Legislature(2021 - 2022)BARNES 124

04/28/2021 01:00 PM RESOURCES

Note: the audio and video recordings are distinct records and are obtained from different sources. As such there may be key differences between the two. The audio recordings are captured by our records offices as the official record of the meeting and will have more accurate timestamps. Use the icons to switch between them.

Download Mp3. <- Right click and save file as

* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
-- Delayed to 10 Minutes Following Recess --
Heard & Held
Moved CSHB 98(RES) Out of Committee
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
        HB 171-PFAS USE & REMEDIATION; FIRE/WATER SAFETY                                                                    
2:01:54 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR PATKOTAK announced  that the final order  of business would                                                               
be HOUSE BILL  NO. 171, "An Act relating  to pollutants; relating                                                               
to  perfluoroalkyl and  polyfluoroalkyl  substances; relating  to                                                               
the  duties  of  the Department  of  Environmental  Conservation;                                                               
relating   to  firefighting   substances;  relating   to  thermal                                                               
remediation  of  perfluoroalkyl   and  polyfluoroalkyl  substance                                                               
contamination; and providing for an effective date."                                                                            
2:02:39 PM                                                                                                                    
TIM  CLARK,  Staff,  Representative  Sara  Hannan,  Alaska  State                                                               
Legislature, on  behalf of  Representative Hannan,  prime sponsor                                                               
of  HB 171,  noted that  the committee  packet included  the full                                                               
report  from   the  Michigan  Science  Advisory   Workgroup  with                                                               
methodology   for    setting   maximum   allowable    levels   of                                                               
perfluoroalkyl substances  (PFAS), as well  as the basis  for the                                                               
language  in HB  171 specifying  the seven  PFAS compounds  to be                                                               
regulated.   He explained  that, with  regard to  the text  of AS                                                               
46.03.345(a),  the action  described is  the regulatory  practice                                                               
within  the Department  of Environmental  Conservation (DEC),  so                                                               
the  proposed legislation  could  be  characterized as  codifying                                                               
that practice.                                                                                                                  
2:06:06 PM                                                                                                                    
RANDY KRAUSE,  Fire Chief, Seattle-Tacoma  International Airport,                                                               
Port of Seattle,  said that the Port of Seattle  has been working                                                               
with  partners at  the Federal  Aviation Administration  (FAA) to                                                               
implement the use of a  fluorine-free firefighting foam.  He said                                                               
that,   while  federal   law  currently   requires  the   use  of                                                               
firefighting  foam  that  includes PFAS  chemicals,  the  airport                                                               
director  has urged  FAA to  aggressively pursue  a fluorine-free                                                               
option.    The  FAA  Reauthorization Act  of  2018  requires  the                                                               
evaluation and  implementation of  fluorine-free foam  by October                                                               
2021, which  many airports  around the  world have  already done.                                                               
He said that  he has observed the use of  fluorine-free foam with                                                               
"great success" and  is confident that FAA will  reach a solution                                                               
by the October deadline.                                                                                                        
2:08:30 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE  FIELDS asked  for  more detail  on the  different                                                               
types of firefighting foam.                                                                                                     
MR. KRAUSE explained  that many other countries  have switched to                                                               
fluorine-free products  with "great success" both  in performance                                                               
and the ability  to effectively mitigate fires.  He  said that he                                                               
sits on an  advisory panel for FAA and that  various products are                                                               
being tested.                                                                                                                   
2:10:00 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE   HANNAN  asked   Mr.   Krause   to  discuss   the                                                               
characteristics of  oil and gas  fires and  possible developments                                                               
in using fluorine-free products for that industry.                                                                              
MR.  KRAUSE said  that the  foam  containing fluorine  is a  very                                                               
robust  and  effective  product.   He  explained  that  fires  at                                                               
airports  are surface  fires, rather  than the  deep-seated fires                                                               
one  would find  in the  oil and  gas industry,  and that  in his                                                               
opinion,  the fluorine-based  products  are  "over designed"  for                                                               
airport  use.   He expressed  his understanding  that the  deeper                                                               
penetration  of the  fluorine-based  foam is  preferable for  the                                                               
"plunge" fires  in an  oil or gas  field.  He  then noted  that a                                                               
company called  LASTFIRE (Large  Atmospheric Storage  Tank Fires)                                                               
is seeing  success in the development  of fluorine-free products.                                                               
In response to  Chair Patkotak, he said he  would provide contact                                                               
information for LASTFIRE to the sponsor's staff.                                                                                
2:15:49 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE  HANNAN thanked  committee members  and noted  the                                                               
complexity of the issue of PFAS pollution.                                                                                      
2:16:59 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE GILLHAM  asked how  the PFAS  concentration cutoff                                                               
of eight parts per trillion was chosen.                                                                                         
MR.  CLARK  explained that  the  Michigan  Science Advisory  Task                                                               
Force  was  assembled  in 2018  and  went  through  peer-reviewed                                                               
studies on PFAS to arrive at the concentration limit.                                                                           
2:18:15 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR PATKOTAK  asked about the distinction  between the Michigan                                                               
PFAS Action Response Team and  the Michigan Science Advisory Task                                                               
REPRESENTATIVE MCKAY  interjected that  the Michigan  PFAS Action                                                               
Response Team is referred to as MPART.                                                                                          
MR. CLARK said that MPART  and the Michigan Science Advisory Task                                                               
Force are both initiatives by the state government.                                                                             
2:20:09 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE  MCKAY  said  that   the  committee  hasn't  heard                                                               
testimony  from  DEC  or the  Department  of  Transportation  and                                                               
Public Facilities  (DOT&PF), and has heard  expert testimony only                                                               
from sources  in Michigan  and Seattle.   He  said he  would like                                                               
information from  Alaska's state  toxicologist, if there  is one,                                                               
and the state fire marshal.                                                                                                     
CHAIR PATKOTAK noted that representatives  from the Department of                                                               
Health and  Social Services (DHSS)  and DOT&PF have been  in both                                                               
MR. CLARK said that testimony  from experts in state agencies was                                                               
heard during  the Thirty-First Alaska State  Legislature and that                                                               
there would be opportunity for further testimony.                                                                               
2:23:00 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE CRONK said  that he thinks it would  be helpful to                                                               
be in contact with DEC.                                                                                                         
2:24:06 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE  GILLHAM said  he would  like to  find out  at the                                                               
next scheduled  bill hearing about  the current  concentration of                                                               
PFAS in the affected areas within Alaska.                                                                                       
[HB 171 was held over.]                                                                                                         

Document Name Date/Time Subjects
HB 98 HRES Proposed CS 4.28.2021.pdf HRES 4/28/2021 1:00:00 PM
HB 98
HB 98 Summary of Changes Version A to HRES CS 4.28.2021.pdf HRES 4/28/2021 1:00:00 PM
HB 98
HB 171 Michigan Science Advisory Task Force Full Report 4.27.2021.pdf HRES 4/28/2021 1:00:00 PM
HB 171
HB 171 Public Testimony Packet 4.26.2021.pdf HRES 4/28/2021 1:00:00 PM
HB 171
HB 171 LASTFIRE Research Test Press Release Two 5.4.2021.pdf HRES 4/28/2021 1:00:00 PM
HB 171
HB 171 LASTFIRE Research Test Press Release One 5.4.2021.pdf HRES 4/28/2021 1:00:00 PM
HB 171
HB 171 Letter Karen Nguyen 5.4.2021.pdf HRES 4/28/2021 1:00:00 PM
HB 171