Legislature(2009 - 2010)BARNES 124
04/14/2009 09:00 AM House FISHERIES
| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| HCR15 | |
| HJR32 | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| *+ | HJR 32 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| *+ | HCR 15 | TELECONFERENCED | |
ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE
HOUSE SPECIAL COMMITTEE ON FISHERIES
April 14, 2009
9:02 a.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Representative Bryce Edgmon, Chair
Representative Craig Johnson
Representative Wes Keller
Representative Cathy Engstrom Munoz
Representative Robert L. "Bob" Buch
Representative Scott Kawasaki
MEMBERS ABSENT
Representative Charisse Millett
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
HOUSE CONCURRENT RESOLUTION NO. 15
Directing the Legislative Council to contract for an assessment
of environmental and socioeconomic consequences of large-scale
mineral extraction in the Bristol Bay area watershed.
- HEARD AND HELD
HOUSE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 32
Opposing litigation that seeks to eliminate the Kenai, Kasilof,
and Chitina sockeye salmon personal use dip net fisheries; and
requesting the governor to re-examine the disproportional
influence of the commercial fisheries industries on fisheries
management in the state.
- HEARD AND HELD
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION
BILL: HCR 15
SHORT TITLE: BRISTOL BAY MINING STUDY
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) AUSTERMAN
04/10/09 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
04/10/09 (H) FSH, RES, FIN
04/14/09 (H) FSH AT 9:00 AM BARNES 124
BILL: HJR 32
SHORT TITLE: FEDERAL PREEMPTION OF SALMON MANAGEMENT
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) STOLTZE
04/10/09 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
04/10/09 (H) FSH, RES
04/14/09 (H) FSH AT 9:00 AM BARNES 124
WITNESS REGISTER
ERIN HARRINGTON, Staff
to Representative Alan Austerman
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Presented HCR 15 on behalf of
Representative Austerman, the prime sponsor, and responded to
questions and comments during the discussion.
DR. JOSEPH SPAEDER, Research Coordinator
Arctic-Yukon-Kuskokwim Sustainable Salmon Initiative
Homer, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Spoke about his experience working with the
National Research Council (NRC).
REPRESENTATIVE BILL STOLTZ
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Presented HJR 32 as the prime sponsor and
answered questions.
ACTION NARRATIVE
9:02:59 AM
CHAIR BRYCE EDGMON called the House Special Committee on
Fisheries meeting to order at 9:02 a.m. Representatives Edgmon,
Buch, Keller, and Munoz were present at the call to order.
Representatives Johnson and Kawasaki arrived as the meeting was
in progress.
HCR 15-BRISTOL BAY MINING STUDY
9:03:17 AM
CHAIR EDGMON announced that the first order of business would be
HOUSE CONCURRENT RESOLUTION NO. 15, Directing the Legislative
Council to contract for an assessment of environmental and
socioeconomic consequences of large-scale mineral extraction in
the Bristol Bay area watershed.
9:04:42 AM
ERIN HARRINGTON, Staff to Representative Alan Austerman, Alaska
State Legislature, introduced HCR 15 and explained that this was
a request for Legislative Council to contract with the National
Research Council (NRC) of the National Academy of Sciences for
an assessment of the environmental and socioeconomic
consequences of large-scale mineral extraction in the Bristol
Bay area watershed. [Talking points included in members
packets.] She gave some background and history of NRC, noting
that the National Academy of Sciences was created in 1863 to
"investigate, examine, experiment, and report upon any subject
of science or art" whenever requested by any government
department. She established that NRC was not a consulting
service, but that its mission was to provide policy guidance and
scientific and technical analysis for governmental decision
making. She listed the three general types of NRC research:
regulatory analyses, program reviews, and general assistance.
She informed the committee that NRC draws conclusions from
existing research to support decision making, and identifies the
research that was still needed. She noted that NRC was non-
profit and non-governmental, and did not provide services to
for-profit entities.
MS. HARRINGTON detailed that the purpose of HCR 15 was a request
for Legislative Council to contract with NRC for "an independent
assessment of known and probable cumulative environmental and
socioeconomic consequences of large-scale mineral extraction in
the Bristol Bay watershed." She explained that this contract
would "assess critical gaps in existing knowledge that might be
necessary to adequately understand, predict, or manage the
environmental and socioeconomic impacts that could be expected
or anticipated from a development in this region." She stated
that the resolution acknowledged and encouraged participation
from non-partisan and non-advocacy organizations. She pointed
out that NRC was the pre-eminent body for conducting research
with objectivity and insulation; and that NRC had conducted 16
studies in Alaska since 1990, including Outer Continental Shelf,
Bering Sea ecosystem, and comprehensive risk assessment for oil
and gas infrastructure and spills research.
