Legislature(1993 - 1994)

05/07/1993 06:00 PM FIN

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
txt
                                                                               
                                                                               
                     HOUSE FINANCE COMMITTEE                                   
                           MAY 7, 1993                                         
                            6:00 P.M.                                          
                                                                               
  TAPE HFC 93 - 131, Side 2, #000 - end.                                       
  TAPE HFC 93 - 132, Side 1, #000 - #469.                                      
                                                                               
  CALL TO ORDER                                                                
                                                                               
  Co-Chair Ron Larson called the  meeting of the House Finance                 
  Committee to order at 6:00 P.M.                                              
                                                                               
  PRESENT                                                                      
                                                                               
  Co-Chair Larson               Representative Brown                           
  Co-Chair MacLean              Representative Foster                          
  Vice-Chair Hanley             Representative Grussendorf                     
  Representative THerriault     Representative Martin                          
  Representative Navarre        Representative Parnell                         
                                                                               
  Representative Hoffman was not present for the vote.                         
                                                                               
  ALSO PRESENT                                                                 
                                                                               
  Representative  Jim  Nordlund;  Representative  Carl  Moses;                 
  Representative   Cynthia   Toohey;    Representative   Cliff                 
  Davidson;    Representative    Fran   Ulmer;    Paul   Fuhs,                 
  Commissioner,   Department   of   Commerce    and   Economic                 
  Development;  John Hansen, Jr.,  Gaming Manager, Division of                 
  Occupational Licensing, Department of  Commerce and Economic                 
  Development.                                                                 
                                                                               
  SUMMARY INFORMATION                                                          
  HB 168    An Act relating to multiple-beneficiary charitable                 
            gaming  permits  and  door  prizes for  charitable                 
            gaming; and providing for an effective date.                       
                                                                               
            CS HB 168 (FIN) was reported out of Committee with                 
            "no recommendation" and with a  fiscal note by the                 
            Department of Commerce and Economic Development.                   
                                                                               
  HOUSE BILL 168                                                               
                                                                               
       "An  Act  relating  to multiple-beneficiary  charitable                 
       gaming permits  and door prizes for  charitable gaming;                 
       and providing for an effective date."                                   
                                                                               
  Representative Hanley MOVED the  work draft #8-LS0674\I  for                 
  CS HB  168 (FIN)  dated 5/07/93  be the  version before  the                 
  Committee.   Representative Martin  OBJECTED noting  for the                 
                                                                               
                                1                                              
                                                                               
                                                                               
  record  that he  disapproved  of  "opening-up"  gambling  in                 
  Alaska.    Representative  Martin  WITHDREW  his  OBJECTION.                 
  There being NO FURTHER OBJECTIONS, the draft was adopted.                    
                                                                               
  Representative  Brown MOVED  a  change to  Page  3, Line  1,                 
  deleting "charitable  gaming activity" and  inserting "bingo                 
  or pull  tab game".   She  pointed out  this language  would                 
  conform  with Page  9,  Lines  12  & 13.    There  being  NO                 
  OBJECTIONS, it was so ordered.                                               
                                                                               
  JOHN  HANSEN,  GAMING  MANAGER,  DIVISION  OF   OCCUPATIONAL                 
  LICENSING, DEPARTMENT OF  COMMERCE AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT,                 
  provided  the Committee  with a brief  history of  gaming in                 
  response to questions  asked by Representative Martin.   Mr.                 
  Hansen stated in 1984, the  regulations were expanded on the                 
  games of chance and skill under "special raffles" to include                 
  pull tabs.  By regulation in 1984, the Department of Revenue                 
  allowed the  sale of  pull tabs which  continued until  1988                 
  when the  regulation changed  into statute.   In 1988,  pull                 
  tabs became legalized.                                                       
                                                                               
