Legislature(2017 - 2018)GRUENBERG 120

02/07/2017 03:00 PM House STATE AFFAIRS

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Moved HB 31 Out of Committee
Heard & Held
-- Public Testimony --
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
        HB 74-DRIVER'S LICENSE & ID CARDS & REAL ID ACT                                                                     
3:17:30 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR KREISS-TOMKINS  announced that the final  order of business                                                               
would  be   HOUSE  BILL   NO.  74,  "An   Act  relating   to  the                                                               
implementation of the  federal REAL ID Act of  2005; and relating                                                               
to issuance  of identification cards  and driver's  licenses; and                                                               
providing for an effective date."                                                                                               
3:20:03 PM                                                                                                                    
LESLIE RIDLE,  Deputy Commissioner, Department  of Administration                                                               
(DOA),  presented HB  74 on  behalf of  the House  Rules Standing                                                               
Committee, sponsor,  by request of  the governor.   She presented                                                               
with  the  use  of  a  PowerPoint  presentation,  titled  "HB  74                                                               
Driver's  Licenses and  ID Cards  and REAL  ID Act."   Ms.  Ridle                                                               
started with  Slide 1, titled  "Federal REAL ID Act,"  and stated                                                               
that in 2005  Congress enacted the REAL ID Act,  which applies to                                                               
all  states, the  five  territories, and  Washington,  D.C.   She                                                               
relayed that  it requires states  to offer a driver's  license or                                                               
identification (ID)  that verifies a person's  identification and                                                               
lawful  status.   She added  that the  card must  have a  digital                                                               
photo,  a signature,  and  a  unique number.    The Act  requires                                                               
states to check  certain databases to verify the  identity of the                                                               
person applying  for the card.   She said if the  state offers an                                                               
ID that  is not  a REAL ID,  then the ID  must be  clearly marked                                                               
either  "REAL  ID compliant"  or  "REAL  ID noncompliant."    She                                                               
explained that  when she  refers to REAL  ID, she  means driver's                                                               
license or ID.                                                                                                                  
MS. RIDLE offered  that HB 74 would allow the  State of Alaska to                                                               
comply with  the federal law  and would allow Alaskans  to choose                                                               
either a compliant ID or a  noncompliant ID.  She said the choice                                                               
would be  totally up  to the  customer at  the time  of purchase.                                                               
She indicated that the federal  government has given the State of                                                               
Alaska an extension for complying with  the REAL ID Act till June                                                               
6, 2017.   She mentioned  that the  extension will expire  if the                                                               
State  of  Alaska has  not  made  any  progress in  changing  its                                                               
current law to allow a REAL ID.                                                                                                 
MS. RIDLE referred to Slide 2,  titled "Federal REAL ID Act," and                                                               
noted the  five states that  are not  compliant with the  REAL ID                                                               
Act - Washington,  Montana, Minnesota, Missouri, and  Maine.  She                                                               
mentioned that Washington  and Minnesota offer what  is called an                                                               
"enhanced  license."   This  is  a  license that  allows  license                                                               
holders to  cross borders; it  has a  chip; and it  is "enhanced"                                                               
beyond the regular ID.                                                                                                          
3:22:38 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE WOOL  asked if  an enhanced  ID is  compliant with                                                               
the REAL  ID Act and would  allow someone to get  onto a military                                                               
base in Alaska.                                                                                                                 
MS.  RIDLE  responded  yes.    She added  that  the  enhanced  ID                                                               
requires extra information,  similar to what is  required for the                                                               
REAL ID.  She said it also has  a chip in it, similar to the chip                                                               
in a passport.   She said DOA  could offer an enhanced  ID with a                                                               
chip, but it would cost more  money to issue compared with a REAL                                                               
ID.  She asserted that the enhanced ID was more labor-intensive.                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE WOOL asked if the  REAL ID and the noncompliant ID                                                               
would be noticeably different, and  how people would become aware                                                               
that they needed the ID.                                                                                                        
MS. RIDLE answered that the IDs  would be clearly different.  The                                                               
REAL ID  has to be marked  as a REAL  ID to comply with  the Act.                                                               
She said that the U.S.  Department of Homeland Security (DHS) has                                                               
already  started  to publicize  the  issue  at airports,  on  the                                                               
internet, and  through advertisements.   She offered that  if the                                                               
State of Alaska  chooses not to "go down the  REAL ID route," DOA                                                               
will need to then  advertise, as well.  She said  that as of now,                                                               
DOA is not  engaged in publicity, as it is  the responsibility of                                                               
the Transportation Security Administration (TSA) and DHS.                                                                       
3:25:13 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX asked  what would happen if HB  74 does not                                                               
become law.                                                                                                                     
MS. RIDLE stated that DHS has  told DOA that Alaska will lose its                                                               
waiver on  June 6,  2017.   She said  that the  first consequence                                                               
would be that Alaskans would  be asked to provide alternate forms                                                               
of ID  to get onto a  military base.   She cited some of  the IDs                                                               
that  would be  suitable:   passport,  enhanced  ID from  another                                                               
state,  REAL ID  from  another  state, and  military  card.   She                                                               
referred to Slide 8, titled  "Timeline," and said that on January                                                               
22,  2018, TSA  will ask  for more  ID at  TSA checkpoints.   She                                                               
stated that  on October 1,  2020, a REAL  ID will be  required by                                                               
the U.S. government in order to fly.                                                                                            
3:26:36 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR  KREISS-TOMKINS  asked  what   would  be  the  "real  world                                                               
