Legislature(2017 - 2018)BARNES 124

04/18/2017 08:00 AM COMMUNITY & REGIONAL AFFAIRS

Note: the audio and video recordings are distinct records and are obtained from different sources. As such there may be key differences between the two. The audio recordings are captured by our records offices as the official record of the meeting and will have more accurate timestamps. Use the icons to switch between them.

Download Mp3. <- Right click and save file as
Download Video part 1. <- Right click and save file as

* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+= SB 63 REGULATION OF SMOKING TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
*+ HB 33 ESTABLISH MAY 31 AS KATIE JOHN DAY TELECONFERENCED
Moved HB 33 Out of Committee
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
                  SB  63-REGULATION OF SMOKING                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
[Contains discussion of SB 15.]                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
8:20:49 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  FANSLER  announced that  the  final  order of  business                                                               
would  be CS  FOR SENATE  BILL NO.  63(FIN), "An  Act prohibiting                                                               
smoking in certain  places; relating to education  on the smoking                                                               
prohibition; and providing for an effective date."                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
8:22:03 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FANSLER reopened public testimony on CSSB 63(FIN).                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
8:22:27 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JOSH  SILAS testified  in opposition  to CSSB  63(FIN).   [Due to                                                               
technical difficulties, Mr. Silas' testimony was inaudible.]                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
8:24:32 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE RAUSCHER  suggested that Mr. Silas  could be asked                                                               
to repeat his stance on CSSB 63(FIN).                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
8:24:46 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  FANSLER  told Mr.  Silas  that  his testimony  was  not                                                               
audible and asked  him to state for the record  whether he was in                                                               
support of or opposed to CSSB 63(FIN).                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
8:24:53 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. SILAS stated that he opposed CSSB 63(FIN).                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
8:25:33 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
STEVEN MAPES  testified in opposition  to CSSB 63(FIN).   He said                                                               
the bill, as written, "would  make it extremely difficult, if not                                                               
impossible, for the lifesaving industry  of vaping to exist, much                                                               
less grow,  in Alaska."  Mr.  Mapes said the opportunity  to vape                                                               
instead of  smoke should  not be  taken away  from Alaskans.   He                                                               
said research available to the  committee, from the Royal College                                                               
of  Physicians  and  the  Heartland  Institute  of  Chicago,  are                                                               
educational  tools.    Mr.  Mapes  stated  that  the  Smoke  Free                                                               
Alternative  Trade  Association   (SFATA)  has  uploaded  several                                                               
research  articles to  the House  Community and  Regional Affairs                                                               
Standing Committee documenting the  difference between vaping and                                                               
smoking,  and  he  urged  the committee  members  to  read  those                                                               
articles before  considering whether to  pass CSSB 63(FIN).   Mr.                                                               
Mapes  said there  is  also a  documentary,  entitled "A  Billion                                                               
Lives," which  he urged the  committee to  watch.  He  said, "Any                                                               
policy  pertaining  to  vaping in  Alaska  should  recognize  and                                                               
reflect the  differences between smoking  a vaping and not  be in                                                               
lockstep  with  tobacco  policy."   He  stated  that  under  CSSB                                                               
63(FIN),  it   would  be  impossible   to  open  new   stores  in                                                               
communities  that want  a choice  between tobacco  or vaping  but                                                               
don't have a vape shop.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MR. MAPES  said he is  not an advocate  for tobacco use,  as both                                                               
his parents  died from lung cancer.   He said he  smoked from age                                                               
12 to  age 53,  at which point  he said he  found vaping  and was                                                               
able "to quit killing" himself.   He related that in 15 months he                                                               
has  helped  358  people  "get  off tobacco."    He  said,  "This                                                               
misguided bill  lumps vaping together  with smoking, which  it is                                                               
not.   I'm  asking  the  committee to  remove  all references  to                                                               
vaping from SB  63, as it does nothing to  educate smokers or the                                                               
public to the  benefits of vaping, and it kills  an industry that                                                               
is helping to save Alaskans' lives."                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
8:28:16 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE DRUMMOND asked Mr. Mapes  if he is affiliated with                                                               
any businesses related to HB 63.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MR. MAPES affirmed that  he is a member of SFATA.   He said there                                                               
is a chapter in Alaska, with three or four active members.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
8:29:11 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MARTIN MASSERA  testified in opposition  to CSSB  63(FIN) because                                                               
