56:44 AM
KIRSTYN STERLING, representing self, gave invited testimony in
support of HB 117. She said that her family has two permits,
and their sites are approximately two miles from one another.
She said that maintaining the status quo is of the upmost
importance for safety and young families. She said that set-
netting is more accommodating to family groups than drift
netting from a boat. She has been raising kids for the last 10
years and during these times a crew swap out was necessary to
nurse the babies. She said that offering citations to women on
set-net boats who are trying to support their family is wrong.
Safety is another concern raised when considering the inability
to comingle fish.
10:59:49 AM
TRACY WELSH, Executive Director, United Fishermen of Alaska,
gave invited testimony in support of HB 117. Speaking on behalf
of the United Fisherman of Alaska (UFA), she said that the
organizations support the bill concept. She said that several
other testifiers had briefed the UFA Board prior to their
testimony and sought a legislative fix to the new legal
interpretations that prevent comingling fish.
11:01:08 AM
REPRESENTATIVE ELAM commented that some Kenai River sportfishing
guide affiliates had contacted him regarding concerns about HB
117. He said that they felt it could be handled at the Board of
Fisheries level and a legislative fix was not necessary.
MR. GRUENING responded that originally a regulatory fix was
considered and after consultation it became clear that there was
some statutory language that needed to be fixed regarding the
unit of gear used. Additionally, he said that the transporter
permit required for set-netting would not work well in rural
communities due to unit of gear definitions in statute. He said
that there is conflicting statutory language and ambiguity, and
a legislative fix was appropriate.
11:03:34 AM
REPRESENTATIVE VANCE asked how quickly the regulations would be
implemented and whether it would be done prior to the next
fishing season.
MR. GRUENING said that the hope is that work can be done with
the Department of Public Safety to place a moratorium on
enforcement while the bill works through the implementation
process. He noted that the Board of Fisheries will not meet in
time to pass regulations unless it makes an agenda change.
REPRESENTATIVE VANCE asked if AS 16.05251 was amending the Board
of Fisheries regulations.
MR. GRUENING said no, it calls on the Board of Fisheries to
establish regulations as per the bill, there would still have to
be a regulatory process taking place by the board to implement
the changes.
REPRESENTATIVE VANCE said that while she respects the Board of
Fisheries process in adopting regulations, she questions why the
legislature could not specify what the department should do to
address and expedite the process.
MR. GRUENING responded that he thinks this may be a better
question for the Department of Public Safety. But it was his
understanding that if HB 117 passed, then any citations would
not be issued against statute. He said that he did not want to
speak on behalf of the Department of Safety, but this was his
understanding. He said this bill is an attempt to solve the
problem, albeit a first attempt. He said any changes necessary
to improve the bill would be considered.
REPRESENTATIVE VANCE said the reason she brings this up is that
a lot of times the regulations get delayed, and people are left
wondering what to do. Any way to avoid this without overriding
delegated authority would be good. She said that in areas like
mariculture, they are still waiting for regulation.
11:07:56 AM
REPRESENTATIVE EDGMON remarked that the committee passed HB 31
which dealt with registration for derelict vessels and in
combination with this bill he feels entirely comfortable working
with the Department of Public Safety to address Representative
Vance's concerns. He said that while he cannot speak on the
department's behalf, he felt that it may be happy to understand
that it could halt enforcement. He thinks that the department
would recognize the intent of HB 125.
CHAIR STUTES said that she had a conversation with the
Department of Public Safety about this and she said that the
department is willing to work with the legislature.
11:09:34 AM
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE commented that this issue seems like
farming in the Lower 48. He said that many farmers form coops
to harvest together. It is the safest and most efficient means
of harvesting. He said that set-netting operates in a similar
fashion. He asked "how smart are we" to change the means of
delivery. He expressed hope that the Department of Public
Safety would recognize this issue and support the fisherman. He
said this is a frustrating issue.