experience"  of  an Alaskan  with  a  noncompliant  ID at  a  TSA                                                               
security  checkpoint, if  Alaska  has not  passed legislation  by                                                               
January 22, 2018.                                                                                                               
MS. RIDLE said TSA will ask for  alternate IDs.  She said TSA has                                                               
not  been specific  but  has given  some  indication of  approved                                                               
alternate  IDs:   immigration card,  military ID,  transportation                                                               
worker  card,  passport,  passport  card,  veterans  ID,  trusted                                                               
travel's card,  and travel  card.  She  confirmed that  there are                                                               
other  types of  federal IDs  that TSA  will accept;  however, by                                                               
October 1,  2020, TSA  will not accept  these alternatives.   She                                                               
clarified that TSA will accept a federal ID, such as a passport.                                                                
3:28:13 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE  BIRCH   expressed  that  his   constituents  have                                                               
concerns related  to the issues  of privacy as well  as inclusion                                                               
in a  database.   He asked  what the  distinction is  between the                                                               
database Ms.  Ridle described, used  for verifying  identity, and                                                               
the one used  by law enforcement during a traffic  stop in Alaska                                                               
or in any other  state.  He asked if the fear  of loss of privacy                                                               
is founded.                                                                                                                     
MS. RIDLE  referred to  Slide 4, titled  "What Will  Change," and                                                               
stated  that  driver's  license  data would  stay  in  the  state                                                               
database.  She  explained that REAL ID would allow  DOA to access                                                               
databases that  already exist, such  as the passport  database or                                                               
the  birth  certificate  database,   to  verify  identity.    She                                                               
explained that currently DOA is  unable to access those databases                                                               
without the technology [to process REAL ID].                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE BIRCH  asked for  confirmation that REAL  ID would                                                               
permit DOA access  to information such as  birth certificates and                                                               
passports, not  available through the driver's  license database.                                                               
He opined  that HB 74  would be  a good initiative  and important                                                               
for people needing to get onto a military base.                                                                                 
3:31:36 PM                                                                                                                    
MS. RIDLE  referred to Slide  3, titled "HB 74  Driver's License,                                                               
State  IDs,  REAL ID  Act,"  and  said  that  HB 74  would  allow                                                               
Alaskans  the choice  of a  compliant  or noncompliant  ID.   She                                                               
mentioned  that HB  74  would  also give  the  Division of  Motor                                                               
Vehicles (DMV)  the authority  to spend  money to  implement REAL                                                               
ID.    She asserted  that  Senate  Bill  202, passed  during  the                                                               
Twenty-Fifth  Alaska State  Legislature,  2007-2008, stated  that                                                               
DMV could not  spend money on implementing REAL ID,  which is why                                                               
DOA has  been unable to  build the technology allowing  access to                                                               
the databases.   She added that  HB 74 would allow  DMV to charge                                                               
an additional five dollars for the  REAL ID to recoup some of the                                                               
MS. RIDLE  directed the committee's  attention to the  right side                                                               
of  Slide 3  and summarized:   DMV  is currently  not allowed  to                                                               
spend money  to implement REAL  ID; without the REAL  ID Alaskans                                                               
will not be  able to get onto  military bases or fly  with just a                                                               
driver's license; and the REAL ID  Act was passed in 2005 to help                                                               
prevent  identity  theft.    She asserted  that  the  checks  and                                                               
balances  implemented through  the  REAL ID  Act  would help  DMV                                                               
prevent identity fraud.                                                                                                         
MS. RIDLE returned to Slide  4 to continue describing the changes                                                               
that would  be instituted under  HB 74.   She said that  a person                                                               
getting a  driver's license would  have his/her  photograph taken                                                               
at the  beginning of the process  and at the end,  to prevent any                                                               
trickery or false identification.   She stated DMV would validate                                                               
the birthdate  and passport information  through the  "reach out"                                                               
databases  she  mentioned; REAL  ID  cards  would have  a  unique                                                               
design; noncompliant  ID cards would  be clearly marked  that the                                                               
ID is not for entering  federal places; driver's licenses and IDs                                                               
would be valid  for eight years instead of five  years; and there                                                               
would be an additional charge.                                                                                                  
3:34:23 PM                                                                                                                    
MS. RIDLE continued  her presentation with Slide  5, titled "What                                                               
Won't  Change."   She  said  DMV  would  still require  the  same                                                               
documents  for getting  a driver's  license -  a Social  Security                                                               
card,  a  birth certificate,  a  passport,  or other  identifying                                                               
document.   She mentioned that  DMV would continue  to background                                                               
check its employees.  She relayed  that DMV would continue to use                                                               
a  secure facility  to print  the driver's  licenses.   She added                                                               
that  there  is  no  facility  in Alaska  that  can  produce  the                                                               
driver's licenses that would be needed.                                                                                         
3:36:18 PM                                                                                                                    
MS.  RIDLE referred  to Slide  7, titled  "What is  Required From                                                               
Alaskans,"  and  said  that  when  a person  is  applying  for  a                                                               
driver's license for  the first time, DMV would ask  for the same                                                               
documents it currently  requires as proof of  identity for either                                                               
a compliant  or noncompliant driver's  license.  She  stated that                                                               
