Legislature(2009 - 2010)HOUSE FINANCE 519

03/25/2009 01:30 PM FINANCE


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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ HB 35 NOTICE & CONSENT FOR MINOR'S ABORTION TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
-- Testimony <Invitation Only> --
Presentation by Sponsor
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
+= HB 20 FISHERIES LOANS FOR ENERGY EFFICIENCY TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
-- Testimony <Invitation Only> --
                  HOUSE FINANCE COMMITTEE                                                                                       
                       March 25, 2009                                                                                           
                         1:38 p.m.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
1:38:41 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CALL TO ORDER                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Stoltze called the House Finance Committee meeting                                                                     
to order at 1:38 p.m.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Representative Mike Hawker, Co-Chair                                                                                            
Representative Bill Stoltze, Co-Chair                                                                                           
Representative Bill Thomas Jr., Vice-Chair                                                                                      
Representative Allan Austerman                                                                                                  
Representative Harry Crawford                                                                                                   
Representative Anna Fairclough                                                                                                  
Representative Richard Foster                                                                                                   
Representative Les Gara                                                                                                         
Representative Reggie Joule                                                                                                     
Representative Mike Kelly                                                                                                       
Representative Woodie Salmon                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
None.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
ALSO PRESENT                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
Representative    John    Coghill;    Representative    Nancy                                                                   
Dahlstrom;  Tim Clark, Staff,  Representative Bryce  Edgemon;                                                                   
Greg  Winegar,  Director,  Alaska  Division  of  Investments,                                                                   
Department of  Commerce, Community and Economic  Development;                                                                   
Ben Mulligan, Staff to Representative Stoltze.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
PRESENT VIA TELECONFERENCE                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
None.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SUMMARY                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
HB 35     "An Act relating to notice and consent for a                                                                          
          minor's   abortion;  relating   to  penalties   for                                                                   
          performing  an  abortion;  relating to  a  judicial                                                                   
          bypass  procedure  for  an  abortion;  relating  to                                                                   
          coercion of  a minor to have an  abortion; relating                                                                   
          to  reporting  of abortions  performed  on  minors;                                                                   
          amending  Rule  220,   Alaska  Rules  of  Appellate                                                                   
          Procedure,  and  Rule  20,  Alaska  Probate  Rules,                                                                   
          relating  to judicial bypass  for an abortion;  and                                                                   
          providing for an effective date."                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
          HB35 was HEARD and HELD in Committee for further                                                                      
          consideration.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
HB 20     "An Act relating to commercial fishing loans for                                                                      
          energy efficiency upgrades."                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
          HB 20 was HEARD and HELD in Committee for further                                                                     
     consideration.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
1:39:14 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 35                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     "An Act  relating to  notice and  consent for  a minor's                                                                   
     abortion;  relating  to   penalties  for  performing  an                                                                   
     abortion;  relating to a  judicial bypass procedure  for                                                                   
     an abortion; relating to  coercion of a minor to have an                                                                   
     abortion; relating  to reporting of  abortions performed                                                                   
     on minors; amending Rule  220, Alaska Rules of Appellate                                                                   
     Procedure, and  Rule 20, Alaska Probate  Rules, relating                                                                   
     to judicial  bypass for an  abortion; and  providing for                                                                   
     an effective date."                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHN  COGHILL,  presented  House Bill  35.  A                                                                   
similar bill  has been before the  House in the past  but has                                                                   
fallen short  of being  made into  law. The Parental  Consent                                                                   
Act  of 1997  established  parental  rights  in the  area  of                                                                   
minor's seeking  abortions. In 2007 the Alaska  Supreme Court                                                                   
overturned the Parental Consent  Act on the basis that it was                                                                   
unconstitutional.  Representative Coghill  stated that  HB 35                                                                   
has been crafted with a sincere  effort to balance the rights                                                                   
and  responsibilities  of all  involved  parties: The  Alaska                                                                   
Supreme Court, the state, parents, and minors.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