11:10:52 AM
REPRESENTATIVE KOPP said that as a commercial fisherman, the
permit he operates is now in his sons' names and as someone who
was raised in the Bristol Bay Fishery, the correlation
Representative McCabe made about farming was spot on. He said
in his last 13 years set netting in Bristol Bay that he
recognizes that these fishermen are multi-family cooperatives.
He said that one thing that has not been highlighted well is how
dangerous skiffs can be in severe weather. He said that
ultimately only one boat makes the run to the tender which can
often be miles away and not everybody should take that risk. He
said it's a cooperative effort, and it's the way the fishery has
always been. The fish are being legally caught, legally sold,
and many fishermen effectively police each other. He concluded
by commenting that this is common sense legislation.
11:13:07 AM
REPRESENTATIVE ELAM said that he agrees that safety is a point
of concern.
11:13:30 AM
CHAIR STUTES thanked the committee for the unified effort to
move the bill forward. She remarked that written testimony
could be sent to [email protected] and announced that HB
117 was held over.
HB 116-COMMERCIAL FISHING INSURANCE CO-OP
11:14:11 AM
CHAIR STUTES announced that the final order of business would be
HOUSE BILL NO. 116, "An Act exempting from insurance regulation
cooperative agreements entered into by two or more people
engaged in commercial fishing for the purpose of paying claims
or losses."
11:14:35 AM
MATT GRUENING, Staff, Representative Louise Stutes, Alaska State
Legislature, introduced HB 116, on behalf of the House Special
Committee on Fisheries by request of the Joint Legislative
Seafood Industry Taskforce. He said this bill would allow for
member owned commercial fishing insurance cooperatives. This
would exempt them from Title 21, the states insurance code. He
said there are already three insurance pools operating in
Alaska, but they are based out of an organization in Washington
State. This is the Purse Seine Vessel Owners Association, which
includes the Seine Vessels Reserve, the Southeast Alaska
Fishermen's Alliance Reserve, and the Bristol Bay Reserve.
Between all three insurance pools there are approximately 840
vessels. He noted that rising premiums and availability of
insurance serve as an operating barrier for Alaska's aging
commercial fishing fleet. Underwriters have been raising
premiums on individual vessels and have become increasingly
selective regarding which vessels get selected for insurance.
MR. GRUENING explained that insurance pooling can provide a more
attractive and lower risk alternative for underwriters than
insuring individual vessels. Additionally, it would generate
lower insurance costs for fishermen. He remarked that some of
the benefits of a commercial fisherman-owned pool could be:
lower premiums, the ability to structure itself to meet the
needs of the fishing industry ,such as licensing unique vessels
that would otherwise not qualify for standard insurance; a board
of directors, who are both fisherman and members, which would
give localized control; and lastly offer dividends to fishermen.
He noted that with operating costs at an all-time high and
fishing markets at an all-time low, HB 116 aims to provide lower
cost and easier access to insurance alternatives to Alaska's
commercial fishing fleet.
11:17:05 AM
CHAIR STUTES announced that the committee would hear invited
testimony on HB 116.
11:17:23 AM
TRACY WELSH, Executive Director, United Fishermen of Alaska,
testified in supports of HB 116. She said that United Fisherman
of Alaska (UFA) support the concept of HB 116. She explained
that UFA has not had a chance to hold a meeting to review the
bill but supports the idea. She said that UFA had provided a
kitchen sink worth of ideas to the taskforce and one of these
ideas was insurance. She said that insurance is among the
largest costs that a fishing operation incurs throughout the
year, and it has been increasing.
11:18:20 AM
REPRESENTATIVE VANCE asked whether UFA had discussed forming its
own insurance pool.
MS. WELSH responded that the idea of a UFA insurance pool has
been discussed but she does not believe there are any immediate
plans to do so.
11:18:46 AM
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE asked Director Lori Wing-Heier if
insurance pools were an effective way to go and, if so, could
they be utilized in other areas as well. He was interested to
hear her opinion and whether it was a viable alternative for
fishermen.