  Representative Martin  MOVED Amendment #1.  [Attachment #1].                 
  Representative Brown asked  if the  intent of the  amendment                 
  was to remove  the reference to pull  tab in the bill.   Mr.                 
  Hansen pointed  out the proposed  legislation including  the                 
  pull  tabs  would  generate  ten  percent  proceeds  on  all                 
  activities including  bingo.   Co-Chair  Larson OBJECTED  to                 
  Amendment #1.                                                                
                                                                               
  PAUL FUHS, COMMISSIONER, DEPARTMENT OF COMMERCE AND ECONOMIC                 
  DEVELOPMENT,  stated  that the  net  effect of  Amendment #1                 
  would reduce the  $16 million dollars generated  revenue for                 
  charities to $3 million dollars.                                             
                                                                               
  A roll call was taken on the MOTION.                                         
                                                                               
       IN FAVOR:      Hanley, Martin, Navarre, Parnell, Brown.                 
                                                                               
       OPPOSED:       Grussendorf,     Therriault,    MacLean,                 
                      Larson.                                                  
                                                                               
  Representatives Foster and Hoffman were  not present for the                 
  vote.                                                                        
                                                                               
  The MOTION PASSED, (5-4).                                                    
                                                                               
  Co-Chair  MacLean  MOVED  Amendment #2.    [Attachment  #2].                 
  Representative  Martin  OBJECTED.    Representative  Navarre                 
  pointed out  Amendment #2 could not be  implemented with the                 
  previous action taken by the Committee on Amendment #1.                      
                                                                               
  Co-Chair MacLean MOVED TO RESCIND  action taken on Amendment                 
                                                                               
                                2                                              
                                                                               
                                                                               
  commented that the  Governor does  not believe in  gambling.                 
  He  added,  as  the  law  exists  charities  should  benefit                 
  charities.  Pull tabs generate 80% of gaming revenue.                        
                                                                               
  A roll call was taken on the MOTION.                                         
                                                                               
       IN FAVOR:      Grussendorf, Therriault, Foster, Larson,                 
                      MacLean.                                                 
                                                                               
       OPPOSED:       Hanley, Martin, Navarre, Brown.                          
                                                                               
  Representatives Hoffman and Parnell were not present for the                 
  vote.                                                                        
                                                                               
  The MOTION PASSED, (5-4).                                                    
                                                                               
  A roll call vote was taken on Amendment #1.                                  
                                                                               
       IN FAVOR:      Hanley, Brown.                                           
                                                                               
       OPPOSED:       Martin,  Navarre,  Therriault,   Foster,                 
                      Grussendorf, MacLean, Larson.                            
                                                                               
  Representatives Hoffman and Parnell were not present for the                 
  vote.                                                                        
                                                                               
  The MOTION FAILED, (2-7).                                                    
                                                                               
  Co-Chair MacLean MOVED Amendment #2.   Representative Martin                 
  OBJECTED.                                                                    
                                                                               
  A roll call was taken on the MOTION.                                         
                                                                               
       IN FAVOR:      Navarre,  Brown,   Foster,  Grussendorf,                 
                      Larson, MacLean.                                         
                                                                               
       OPPOSED:       Martin, Parnell, Therriault, Hanley.                     
                                                                               
  Representative Hoffman was not present for the vote.                         
                                                                               
  The MOTION PASSED, (6-4).                                                    
                                                                               
  Representative Brown  provided the Committee  with Amendment                 
  prohibit gaming within  their districts by a vote.  Co-Chair                 
  Larson  OBJECTED.   Commissioner Fuhs  noted the  Department                 
  would support the amendment.                                                 
                                                                               
  Co-Chair MacLean asked if it would be necessary for villages                 
  and municipalities to vote for gaming and pull tabs with the                 
  inclusion  of the  proposed  amendment.   Commissioner  Fuhs                 
                                                                               
                                3                                              
                                                                               
                                                                               
  replied,  the vote would be  necessary only if the Committee                 
  wanted to prohibit gaming from occurring.                                    
                                                                               
  Representative  Hanley  MOVED  TO  AMEND  the  amendment and                 
  change the number of registered voters from 35% to 10%.  Co-                 
  Chair Larson OBJECTED.                                                       
                                                                               