of its inclusion  of language pertaining to vaping.   He said the                                                               
proposed legislation  would "stifle a growing  industry, which is                                                               
benefiting  any  tobacco user  that  wants  to  quit."   He  said                                                               
research  has   proven  the  benefits  of   vaping  for  smokers,                                                               
including that from  the Royal College of  Physicians in England,                                                               
Igor  Bernstein's  documents,  and  a  documentary,  entitled  "A                                                               
Billion Lives."   Mr. Massera shared that vaping  helped him quit                                                               
smoking;  he was  a smoker  for  over 15  years, but  he has  not                                                               
smoked in  over 4  years, thanks  to vape  products.   He stated,                                                               
"Alaska's  policies   pertaining  to  vape  really   do  need  to                                                               
recognize  the difference  between smoking  and vaping.   I,  for                                                               
one, cannot  support anything  that would  lump together  a life-                                                               
saving industry  with one  that kills our  fellow Alaskans."   He                                                               
asked  the  committee  to  remove the  vape  language  from  CSSB                                                               
63(FIN) to "save an industry that  saves our lives."  In response                                                               
to Co-Chair Fansler,  Mr. Massera said he manages a  vape shop in                                                               
Soldotna, Alaska.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
8:31:11 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
DIANA REDWOOD  testified in support  of CSSB 63(FIN),  as written                                                               
with the  inclusion of  e-cigs.   She recollected  when Anchorage                                                               
and  Palmer  "went  smoke-free" and  expressed  appreciation  for                                                               
being able to  go to public places without feeling  sick from the                                                               
cigarette smoke.   She  said she travels  around the  state often                                                               
and  must leave  smoke-filled restaurants  and bars  immediately.                                                               
Ms.  Redwood  urged the  committee  to  support CSSB  63(FIN)  to                                                               
protect the lives of both customers and workers.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
8:32:21 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
PENELOPE  PALMQUIST  testified in  support  of  CSSB 63(FIN),  as                                                               
written with  the inclusion of  e-cigs.   She said for  years she                                                               
worked on "the  alcohol-side" of an event arena  and, while there                                                               
seemed to be  a no-smoking policy, concert  attendees would smoke                                                               
wherever they  please and she would  go home at night  with lungs                                                               
hurting and with a cough for several days afterward.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MS. PALMQUIST said  she can understand "where  smokers are coming                                                               
from,"  because  she  smoked  for  years  before  quitting  "cold                                                               
turkey."  She said this  legislation has been brought forward for                                                               
four years,  and she opined that  it is time to  help those whose                                                               
health is  in jeopardy.   She  asked the  committee to  pass CSSB                                                               
63(FIN), "including the e-cigarettes and the vape."                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
8:34:36 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
AMANDA  LENHARD  testified  in  support of  CSSB  63(FIN).    She                                                               
related that  she is a  bartender in Anchorage, where  local bars                                                               
have been  smoke-free for several  years; however, she  said half                                                               
the  state  is not  as  lucky  to  work  and live  in  smoke-free                                                               
environments.   She stated that  bartenders, servers,  cooks, and                                                               
dishwashers, as well  as any other employees, should  not have to                                                               
sacrifice their health  for a job.  She opined  that workers need                                                               
to  be  protected  from  the  effects  of  secondhand  smoke  and                                                               
aerosols, and she urged the committee to support CSSB 63(FIN).                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
8:35:39 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  FANSLER  noted  that someone  was  available  from  the                                                               
Department of Health and Social Services to answer questions.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
8:36:04 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
PETE HANSON,  Chief Operating Officer, Alaska  CHARR, first noted                                                               
that Alaska  CHARR is a statewide  trade association representing                                                               
restaurants, bars,  and other small  businesses operators  in the                                                               
hospitality sector.   Mr. Hanson opined that CSSB  63(FIN) is not                                                               
needed.   He explained that  citizens have  organized referendums                                                               
and  local government  officials have  voted on  smoking bans  in                                                               
many communities.   He said in most cases, the  citizens in those                                                               
communities  have voted  "no" on  banning  smoking in  bars.   He                                                               
stated the  reason is  that people know  that bars  are different                                                               
from other  places:  a  person must be 21  to enter a  bar; there                                                               
are no  kids present in  bars; and no  one is  forced to go  to a                                                               