1:42:01 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Coghill  pointed  out that  there  are  state                                                                   
statutes that mandate parental  consent for minors to undergo                                                                   
medical  procedures, obtain  marriage  and drivers  licenses,                                                                   
and receive tattoos and piercings.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
1:44:05 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Coghill read from  a prepared statement, "HB35                                                                   
Parental Consent for Abortions" (Copy on File):                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
   · This bill is in the Alaska Statutes dealing with                                                                           
     abortions.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
   · This bill answers an Alaska Supreme Court decision in                                                                      
     statute  by   modifying  the  standards,   process,  and                                                                   
     parental part of a minor  girl with regard to abortions.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Coghill argued  that the  U.S. Supreme  Court                                                                   
decision puts a barrier between  parents and children because                                                                   
it does not statutorily give the  parent the right to know if                                                                   
the  child  has  had an  abortion.  He  felt  loving,  caring                                                                   
parents  should be  allowed  by  law to  guide  the minor  in                                                                   
decision  making  of  this magnitude.  The  bill  would  give                                                                   
parents the  right not only to  know about the  abortion, but                                                                   
would ultimately extend  to the parent the right  to make the                                                                   
choice for the immature minor.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
Representative Coghill continued  on Slide 1, "The Standard":                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
   · The Standards are a balance of parental rights and                                                                         
     responsibilities, the minor's  right of protection under                                                                   
     the privacy  clause, and the states  compelling interest                                                                   
     in  protecting the  family,  the minor,  and each  right                                                                   
     enjoyed by both.                                                                                                           
   · The way the court viewed the Standard was that it                                                                          
     needed to be the least restrictive of the minor's right                                                                    
     to privacy.                                                                                                                
   · Therefore this bill outlines the flow of consent                                                                           
     requirements:                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
        o Minor must obtain consent of parents and 48 hour                                                                      
          notice for fit and loving parents.                                                                                    
        o If married - no parental consent required.                                                                            
        o If legally emancipated - no parental consent                                                                          
          required.                                                                                                             
        o If entered in the armed forces - no parental                                                                          
          consent required.                                                                                                     
        o If self-subsisting and employed - no parental                                                                         
          consent required.                                                                                                     
        o If petition court showing mature decision - no                                                                        
          parental consent required.                                                                                            
        o If court inactive - no parental consent required.                                                                     
        o If sexual of physical abuse upon signature and                                                                        
          witness - no parental or court consent required.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
1:45:55 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Coghill  felt   that  cases  defined  by  the                                                                   
standards  are   cases  where   minors  had  demonstrated   a                                                                   
sufficient maturity  level and could  be trusted to  make the                                                                   
decision whether or not to have an abortion.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
1:47:38 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Coghill expounded  on the reasoning behind the                                                                   
U.S.  Supreme Court  decision of  2007. The  court sought  to                                                                   
find a balance  between the minor's right to  privacy and the                                                                   
parent's right to  be involved in decision making  related to                                                                   
abortion. After ten years of deliberation  the Alaska Supreme                                                                   
Court  stated that  requiring  parental consent  for a  minor                                                                   
female to  obtain an abortion  was constitutionally  suspect.                                                                   
The  court was  in favor  of parental  notification, but  not                                                                   
consent. Representative  Coghill thought that  parents should                                                                   
have more than a notification provision under state law.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
1:49:46 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Coghill discussed  judicial bypass.  Under HB                                                                   
35  victims of  physical abuse,  sexual  abuse, or  emotional                                                                   
abuse can  go directly  to a  doctor for  an abortion  with a                                                                   
signed and notarized statement  from the minor and one of the                                                                   
following:                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
