Legislature(2017 - 2018)BELTZ 105 (TSBldg)

04/18/2018 01:30 PM JUDICIARY

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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+= SB 81 DHSS CENT. REGISTRY;LICENSE;BCKGROUND CHK TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
+ HB 355 FIRE;FOREST LAND; CRIMES;FIRE PREVENTION TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
+= HB 170 AK SECURITIES ACT; PENALTIES; CRT. RULES TELECONFERENCED
Moved SCS CSHB 170(L&C) Out of Committee
+= HB 208 TRUSTS; COMM PROP TRUSTS; POWERS OF APPT TELECONFERENCED
Scheduled but Not Heard
-- Public Testimony --
+ HB 216 CRIMES;RESTITUTION;DIVIDEND FUND TELECONFERENCED
<Pending Referral><Bill Hearing Canceled>
+ HB 342 LAND SALES PRACTICES TELECONFERENCED
<Bill Hearing Canceled>
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
        HB 355-FIRE;FOREST LAND; CRIMES;FIRE PREVENTION                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
2:18:06 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR COGHILL  announced the  consideration of  HB 355  and noted                                                               
the proposed committee substitute (CS).                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:18:48 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  COSTELLO moved  to adopt  the  Senate CS  for CSHB  355,                                                               
version 30-LS1382\U, as the working document.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
2:18:59 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR COGHILL objected for an explanation of the changes.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
2:19:04 PM                                                                                                                    
ALLIANA  SALANGUIT,   Staff,  Representative   David  Guttenberg,                                                               
Alaska State Legislature, Juneau,  Alaska, explained that version                                                               
U of HB 355  updates the language in Section 8,  page 3, line 11-                                                               
15. It reads:                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
     Sec. 41.15.070.  Disposal of burning  materials. During                                                                
     the  fire  season  or a  burn  closure  or  restriction                                                              
     established  under  AS  41.15.050,  a  person  may  not                                                            
     discard any  lighted tobacco, cigar,  cigarette, match,                                                              
     firecracker,  or  other  burning material  on  forested                                                                    
     land.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
She  advised   that  this  conforming  change   makes  Section  8                                                               
consistent with Section 5 that talks about fire season.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  COGHILL asked  if this  addressed  the inconsistency  that                                                               
Senator Wielechowski brought up in a previous meeting.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MS. SALANGUIT said yes.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI  asked  if   littering  laws,  and  perhaps                                                               
others, would  prohibit someone  from discarding  these materials                                                               
during any season.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
2:20:21 PM                                                                                                                    
CHRIS MAISCH, State Forester and  Director, Division of Forestry,                                                               
Department  of   Natural  Resources  (DNR),   Fairbanks,  Alaska,                                                               
replied he  was not aware  of any  laws the Division  of Forestry                                                               
would enforce, but local laws  may prevent people from discarding                                                               
trash  or  other  materials.  Section 8  now  conforms  with  the                                                               
purpose of fire protection in Section 5.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI said he was satisfied.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
2:20:54 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR COGHILL removed his objection and version U was adopted.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
He noted  the proposed  amendments and advised  that if  any were                                                               
adopted they  would be conformed  to version U. He  opened public                                                               
testimony.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
2:22:38 PM                                                                                                                    
JEFF  TUCK, President,  Alaska  Fire  Chiefs Association,  Kenai,                                                               
Alaska,  testified in  support of  HB  355. It  will provide  the                                                               
Division of  Forestry with  prevention tools  to better  do their                                                               
job. He expressed hope that  the proposed amendments would do the                                                               
same.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  COGHILL  asked  Senator Shower  to  present  the  proposed                                                               
amendments.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
2:23:53 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR SHOWER moved Amendment 1, labeled 30-LS1382\O.16.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
                                                30-LS1382\O.16                                                                  
                                                      Radford                                                                   
                                                      4/18/18                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
                          AMENDMENT 1                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
    OFFERED IN THE SENATE                 BY SENATOR SHOWER                                                                     
          TO: CSHB 355(JUD)                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Page 2, line 16:                                                                                                           
          Delete "investigating,"                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     Page 4, line 16-17:                                                                                                        
          Delete ",investigate,"                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR COGHILL objected.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  SHOWER  explained that  this  and  the other  amendments                                                               
address  what he  views to  be  enforcement powers  that are  too                                                               
broad  and   vague.  He  opined   that  "investigating"   is  not                                                               
applicable  to  the title.  The  same  reasoning applies  to  the                                                               
deletion on page 4.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
2:25:28 PM                                                                                                                    