  A roll call was taken on the MOTION.                                         
                                                                               
       IN FAVOR:      Martin,  Navarre,  Parnell,  Therriault,                 
                      Brown, Hanley, MacLean.                                  
                                                                               
       OPPOSED:       Foster, Grussendorf, Larson.                             
                                                                               
  Representative Hoffman was not present for the vote.                         
                                                                               
  The MOTION PASSED, (7-3).                                                    
                                                                               
  Amendment #3  was once  again before  the Committee.   There                 
  being NO OBJECTION, it was so ordered.                                       
                                                                               
  Representative  Brown  WITHDREW AMENDMENT  #4.   [Attachment                 
                                                                               
  Representative Brown  MOVED Amendment #5.   [Attachment #5].                 
  The amendment would increase  the annual fee for a  pull tab                 
  manufactures license  from $500  to  $2.5 thousand  dollars.                 
  She added, that  amount is closer  to the national  average.                 
  Commissioner Fuhs stated there are  only ten manufactures in                 
  the  United States and  that $2.5 thousand  dollars would be                 
  amongst  the highest  rate charged.   Representative  Martin                 
  OBJECTED to the amendment.                                                   
                                                                               
  A roll call was taken on the MOTION.                                         
                                                                               
       IN FAVOR:      Navarre,  Parnell,   Therriault,  Brown,                 
                      Grussendorf, Hanley.                                     
                                                                               
       OPPOSED:       Foster, Martin, Larson, MacLean.                         
                                                                               
  Representative Hoffman was not present for the vote.                         
                                                                               
  The MOTION PASSED, (6-4).                                                    
                                                                               
  Representative Brown  MOVED Amendment #6.   [Attachment #6].                 
  The amendment would increase  the age to play bingo  or pull                 
  tab games from 19  to 21 years.  Commissioner  Fuhs replied,                 
  the  Department would support the amendment.  Representative                 
  Grussendorf pointed  out that bingo is a  family activity in                 
  many  of  the smaller  communities  and the  proposed change                 
  could eliminate that.   Representative Brown MOVED  TO AMEND                 
  Amendment #6 changing the language to cover "pull tabs" only                 
                                                                               
                                4                                              
                                                                               
                                                                               
  which   would   continue   to  allow   bingo   and  raffles.                 
  Representative Brown MOVED the language change.  There being                 
  NO OBJECTION, it was so ordered.                                             
                                                                               
  Representative Brown  MOVED Amendment #7.   [Attachment #7].                 
  She  explained  the amendment  would  provide protection  to                 
  consumers  when  purchasing pull  tabs.    Commissioner Fuhs                 
  explained  the   amendment  would  be  unnecessary  as  that                 
  information is already required on the flyer cards.                          
                                                                               
  (Tape Change, HFC 93-132, Side 1).                                           
                                                                               
  Representative Brown WITHDREW Amendment #7.   There being NO                 
  OBJECTION, it was so ordered.                                                
                                                                               
  Representative Brown MOVED Amendment #8.  [Attachment #8].                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE  JIM  NORDLUND  explained that  Amendment  #8                 
  would  require  a bond  be  posted when  selling  pull tabs.                 
  Commissioner  Fuhs explained  there could  be no  way for  a                 
  customer to make a claim against a bar for selling pull tabs                 
  and  not advertising  them.   Representative  Brown WITHDREW                 
  Amendment #8.  There being NO  OBJECTION, it was so ordered.                 
                                                                               
                                                                               
  Representative Brown  MOVED Amendment  #9 which  would limit                 
  the  number to  five permittees  who  could contract  with a                 
  vendor for  the sale of  pull tabs.   [Attachment #9].   Mr.                 
  Hansen  stated is  limitation was  addressed in  SB 6  which                 
  limited  the  amount  of locations  a  permittee  could use.                 
  Representative Nordlund thought Amendment  #10 would address                 
  the   Department's   concern   stating   there   could    be                 
  consolidation  of  permittees  either way.    Representative                 
  Brown WITHDREW Amendment #9.   There being NO  OBJECTION, it                 
  was so ordered.                                                              
                                                                               