"smoking bar."  Mr. Hanson stated,  "Go to any of the communities                                                               
that have rejected  smoking bans like this one and  you will find                                                               
that  there are  more smoke-free  establishments than  those that                                                               
allow  smoking."   He  said  this was  achieved  without a  state                                                               
mandate  "squashing  local control  and  consumer  choice."   For                                                               
example, Mr.  Hanson noted  that there  are 16  establishments in                                                               
Kodiak  where  a person  can  go  for  a  drink in  a  smoke-free                                                               
environment and  only 6  in which patrons  are allowed  to smoke.                                                               
He stated, "Clearly the patrons  and employees at bars that allow                                                               
smoking  have  chosen  to  be   in  a  bar  that  allows  smoking                                                               
predominantly because they  want to smoke while  they work, drink                                                               
a beer, or watch a football game."                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
MR. HANSON continued:                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     If you  believe in  local control,  then you  know that                                                                    
     these  decisions have  already been  made at  the local                                                                    
     level,  and   those  decisions  should   be  respected.                                                                    
     Contrary  to other  testimony you  may  hear, the  vast                                                                    
     majority  of Alaskans  do have  a ...  local government                                                                    
     body with the authority to ban smoking.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  HANSON   stated  that   Article  X   of  the   Alaska  State                                                               
Constitution clearly provides  for maximum, local self-government                                                               
and a  liberal construction  to the  powers of  local government.                                                               
He asked  the committee  to consider whether  a state  mandate is                                                               
necessary or  whether the state could  "give it a few  years" and                                                               
allow local consumers and officials  to "get there on their own."                                                               
He added, "I assure you they would get there on their own."                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
8:39:15 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SADDLER  asked  Mr.  Hanson  what  percentage  of                                                               
CHARR's membership are smoke-free  bars and what percentage allow                                                               
smoking.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MR. HANSON answered  that he does not know the  exact number, but                                                               
he ventured that the vast majority of the bars are smoke-free.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
8:39:47 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  DRUMMOND  asked  if  any of  CHARR's  members  in                                                               
Anchorage or elsewhere in the state  have gone out of business or                                                               
lost business by becoming smoke-free establishments.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MR.  HANSON  responded that  it  is  difficult to  determine  the                                                               
reason bars  go out of  business.  He  said, "Some that  did fold                                                               
were ...  kind of  on the ropes  to begin with."   He  said there                                                               
were certainly businesses in Anchorage  where the smoking ban was                                                               
a factor  in their demise,  but he  emphasized that he  could not                                                               
say exactly that that was the reason they went out of business.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
8:41:07 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JIM  FASSLER testified  in support  of CSSB  63(FIN).   He opined                                                               
that "it should  have passed years ago."   Regarding Mr. Hanson's                                                               
previous  comment  regarding local  ability  to  ban smoking,  he                                                               
offered his understanding  that when Kenai and  Soldotna tried to                                                               
[establish smoke-free  ordinances], "the organizations  that were                                                               
inside city  limits was tougher,  because they would  have forced                                                               
us out  of business; they  would have  closed down our  bar; they                                                               
would have closed down our  revenue source."  He interjected that                                                               
he  is  a member  of  all  three  military organizations  on  the                                                               
peninsula.   He explained that at  the time, he had  said that he                                                               
would "wholeheartedly" support [a smoking  ban] if it was imposed                                                               
statewide.  He urged the committee  to pass CSSB 63(FIN) "with or                                                               
without the vaping issue."                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
8:43:09 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
HANNAH BRICE  SMITH, American Cancer Society  (ACS) Cancer Action                                                               
Network (CAN),  stated that she  is a nurse  who has worked  in a                                                               
cancer unit for 15 out of 30  years of her career.  She indicated                                                               
that people  present with  cancer who have  never smoked  but who                                                               
have worked for years in  an environment where there was smoking,                                                               
and she  asked the committee  to imagine what  it is like  to sit                                                               