MS.  SALANGUIT advised  that the  sponsor opposes  the amendment.                                                               
She noted  that this and  the other amendments were  presented in                                                               
the other body and were not adopted.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
2:25:41 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI  asked  Mr.  Maisch  why  the  Division  of                                                               
Forestry needs the ability to investigate.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MR. MAISCH  replied the division's  fire prevention  officers are                                                               
specifically trained  in the cause and  determination of wildland                                                               
fires. This is  expertise that other state agencies  do not have.                                                               
He explained  that the ability  to investigate is  important when                                                               
there are  smoke reports.  He highlighted  that following  a fire                                                               
emergency, an  individual's constitutional rights  are maintained                                                               
and warrants are used to do more detailed investigations.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
2:26:37 PM                                                                                                                    
At ease                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  COGHILL   asked  Senator  Shower  if   he  maintained  the                                                               
amendment.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR SHOWER said yes.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR COGHILL asked for a roll call.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
2:26:46 PM                                                                                                                    
A roll  call vote was taken.  Senators Shower and Kelly  voted in                                                               
favor  of Amendment  1 and  Senators Costello,  Wielechowski, and                                                               
Coghill voted against it. Therefore,  Amendment 1 failed by a 2:3                                                               
vote.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
2:27:35 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR SHOWER moved Amendment 2, labeled 30-LS1382\O.17.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
                                                30-LS1382\O.17                                                                  
                                                      Radford                                                                   
                                                      4/17/18                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
                          AMENDMENT 2                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
    OFFERED IN THE SENATE                 BY SENATOR SHOWER                                                                     
          TO: CSHB 355(JUD)                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Page 2, lines 14-15:                                                                                                       
          Delete "or administering the provisions of this                                                                   
     chapter"                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR COGHILL objected.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  SHOWER  said the  reasoning  is  the  same as  with  the                                                               
previous  amendment.  The powers  this  language  grants are  too                                                               
broad when  the paragraph specifically  talks about the  right of                                                               
entry to  control and suppress  fires. He opined that  this needs                                                               
to be rewritten and placed in a separate section.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MS. SALANGUIT stated that the  sponsor opposes this amendment. It                                                               
is more restrictive  for the division and would  allow permits to                                                               
be issued only for setting fires and the use of burning devices.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MR. MAISCH confirmed  that Amendment 2 would  be more restrictive                                                               
and  would limit  the division    right to  enter only  during an                                                               
emergency to suppress and control wildland fires.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR COGHILL  asked Senator  Shower if it  was his  intention to                                                               
make it more restrictive.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  SHOWER  said   he  didn't  believe  it   would  be  more                                                               
restrictive. His view is that  the amendment makes enforcing this                                                               
chapter less restrictive for the  division. It does not stop them                                                               
from  responding  to  and controlling  and  suppressing  wildland                                                               
fires or suspected wildland fires.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
MR.  MAISCH pointed  out that  one  of the  sections talks  about                                                               
other  types  of land  uses.  This  includes things  like  timber                                                               
harvesting and  land clearing, both  of which could  cause fires.                                                               
The amendment would prevent the  division's ability to work under                                                               
those scenarios.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
2:29:47 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR COGHILL maintained his objection to Amendment 2.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI  asked for more  examples of why  this power                                                               
is needed.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MR  MAISCH said  other  provisions of  this  chapter include  the                                                               
section  that  refers  to  destructive   agents  such  as  insect                                                               
infestations.   AS   41.17.082(d)   outlines  the   process   the                                                               
commissioner must use to identify  a zone of infestation and deal                                                               
with  the  destructive  agents.   The  proposed  amendment  would                                                               
restrict that authority.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR COGHILL asked for a roll call.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
2:31:04 PM                                                                                                                    
A roll  call vote  was taken.  Senator Shower  voted in  favor of                                                               
Amendment  2  and  Senators Wielechowski,  Kelly,  Costello,  and                                                               
Coghill voted against it. Therefore,  Amendment 2 failed by a 1:4                                                               
vote.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