   · Adult sibling                                                                                                              
   · Law enforcement officer                                                                                                    
   · Department of Health and Social Services representative                                                                    
     such as a case worker for Office of Children's Services                                                                    
     (OCS) or Juvenile Justice.                                                                                                 
   · A grandparent                                                                                                              
   · A stepparent                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Coghill reasoned that  the pregnant  minor is                                                                   
in need of mature  guidance, outside of herself,  to make the                                                                   
choice of whether  or not to have an abortion.  He added that                                                                   
if the parents  of the minor in question are  abusive or have                                                                   
strong  beliefs  against  abortion,   the  additional  bypass                                                                   
provides the minor  female a way to demonstrate  her maturity                                                                   
and need for an abortion without parental consent.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
1:50:44 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Coghill discussed  coercion. By  law a  minor                                                                   
cannot be  coerced to have an  abortion. A minor  child could                                                                   
obtain emancipation  if a parent were forcing her  to have an                                                                   
abortion through coercion. For  example, a parent refusing to                                                                   
provide  food, shelter,  or  financial  support. He  believed                                                                   
that in our  current society young women are  preyed upon. He                                                                   
asserted  that  as the  law  currently  stands, there  is  no                                                                   
protection from coercion for the  minor child. The bill would                                                                   
provide  a mandatory provision  for doctors  to report  abuse                                                                   
immediately.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
1:52:47 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Coghill pondered  on the Supreme Court case of                                                                   
Bellotti  v. Baird,  443  U.S. 622  (1979),  (Copy on  File),                                                                   
which   established   the  court   bypass   provisions.   The                                                                   
Massachusetts    parental     consent    law     was    found                                                                   
unconstitutional by the U.S. Supreme Court because:                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
   · It allowed judicial authorization for an abortion to be                                                                    
     withheld  from  a  minor  who is  mature  and  competent                                                                   
     enough to  make the decision independently.  (House Bill                                                                   
     35 complies and allows exemption for this minor.)                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
   · It required parental notification in all cases (parents                                                                    
     were  required   to  be   notified  if  their   daughter                                                                   
     initiated   proceedings  in   superior  court)   without                                                                   
     allowing  the  minor  to seek  an  independent  judicial                                                                   
     assessment  of her  competence  to  decide the  abortion                                                                   
     issue.  (House  Bill  35   allows  for  judicial  bypass                                                                   
     without notification of parents.)                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Representative   Coghill   informed    the   committee   that                                                                   
provisions  have  been entered  into  the  bill in  order  to                                                                   
provide the minor  accessibility to the court  and protection                                                                   
from coercion by perpetrators.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
1:54:01 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Coghill discussed Section  1 of HB  35, (Copy                                                                   
on File). The section elucidates  the conditions under Alaska                                                                   
Statute  (AS)  18.16.010(a),  in  which an  abortion  can  be                                                                   
performed  in  the  state.  He continued  to  Section  2,  AS                                                                   
18.16.010(g),  which  elaborates  on the  protection  of  the                                                                   
physician or surgeon performing  the abortion when using good                                                                   
faith clinical judgment.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
1:55:39 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Coghill continued  to Section 3, AS 18.16.020,                                                                   
which provides the language pertaining  to notice and consent                                                                   
required  before  a  minor's   abortion.    He  stressed  the                                                                   
importance of  mature guidance  for minors in  navigating the                                                                   
court system.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
1:57:24 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Coghill felt that  some people favor abortion.                                                                   
He specifically  cited Planned Parenthood. He  mentioned that                                                                   
there are  people ready to  help the  minor on both  sides of                                                                   
the  issue.  He expressed  concern  for  minors that  may  be                                                                   
trapped in their hometowns without any authoritive help.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
1:59:25 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Coghill continued  to Section 5, line 22. This                                                                   
section  covers   the  possibility   of  parental   interests                                                                   