  Representative Brown MOVED Amendment #10.  Commissioner Fuhs                 
  noted the  Department would  support the  amendment.   There                 
  being NO OBJECTION, it was adopted.                                          
                                                                               
  Commissioner   Fuhs  urged  the  Committee  to  support  the                 
  legislation so that there could be further regulatory powers                 
  to  insure  that  the charities  benefit  from  the program.                 
  Representative Martin  disagreed.   He  emphasized that  the                 
  legislation would make  gambling "wide-open" in the  name of                 
  charity.                                                                     
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE CLIFF DAVIDSON  questioned why the Department                 
  feels that the  legislation does not represent  an expansion                 
  of the  pull tab business.   Commissioner Fuhs  replied, the                 
  legislation  would not  authorize any  additional locations.                 
  Representative Davidson asked if a saturation point had been                 
                                                                               
                                5                                              
                                                                               
                                                                               
  reached  for  pull tabs  in  the State.    Commissioner Fuhs                 
  stated  the  bill  will  not  affect the  saturation  point.                 
  Currently, pulls tabs can exist in  any location.  He added,                 
  with paying 70%  of the  profit up-front, the  profitability                 
  becomes marginal for the operations.                                         
                                                                               
  Co-Chair Larson MOVED Amendment #11,  [Attachment #11] which                 
  would make a title  language.  There being NO  OBJECTION, it                 
  was adopted.                                                                 
                                                                               
  Representative Brown MOVED a language change to Page 7, Line                 
  19 deleting "quarter"  and inserting  "annual".  Mr.  Hansen                 
  stated under current law, operators are required to pay  15%                 
  of  the  adjusted  gross   income  for  no  less  than   two                 
  consecutive  quarters.    The current  law  allows  that the                 
  operators would be  allowed to pay  7.5% on an annual  basis                 
  and not be out of compliance.  Commissioner Fuhs pointed out                 
  the existing bill contained a major loophole and the current                 
  law  corrects that  problem.   He added  there  are seasonal                 
  changes making payment more difficult for some operators.                    
                                                                               
  Representative  Brown MOVED  the  change  which  would  read                 
  "...pay to each  authorizing permittee at least  30% percent                 
  annually...".  Representative Martin OBJECTED.                               
                                                                               
  A roll call was taken on the MOTION.                                         
                                                                               
       IN FAVOR:      Therriault, Brown, Foster, Grussendorf.                  
                                                                               
       OPPOSED:       Hanley,    Martin,   Parnell,    Larson,                 
                      MacLean.                                                 
                                                                               
  Representatives Hoffman and Navarre were not present for the                 
  vote.                                                                        
                                                                               
  The MOTION FAILED, (4-5).                                                    
                                                                               
  Co-Chair MacLean  MOVED to  report CS  HB 168  (FIN) out  of                 
  Committee  with  individual  recommendations  and  with  the                 
  accompanying  fiscal  note.     Representative  Brown  MOVED                 
  increasing  the fiscal  note to  match the amount  the House                 
  Finance  Committee added  to the  budget.   She stated  $381                 
  thousand  dollars  had been  added  to support  auditing and                 
  enforcement of the  legislation.  Co-Chair Larson  noted the                 
  House portion of the budget  includes three investigators to                 
  the  Department  of Administration.    Representative Martin                 
  stressed his dissatisfaction  with the basic concept  of the                 
  legislation.  There being NO  OBJECTION to moving the  bill,                 
  it was so ordered.                                                           
                                                                               
  CS  HB  168 (FIN)  was reported  out  of Committee  with "no                 
  recommendation" and with a new fiscal note by the Department                 
                                                                               
                                6                                              
                                                                               
                                                                               
  of Commerce and Economic Development.                                        
  ADJOURNMENT                                                                  
                                                                               
  The meeting adjourned at 7:25 P.M.                                           
                                                                               
