Legislature(2021 - 2022)ADAMS 519
05/17/2021 09:00 AM House FINANCE
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| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| SB27 | |
| SB101 | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| + | SB 27 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | SB 101 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | TELECONFERENCED |
HOUSE FINANCE COMMITTEE
May 17, 2021
9:15 a.m.
9:15:46 AM
CALL TO ORDER
Co-Chair Merrick called the House Finance Committee meeting
to order at 9:15 a.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Representative Neal Foster, Co-Chair
Representative Kelly Merrick, Co-Chair
Representative Dan Ortiz, Vice-Chair
Representative Bryce Edgmon
Representative DeLena Johnson
Representative Andy Josephson
Representative Bart LeBon
Representative Sara Rasmussen
Representative Steve Thompson
Representative Adam Wool
MEMBERS ABSENT
Representative Ben Carpenter
ALSO PRESENT
Senator Joshua Revak, Chair, Senate Resources Committee;
Kris Curtis, Legislative Auditor, Alaska Division of
Legislative Audit.
PRESENT VIA TELECONFERENCE
Tina Cunning, Alaska National Interest Lands Conservation
Act (ANILCA) Specialist, Anchorage; Rod Arno, Policy
Advisor, Alaska Outdoor Council; Christine Hutchison, Self,
Kenai.
SUMMARY
SB 27 INDUSTRIAL HEMP PROGRAM; MANUFACTURING
CSSB 27(RES) was REPORTED out of committee with a
"do pass" recommendation and with one previously
published fiscal impact note: FN2 (DNR).
SB 101 ADVISORY COMMISSION ON FEDERAL MGT AREAS
CSSB 101(FIN) was REPORTED out of committee with
two "do pass" recommendations and six "no
recommendation" recommendations and with one
previously published fiscal impact note: FN2
(DNR).
Co-Chair Merrick reviewed the agenda for the meeting.
CS FOR SENATE BILL NO. 27(RES)
"An Act relating to industrial hemp; and providing for
an effective date."
9:16:24 AM
Co-Chair Merrick indicated that the companion bill had
already passed out of committee and was identical to SB 27.
She suggested moving the bill without hearing it.
Co-Chair Foster MOVED to report CSSB 27(RES) out of
Committee with individual recommendations and the
accompanying fiscal note.
There being NO OBJECTION, it was so ordered.
CSSB 27(RES) was REPORTED out of committee with a "do pass"
recommendation and with one previously published fiscal
impact note: FN2 (DNR).
9:17:00 AM
AT EASE
9:20:37 AM
RECONVENNED
CS FOR SENATE BILL NO. 101(FIN)
"An Act relating to the membership of the Citizens'
Advisory Commission on Federal Management Areas in
Alaska; extending the termination date of the
Citizens' Advisory Commission on Federal Management
Areas in Alaska; and providing for an effective date."
9:20:47 AM
SENATOR JOSHUA REVAK, CHAIR, SENATE RESOURCES COMMITTEE,
explained the bill. The bill extended the sunset date for
the Citizens' Advisory Commission on Federal Management
Areas in Alaska (CACFA) from June 30, 2021, to June 30,
2029, which was 8 years. The commission was first
established in 1981, shortly after, Congress passed
comprehensive legislation governing all federal public
lands in the state called the Alaska National Interest
Lands Conservation Act (ANILCA). Along with the Alaska
Statehood Act and Alaska Native Claims Settlement Act
(ANCSA), much of Alaskas lands were regulated under an
extremely unique and complex legislative web. He conveyed
that the mission of CACFA was helping Alaskans navigate
these complex rules and regulations and work with federal
agencies to ensure Congressional intent was implemented
with respect to their interests. The commission served as a
vigilant and knowledgeable resource for Alaskans to defend
the rights and protections they were promised under federal
law. The commission helped Alaskans with federal permitting
and understanding access rights under ANILCA. The
commission also researched and held hearings on consistency
with federal law and on the management, development, and
additions to federal land. He related that the Senate
Finance Committee changed SB 101 by requiring that at least
three of the governor's appointees to the commission were
representatives of ANCSA corporations. He elaborated that
ANCSA corporations were large land holders that frequently
handled land access and subsistence issues and it was felt
that incorporating their perspective into the commission
was beneficial to its work. The committee also restored
funding for one full-time position to reestablish staff
support for the commission.