these documents  include a  Social Security  card, a  passport, a                                                               
birth certificate, and a tribal card.                                                                                           
MS.  RIDLE went  on  to  Slide 9,  titled  "REAL  ID -  Accessing                                                               
Military  Bases," and  said that  before Alaska  got its  waiver,                                                               
there were a  couple of weeks last fall during  which DHS was not                                                               
going to  give Alaska any more  waivers if no [REAL  ID] bill was                                                               
introduced.   She claimed  that Alaska was  given a  waiver until                                                               
June  6, 2017,  because the  State  of Alaska  indicated that  it                                                               
would introduce  a [REAL  ID] bill.   She  said that  during that                                                               
period of time, the military  bases informed people that an extra                                                               
ID  would be  needed  to get  on  base.   She  attested that  DOA                                                               
started   getting   phone   calls  immediately   from   concerned                                                               
individuals  and  groups.    She  reported  that  there  are  new                                                               
projects on bases; people needing to  get onto bases are not just                                                               
military employees  but include state workers  and civilians; the                                                               
Anchorage  School  District has  four  schools  on base  and  two                                                               
departments;  students  travel onto  bases  for  sports; and  the                                                               
Fairbanks  North Star  Borough  School District  (FNSB) also  has                                                               
students on base.   She went on  to say that if  Alaska loses its                                                               
waiver in June,  the scenario last fall will  repeat itself, with                                                               
military bases requiring an extra ID.                                                                                           
MS.  RIDLE referred  to  Slide  10, titled  "REAL  ID -  Possible                                                               
alternative documents," to point out  the list of alternative IDs                                                               
for  entering a  military  base.   She  added  that  some of  the                                                               
callers  asked about  using a  passport  to get  onto a  military                                                               
base.  She agreed that a  passport could be used but offered that                                                               
at a  cost of $125,  requiring school district personnel  and all                                                               
the workers doing business on  base to have passports constituted                                                               
a hurdle.                                                                                                                       
3:39:32 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE  WOOL asked  how long  a current  driver's license                                                               
MS. RIDLE replied, "Five years."                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE WOOL  said his  recollection is  that in  the past                                                               
when  his  driver's  license  expired, he  only  needed  his  old                                                               
license to  renew.  He  mentioned that he doesn't  recall showing                                                               
DMV additional documents.                                                                                                       
MS.  RIDLE stated  that  it is  only  the first  time  you get  a                                                               
driver's license that you need the additional IDs.                                                                              
3:41:03 PM                                                                                                                    
MARLA  THOMPSON,  Director,  Division of  Motor  Vehicles  (DMV),                                                               
Department of  Administration (DOA), said  that the first  time a                                                               
person applied  for a REAL  ID, DMV would require  the additional                                                               
documentation, but it would not be needed for renewal.                                                                          
REPRESENTATIVE  WOOL  asked  if   other  states  are  doing  this                                                               
"duality of IDs" - compliant and noncompliant.                                                                                  
MS. RIDLE stated  there are at least a couple  of states that are                                                               
doing IDs this way,  so that Alaska would not be  the first.  She                                                               
asserted that this method was  suggested by DHS as an alternative                                                               
for states "not wanting to accept it right away."                                                                               
REPRESENTATIVE WOOL  asked if Ms.  Ridle anticipated the  REAL ID                                                               
becoming the standard and, eventually,  the noncompliant ID would                                                               
not even  be available.   He asked  for confirmation  that Alaska                                                               
data would not  actually be uploaded to a  national database, but                                                               
DMV would have access to national data.                                                                                         
MS. RIDLE  said that  if HB  74 becomes  law, DMV  would probably                                                               
always offer the noncompliant ID unless  the law is changed.  She                                                               
said that based  on information from other  states, she estimates                                                               
about 50 percent of people  renewing their driver's license would                                                               
get the REAL ID.  She added that number may increase over time.                                                                 
REPRESENTATIVE WOOL  commented that since Alaska  is so dependent                                                               
on  plane transportation,  the  need  for a  REAL  ID is  "pretty                                                               
3:43:09 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX  noted there were five  states that haven't                                                               
complied with REAL ID, and two  of the five offered enhanced IDs.                                                               
She asked  about the three  remaining states - which  states they                                                               
were and what they were doing about this issue.                                                                                 
MS. RIDLE  referred back  to Slide 2  and answered  that Montana,                                                               
Missouri, and  Maine are  noncompliant and  do not  have enhanced                                                               
IDs.   She  acknowledged  that in  those  states, residents  must                                                               
provide additional IDs to get onto military bases and to fly.                                                                   
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX asked if those states have waivers.                                                                       
MS. RIDLE  responded no, the  five states [who have  not complied                                                               
with REAL  ID] do not have  waivers.  She relayed  that there are                                                               
26 states that  offer a REAL ID and 19  states, including Alaska,                                                               
with waivers.                                                                                                                   
REPRESENTATIVE  LEDOUX  asked  if  the authorities  in  the  five                                                               
states have  been contacted  "to see how  things are  working out                                                               
MS.  RIDLE responded  that  she  has not  done  that,  but it  is                                                               
something DOA  could do.   She added that  she has talked  to the                                                               