existing  outside of  the child's  best  interest. Section  8                                                                   
outlines protections in place  for the minor should the court                                                                   
decide  that  the  abortion  be  performed  without  parental                                                                   
consent. Section  9 deals  with coercion.  He felt  this gave                                                                   
the  minor  some  power  in  defending   herself  should  the                                                                   
parent/child relationship be abusive.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
2:01:36 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Coghill stated that  the bill is  designed to                                                                   
bring minors and  parents together in making  the decision on                                                                   
abortion,  provide an  avenue  for the  minor to  demonstrate                                                                   
maturity or need  for an abortion, and give  the most benefit                                                                   
to the minor in the least restrictive  way. He reiterated his                                                                   
personal  fear   that  without  the  law,  minors   would  be                                                                   
manipulated by abusers.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:03:01 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  NANCY DAHLSTROM,  stated  her strong  support                                                                   
for HB  35. She said that  her constituents,  both "pro-life"                                                                   
and "pro-choice", are in favor of the bill.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
2:04:32 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Gara wondered  if a  representative from  OCS                                                                   
would be  available to answer  questions regarding  the bill.                                                                   
He  pointed out  that  it cannot  be  written  into law  that                                                                   
parents  be "loving  and caring."  He  expressed concern  for                                                                   
minors  who did  not  have "loving  and  caring" parents  and                                                                   
wondered how the  consent provision would work  for minors in                                                                   
foster  care  or  awaiting  foster  care  placement.  He  was                                                                   
curious how OCS  would implement the law in  situations where                                                                   
the  child  has  been taken  out  of  the  parent's  custody.                                                                   
Representative Coghill replied  that he would wait for OCS to                                                                   
give  the   final  answer.   Co-Chair  Stoltze  assured   the                                                                   
committee  that a  formal request  would  be made  to OCS  to                                                                   
speak to Representative Gara's  concerns. Representative Gara                                                                   
also requested an  analysis of the possible  fiscal impact to                                                                   
the state.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
2:07:39 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Stoltze stated that he  would work to have questions                                                                   
answered by OCS as soon as possible.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Coghill  informed  the committee  that  there                                                                   
were 12 abortions performed on  children under 15 in 2008. He                                                                   
felt that  it would not  take long to  determine how  many of                                                                   
those minors were  in state custody at the  time the abortion                                                                   
was performed.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Austerman  referred   to  earlier  statistics                                                                   
provided   by  Representative   Coghill.  According   to  the                                                                   
statistics there were 13 abortions  performed on minors under                                                                   
15 and 128 abortions performed on 15-17 year olds in 2008.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Representative   Crawford  identified   with   Representative                                                                   
Coghill's  passion  for the  issue.  He wondered  what  would                                                                   
happen  if parents  have conflicting  views on  the issue  of                                                                   
abortion. He also  questioned how the bill would  address the                                                                   
"morning  after  pill,"  or  RU486.   Representative  Coghill                                                                   
replied that he  would research the issue of  the RU486 pill.                                                                   
He  gave that  the  matter of  a  split opinion  on  abortion                                                                   
between parents  was more complicated. He assumed  that there                                                                   
would be  a family discussion  to determine consensus  on the                                                                   
matter.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:12:49 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Coghill stated  that there were three parts to                                                                   
the question;  how  close is the  family, what  is the  legal                                                                   
question,  and how  is the  child's  relationship with  their                                                                   
parents. He  felt that the issue  is a legal issue  but it is                                                                   
also about life choices.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Gara  thought  that  minimizing  the  overall                                                                   
number  of  abortions  altogether  was a  positive  goal.  He                                                                   
wondered if  health classes could  provide young  people more                                                                   
information on  navigating the adoption system.  He felt such                                                                   
information  could help  to limit  abortions.  Representative                                                                   
Coghill  replied  that  informed  consent  would  open  up  a                                                                   
dialogue between  parents and  minors to discuss  all options                                                                   