Co-Chair Merrick relayed that Representative Edgmon had
joined the meeting.
9:23:28 AM
Representative Josephson asked how the commission had
functioned the last few years without staff.
Senator Revak answered that while they were not funded the
members acted as volunteers.
9:24:15 AM
Representative Wool asked how many appointees sat on the
board. Senator Revak responded that there were 12 members;
six were appointed by the governor and six were appointed
by the legislature.
9:24:46 AM
KRIS CURTIS, LEGISLATIVE AUDITOR, ALASKA DIVISION OF
LEGISLATIVE AUDIT, pointed to the Audit titled A Sunset
Review of the Department of Natural Resources, Citizens'
Advisory Commission on Federal Areas (CACFA) dated April 8,
2020 (copy on file) in members bill packets. She reminded
the committee that the purpose of the sunset audit was to
determine whether a board or commission was serving the
publics interest and if it should be extended. She began
with page 1 of the audit and read the following:
CACFA is responsible for identifying and reducing
potential negative impacts on Alaska and its citizens
from federal actions on any of the over 200 million
acres of federal land in the state.
The commission was active from 1981 until 1999, at
which time funding was eliminated. Alaska Statute
41.37 reestablished CACFA in 2007. CACFA operated from
FY 08 through FY 17, when funding was again
eliminated.
Ms. Curtis read from page 5 of the audit:
Federal management of land in Alaska has been widely
criticized.
Concerns with federal overreach and unfulfilled
commitments were the impetus for the creation of
CACFA. House Bill 87, passed in 2007, reestablished
the commission to advocate on behalf of Alaska
citizens on issues related to federal management of
Alaska land.
Ms. Curtis read from the Report Conclusions starting on
page 7:
From the date of the prior audit in February 2015
through the time CACFA was defunded in June 2017, the
commission operated effectively and did not
significantly duplicate the efforts of other entities.
During this period, the commission actively monitored
the effects of federal regulation and management
decisions in accordance with statutory duties. The
audit also concluded that there is a continuing public
need for the commission.
Ms. Curtis relayed that the audit recommended the
legislature extend the commission's termination date eight
years, to June 30, 2029. She continued to read from the
audit report.
Beginning in FY 17, funding CACFA has not been a
priority. While not a consistent priority for either
the governor or the legislature, both entities
supported the commission at separate times. The
legislature approved funding for the commission in FY
17; however, the governor vetoed the appropriation.
Funding for the commission in FY 18 and FY 19 was not
included in the governor's request, nor the final
operating bills passed by the legislature. The
legislature approved funding in FY 20, but the
governor vetoed the appropriation. The governor's
amended FY 21 budget included funds to restore CACFA
in recognition of the continued need for the
commission. The proposed funding was not included in
the legislature's approved budget.
The executive director monitored the Federal Register3
for new information related to CACFA's mission,
provided comments on proposed changes, and brought
relevant information to the commission's attention. If
determined necessary, the commission sent a comment
letter to the applicable federal agency. Per the prior
executive director, comment letters formally
summarized CACFA's concerns with proposed management
plans and changes to regulations and laws. The
commission sent 14 comment letters and provided
testimony four times from February 2015 through August
2016. Letters and testimony were directed to federal
agencies and congressional subcommittees.
9:27:37 AM
According to a prior CACFA member, CACFA invited
federal agencies to present information and discuss
federal plans and policies via panel discussions to
help facilitate communication between the public and
state and federal agencies. Meetings generally lasted
for one or two days and included multiple
presentations from individuals representing federal
agencies such as the U.S. National Park Service, U.S.
Fish and Wildlife Service, Bureau of Land Management,
and State agencies such as Department of Natural
Resources (DNR) and Department of Fish and Game.
Ms. Curtis remarked that the commission was very active.
She indicated that the auditor did not make any
recommendations. She pointed to page 21 for the response to
the audit from the Department of Natural Resources (DNR)
where the commissioner [Corri Feige, Commissioner,
Department of Natural Resources] concurred with an eight
year extension.
Representative Josephson hypothesized if the legislature
had a commission that defended the federal governments
interest in management of its land in protecting intact
eco-systems for the visitor industry and wildlife viewing,
whether the Division of Audit would determine that such a
commission acted in the public interest because the
legislature adopted the law creating the commission. Ms.