                                                                               
                     HOUSE FINANCE COMMITTEE                                   
                           MAY 7, 1993                                         
                            6:00 P.M.                                          
                                                                               
  TAPE HFC 93 - 131, Side 2, #000 - end.                                       
  TAPE HFC 93 - 132, Side 1, #000 - #469.                                      
                                                                               
  CALL TO ORDER                                                                
                                                                               
  Co-Chair Ron Larson called the meeting of the  House Finance                 
  Committee to order at 6:00 P.M.                                              
                                                                               
  PRESENT                                                                      
                                                                               
  Co-Chair Larson               Representative Brown                           
  Co-Chair MacLean              Representative Foster                          
  Vice-Chair Hanley             Representative Grussendorf                     
  Representative THerriault     Representative Martin                          
  Representative Navarre        Representative Parnell                         
                                                                               
  Representative Hoffman was not present for the vote.                         
                                                                               
  ALSO PRESENT                                                                 
                                                                               
  Representative  Jim  Nordlund;  Representative  Carl  Moses;                 
  Representative   Cynthia   Toohey;    Representative   Cliff                 
  Davidson;    Representative    Fran   Ulmer;    Paul   Fuhs,                 
  Commissioner,   Department   of   Commerce    and   Economic                 
  Development; John Hansen, Jr.,  Gaming Manager, Division  of                 
  Occupational Licensing, Department of  Commerce and Economic                 
  Development.                                                                 
                                                                               
  SUMMARY INFORMATION                                                          
                                                                               
  HB 168    An Act relating to multiple-beneficiary charitable                 
            gaming  permits  and  door  prizes for  charitable                 
            gaming; and providing for an effective date.                       
                                                                               
            CS HB 168 (FIN) was reported out of Committee with                 
            "no recommendation" and with a  fiscal note by the                 
            Department of Commerce and Economic Development.                   
                                                                               
  HOUSE BILL 168                                                               
                                                                               
       "An  Act  relating  to multiple-beneficiary  charitable                 
                                                                               
                                7                                              
                                                                               
                                                                               
       gaming permits and door  prizes for charitable  gaming;                 
       and providing for an effective date."                                   
                                                                               
  Representative Hanley  MOVED the work  draft #8-LS0674\I for                 
  CS HB  168 (FIN)  dated 5/07/93  be the  version before  the                 
  Committee.   Representative  Martin OBJECTED noting  for the                 
  record  that  he  disapproved  of "opening-up"  gambling  in                 
  Alaska.    Representative  Martin  WITHDREW  his  OBJECTION.                 
  There being NO FURTHER OBJECTIONS, the draft was adopted.                    
                                                                               
  Representative  Brown MOVED  a  change to  Page  3, Line  1,                 
  deleting "charitable  gaming activity" and  inserting "bingo                 
  or pull  tab game".   She  pointed out  this language  would                 
  conform  with  Page 9,  Lines  12  &  13.   There  being  NO                 
  OBJECTIONS, it was so ordered.                                               
                                                                               
  JOHN  HANSEN,  GAMING  MANAGER,  DIVISION  OF   OCCUPATIONAL                 
  LICENSING, DEPARTMENT OF  COMMERCE AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT,                 
  provided the  Committee with  a brief  history of gaming  in                 
  response to questions  asked by Representative Martin.   Mr.                 
  Hansen stated in 1984, the regulations were  expanded on the                 
  games of chance and skill under "special raffles" to include                 
  pull tabs.  By regulation in 1984, the Department of Revenue                 
  allowed the  sale of  pull tabs  which continued  until 1988                 
  when the regulation  changed into  statute.   In 1988,  pull                 
  tabs became legalized.                                                       
                                                                               
  Representative Martin MOVED Amendment #1.   [Attachment #1].                 
  Representative Brown asked  if the  intent of the  amendment                 
  was to remove  the reference to pull  tab in the bill.   Mr.                 
  Hansen pointed  out the  proposed legislation  including the                 
  pull  tabs  would  generate  ten  percent  proceeds  on  all                 
  activities  including bingo.   Co-Chair  Larson OBJECTED  to                 
  Amendment #1.                                                                
                                                                               