Department  of  Military  & Veterans'  Affairs  (DMVA),  who  has                                                               
counterparts in other states, and found  it to be an issue in the                                                               
five  noncompliant  states.   She  attested  that  residents  are                                                               
required  to show  additional identification,  and  some of  them                                                               
find that inconvenient.                                                                                                         
3:44:58 PM                                                                                                                    
ROBERT  DOEHL,  Deputy  Commissioner, Department  of  Military  &                                                               
Veterans' Affairs (DMVA), responded  that DMVA is still gathering                                                               
quantitative  information,  but  has  learned  anecdotally  about                                                               
incidents that have  occurred.  He reported an  incident in which                                                               
a military base  required a Minnesota resident, who  did not have                                                               
an  enhanced ID,  be escorted  while on  base by  someone with  a                                                               
military ID.  He added that  without being able to verify his/her                                                               
ID, the  visitor was treated  like a  foreign national.   He said                                                               
such a  practice would be  difficult for ordinary  vendors coming                                                               
on base.                                                                                                                        
3:46:10 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE BIRCH asked which  school district personnel would                                                               
be impacted by the requirement for REAL IDs on military bases.                                                                  
MS. RIDLE responded those impacted  would be teachers, school bus                                                               
drivers,  custodians, coaches,  school volunteers,  and those  in                                                               
the two  school district  departments on  base -  the information                                                               
technology (IT) department and the fine arts department.                                                                        
REPRESENTATIVE BIRCH offered that the  impact is not just limited                                                               
to  school  district  personnel.   He  relayed  that  the  Alaska                                                               
Trucking Association (ATA)  is very concerned.   He conceded that                                                               
in  Anchorage it  is a  small issue,  because many  of the  truck                                                               
drivers  have  Transportation  Worker  Identification  Credential                                                               
(TWIC) cards,  which allow them  in and out of  ports; therefore,                                                               
they already have some of  the qualifications necessary to access                                                               
military bases.   He offered  that people in Fairbanks  and other                                                               
regions with military installations are  "really going to be in a                                                               
tangle down the road," if they are not able to get REAL IDs.                                                                    
MS. RIDLE  agreed and said  that there  are quite a  few civilian                                                               
businesses on base;  people are coming and  going for restaurants                                                               
and  truckers and movers come  on base who are not represented by                                                               
ATA  and  do  not  have  TWIC  cards.    She  conceded  there  is                                                               
"definitely a lot of movement back and forth."                                                                                  
3:48:28 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE TUCK asked why it  would be necessary for a person                                                               
to  resubmit information  to obtain  an  ID in  the first  place,                                                               
since the  documents needed  to verify  one's identity  would not                                                               
change.    He  referred  to   Slide  7  and  mentioned  that  the                                                               
requirements for  the three IDs  are the same.   He asked  what a                                                               
person would  need to submit  for a  REAL ID that  hadn't already                                                               
been submitted for a new driver's license.                                                                                      
MS. RIDLE  explained that  if someone  is getting  a noncompliant                                                               
license  as  a  renewal,  he/she  would  not  need  the  "proving                                                               
documents."   However, if someone  is getting  a REAL ID  for the                                                               
first  time,  part of  the  REAL  ID  requirements are  that  DMV                                                               
verifies the person's identity using the databases.                                                                             
REPRESENTATIVE  TUCK  referred  to   Slide  6,  titled  "REAL  ID                                                               
Process,"   and   noted   Social   Security   number   electronic                                                               
verification would be  through a government agency.   He asked if                                                               
the  Problem  Driver  Pointer  System (PDPS)  is  provided  by  a                                                               
government agency or a non-profit agency.                                                                                       
3:50:15 PM                                                                                                                    
MS. THOMPSON  said that PDPS  is a  system currently used  by DMV                                                               
and is  available to Alaska  through the American  Association of                                                               
Motor Vehicle  Administrators (AAMVA).   She explained  that PDPS                                                               
allows DMV in  Alaska to check with other states  for "points" on                                                               
a driver's record  to determine if a person is  eligible to get a                                                               
driver's license in Alaska.                                                                                                     
MS. THOMPSON, in  response to Representative Tuck,  said that DMV                                                               
has  been using  the PDPS  system for  more than  10 years.   She                                                               
added  that AAMVA  it is  a  tax-exempt, non-profit  organization                                                               
that helps develop models with  motor vehicle administrations and                                                               
law  enforcement throughout  the U.S.  and Canada.   She  relayed                                                               
that DMV  is a  member of  AAMVA.  She  offered that  AAMVA helps                                                               
states  work  together to  ensure  that  a  person has  only  one                                                               
driver's license,  and the person  getting a driver's  license is                                                               
permitted to have a license.                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE  TUCK  speculated  that   it  is  similar  to  the                                                               
Electronic  Registration Information  Center  (ERIC) program  for                                                               
voter ID.                                                                                                                       
MS. RIDLE  responded yes, that she  believes it to be  similar to                                                               
that program.   She noted  the definition  of AAMVA on  Slide 12,                                                               
titled "What is AAMVA."                                                                                                         
3:52:18 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE  TUCK referred  to information  in Slide  6, which                                                               