Curtis responded that she would first look to the
legislature and the governor for guidance as to whether the
commission served the publics interest. She relayed that
the commission was disbanded at the time of the audit and
the division struggled with how to determine whether the
commission was operating in the publics interest. She
provided the criteria the auditor used to determine the
need for the commission. The division investigated why the
commission was initially created and whether the concerns
were still valid. The division sent a letter to the
administration regarding the need for the commission and
received a positive response from the DNR commissioner. The
governor also included funding for the commission in the
budget. The division considered how the commission operated
and if they were successful in achieving its mission. The
audit determined that although the commission was not
funded, it recommended continuing the commission, which
provided the legislature with another opportunity to fund
CACFA.
9:30:53 AM
Representative Josephson appreciated the due diligence of
the legislative auditors. He deduced that the answer to his
question would be an affirmative response from Ms. Curtis
and the division would perform the same type of vetting and
reach a conclusion that the commission to support intact
eco-systems was in the states interest. Ms. Curtis replied
in the affirmative and added that if the legislature
adopted such a measure and it was time for a sunset audit,
she would follow the same process.
9:31:58 AM
Representative Wool asked why the commission was defunded
in prior legislatures. Ms. Curtis replied that it was the
legislatures decision whether to fund the commission. She
restated that the legislature attempted to fund it in FY
2017, but the transaction was vetoed by the governor. The
legislature attempted to fund it again in FY 2020 and it
was again vetoed. The governor's amended budget contained
CACFA funding but was not included in the final operating
bill. The division concluded that while CACFA had not been
a consistent priority for the executive and legislative
branches both showed some interest in funding it over the
past 5 years.
9:33:01 AM
Representative Wool referred to the report and ascertained
that the commission had been defunded twice and for long
periods of time it was eliminated. He wondered what the
reasons were for defunding the commission. Ms. Curtis
presumed that in 2017 it was due to budgetary reasons. She
reminded Representative Wool that CACFA was established in
1981 as a temporary agency. Representative Wool cited the
published fiscal note [FN2 (DNR)] and noted the $5.2
thousand for travel and $6.8 thousand appropriations for
services. He turned to the Operating Expenditures listed in
in the audit on page 3 and reported that in 2016, travel
costs were $34 thousand, and services were $77 thousand. He
wondered whether the numbers in 2016 were bloated. Ms.
Curtis responded that in 2016 the commission had an
executive director and a part-time staff person that were
engaged in active projects. She deemed that the current
fiscal note was bare bones.
9:34:57 AM
Co-Chair Merrick noted Vice-Chair Ortiz had joined the
meeting.
Co-Chair Foster informed the committee that the House had
included CACFA funding in FY 2020. The funding was vetoed
by the governor. He recalled that the Office of Budget and
Management Director at the time was Donna Arduin, who
proposed drastic budget cuts and vetoes. He had asked the
governor why he vetoed the funding. The governors response
was that he thought the then presidential administration
would be cooperative. He relayed that the president of the
commission lived in Nome. He shared that his constituents
were very interested in maintaining the commission and
wanted public access to the many established trails in a
nearby National Park in Nome. He received significant
support from his constituents regarding passage of SB 101.
He relayed that in a prior year, there had been a training
on Alaska National Interest Lands Conservation Act arranged
by prior Senator Giessel. He learned how complex the issues
regarding ANILCA and ANCSA were. He cited the sponsor
statement and read the following:
As institutional memory and expertise is lost, and as
agency decisions that revise our history and upend our
reasonable expectations are deferred to by the courts,
federal managers have little incentive to uphold
Congress's promises to Alaskans.
Co-Chair Foster read the first phrase as institutional
memory and expertise is lost and emphasized that was a
critical point and what he worried about.
9:38:09 AM
Representative Rasmussen aligned herself with many of the
prior comments. She thought it would be interesting to see
if there was a parallel between the prior federal
administrations actions and the actions of the board. She
opined that when a federal administration was more
cooperative regarding Alaskas states rights with access
to land, the legislature might not have the same level of
concern versus when the states rights were under attack as
under the first few months of the Biden Administration. She
felt that it was currently important to fund CACFA and
deemed that the governor would support the funding.