with someone  who has  never smoked and  explain to  him/her that                                                               
he/she  has lung  cancer.    She stated  that  whether a  smoking                                                               
device is  a cigarette, has  a filter, or  has an "e"  before its                                                               
name, it  carries a carcinogenic  that can lead to  the diagnosis                                                               
of cancer.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MS. BRICE SMITH said the State  of Alaska has a responsibility to                                                               
protect people.   She  emphasized that nobody  is being  asked to                                                               
stop smoking  or vaping - just  to "take it outside."   She asked                                                               
the committee to  do whatever it can to move  CSSB 63(FIN) out of                                                               
committee and to the floor for a vote.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
8:45:39 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JENNIFER  VARGASON  testified that  as  an  ex-tobacco user,  she                                                               
would support CSSB 63(FIN) without  the vaping language; however,                                                               
with that  language she is  compelled to  oppose it.   She shared                                                               
that she is  39 years of age and has  been using tobacco products                                                               
since the age of 9; her  husband was a tobacco user; her youngest                                                               
daughter had to use an  inhaler, even though neither Ms. Vargason                                                               
nor her husband  ever smoked indoors.  She said  her husband used                                                               
vaping as  an alternative  to smoking.   She  said she  felt that                                                               
vaping was dangerous and was  angry with her husband for bringing                                                               
it  into their  home;  however, she  observed  that her  husband,                                                               
having  quite  smoking  [combustible cigarettes],  had  increased                                                               
energy  and, even  though  her husband  was  vaping indoors,  her                                                               
daughter no longer required breathing treatments.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MS.  VARGASON shared  her story  of  addiction to  tobacco and  a                                                               
determination  to continue  its use  that only  changed when  she                                                               
started  vaping  in  September  2014  and  ever  since  has  been                                                               
tobacco-free.   She said, "This  technology has helped  my family                                                               
to become  tobacco-free, and  I do  not want to  be forced  to be                                                               
around tobacco users  and their combustible products."   She said                                                               
people  are  trying to  better  themselves  by vaping,  and  CSSB                                                               
63(FIN) will only  deter tobacco users from trying to  quit.  She                                                               
asked  the committee  to  remove the  vaping  language from  CSSB                                                               
63(FIN).                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
8:48:28 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER noted  that Ms. Vargason had  said she was                                                               
tobacco-free, and he asked what product is in the e-cigarette.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MS. VARGASON  answered nicotine,  which she  said is  a stimulate                                                               
like  caffeine.   She  said  there is  "no  combustion  in an  e-                                                               
cigarette at  all."  She  added, "I'm not burning  anything, just                                                               
boiling."                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
8:49:27 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ALISON HALPIN  testified to request  that the  language regarding                                                               
vaping be removed  from CSSB 63(FIN).  She stated  that vaping is                                                               
not the same as smoking, because  there is no combustion or smoke                                                               
produced by  vaping products.   She indicated that  vaping helped                                                               
her quit smoking  after failing attempts through  use of patches,                                                               
gums,  lozenges, and  prescriptions.   She  said other  countries                                                               
have  embraced vaping:    New  Zealand is  changing  its laws  to                                                               
support its  country's smoke-free  effort; Australia is  doing so                                                               
also;  England's  tobacco usage  has  dropped  by 50  percent  by                                                               
encouraging vapor products.  She  asked the committee to consider                                                               
the choices made in these  other countries and remove vaping from                                                               
the language  of CSSB 63(FIN).   She said a New  York state judge                                                               
determined  that   there  is  no  combustion   from  e-cigs;  the                                                               
secondhand  [effects  of e-cigs]  is  minimal  - it  compares  to                                                               
"standing outside  next to  a running  vehicle."   She encouraged                                                               
the committee  to consider  the studies that  have been  done and                                                               
the help e-cigs are giving others in ceasing tobacco use.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MS.  HALPIN,  in  response  to  a  question  from  Representative                                                               
Rauscher, clarified  that she would  support CSSB 63(FIN)  if the                                                               
language regarding e-cigs and vapor products was removed.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
8:52:39 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MICHELLE SHAPIRO, Executive Director,  testified in opposition to                                                               