9:12:57 AM
REPRESENTATIVE BUCH reported on his visit to the Pebble Mine
site and noted that its hydrologists were doing an empirical
analysis utilizing a protocol of top-level standards. He
predicted that this aquifer study data would provide a most
comprehensive base line, and expressed his desire for this
completed study to be made public.
9:15:04 AM
CHAIR EDGMON noted that Representative Kawasaki arrived.
9:15:26 AM
MS. HARRINGTON, in response to Representative Buch, reported
that she was not aware of any plan for the study data to be
shared with the public.
9:15:46 AM
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON asked how many other statewide studies
had been completed.
MS. HARRINGTON cited a list of 16 studies from 1990 to 2009.
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON asked who paid for those studies.
MS. HARRINGTON noted that, although she did not have a list of
the contractors for each individual study, the National Research
Council of the National Academy of Sciences (NRC) provided
consulting work to many governmental agencies which included the
State of Alaska.
9:16:34 AM
REPRESENTATIVE KELLER asked for a more specific clarification of
the goal for this NRC contract.
MS. HARRINGTON directed attention to the NRC research and study
report on North Slope gas development which was available to the
committee. She pointed out that these reports provided a review
of scientific and technical information which was both specific
to the study region and general to other regional development.
She noted that the NRC report would also identify pertinent
questions to ask during each of the stages for the long term
permitting process.
9:19:08 AM
CHAIR EDGMON, as a sponsor, declared his support of HCR 15, and
referred to page 2, line 21, of the resolution, which read:
WHEREAS the National Academy of Sciences is the
premier source of objective review of complex
scientific questions;
He explained that the Pebble Mine project abutted "the last
great salmon fishery on the planet Earth" and the issue was
about the interaction of surface and subsurface water. Noting
the sensitivity of this watershed, he pointed out the need for
extensive scientific analysis. He stressed that no other mining
project in Alaska was contiguous to "the biggest salmon fishery
left on the planet Earth." He mentioned that the study may also
help the development of the mine.
9:21:02 AM
REPRESENTATIVE KELLER clarified that it is important to know
what was being purchased. He offered his belief that a broad,
general assessment of existing data was not necessary. He
pointed out that $90 million had already been spent on studies
by the Pebble Partnership.
MS. HARRINGTON, in response to Representative Keller, agreed
that the contracting process with NRC should include an outline
of the scope of the project, which would reflect the desires and
requests of the Legislature.
REPRESENTATIVE KELLER surmised that this request for a study
appeared to be too early in the process.
9:22:41 AM
CHAIR EDGMON reflected that this type of study should be done
early, and noted that "after the fact" was not appropriate. In
response to Representative Johnson, he shared that the Pebble
Partnership had spent $132 million on environmental and socio-
economic studies, but that this was an opportunity for a third
party assessment.
9:23:59 AM
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON asked where NRC would get the information
to evaluate. He further inquired how the NRC could do this
analysis for $1 million when the Pebble Partnership had spent
$132 million for its analysis. He noted that the Pebble
Partnership analysis was still proprietary information.
MS. HARRINGTON, in response to Representative Johnson, explained
that the NRC process would not duplicate that of the Pebble
Partnership; instead, this analysis would study the known
parameters in order to determine the relevant questions to pose
to the Pebble Partnership. She explained that the NRC analysis
would be a "tool for the policy body, which is a little bit
different than a tool for the permitting process." She reported
that the permitting process was a legally constrained process,
while this broader NRC study may invite additional questions to
be asked during the permitting process. She gave an example of
the Environmental Impact Statement (EIS) for the outer
continental shelf, and noted that NRC research was able to
establish details to be questioned during that decision making.
9:29:30 AM
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON pointed out that this project appeared to
be premature.
CHAIR EDGMON responded that his constituents desired additional
analysis.
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON offered his belief that there would never
be enough information on this project. He asked if there were
any others who would testify.
CHAIR EDGMON replied that testimony was by invitation only and
there was just one speaker.