9:39:25 AM
Co-Chair Merrick relayed the committee would hear invited
testimony for SB 101.
9:39:46 AM
TINA CUNNING, ALASKA NATIONAL INTEREST LANDS CONSERVATION
ACT (ANILCA) SPECIALIST, ANCHORAGE (via teleconference),
shared that she worked for the states ANILCA program since
its inception in 1981 until 2010. She has been part of an
ANILCA training team since 2010. She related that the
governor and legislature worked hard during the ANILCA
deliberations in Congress to protect economic and social
opportunities for Alaska. Alaskans from all walks of life
and many organizations and professions worked arduously in
partnership for passage of ANILCA in 1980, that protected
the Alaska lifestyle and future uses of federal lands. In
1981, the state passed legislation that formed CACFA so
Alaskans could be kept informed as the lands act was being
implemented and to protect uses of the public lands as
Congress envisioned in ANILCA. She elaborated that while
the states ANILCA program worked to protect the states
agencies responsibilities, CACFA was invaluable in helping
individuals work through the new federal requirements for
commercial service permits that were necessary for things
like: air taxi operators, sled dog tours, hiking guides,
subsistence cabins, and access through conservation
inholdings. She communicated that it had been 40 years
since the passage of ANILCA and many have forgotten the
special provisions for public uses that were hard won in
the final ANILCA bill. Consequently, she believed that
CACFA was more necessary than ever. She elaborated that
currently, a federal agency published draft access
regulations that would change the process requirements for
acquiring permits to access non-federal land. The proposals
impacted all adjacent landholders and inholders, totaling
20 million acres. The changes would impact non-federal land
use for the state, ANCSA corporations, municipalities, and
hundreds of Alaskans. She reported that without CACFA
providing information most of the landowners would not be
made aware of the conflict between the proposed federal
changes, regulations, and the ANILCA process that Congress
adopted already in regulation. Without CACFA, rural
Alaskans had no none to help them navigate red tape or
appeal decisions if a federal land manager said no to
activities like snowmachine rentals, tour guiding, or other
economic activity. She believed that the governor and
legislature were wise in establishing CACFA, a citizen
forum that helped Alaskans meet their social and economic
needs that were promised in the final version of ANILCA.
She felt that every passing year without CACFA resulted in
lost opportunities and unresolved conflicts over uses. She
strongly supported reauthorization of CACFA.
9:43:40 AM
Co-Chair Merrick OPENED public testimony.
9:43:50 AM
ROD ARNO, POLICY ADVISOR, ALASKA OUTDOOR COUNCIL (via
teleconference), spoke in support of SB 101 on behalf of
the council. He shared that he had been a prior
commissioner of CACFA from 2008 to 2017. He viewed the
commissions extension as extremely important because it
helped Alaskans gain access to federal public lands.
Considering that 18 million acres of ANCSA land was within
the conservation system units created by ANILCA, it was
appropriate to have ANCSA shareholders as members. He
appreciated that the committee heard the bill. He urged
support for the bill.
9:45:41 AM
CHRISTINE HUTCHISON, SELF, KENAI (via teleconference),
spoke in support of the bill. She had been concerned that
Alaska had not received what it had deserved from the
federal government. She opined that Alaska was being
treated differently with the new federal administration.
She strongly favored reinstating the commission with
funding to protect the states interests. She also
expressed concern that the Kenai Peninsula was not properly
represented on the commission. She urged support of the
bill.
Co-Chair Merrick CLOSED public testimony.
9:47:52 AM
AT EASE
9:48:32 AM
RECONVENED
Representative Edgmon commented that he served on the House
Finance Committee in 2016 when the decision not to fund
CACFA was made. He had been concerned that the executive
director was overpaid. He noted that the composition of the
House Majority was very different in 2016. He voiced that
he was of two minds over the issue. He related that the
governor had recently proposed budget amendments in the
amount of $19 million to fight the federal government in
various ways. He supported the activities of CACFA and
thought that it was important. However, he was concerned
with the costs associated with the bill. He saw a lot of
money being mounted to fight the Biden Administration. He
interjected that the Biden Administration was cooperating
on the King Cove Road. He would not oppose the bill. He
wanted to provide some context on the record. He restated
that he saw a lot of money expended to fight the federal
government and his experience was that the funding was not
effective.