CSSB 63(FIN).   She  said the  proposed legislation  would affect                                                               
businesses that have made the  decision to allow smoking in their                                                               
establishments.   She opined that  the decision to  allow smoking                                                               
in a bar should  be left to the business owner,  who has made the                                                               
decision based  on the  desires of  the customers  he/she serves.                                                               
She  said  some bars  allow  smoking  just  at certain  hours  to                                                               
accommodate both  the smokers and  non-smokers, usually  with the                                                               
smoking being allowed during the daytime.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
8:54:15 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER asked what  percentage of the Mat-Su CHARR                                                               
members are smoke-free.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MS.  SHAPIRO  estimated  that  a quarter  of  the  members  allow                                                               
smoking.  She  added that most of the members  are restaurants or                                                               
package stores, which do not allow smoking.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
8:55:28 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
DANIEL  LYNCH  said he  was  testifying  on  his own  behalf  and                                                               
"citizens for common  sense and free market economies."   He said                                                               
where he  lives he  has access  to three  "watering holes":   one                                                               
allows smoking, one  does not, and the third  allows smoking only                                                               
on the  deck.   He said  that is freedom  of choice  for property                                                               
owners, business owners, employees, and customers.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
MR. LYNCH  said the bill addresses  smoking on deck of  a vessel,                                                               
and he offered  his understanding that the bill  sponsor had said                                                               
it  would be  "dangerous and  miserable to  smoke on  deck."   He                                                               
questioned why,  then, [members  of] private  clubs, such  as the                                                               
Veterans of Foreign  Wars (VFW) and the American  Legion, must go                                                               
outside to  smoke in inclement weather.   He said, "This  bill is                                                               
falsely framed  as a  workplace safety issue  or a  red herring."                                                               
He  relayed that  on  his drive  to  the Legislative  Information                                                               
Office to testify,  he passed 12 drive-through  coffeeshops and 6                                                               
drive-through fast food restaurants  where employees "get all the                                                               
carbon  monoxide they  can breathe  with  every customer  driving                                                               
in."                                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MR. LYNCH said  "we" favor "local option/local  control" in terms                                                               
of alcohol  and marijuana.   He said  Kenai, Homer,  and Soldotna                                                               
have  already set  up  local-control  smoking regulation,  "which                                                               
ended up being  the middle of the  road."  He stated,  "I find it                                                               
extremely troubling that for four years  in a row now, I'm forced                                                               
to come and testify against this  proposed bad idea for the prime                                                               
sponsor's  shameless self-promotion  at a  statewide level  while                                                               
the State of Alaska teeters  on financial collapse."  He reminded                                                               
the committee that over the last  decade, the state has gained an                                                               
average of $70 million a year  in tobacco taxes; "the borough and                                                               
cities take in huge amounts of  revenue to help keep them solvent                                                               
and  other taxes  lower."    He called  a  tobacco  tax "a  self-                                                               
imposed, voluntary tax  on smokers."  He noted  that CSSB 63(FIN)                                                               
has  a minimal  [fiscal]  note,  "because it's  complaint-driven,                                                               
with  a  $50  fine."    He  added,  "Good  luck  with  that  free                                                               
enforcement, both statewide and locally."                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR. LYNCH continued:                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
     Previous  testifiers  stated  that  ...  Bethel  became                                                                    
     smoke-free  in  1998,  so  evidence  should  show  that                                                                    
     Bethel is the healthiest region  in the state after two                                                                    
     decades of  nonsmoking.  ...  The health  care experts'                                                                    
     testifiers  make huge  statements about  death, hearts,                                                                    
     lungs, et  cetera, with no  provable evidence  of these                                                                    
     speculative statements.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     In  closing,  I  will  thank  you  for  your  time  and                                                                    
     consideration.   I request that  you hold this  bill in                                                                    
     the  bottom of  the  trash  can and  let  the state  of                                                                    
     Alaska be known  as the Last Frontier and  home to free                                                                    
     market  economies  and  common  sense  and  freedom  to                                                                    
     property and business owners - not the nanny state.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