9:31:49 AM
DR. JOSEPH SPAEDER, Research Coordinator, Arctic-Yukon-Kuskokwim
Sustainable Salmon Initiative, explained that his group focused
on identifying and funding high priority salmon research in
Western Alaska, in order to better understand causes for the
decline of salmon stocks. He reported that this was a
collaborative research effort that included state, federal,
native, and non-profit organizations. He pointed out that its
research plan to target funding needed an objective, independent
third party opinion, so the group contracted with NRC. He
described the NRC process to be rigorous, objective, balanced,
and methodical. He pointed out that NRC was not a consulting
firm and that all the information in the process became
available to the public. He detailed that after the study
committee developed the report, the report was circulated for
external peer review to ensure independence and objectivity. He
praised the NRC report for its ability to sort through
information and focus on an interdisciplinary, comprehensive
research plan.
9:41:22 AM
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON, noting that the NRC reports were made
public, asked how proprietary information was protected.
DR. SPAEDER, in response to Representative Johnson, explained
that the NRC often dealt with contentious and confidential
issues, and that certain elements could be protected; however,
he confirmed that base line scientific and environmental data
was made public.
9:43:57 AM
REPRESENTATIVE KELLER opined that the value was in the
objectivity and reputation of the NRC. He asked Dr. Spaeder how
early in its project did his group contract with NRC. He
offered his opinion that it would be best to contract with NRC
after the Pebble Partnership and the state had collected the
data.
DR. SPAEDER replied that the NRC study was commissioned early on
in the process in order to provide a broad perspective for
integrative questions. He opined that this provided
corroboration and objectivity.
9:47:01 AM
CHAIR EDGMON closed testimony. [HCR 15 was held.]
HJR 32-FEDERAL PREEMPTION OF SALMON MANAGEMENT
CHAIR EDGMON announced that the final order of business would be
HOUSE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 32, Opposing litigation that seeks to
eliminate the Kenai, Kasilof, and Chitina sockeye salmon
personal use dip net fisheries; and requesting the governor to
re-examine the disproportional influence of the commercial
fisheries industries on fisheries management in the state.
9:47:42 AM
REPRESENTATIVE BILL STOLTZ, Alaska State Legislature, introduced
HJR 32 and discussed the personal use fisheries that it seeks to
protect.
9:50:16 AM
REPRESENTATIVE KELLER moved to adopt the proposed committee
substitute (CS) for HJR 32, Version 26-LS0865\E, Kane, 4/13/09,
as the working document.
CHAIR EDGMON objected for discussion.
9:50:51 AM
REPRESENTATIVE STOLTZE explained that HJR 32 represented many
Alaskans who relied on dip-netting. He thanked the various
legislators who had been involved in developing this resolution.
He extolled the virtues of salmon and the activity of dip
netting.
9:54:13 AM
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON asked if legislation to grant subsistence
use for every Alaskan would be included in HJR 32.
REPRESENTATIVE STOLTZE replied that HJR 32 already sends a
direct, unified message.
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON requested an opportunity to speak with
Representative Stoltze about this inclusion at a later date.
9:55:35 AM
REPRESENTATIVE KELLER opined how important it was to keep the
resources primarily for the use of Alaskans.
9:55:58 AM
REPRESENTATIVE MUNOZ agreed and said it was important to
advocate for personal use fisheries.
9:57:00 AM
CHAIR EDGMON removed his objection. There being no further
objection, CSHJR 32, Version E was before the committee.
[HJR 32 was held.]
9:57:08 AM
ADJOURNMENT
There being no further business before the committee, the House
Special Committee on Fisheries meeting was adjourned at 9:57
a.m.
| Document Name | Date/Time | Subjects |
|---|---|---|
| Draft CSHJR32.PDF |
HFSH 4/14/2009 9:00:00 AM |
HJR 32 |
| HCR15--Fiscal Note--LEG-COU-4-13-09.pdf |
HFSH 4/14/2009 9:00:00 AM |
HCR 15 |
| HCR15.pdf |
HFSH 4/14/2009 9:00:00 AM |
|
| National Academies Earth Science State and Local Guide.pdf |
HFSH 4/14/2009 9:00:00 AM |
HCR 15 |
| National Academies Earth and Life Working With Us.pdf |
HFSH 4/14/2009 9:00:00 AM |
HCR 15 |
| NRC Home Page Information.pdf |
HFSH 4/14/2009 9:00:00 AM |
HCR 15 |
| UCIDA vs. Wolf Complaint.pdf |
HFSH 4/14/2009 9:00:00 AM |
HJR 32 |
| HJR32--SEAS Letter.PDF |
HFSH 4/14/2009 9:00:00 AM |
HJR 32 |