  PAUL FUHS, COMMISSIONER, DEPARTMENT OF COMMERCE AND ECONOMIC                 
  DEVELOPMENT,  stated  that the  net  effect of  Amendment #1                 
  would reduce the  $16 million dollars generated  revenue for                 
  charities to $3 million dollars.                                             
                                                                               
  A roll call was taken on the MOTION.                                         
                                                                               
       IN FAVOR:      Hanley, Martin, Navarre, Parnell, Brown.                 
                                                                               
       OPPOSED:       Grussendorf,     Therriault,    MacLean,                 
                      Larson.                                                  
                                                                               
  Representatives Foster and Hoffman were  not present for the                 
  vote.                                                                        
                                                                               
  The MOTION PASSED, (5-4).                                                    
                                                                               
                                                                               
                                8                                              
                                                                               
                                                                               
  Co-Chair  MacLean MOVED  Amendment  #2.    [Attachment  #2].                 
  Representative  Martin  OBJECTED.    Representative  Navarre                 
  pointed out Amendment #2 could  not be implemented with  the                 
  previous action taken by the Committee on Amendment #1.                      
                                                                               
  Co-Chair MacLean MOVED TO RESCIND  action taken on Amendment                 
  commented that the  Governor does  not believe in  gambling.                 
  He  added,  as  the  law  exists  charities  should  benefit                 
  charities.  Pull tabs generate 80% of gaming revenue.                        
                                                                               
  A roll call was taken on the MOTION.                                         
                                                                               
       IN FAVOR:      Grussendorf, Therriault, Foster, Larson,                 
                      MacLean.                                                 
                                                                               
       OPPOSED:       Hanley, Martin, Navarre, Brown.                          
                                                                               
  Representatives Hoffman and Parnell were not present for the                 
  vote.                                                                        
                                                                               
  The MOTION PASSED, (5-4).                                                    
                                                                               
  A roll call vote was taken on Amendment #1.                                  
                                                                               
       IN FAVOR:      Hanley, Brown.                                           
                                                                               
       OPPOSED:       Martin,  Navarre,  Therriault,   Foster,                 
                      Grussendorf, MacLean, Larson.                            
                                                                               
  Representatives Hoffman and Parnell were not present for the                 
  vote.                                                                        
                                                                               
  The MOTION FAILED, (2-7).                                                    
                                                                               
  Co-Chair MacLean  MOVED Amendment #2.  Representative Martin                 
  OBJECTED.                                                                    
                                                                               
  A roll call was taken on the MOTION.                                         
                                                                               
       IN FAVOR:      Navarre,  Brown,   Foster,  Grussendorf,                 
                      Larson, MacLean.                                         
                                                                               
       OPPOSED:       Martin, Parnell, Therriault, Hanley.                     
                                                                               
  Representative Hoffman was not present for the vote.                         
                                                                               
  The MOTION PASSED, (6-4).                                                    
                                                                               
  Representative Brown  provided the Committee  with Amendment                 
  prohibit gaming within their districts by  a vote.  Co-Chair                 
                                                                               
                                9                                              
                                                                               
                                                                               
  Larson  OBJECTED.   Commissioner Fuhs  noted  the Department                 
  would support the amendment.                                                 
                                                                               
  Co-Chair MacLean asked if it would be necessary for villages                 
  and municipalities to vote for gaming and pull tabs with the                 
  inclusion  of  the proposed  amendment.   Commissioner  Fuhs                 
  replied, the vote would  be necessary only if  the Committee                 
  wanted to prohibit gaming from occurring.                                    
                                                                               
  Representative  Hanley  MOVED  TO AMEND  the  amendment  and                 
  change the number of registered voters from 35% to 10%.  Co-                 
  Chair Larson OBJECTED.                                                       
                                                                               