8:58:46 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER  asked Co-Chair Fansler to  respond to Mr.                                                               
Lynch's  statement  about  the  outcome  of  Bethel's  smoke-free                                                               
status.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
8:59:00 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FANSLER  responded that  while he  has been  involved in                                                               
many things in Bethel, he is not  an expert in health issues.  He                                                               
noted that there were people  from Bethel waiting to testify, and                                                               
he suggested perhaps they could address the issue.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
8:59:57 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
KEVIN  COLLINS, Owner,  Local  Legends Vape  Shop  and Custom  E-                                                               
liquids, testified  in opposition to  the inclusion of  e-cigs in                                                               
CSSB  63(FIN).   He  said  e-cigs  are  one  form of  a  nicotine                                                               
delivery system.   He shared that  he is a former  smoker of over                                                               
30  years,  who  believes  that if  e-cigs  had  been  introduced                                                               
sooner,  then  his  parents  -  who  died  from  smoking  related                                                               
illnesses - would still be alive.   Mr. Collins indicated that e-                                                               
cigs inspired him  to create e-liquid, and he stated  his goal is                                                               
to inspire  smokers to  switch to  e-cigs.   He stated  that CSSB                                                               
63(FIN) does not support e-cigs as  a delivery system.  He stated                                                               
his  belief that  e-cig  users  should not  be  "lumped into  the                                                               
category  of smokers  again."   He reemphasized  that he  opposes                                                               
CSSB 63(FIN) because of its inclusion of e-cigs.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
9:01:30 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CANDACE KUCK  testified in  opposition to  the inclusion  of "the                                                               
vapor language" in CSSB 63(FIN).   She mentioned that she owns "a                                                               
shop" in North Pole.  Ms.  Kuck shared that she smoked for almost                                                               
20 years  and her  husband smoked  for over  30 years;  both quit                                                               
smoking  on  February 7,  2015,  by  switching  to vaping.    She                                                               
expressed the positive health changes  that ensued.  She said her                                                               
five-year-old commented that the parents "don't stink anymore."                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MS. KUCK  said she does not  understand why she should  be lumped                                                               
in  with  tobacco  users.    She said  studies  have  shown  that                                                               
regulation on e-cigs could impact them  as a cessation tool.  She                                                               
said the  United Kingdom  "has a 20  percent higher  success rate                                                               
for  people   quitting  smoking   with  vapor  products."     She                                                               
recommended  the  aforementioned  documentary.    She  said  CSSB                                                               
63(FIN) is  "a secondhand smoke  bill" and needs to  remain such.                                                               
She emphasized, "I don't smoke -  I vape."  She said she supports                                                               
healthier  working  environments  but  wants  the  vape  language                                                               
removed from CSSB 63(FIN).                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
9:04:22 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
LARRY HACKENMILLER testified  in opposition to CSSB  63(FIN).  He                                                               
said  he questions  the  intent of  the  proposed legislation  to                                                               
eliminate  the  presence  of secondhand  smoke  in  buildings  to                                                               
protect the employees  from a hazardous workplace  condition.  He                                                               
continued:                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
      Secondhand smoke is not a chemical - it consists of                                                                       
      many chemicals.  Some of the chemicals in secondhand                                                                      
     smoke are  hazardous toxins and some  are identified to                                                                    
     be carcinogens, which have been  known to cause cancer.                                                                    
     All  of those  chemicals  are listed  in  the OSHA  Air                                                                    
     Containment Standard 29  CFR 1910.1000 Air Contaminants                                                                    
     List.   This  is a  standard used  under the  Clean Air                                                                    
     Act,  which is  enforced  by OSHA,  on  Alaska, by  the                                                                    
     Alaska  Occupational Safety  And Health  - AKOSH,  they                                                                    
     call it.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
     Secondhand  smoke  is  a  source  for  many  chemicals.                                                                    
     Natural  gas  emissions  are also  a  source  for  many                                                                    
     chemicals.   The chemicals - hazardous  or nonhazardous                                                                    
     -  are duplicated  in the  secondhand smoke  source and                                                                    
     the  natural   gas  emission   source.     Natural  gas                                                                    
     emissions  do have  more fine  particulates than  those                                                                    
     found   in   secondhand    smokes   -   more   metallic                                                                    
     particulates  -  which  is  another  concern  for  your                                                                    