11:19:10 AM
LORI WING-HEIER, Director, Division of Insurance, Department of
Commerce, Community and Economic Development, said that after
discussions she did not know whether it was going to make things
cheaper. She said that capital would need to be put up, claims
would need to be adjudicated, and there would need to be legal
counsel, since vessels are under maritime law not state law.
She opined that there would be "humps" that would need to be
navigated. She said that insurance is high right now across the
nation and people are looking for alternative ideas. She said
the downside of new insurance ideas is solvency, something needs
to be available to pay claims until books balance out. She
opined that more research is required for determining how it
would work in Alaska, and that ten vessels would not be enough.
Enough money would need to be generated to support claims. She
said it could work, but it would need time to be brought
together.
CHAIR STUTES noted that this legislation does not create the
pool but simply allows fishing entities to create a pool. There
is no liability to the state itself.
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE noted that HB 116 is permissive
legislation that allows the fishermen to "get together" to form
pools. He asked how Washington State did it and whether they
were backed by an insurance company and what insurance companies
think of this.
CHAIR STUTES remarked that this question may be better answered
by Bob Kehoe.
11:22:26 AM
BOB KEHOE, Executive Director, Purse Seine Vessel Owners
Association, said that insurance pools work by vessel owners
getting together, coming to an agreement, and group insuring
their vessels. He said that premiums are charged to do two
things: to pay the claims that arise during a policy year and
secondly, to purchase a layer of insurance above the self-
insured deductible. He said that addresses the issue of
solvency, he said that someone would not want to be in a
situation where they can't pay claims. He said that in his
experience, underwriters often like this. He said it is a
premium game and a way for underwriters to get substantial
premium but mitigate their risks by spreading it out amongst a
group of different vessels.
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE asked if there was any self-policing
amongst insurance holders.
MR. KEHOE responded that this was correct. He said that Mr.
Gruening made the point that a Board of Directors is comprised
of vessel owners using the pool. He said that they take the
role seriously and review vessels to ensure safety. He said
that at the end of the day, when sharing a risk, it becomes
one's own business with regards to other vessels and how they
conduct themselves.
11:25:49 AM
REPRESENTATIVE VANCE asked whether the state could offer
insurance for the fishermen and said that she liked the concept
of pooled insurance. She asked why this method is considered
the most advisable.
MS. WING-HEIER said that when the Division of Insurance was
brought into the matter, they looked at why the cost was so high
and what the alternatives were. She said that there were
already a couple successful insurance pools that were set up in
the state. This includes the Alaska Rural Electric Cooperative
and the Alaska Municipal League. The thought for the division
was whether the fishermen could do something similar; the answer
is yes. She said that it can be done but it requires statutory
authority to do so, taking insurance out of Title 21. She said
that there is a lot of work to do before it can be determined
how successful this program could be.
REPRESENTATIVE VANCE commented that it is amazing how the
fishery has been so important prior to statehood and now and
there was never this permission in statute. She hoped that
there would be some people who could take advantage of this.
11:28:37 AM
MR. GRUENING, in response to comments by Ms. Wing-Heier, said
that there is nothing that guarantees that insurance pooling
would work. However, as a former member of the Southeast Alaska
Fishermen's Alliance Reserve, he felt it was managed well, and
his insurance was cheaper, and his insurance costs kept going
down. He said if the pools are managed well, they can be
successful.
11:29:32 AM
REPRESENTATIVE HIMSCHOOT remarked that one of her staffers was
in an insurance pool and opined that the Board of Directors was
composed of members and the Board requires new applicants to
provide a reference from existing members. She said that there
is some self-policing with regards to managing the pools.
11:29:57 AM
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE commented that he was wondering how the
state can get the fisherman to come back to Alaska from
Washington and maybe the proposed legislation would help.
11:30:32 AM
CHAIR STUTES announced that HB 116 was held over.
11:30:51 AM
ADJOURNMENT
There being no further business before the committee, the House
Special Committee on Fisheries meeting was adjourned at 11:30
a.m.