  A roll call was taken on the MOTION.                                         
                                                                               
       IN FAVOR:      Martin,  Navarre,  Parnell,  Therriault,                 
                      Brown, Hanley, MacLean.                                  
                                                                               
       OPPOSED:       Foster, Grussendorf, Larson.                             
                                                                               
  Representative Hoffman was not present for the vote.                         
                                                                               
  The MOTION PASSED, (7-3).                                                    
                                                                               
  Amendment #3 was  once again  before the  Committee.   There                 
  being NO OBJECTION, it was so ordered.                                       
                                                                               
  Representative  Brown  WITHDREW AMENDMENT  #4.   [Attachment                 
                                                                               
  Representative Brown  MOVED Amendment #5.   [Attachment #5].                 
  The amendment would increase  the annual fee for a  pull tab                 
  manufactures  license from  $500 to  $2.5 thousand  dollars.                 
  She added, that  amount is closer  to the national  average.                 
  Commissioner Fuhs stated there are  only ten manufactures in                 
  the  United States and  that $2.5 thousand  dollars would be                 
  amongst the  highest  rate charged.   Representative  Martin                 
  OBJECTED to the amendment.                                                   
                                                                               
  A roll call was taken on the MOTION.                                         
                                                                               
       IN FAVOR:      Navarre,  Parnell,   Therriault,  Brown,                 
                      Grussendorf, Hanley.                                     
                                                                               
       OPPOSED:       Foster, Martin, Larson, MacLean.                         
                                                                               
  Representative Hoffman was not present for the vote.                         
                                                                               
  The MOTION PASSED, (6-4).                                                    
                                                                               
  Representative  Brown MOVED Amendment  #6.  [Attachment #6].                 
  The amendment would increase  the age to play bingo  or pull                 
                                                                               
                               10                                              
                                                                               
                                                                               
  tab games from 19  to 21 years.  Commissioner  Fuhs replied,                 
  the Department would support the amendment.   Representative                 
  Grussendorf pointed out that bingo  is a family activity  in                 
  many  of  the smaller  communities  and the  proposed change                 
  could eliminate that.   Representative Brown MOVED  TO AMEND                 
  Amendment #6 changing the language to cover "pull tabs" only                 
  which   would   continue  to   allow   bingo   and  raffles.                 
  Representative Brown MOVED the language change.  There being                 
  NO OBJECTION, it was so ordered.                                             
                                                                               
  Representative Brown  MOVED Amendment #7.   [Attachment #7].                 
  She  explained the  amendment  would  provide protection  to                 
  consumers  when  purchasing pull  tabs.   Commissioner  Fuhs                 
  explained  the  amendment  would  be   unnecessary  as  that                 
  information is already required on the flyer cards.                          
                                                                               
  (Tape Change, HFC 93-132, Side 1).                                           
                                                                               
  Representative Brown WITHDREW Amendment #7.   There being NO                 
  OBJECTION, it was so ordered.                                                
                                                                               
  Representative Brown MOVED Amendment #8.  [Attachment #8].                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE  JIM  NORDLUND  explained that  Amendment  #8                 
  would  require  a bond  be  posted when  selling  pull tabs.                 
  Commissioner  Fuhs explained  there  could be  no way  for a                 
  customer to make a claim against a bar for selling pull tabs                 
  and  not  advertising them.   Representative  Brown WITHDREW                 
  Amendment #8.  There being NO  OBJECTION, it was so ordered.                 
                                                                               
                                                                               
  Representative Brown  MOVED Amendment #9  which would  limit                 
  the  number to  five permittees  who could  contract with  a                 
  vendor for the  sale of pull  tabs.   [Attachment #9].   Mr.                 
  Hansen  stated is  limitation  was addressed  in SB  6 which                 
  limited  the  amount  of locations  a  permittee  could use.                 
  Representative Nordlund thought Amendment  #10 would address                 
  the   Department's   concern   stating   there   could    be                 
  consolidation  of  permittees  either way.    Representative                 
  Brown WITHDREW  Amendment #9.  There being  NO OBJECTION, it                 
  was so ordered.                                                              
                                                                               