read:  "SPEX/CDLIS [State Pointer  Exchange Services / Commercial                                                               
Driver's License  Information System] -  State to State  - Verify                                                               
existence   of  license   and  id's   [sic]  from   other  states                                                               
electronically."  He  asked if this referred  to another division                                                               
similar to ERIC.                                                                                                                
MS.  RIDLE said  that SPEX/CDLIS  is  a bridge  that allows  DMV,                                                               
through AAMVA,  to do a quick  check to ensure a  person does not                                                               
have a driver's  license in another state.  She  added that it is                                                               
a federal law that a person can have only one driver's license.                                                                 
CHAIR  KREISS-TOMKINS  asked if  AAMVA  and  the databases  being                                                               
discussed  are identified  in  the  original federal  authorizing                                                               
legislation as  entities and databases  that must be  utilized in                                                               
the REAL ID process.                                                                                                            
3:53:41 PM                                                                                                                    
MS. THOMPSON  said yes, AAMVA  is mentioned  in the REAL  ID Act.                                                               
She said the  Act gives options for databases that  can be used -                                                               
CDLIS,  PDPS, Social  Security  Online  Verification (SSOLV),  or                                                               
State to  State -  to check  the validity  of the  documents that                                                               
have been presented.                                                                                                            
REPRESENTATIVE TUCK  offered his understanding that  PDPS, SSOLV,                                                               
and   SPEX/CDLIS  are   all  private,   non-profit  "data-basing"                                                               
companies.   He asked which of  the entities, listed on  Slide 6,                                                               
were federal government agencies.                                                                                               
MS.  RIDLE  responded that  the  entities  on  the list  are  not                                                               
companies but databases accessed through AAMVA.                                                                                 
MS.   THOMPSON   said   that   currently   AAMVA   supports   the                                                               
telecommunications  that  facilitate  communication with  all  of                                                               
these  databases.   She said  that the  U.S. Department  of State                                                               
(DOS) passport database  is a U.S. database.   She explained that                                                               
AAMVA has created a portal to  the databases for states to easily                                                               
connect  to them.   She  added  that without  AAMVA's portal,  50                                                               
different states  would have to  create their own portals  to the                                                               
databases.   She said that because  DMV in Alaska is  a member of                                                               
AAMVA, it benefits  from the facilitated access.   She added that                                                               
SSOLV is  a federal database.   She stated  that CDLIS is  also a                                                               
federal database  that is overseen  by the Federal  Motor Carrier                                                               
Safety   Administration  (FMCSA).     She   mentioned  that   the                                                               
Systematic Alien Verification for  Entitlements Program (SAVE) is                                                               
a DHS program.                                                                                                                  
CHAIR  KREISS-TOMKINS  asked  for  a  written  response  to  that                                                               
question for clarification.                                                                                                     
REPRESENTATIVE  TUCK offered  to  draft a  letter requesting  the                                                               
3:57:22 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE KNOPP asked why AS  44.99.040 was enacted, when it                                                               
was enacted,  and why the Twenty-Fifth  Alaska State Legislature,                                                               
2007-2008, passed legislation to prohibit  the use of state funds                                                               
to comply with REAL ID.                                                                                                         
REPRESENTATIVE  TUCK responded  that  as recently  as last  year,                                                               
people  had  a  problem  with  non-governmental  agencies  having                                                               
databases that  included civilians.   He referred to a  major DOA                                                               
data  breach involving  PricewaterhouseCoopers  (PwC).   He  also                                                               
mentioned  the state's  investigation of  Mercer [Consulting]  in                                                               
regard  to State  of Alaska  Public Employees'  Retirement System                                                               
(PERS) and the State of  Alaska Teachers' Retirement System (TRS)                                                               
data.   He stated the  concern is for  being able to  contain and                                                               
protect  confidential information  on Alaska  residents and  U.S.                                                               
CHAIR  KREISS-TOMKINS  concurred  that  cyber  security  and  the                                                               
protection  of  digital  data  is  increasingly  important.    He                                                               
offered  that in  the DOA  overview [in  the House  State Affairs                                                               
Standing  Committee meeting  of  01/26/17], Commissioner  Sheldon                                                               
Fisher  mentioned  the first-ever  hire  of  a chief  information                                                               
officer (CIO).  Representative Kreiss-Tomkins  noted that the new                                                               
CIO  was  "impressively credentialed"  in  the  subject of  cyber                                                               
3:59:15 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE WOOL asked if government  data systems and private                                                               
data  systems   were  equally   susceptible  to   cyber  security                                                               
MS. RIDLE confirmed  the hire of a new CIO,  who will be focusing                                                               
on  cyber security.    She  offered her  belief  that public  and                                                               
private   databases  are   always  open   to  hacking   and  need                                                               
REPRESENTATIVE WOOL  referred to  the flow chart  on Slide  6 and                                                               
said  he suspects  that  the process  refers to  a  brand new  ID                                                               
because it mentions  driver's license tests.  He  asked about the                                                               
process for  someone who already  has a  driver's license:   if a                                                               
passport  is required  for a  REAL  ID or  if it  is an  optional                                                               
secondary ID.                                                                                                                   
MS.  RIDLE responded  that if  a person  had a  driver's license,                                                               
he/she  would  not  need  to  retake the  driver's  tests.    She                                                               
confirmed  that the  flow  chart  was for  the  person needing  a                                                               
driver's license for the first time.   She said that the passport                                                               