2:31:34 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR SHOWER moved Amendment 3, labeled 30-LS1382\O.18.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
                                                30-LS1382\O.18                                                                  
                                                      Radford                                                                   
                                                      4/17/18                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
                          AMENDMENT 3                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
    OFFERED IN THE SENATE                 BY SENATOR SHOWER                                                                     
          TO: CSHB 355(JUD)                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Page 3, lines 7-9:                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
        Delete all material and insert:                                                                                         
               "(b)  A  person  may  not set  fires  or  use                                                                    
               burning   devices   without   a   permit   as                                                                    
               prescribed    by    the    commissioner    in                                                                    
               regulation."                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR COGHILL objected                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR SHOWER said the amendment  addresses the concern that the                                                               
language is too broad for what the section tries to accomplish.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR COSTELLO  asked if the phrase  "conduct other activities"                                                               
is balanced  by the phrase  "without a permit as  described." She                                                               
questioned  whether  a  permit  would  be  required  to  smoke  a                                                               
cigarette.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MR.  MAISCH   said  the  division  opposes   Amendment  3.  Other                                                               
activities  refers to  other types  of land  uses such  as timber                                                               
harvest and land  clearing, both of which would  require a permit                                                               
during fire  season. A permit  would not  be required to  smoke a                                                               
cigarette.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked  if mowing a lawn would  be an example                                                               
of  an  activity that  could  increase  fire danger,  given  that                                                               
hitting a rock could cause a spark and ignite a fire.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR. MAISCH said yes.  In a similar example, a hot  saw hit a rock                                                               
during timber harvest and started a large forest fire.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked to which  lands and what times of year                                                               
Section 7 applies.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
MR. MAISCH replied  it applies to forested lands  during the fire                                                               
season  or  other  times  prescribed  by  the  commissioner.  The                                                               
definition  of "forested  lands"  is broad  and  would include  a                                                               
lawn.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI asked  if a  permit is  needed to  mow your                                                               
lawn.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR.  MAISCH  clarified that  a  permit  is  not required  but  an                                                               
individual could be cited if it causes a fire.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked about using a firearm outside.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR.  MAISCH said  a permit  is not  needed to  use a  firearm but                                                               
anything  that can  start a  fire could  be considered  under the                                                               
statute. The purpose of the broad  statute is to prevent the risk                                                               
to public safety that occurs with such ignition devices.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI maintained  that the  bill would  require a                                                               
permit to use a firearm.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
He said  he would support  the amendment because the  language in                                                               
Section 7 is far too broad at this point.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
2:35:35 PM                                                                                                                    
At ease                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:35:40 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR  COGHILL   reconvened  the   meeting  and   maintained  his                                                               
objection to Amendment  3. His understanding is  that the broader                                                               
language would only be used during imminent fire danger.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI said  this would apply to  all forested land                                                               
(including lawns) during fire season, which is overbroad.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR COGHILL asked for a roll call.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
2:36:57 PM                                                                                                                    
A roll  call vote  was taken.  Senators Wielechowski,  Kelly, and                                                               
Shower voted  in favor of  Amendment 3 and Senators  Costello and                                                               
Coghill voted against it. Therefore,  Amendment 3 passed by a 3:2                                                               
vote.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
2:37:39 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR SHOWER moved Amendment 4, LS-301382\O.19.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
                                                30-LS1382\O.19                                                                  
                                                      Radford                                                                   
                                                      4/17/18                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
                          AMENDMENT 4                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
    OFFERED IN THE SENATE                 BY SENATOR SHOWER                                                                     
          TO: CSHB 355(JUD)                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Page 6, following line 16:                                                                                                 
          Insert a new bill section to read:                                                                                    
      "* Sec. 21. AS 41.15.950 is amended by adding a new                                                                   
     subsection to read:                                                                                                        