  Representative Brown MOVED Amendment #10.  Commissioner Fuhs                 
  noted the  Department would  support the  amendment.   There                 
  being NO OBJECTION, it was adopted.                                          
                                                                               
  Commissioner  Fuhs  urged  the   Committee  to  support  the                 
  legislation so that there could be further regulatory powers                 
  to  insure  that  the charities  benefit  from  the program.                 
  Representative  Martin disagreed.   He  emphasized  that the                 
  legislation would make  gambling "wide-open" in the  name of                 
  charity.                                                                     
                                                                               
                               11                                              
                                                                               
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE CLIFF DAVIDSON questioned why the  Department                 
  feels that the  legislation does not represent  an expansion                 
  of the pull  tab business.   Commissioner Fuhs replied,  the                 
  legislation would  not authorize  any additional  locations.                 
  Representative Davidson asked if a saturation point had been                 
  reached  for  pull tabs  in  the State.    Commissioner Fuhs                 
  stated  the  bill  will  not  affect the  saturation  point.                 
  Currently, pulls tabs can exist in  any location.  He added,                 
  with paying 70%  of the  profit up-front, the  profitability                 
  becomes marginal for the operations.                                         
                                                                               
  Co-Chair  Larson MOVED Amendment #11, [Attachment #11] which                 
  would make a title  language.  There being NO  OBJECTION, it                 
  was adopted.                                                                 
                                                                               
  Representative Brown MOVED a language change to Page 7, Line                 
  19 deleting "quarter"  and inserting  "annual".  Mr.  Hansen                 
  stated under current  law, operators are required to pay 15%                 
  of  the  adjusted   gross  income  for  no   less  than  two                 
  consecutive  quarters.    The current  law  allows  that the                 
  operators would be  allowed to pay  7.5% on an annual  basis                 
  and not be out of compliance.  Commissioner Fuhs pointed out                 
  the existing bill contained a major loophole and the current                 
  law  corrects  that problem.   He  added there  are seasonal                 
  changes making payment more difficult for some operators.                    
                                                                               
  Representative  Brown  MOVED  the  change which  would  read                 
  "...pay to each  authorizing permittee at least  30% percent                 
  annually...".  Representative Martin OBJECTED.                               
                                                                               
  A roll call was taken on the MOTION.                                         
                                                                               
       IN FAVOR:      Therriault, Brown, Foster, Grussendorf.                  
                                                                               
       OPPOSED:       Hanley,    Martin,   Parnell,    Larson,                 
                      MacLean.                                                 
                                                                               
  Representatives Hoffman and Navarre were not present for the                 
  vote.                                                                        
                                                                               
  The MOTION FAILED, (4-5).                                                    
                                                                               
  Co-Chair MacLean  MOVED to  report CS  HB 168  (FIN) out  of                 
  Committee  with  individual  recommendations  and  with  the                 
  accompanying  fiscal  note.     Representative  Brown  MOVED                 
  increasing the  fiscal note  to match  the amount  the House                 
  Finance Committee  added  to the  budget.   She stated  $381                 
  thousand  dollars  had been  added  to support  auditing and                 
  enforcement of the  legislation.  Co-Chair Larson  noted the                 
  House portion of the budget  includes three investigators to                 
  the  Department  of Administration.    Representative Martin                 
                                                                               
                               12                                              
                                                                               
                                                                               
  stressed his dissatisfaction  with the basic concept  of the                 
  legislation.  There  being NO OBJECTION to  moving the bill,                 
  it was so ordered.                                                           
                                                                               
  CS  HB  168 (FIN)  was reported  out  of Committee  with "no                 
  recommendation" and with a new fiscal note by the Department                 
  of Commerce and Economic Development.                                        
                                                                               
  ADJOURNMENT                                                                  
                                                                               
  The meeting adjourned at 7:25 P.M.                                           
                                                                               
                                                                               
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