is  just   one  of   the  documents  that   could  be   used  for                                                               
REPRESENTATIVE WOOL  restated that  a person who  wants to  get a                                                               
REAL ID would need a primary  and secondary ID, a Social Security                                                               
card, and  proof of residency.   He asked  how many pieces  of ID                                                               
with an  actual photograph  would be required,  in addition  to a                                                               
current driver's license.                                                                                                       
4:02:09 PM                                                                                                                    
MS. THOMPSON replied  that DMV would require  a driver's license,                                                               
which would  have the person's  photograph; the  primary document                                                               
could  be a  birth  certificate,  a passport,  a  green card,  or                                                               
anything  from the  list on  the  flow chart;  and the  secondary                                                               
document could be one's Social  Security card or another document                                                               
on the list.                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE  WOOL mentioned  that proof  of a  Social Security                                                               
number is required,  but the Social Security card is  listed as a                                                               
secondary document.  He suggested  that it might be difficult for                                                               
someone to  locate his/her  Social Security  card and  asked "How                                                               
many government agencies am I going to  have to go to, to get IDs                                                               
to go  to the DMV to  get my REAL ID?"   He added that  he didn't                                                               
readily see a listing of all of the possible IDs.                                                                               
MS.  RIDLE said  that some  of the  IDs are  listed on  Slide 10;                                                               
however,  she conceded  that DOA  could do  a better  job in  its                                                               
presentation  by making  a better  list.   She answered  that the                                                               
process may seem  cumbersome and may deter people  from getting a                                                               
REAL  ID  at   first.    She  added  that  at   some  point,  the                                                               
inconveniences of not having a REAL ID may reverse that.                                                                        
REPRESENTATIVE  WOOL   pointed  out  that  Slide   10  lists  IDs                                                               
acceptable for entering a military  base but not those needed for                                                               
DMV.  He added that many people wouldn't have the IDs listed.                                                                   
4:04:52 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR  KREISS-TOMKINS asked  what [form  of ID]  a resident  of a                                                               
noncompliant state, such as Montana,  would need to get through a                                                               
TSA checkpoint.                                                                                                                 
MS.  RIDLE  answered  that  for   the  noncompliant  states,  the                                                               
restriction  currently only  applies to  entering military  bases                                                               
and federal  facilities.   She added that  not until  January 22,                                                               
2018,  would   a  resident  of   a  noncompliant  state   face  a                                                               
restriction for air travel.                                                                                                     
CHAIR KREISS-TOMKINS  asked if a  resident of Montana  would have                                                               
to  present a  passport, military  ID, or  other alternative  ID,                                                               
mentioned on  Slide 10, to get  through a TSA checkpoint,  if the                                                               
Montana legislature did not act by January 23, 2018.                                                                            
MS. RIDLE answered yes, that is DHS's current policy.                                                                           
4:06:24 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE  LEDOUX  asked  if  the  purpose  of  the  federal                                                               
government requiring the REAL ID is to prevent identity fraud.                                                                  
MS.  RIDLE speculated  that  the requirement  was  partly due  to                                                               
identity fraud and partly in response to DHS legislation.                                                                       
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX  opined that having  everyone's information                                                               
in a database makes identity fraud more likely.                                                                                 
MS. RIDLE reiterated that a  person's information already resides                                                               
in  the databases  listed  on the  flow chart,  and  the REAL  ID                                                               
process would not create a new  database.  She emphasized that no                                                               
Alaska data would be sent out of  state.  She said that any other                                                               
state  wanting to  check on  an Alaskan's  driver's license  must                                                               
come through  the "bridge"  and have  specific credentials  to do                                                               
so, such  as being a  DMV from another  state.  She  offered that                                                               
the other state's  DMV would have enough  information that Alaska                                                               
DMV  can respond  "yes or  no, you  do or  don't have  a driver's                                                               
license."   She reiterated that  Alaska DMV would not  be opening                                                               
its database to any other entity.                                                                                               
REPRESENTATIVE  LEDOUX  asked  if  AAMVA  would  have  access  to                                                               
Alaska's database.                                                                                                              
MS. RIDLE  said AAMVA would not  have access:  AAMVA  houses "the                                                               
bridge";  requests  for  information  would come  to  AAMVA  from                                                               
another  state; and  the information  would go  back through  the                                                               
bridge  to the  requesting state.    She attested  that the  data                                                               
would not "live" in AAMVA.                                                                                                      
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX said  that as someone who has  to renew her                                                               
credit card at least once a  year, usually around May, because of                                                               
a credit  card database  breach, she  is uncomfortable  with this                                                               
requirement.   She added, "And yet,  at the same time  you got to                                                               
be able to fly."                                                                                                                
4:09:36 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR  KREISS-TOMKINS   expressed  his  sympathy  for   "the  DOA                                                               
delegation" as  being merely the messengers  conveying the wishes                                                               
of the federal government as enacted in 2005.                                                                                   
REPRESENTATIVE  KNOPP   opined  that  the  REAL   ID  Act  seemed                                                               
redundant, as  it does exactly what  the TWIC was designed  to do                                                               