             (c)  A person is not required under this                                                                           
          section to disclose a deadly weapon under                                                                             
          AS 11.61.220(a)(1)(A)    to   a    peace   officer                                                                    
          described under (a)(1) of this section."                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
     Renumber the following bill sections accordingly.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     Page 7, line 2:                                                                                                            
          Delete "sec. 21"                                                                                                      
          Insert "sec. 22"                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     Page 7, line 3:                                                                                                            
          Delete "sec. 21" in both places                                                                                       
          Insert "sec. 22" in both places                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     Page 7, line 4:                                                                                                            
          Delete "Sections 23 and 24"                                                                                           
          Insert "Sections 24 and 25"                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     Page 7, line 5:                                                                                                            
          Delete "sec. 25"                                                                                                      
          Insert "sec. 26"                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR COGHILL objected.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR SHOWER explained that the  amendment is intended to avoid                                                               
potential conflicts  between firemen who are  not law enforcement                                                               
and citizens who are armed and do not have the duty to disclose.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR COGHILL  asked Ms.  Salanguit if the  sponsor had  seen the                                                               
proposed amendment.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
MS. SALANGUIT said  yes and the Department of Law  could speak to                                                               
it.                                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
2:40:00 PM                                                                                                                    
AARON  PETERSON, Assistant  Attorney General,  Office of  Special                                                               
Prosecutions,  Criminal Division,  Department of  Law, Anchorage,                                                               
Alaska,  said  the  way  it  stands   now  is  that  there  is  a                                                               
reasonableness   requirement  that   the  person   who  knowingly                                                               
possesses  a  concealed  firearm  is  reckless  that  the  person                                                               
contacting them is  a peace officer. Under the  circumstance of a                                                               
fireman who is  dressed in a lime green uniform,  it would not be                                                               
reckless to be unaware that a fireman is a peace officer.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI  asked if  this  refers  to Sec.  11.61.220                                                               
(a)(1)(A) which is  the affirmative duty to disclose  to a police                                                               
officer that you have a firearm.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MR. PETERSON said yes.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI  asked  if  he agrees  that  the  amendment                                                               
clarifies that  an individual does  not have an  affirmative duty                                                               
to disclose to a peace officer  that they have a firearm in their                                                               
possession.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MR. PETERSON  confirmed that the  amendment would codify  that an                                                               
individual  would never  have the  duty to  disclose a  concealed                                                               
firearm, even  if the fire  prevention officer (FPO)  was dressed                                                               
as a peace officer.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
2:43:54 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR SHOWER said  the amendment tries to clarify  that for the                                                               
purpose   of  enforcing   this   chapter.  Sec.   41.15.950(a)(1)                                                               
identifies  an  employee  of  the   department  or  other  person                                                               
authorized by  the commissioner as  peace officers of  the state,                                                               
regardless of their dress.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR COGHILL asked Mr. Peterson if he had a comment.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR.  PETERSON  said   no;  he  understands  the   intent  of  the                                                               
amendment.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI  said his question  was who is defined  as a                                                               
peace officer and Sec. 41.15.950(a) appears to be fairly broad.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MR.  PETERSON  said  there  are  numerous  definitions  of  peace                                                               
officer throughout the  statutes, but the definition  in Title 41                                                               
is for the purpose of enforcing Title 41.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
2:45:33 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR SHOWER withdrew Amendment 4.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
2:45:56 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR COGHILL held HB 355 in committee.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                

Document Name Date/Time Subjects
SB 81 - Sectional Summary (ver. D).pdf SJUD 4/18/2018 1:30:00 PM
SB 81
SB 81 - Summary of Changes (ver. A to ver. D).pdf SJUD 4/18/2018 1:30:00 PM
SB 81
SB 81 - Governor Transmittal Letter.pdf SJUD 4/18/2018 1:30:00 PM
SB 81
SB 81 - Supporting Document - FAQs.pdf SJUD 4/18/2018 1:30:00 PM
SB 81
HB 208 - Additional Letters of Support and Opposition.pdf SJUD 4/18/2018 1:30:00 PM
HB 208
HB 208 - Additional Letters.pdf SJUD 4/18/2018 1:30:00 PM
HB 208
CS to HB 355 - Version U.pdf SJUD 4/18/2018 1:30:00 PM
HB 355
HB 355 - Explanation of Changes (ver. O to ver. U).pdf SJUD 4/18/2018 1:30:00 PM
HB 355
HB 208 - Letter - UA Foundation.pdf SJUD 4/18/2018 1:30:00 PM
HB 208
Legal Memo HB 208.pdf SJUD 4/18/2018 1:30:00 PM
HB 208
HB 355 - Shower Amendment O.18.pdf SJUD 4/18/2018 1:30:00 PM
HB 355
HB 355 - Shower Amendment O.17.pdf SJUD 4/18/2018 1:30:00 PM
HB 355
HB 355 - Shower Amendment O.16.pdf SJUD 4/18/2018 1:30:00 PM
HB 355
HB 355 - Shower Amendment O.19.pdf SJUD 4/18/2018 1:30:00 PM
HB 355
HB 355 - Shower Amendment O.24.pdf SJUD 4/18/2018 1:30:00 PM
HB 355
HB 355 - Shower Amendment O.21.pdf SJUD 4/18/2018 1:30:00 PM
HB 355