for  the  minor. Representative  Gara  maintained  that  laws                                                                   
could   not  be   written   to  make   families   communicate                                                                   
productively. He  pointed out that there is  no law requiring                                                                   
a child to have parental consent to have sex.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
2:17:07 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Coghill referenced  the statutory age  limits                                                                   
for sex between minors and legal adults.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
2:18:05 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Austerman spoke in support of the Sponsor.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Representative Gara had issue  with some the mechanics of the                                                                   
bill.  He felt that  the list  of standards  for the  judge's                                                                   
ruling  was  not  clear  in the  language  of  the  bill.  He                                                                   
wondered what  standard the judge  would base a  decision on.                                                                   
Representative  Coghill referred  to page 5,  line 19  of the                                                                   
bill.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
2:20:13 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Coghill recognized  that the language could be                                                                   
subjective. He  stated that the  bill establishes  a timeline                                                                   
to ensure that  the minor is not experiencing  hardship while                                                                   
waiting for  a court hearing.  The hope is that  court action                                                                   
will be  quick under the  legislation. He reiterated  that as                                                                   
the law  stands there is a  void of protection for  the minor                                                                   
and a  barrier between the  parent and the immature  pregnant                                                                   
person.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:21:18 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Gara argued  that  the language  in the  bill                                                                   
regarding  the information  needed in  the minor's  affidavit                                                                   
before the court is clear, but  that there is no provision in                                                                   
the bill that  establishes the standard that the  judge is to                                                                   
base the final decision on.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Representative Coghill replied  that the judge would base the                                                                   
decision on the  maturity level of the minor  and the minor's                                                                   
intelligence  level. He  warned  that presently  there is  no                                                                   
standard  and that immature  minors have  no protection  from                                                                   
coercion.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
2:23:10 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Gara pointed  out that  there must  be a  law                                                                   
that the  judge applies when making  the decision and  he did                                                                   
not believe the bill contained such a standard.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
2:23:53 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Coghill replied  that the  standard had  been                                                                   
lowered to  "clear and  convincing evidence".  Representative                                                                   
Gara reiterated  that he had  many questions about  the bill.                                                                   
Co-Chair Stoltze said that there  would be an opportunity for                                                                   
everyone ask questions  and to speak their mind  on the bill,                                                                   
but stressed that time is limited.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
2:26:26 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Coghill noted  that the  protection of  minor                                                                   
children  is a  nationwide issue.  He felt  if minors  cannot                                                                   
trust their  parents, other options  need to be  available to                                                                   
them.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Stoltze  assented that this is a  substantial policy                                                                   
issue.  Representative  Coghill  understood  that  there  are                                                                   
court process  issues  that should be  researched further  in                                                                   
order to speak to Representative Gara's concerns.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
2:27:44 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair  Stoltze   shared  that   he  had  reviewed   public                                                                   
testimony from past meetings in  preparation for the meeting.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
HB  35   was  HEARD  and   HELD  in  Committee   for  further                                                                   
consideration.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
2:28:54 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 20                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
          "An Act relating to commercial fishing loans for                                                                      
          energy efficiency upgrades."                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
TIM  CLARK, STAFF,  REPRESENTATIVE  BRYCE EDGEMON,  discussed                                                                   
the CS of HB  20, which amends the Commercial  Fisheries Loan                                                                   
Act.  He elaborated  on the  sections  with amended  language                                                                   
(Copy on File).                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
2:31:41 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Clark finished  with the Retroactivity Clause  in section                                                                   
3. Section 4 sets an immediate effective date for the bill.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
2:32:32 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Foster  wondered about preferential  treatment                                                                   
for people  in rural areas. He  voiced the need for  loans to                                                                   
be made  available to other  Alaskans, such as  Alaska Native                                                                   