for access  to airports,  harbors, and  military facilities.   He                                                               
relayed  an instance  in  which he  went  to a  dock  to pick  up                                                               
equipment and  was required to  show a driver's  license, because                                                               
the TWIC was not acceptable.                                                                                                    
MS. THOMPSON  responded that the TWIC  may work as an  ID, but it                                                               
is not a license to drive.                                                                                                      
REPRESENTATIVE  KNOPP   mentioned  that  it  obviously   isn't  a                                                               
driver's  license but  is transportation  worker's identification                                                               
card for access  to the facilities he listed.   He said he didn't                                                               
see how the  "REAL ID driver's license scenario  is any different                                                               
than  what we  have  in  place."   He  expressed  that he  shared                                                               
Representative LeDoux's concerns about data security.                                                                           
4:12:12 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE  TUCK said  the real  question  is:   "Why are  we                                                               
doing this?"   He  said the federal  government is  imposing huge                                                               
requirements impacting  our private lifestyles.   He offered that                                                               
he  has problems  with this  database and  has even  had problems                                                               
with voter  ID, which is making  it harder for rural  Alaskans to                                                               
vote.  He  asserted that many elderly Native  Alaskans don't have                                                               
the  identification necessary  to meet  the requirements  to vote                                                               
and "now  we're going to tell  them that they can't  travel."  He                                                               
claimed, "It's a huge federal overreach."                                                                                       
REPRESENTATIVE  TUCK mentioned  that in  the past,  DMV stored  a                                                               
hard copy  of one's  driver's license  in a  vault in  the Alaska                                                               
State Troopers'  barracks in Fairbanks,  and no one would  try to                                                               
break into  those barracks  for identify theft.   He  opined that                                                               
through  the REAL  ID Act,  identity theft  would be  easier, not                                                               
harder.   He  asserted that  he  has always  been concerned  with                                                               
DMV's  process for  securing ID  cards:   sending  identification                                                               
information to  Indiana and waiting 30  days for the cards  to be                                                               
manufactured and returned to Alaska.   He said he witnessed a man                                                               
at a TSA checkpoint being  subject to invasive procedures because                                                               
his paper ID was inadequate.                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE TUCK  related that  former Governor  Sarah Palin's                                                               
administration  spent   considerable  money   on  finger-printing                                                               
equipment to  comply with  the REAL ID  Act, but  the legislature                                                               
"changed that"  and the former  director of  DMV is no  longer in                                                               
that position.   He said, "I  think a better approach  is to have                                                               
the  federal government  not  be so  paranoid  about the  average                                                               
resident of  Alaska, the  average civilian in  America ...."   He                                                               
expressed  his  concern with  HB  74,  with protecting  Alaskans'                                                               
rights  and their  privacy, and  with more  federal control.   He                                                               
added  that he  has never  understood  the need  to have  Alaskan                                                               
driver's  licenses  manufactured  in  Indiana, nor  has  he  ever                                                               
received proof  or numbers of  fraudulent driver's licenses.   He                                                               
said he understands  that the IDs made in Indiana  are 90 percent                                                               
federally  funded,  but asserted  that  the  Alaska DMV  has  the                                                               
ability to create the holograms  needed and the ability to verify                                                               
identification.  He opined that  the federal government now wants                                                               
more  control   and  is  using  other   agencies  to  cross-check                                                               
4:15:56 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR KREISS-TOMKINS asked if the  process of obtaining a REAL ID                                                               
would  be  similar  to  the  process  of  obtaining  a  passport:                                                               
submitting information to DMV and receiving the ID in the mail.                                                                 
MS.  RIDLE said  that  the  REAL ID  would  not  function like  a                                                               
passport in that  you could not enter a foreign  country with it.                                                               
She  said  that one  would  get  the REAL  ID  in  the mail  from                                                               
Indiana.   She  offered that  she totally  understands the  angst                                                               
about  REAL ID;  the legislature  passed Senate  Bill 202  with a                                                               
vote  of  59 to  1;  and  she  herself  has concerns  about  data                                                               
[security].    She asserted  that HB  74 was introduced  to offer                                                               
Alaskans the  choice of  whether or  not to  get a  compliant ID.                                                               
She offered  that DOA is trying  to strike a balance  with HB 74.                                                               
She reiterated  that come 2020,  people without the  necessary ID                                                               
to fly, may ask why DOA didn't inform them or do something.                                                                     
CHAIR KREISS-TOMKINS asked what determined  the number of years a                                                               
driver's license is in effect.                                                                                                  
MS.  THOMPSON  replied  that  under  current  state  statute  [AS                                                               
28.15.101],  IDs and  driver's licenses  are in  effect for  five                                                               
years.   She added that  a REAL ID would  be in effect  for eight                                                               
4:19:50 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE BIRCH opined  that HB 74 would  achieve a balance,                                                               
both for those concerned with  data breach and for commercial and                                                               
economic needs.  He noted  the considerable federal investment in                                                               
Alaskan and federal contractors, and he  opined that it is not an                                                               
unreasonable expectation  that Alaska conform to  security needs.                                                               
He asked  if there  would be  any new  information that  would be                                                               
"pushed  out"   online.    He  suggested   that  the  information                                                               
discussed is already readily available.                                                                                         
MS.  THOMPSON  responded that  DMV  would  not be  securing  more                                                               