9:51:38 AM
Representative Wool shared some of Representative Edgmon's
comments. He cited the audit and relayed that in FY 2017,
personnel services were $45 thousand and currently the cost
was $178,000. He thought that the amount was significant.
9:52:37 AM
Ms. Curtis wanted to understand the representative's
comments. She asked what information he was referring to.
Representative Wool clarified and noted errors in his
statements. He corrected that in FY 2016, $148 thousand was
expended for personnel services and currently the cost for
a staff position was $163 thousand. Ms. Curtis replied that
the information on page 11 of the audit showed capital
expenditures were appropriated in FY 15 and the remainder
of the funding was carryforward to fund activities in 2017.
The chart did not reference an actual full-time position.
She relayed that the current fiscal note of $163,000 for
one position included salaries and benefits. Representative
Wool was aware of the inclusion of benefits. He believed
that the amount was high for one salary with benefits. Ms.
Curtis replied that typically, the cost of state benefits
was high. The employee would likely have a law background
and be able to navigate federal law and ANILCA. She
determined that it warranted an upper level position.
9:55:54 AM
Representative Edgmon relayed that Ms. Cunning had
participated in the ANILCA training mentioned by Co-Chair
Foster. She demonstrated that ANILCA was very complex, and
that it required an encyclopedic knowledge to understand
it.
Representative Rasmussen relayed that the current federal
administration issued an executive order placing 30 percent
of Alaskas lands and water in protective status by 2030.
She opined that there was a major opportunity cost by
having a moratorium on oil and gas leases and making it
more difficult for rural Alaskans to access lands and
subsistence activities. The legislature needed a
knowledgeable resource. She argued that it would be more
costly if the legislature let the executive branch take
away state land.
9:57:29 AM
Representative Josephson agreed with comments by
Representative Edgmon. He related that he had attended the
ANILCA training and while the forum was very informative,
he observed a belief that everyone in the room must think
the federal government is sort of inherently evil." He
suggested that there was a silent majority of people in
the state that did not feel animosity towards the federal
government. He remarked that there was a significant budget
redundancy for fighting the federal government. He noted a
program that was not mentioned called the Public Access
and Defense Unit in DNR. He recalled that he had viewed
CACFAs online website and felt that it was very
informative and neutral in its presentation.
9:59:22 AM
Co-Chair Foster relayed that he had spoken with numerous
citizens in his district who did not believe that the
federal government was the enemy. However, they wanted to
gain access to areas for hunting or visiting hot springs.
He noted that the desired areas were traditionally used
routes.
10:00:39 AM
Co-Chair Foster MOVED to report CSSB 101(FIN) out of
Committee with individual recommendations and the
accompanying fiscal note.
There being NO OBJECTION, it was so ordered.
CSSB 101(FIN) was REPORTED out of committee with two "do
pass" recommendations and six "no recommendation"
recommendations and with one previously published fiscal
impact note: FN2 (DNR).
Co-Chair Merrick reviewed the agenda for the afternoon.
ADJOURNMENT
10:01:18 AM
The meeting was adjourned at 10:01 a.m.
| Document Name | Date/Time | Subjects |
|---|---|---|
| SB 101 Explanation of Changes ver A to B 4.24.2021.pdf |
HFIN 5/17/2021 9:00:00 AM |
SB 101 |
| SB 101 LB&A CACFA Audit Report 4.8.2020.pdf |
HFIN 5/17/2021 9:00:00 AM |
SB 101 |
| SB 101 Letters of Support batch 5.13.21.pdf |
HFIN 5/17/2021 9:00:00 AM |
SB 101 |
| SB 101 Sponsor Statement-CACFA 5.6.21.pdf |
HFIN 5/17/2021 9:00:00 AM |
SB 101 |
| SB 101 Support Doc White Paper Differences ANILCA Program & CACFA.pdf |
HFIN 5/17/2021 9:00:00 AM |
SB 101 |
| CSB27 Explanation of Changes from Version B to I.pdf |
HFIN 5/17/2021 9:00:00 AM |
SB 27 |
| CSSB 27 Sectional Analysis Version I.pdf |
HFIN 5/17/2021 9:00:00 AM |
SB 27 |
| CSSB 27 Sponsor Statement Version I.pdf |
HFIN 5/17/2021 9:00:00 AM |
SB 27 |