artisans, as well as fishermen.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
2:33:53 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Mr.  Clark replied  that  he believed  that  artisans may  be                                                                   
eligible  for loans  under the  Rural Development  Initiative                                                                   
and possible  small business  or economic development  loans.                                                                   
Representative Foster wondered  why the loans were not coming                                                                   
from a bank, as would a car or home loan.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
2:34:45 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Clark explained that the Commercial  Fishing Loan Act was                                                                   
established  in  early 1970,  at  a  time when  the  industry                                                                   
needed state assistance. He said  the program was a different                                                                   
way for fishermen, who may not  have had a credit history, to                                                                   
acquire loans.  Representative Foster pointed out  that there                                                                   
used  to be  small loans  available for  miners. He  stressed                                                                   
that not only fishermen needed loans to operate.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
2:36:49 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Stoltze  said that these  loans were  available only                                                                   
to  commercial fishermen.  Representative  Foster  maintained                                                                   
that there  are banks available  to provide loans  for viable                                                                   
businesses.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
2:37:31 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Mr.  Clark explained  that  the criteria  for  the loans  are                                                                   
directly related  to the needs  of fishermen. The  loans that                                                                   
are approved are directly related to commercial fishing.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
2:38:18 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Foster   wondered  if  the  loans   are  only                                                                   
available to Alaskan residents. Mr. Clark replied yes.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
GREG WINEGAR,  DIRECTOR, DIVISION OF INVESTMENTS,  DEPARTMENT                                                                   
OF  COMMERCE,  COMMUNITY  AND  ECONOMIC  DEVELOPMENT,  stated                                                                   
that DCCED  supports the bill  with amendments. He  felt that                                                                   
the  amendments  were  consistent  with the  mission  of  the                                                                   
Commercial Fishing Loan Act.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair  Stoltze  moved Amendment  1,  26-LS0124\P.1,  Kane,                                                                   
6/26/09 (copy on file):                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     Page 2, line 1, following "permits;":                                                                                      
     Delete "or"                                                                                                                
     Insert "[OR]"                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
     Page 2, line 4, following "efficiency;":                                                                                   
     Insert "or                                                                                                                 
     (iii)  for new construction related to a vessel for                                                                        
     the purpose of improving energy efficiency in a loan                                                                       
     amount not greater than $100,000;"                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
 Vice-Chair Thomas OBJECTED.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
2:40:11 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
BEN MULLIGAN, STAFF REPRESENTATIVE  BILL STOLTZE, stated that                                                                   
the amendment  puts a clause  in place  to cap loans  for new                                                                   
vessel construction  at $100,000.  He explained that  in some                                                                   
cases  replacing  an  old  vessel   is  more  efficient  than                                                                   
investing in repair on the old vessel.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Hawker  wondered what would happen to  older vessels                                                                   
if replaced  by new  vessels. Mr.  Mulligan replied  that the                                                                   
vessel owner could sell the vessel  outright or for scrap. He                                                                   
said that  it would  be up to  the owner  of the vessel.  Co-                                                                   
Chair  Hawker felt  that  there was  a gap  in  the logic  of                                                                   
replacing  an  old vessel  that  could  be repaired  with  an                                                                   
entirely new vessel.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
2:41:04 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Foster  questioned  the practicality  of  the                                                                   
amendment.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
2:41:57 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Mulligan  replied that  the amendment left  it up  to the                                                                   
individual  boat owner to  decide the  best course  of action                                                                   
when upgrading vessels.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Vice-Chair Thomas  explained how the fishing  industry works.                                                                   
He relayed that  he personally would not qualify  for a state                                                                   
loan because  he could qualify  for a bank loan.  He stressed                                                                   
that the  loans are  meant for  fishermen who are  struggling                                                                   
financially. He  told of the cost  of fuel and the  burden it                                                                   
can  place on  the  fishermen. He  explained  that boats  are                                                                   
often recycled among fishermen.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
2:43:52 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Kelly  remarked that he read  the amendment in                                                                   
a different  way. He hoped  that the  loans were going  to be                                                                   