information but  only verifying the  information provided  by the                                                               
customer.   She asserted  that DMV is  also concerned  about data                                                               
breach.  She added that the  information DMV would request is the                                                               
minimum necessary to verify a  person's identity and the validity                                                               
of the document.                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  BIRCH  expressed  his appreciation  for  HB  74's                                                               
innovative approach  offering a "double pathway"  and offered his                                                               
support for HB 74 to move forward in a timely manner.                                                                           
CHAIR KREISS-TOMKINS  stated that he  will not be  opening public                                                               
testimony on HB 74 in the present meeting.                                                                                      
4:23:42 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE  LEDOUX  asked if  the  federal  government has  a                                                               
compliant  ID, other  than a  passport.   She asked  if a  person                                                               
could  obtain  a federal  ID  that  was  less cumbersome  than  a                                                               
passport, if HB 74 does not pass.                                                                                               
MS. RIDLE  answered that she did  not think there was  an ID less                                                               
cumbersome than  a passport.  There  is no federal ID  card.  She                                                               
offered that for  a military ID or veteran ID,  one would need to                                                               
be in either one of those categories.                                                                                           
MS. THOMPSON  agreed there is  no other  federal ID other  than a                                                               
4:25:05 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE  WOOL mentioned  the passport  card, [included  on                                                               
the list of alternate documents on  slide 10], and he asked if it                                                               
was a condensed  version of a passport and could  be considered a                                                               
federal ID.                                                                                                                     
MS. RIDLE said  that one can obtain  a passport card:   it is $55                                                               
new, $35  to renew,  and lasts  10 years.   She said  that people                                                               
could  use passport  cards as  IDs, but  they are  more expensive                                                               
than the REAL ID card would be.                                                                                                 
REPRESENTATIVE  WOOL  asked if  the  data  is  the same  for  the                                                               
compliant  and   the  noncompliant   ID,  but  the   "bridge"  is                                                               
MS  RIDLE  said  Representative  Wool was  exactly  right.    She                                                               
explained  that the  data was  the same,  but DMV  could use  the                                                               
technology to  look in the  appropriate databases to  verify that                                                               
the  information  on  the  ID  matches  the  information  in  the                                                               
REPRESENTATIVE  WOOL  reiterated  that   the  difference  is  the                                                               
verification of  the information.   He offered  that with  just a                                                               
passport card, he would be able to travel anywhere.                                                                             
MS. RIDLE responded that was her understanding.                                                                                 
CHAIR KREISS-TOMKINS  offered that a  passport card is  only good                                                               
for getting into Canada and Mexico.                                                                                             
MS. THOMPSON  clarified that a  passport card also works  for the                                                               
Caribbean and  Bermuda.   She reiterated  that the  passport card                                                               
does not  work everywhere that  a regular passport does,  and one                                                               
would need both.                                                                                                                
4:28:32 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX  commented that although more  expensive, a                                                               
passport  card would  last 10  years rather  than 8  years.   She                                                               
opined that  "now that I  know that all you  have to do  is carry                                                               
this little  card with  you as  opposed to  a whole  passport ...                                                               
it's ceasing to  be quite as important to me  that this gets done                                                               
on the  state level."  She  added, "This leads to  my question of                                                               
how much is this going to cost the state to implement?"                                                                         
MS.  RIDLE responded  that  the fiscal  note for  HB  74 is  $1.5                                                               
million, which  represents the database  upgrades.  She  gave the                                                               
breakdown:    $400,000  for   the  integration  and  verification                                                               
programs;  $200,000  for  the  additional  design  and  security;                                                               
$500,000 for  the equipment for  statewide offices;  and $400,000                                                               
for development work for the printing and software templates.                                                                   
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX  asked if  there would  be costs  in future                                                               
years [for implementation of REAL ID].                                                                                          
MS. THOMPSON replied that the  $1.5 million is a one-time expense                                                               
for the  database and system  changes in order to  implement REAL                                                               
ID.  She said  that the cost of REAL ID  card production was just                                                               
under  $5 each;  therefore, the  fee for  the card  would be  [an                                                               
additional] $5.                                                                                                                 
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX asked for  clarification that a dual system                                                               
in future years would not cost the state any more money.                                                                        
MS. THOMPSON answered  that is correct.  She added  that the $1.5                                                               
million  constitutes a  set-up fee,  and  that expenditure  would                                                               
allow DMV  to have the dual  system - the REAL  ID compliant card                                                               
and the noncompliant card.                                                                                                      
[HB 74 was held over.]                                                                                                          

Document Name Date/Time Subjects
HB 74 Hearing Request.pdf HSTA 2/7/2017 3:00:00 PM
HB 74
HB 74 Sectional Analysis.pdf HSTA 2/7/2017 3:00:00 PM
HB 74
HB0074A.pdf HSTA 2/7/2017 3:00:00 PM
HB 74
HB 74 Fiscal Note MVA.pdf HSTA 2/7/2017 3:00:00 PM
HB 74
HB 74 Fiscal Note DOA.pdf HSTA 2/7/2017 3:00:00 PM
HB 74
HB74 Fiscal Note DPS.pdf HSTA 2/7/2017 3:00:00 PM
HB 74
HB 74 REAL ID Presentation FINAL.pdf HSTA 2/7/2017 3:00:00 PM
HB 74
HB074 Supporting Document Letter of Support 1.31.17.pdf HSTA 2/7/2017 3:00:00 PM
HB 74
HB074 Anchorage School District Ltr of Support for REAL ID Act Legislation 020317.pdf HSTA 2/7/2017 3:00:00 PM
HB 74
HB074 Letter of Support Teamsters Local 959 2.23.17.pdf HSTA 2/7/2017 3:00:00 PM
HB 74
HB 074 Letter of Support Alaska Dist Council of Laborers 2.24.pdf HSTA 2/7/2017 3:00:00 PM
HB 74
HB074 Letter of Support FNSBSD 2.24.17.pdf HSTA 2/7/2017 3:00:00 PM
HB 74