issued to upgrade old boats and not to buy new vessels.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:44:59 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Fairclough  referred to page 2, line  4 of the                                                                   
bill. She understood  that the amendment does  not pertain to                                                                   
new vessels.  Co-Chair  Stoltze clarified  the intent  of the                                                                   
amendment was to  not put energy efficiencies  on a deficient                                                                   
boat. Representative Fairclough  maintained that the language                                                                   
was unclear.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
2:45:52 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Winegar understood that the  amendment did pertain to new                                                                   
vessels. He remarked  that the purchase of new  vessels would                                                                   
be limited.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Vice-Chair Thomas WITHDREW his OBJECTION.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
2:46:56 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Kelly  maintained that  the  language in  the                                                                   
amendment was unclear.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
2:47:27 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Vice-Chair Thomas reiterated his support of the amendment.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
2:48:17 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Kelly felt  that some  vessels had been  left                                                                   
out of the bill altogether.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
2:49:14 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Foster asked  about the  delinquency rate  on                                                                   
the  loans.  Mr.  Winegar  explained  that  the  rate  was  7                                                                   
percent.  Representative  Foster thought  that  the rate  was                                                                   
high. Mr. Winegar  thought the rate would  decline throughout                                                                   
the year.  He pointed  out that the  fund has performed  well                                                                   
from   a   financial   standpoint.    Representative   Foster                                                                   
maintained that  the rate of  return was disappointing.   Mr.                                                                   
Winegar assured that the overall  numbers speak favorably for                                                                   
the program.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
2:50:51 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative    Kelly   thought    there   was    still   a                                                                   
misunderstanding  of whether or not  the bill applies  to new                                                                   
boats.   He requested  clarification  from the Department  of                                                                   
Law (LAW).                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair  Hawker  understood  that  the  bill  addresses  new                                                                   
vessels.   He requested clarification.   Mr. Winegar  said he                                                                   
could  not  answer  the  question.  Co-Chair  Hawker  thought                                                                   
clarification was warranted.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
2:52:25 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Stoltze contended the  bill should be held until the                                                                   
language could be clarified by LAW.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Foster  expressed  frustration  with  special                                                                   
interest   groups.  He   felt   that  fishermen   are   given                                                                   
preferential treatment  that is  not extended to  miners. Co-                                                                   
Chair  Stoltze responded  that  he understood  Representative                                                                   
Foster's concerns.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
2:54:21 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Gara reported  on constituent comments  about                                                                   
expanded eligibility for the loans.  He understood that there                                                                   
was a class of people that did not qualify for the loans.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
2:55:56 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Mr. Winegar  explained  that there are  separate sections  in                                                                   
the statute  that addressed the  issue.  Under Section  A the                                                                   
applicant does not  have to have been turned down  by a bank.                                                                   
Section B  requires that the  applicant has tried  to qualify                                                                   
for a bank  loan and has  been turned down. A  lower interest                                                                   
rate distinguishes the difference.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Representative  Gara commented  that his constituents  wanted                                                                   
loans to improve energy efficiency.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Mr.  Clark  explained that  the  intent  of  the bill  is  to                                                                   
correct  inequities,  widen  eligibility,  and  to  encourage                                                                   
conversion of vessels to prevent high energy costs.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
2:58:53 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Representative Kelly reported that he had similar                                                                               
constituent concerns.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
HB 20 was HEARD and HELD in Committee for further                                                                               
consideration.                                                                                                                  
ADJOURNMENT                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
The meeting was adjourned at 2:59 PM.                                                                                           

Document Name Date/Time Subjects
01 HB35 Sponsor Statement.pdf HFIN 3/25/2009 1:30:00 PM
HB 35
03 HB35 Sectional.pdf HFIN 3/25/2009 1:30:00 PM
HB 35
04 Bellotti v Baird.pdf HFIN 3/25/2009 1:30:00 PM
HB 35
05 State v. Planned Parenthood.pdf HFIN 3/25/2009 1:30:00 PM
HB 35
06 Court Forms re Bypass.pdf HFIN 3/25/2009 1:30:00 PM
HB 35
11 HB35 Backup.pdf HFIN 3/25/2009 1:30:00 PM
HB 35
Amendment 1 to HB 20.pdf HFIN 3/25/2009 1:30:00 PM
HB 20
Amendment 2 to HB 20.pdf HFIN 3/25/2009 1:30:00 PM
HB 20
HB 35 Overview by Rep. Coghill.pdf HFIN 3/25/2009 1:30:00 PM
HB 35