     health.  ... Same chemicals - different sources.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     In Anchorage  and other locations where  natural gas is                                                                    
     available, natural  gas emissions come  from restaurant                                                                    
     deep  fryers, grills,  flattop pizza  ovens, hot  water                                                                    
     heaters, and building heating  units.  Most restaurants                                                                    
     have ventilation systems  for their cooking appliances,                                                                    
     except  for  some pizza  ovens,  which  do not  require                                                                    
     ventilation systems.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     Common sense would  dictate if the intent  of this bill                                                                    
     is to protect employees  from inhaling hazardous toxins                                                                    
     in  the workplace,  it would  eliminate all  sources of                                                                    
     hazardous toxins  from the workplace.   If  the sponsor                                                                    
     and the  highly intellectual leaders of  our Health and                                                                    
     Social  Services Department  are sincere  in protecting                                                                    
     employees, then  natural gas  emissions must  be banned                                                                    
     in  every public  building  in the  state.   If  common                                                                    
     sense  does  not  dictate  the  removal  of  all  these                                                                    
     hazardous toxins  from a place  of employment,  we need                                                                    
     not worry.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     In that  air contaminants  list used to  enforce indoor                                                                    
     air  quality  under  the  Clean   Air  Act,  all  these                                                                    
     chemicals have permissible exposure  limits - or PELs -                                                                    
     established by  the EPA in the  Risk Assessment Program                                                                    
     and  enforced by  OSHA and  AKOSH.   This list  clearly                                                                    
     shows that  all the  identified hazardous  toxins found                                                                    
     in  secondhand smoke  and  natural  gas emissions  -and                                                                    
     even vehicle emissions - do  not exceed the permissible                                                                    
     exposure  limit for  inside a  public building  and are                                                                    
     considered safe to inhale under those limits.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
     The  sponsor  of  the  bill   knows  this;  the  highly                                                                    
     intellectual leaders of our  Health and Social Services                                                                    
     Department know this.  If  the distinguished members of                                                                    
     this  committee would  question the  sponsor or  Health                                                                    
     and  Social Services  on line,  OSHA and  AKOSH do  not                                                                    
     classify   secondhand  smoke   as   a  hazardous   work                                                                    
     condition, perhaps  they can site the  science they use                                                                    
     other than what the surgeon general says.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MR. HACKENMILLER indicated  his willingness to remain  on line to                                                               
discuss  the conflicts  of the  wording  in CSSB  63(FIN) and  to                                                               
answer questions.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
9:08:15 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JAMIE HANSEN acknowledged those who  had already testified on the                                                               
importance  of e-cigs  in  helping  them to  quit  smoking.   She                                                               
emphasized  the dangers  of cigarettes;  however, she  stated her                                                               
concern  that excluding  e-cigs from  the bill  would essentially                                                               
give the message from the state  that e-cigs are safe.  She said,                                                               
"That is something  that I simply cannot accept."   She mentioned                                                               
the surgeon general's warning in  2016 regarding the danger of e-                                                               
cigs to  children and young  adults up to age  20.  She  said she                                                               
thinks there  is enough science  already to know that  e-cigs and                                                               
vaping should not be included  in the workplace, because they are                                                               
hazardous.   She opined that the  bigger issue is that  the state                                                               
is refusing to acknowledge the education of the public.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
9:09:47 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER noted that the  state does allow people to                                                               
do things  that are bad for  them.  For example,  one could argue                                                               
that alcohol is  bad for people, and the  state regulates alcohol                                                               
but does not  prohibit it.  He asked Ms.  Hansen, "To what extent                                                               
should the  state regulate people's  choices that may be  bad for                                                               
them?"                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MS.  HANSEN  answered that  she  thinks  most important  is  that                                                               
"vaping and  smoking cigarettes affects  those outside, so  it is                                                               
not simply an individual decision."   She said that is where CSSB                                                               
63(FIN)   "is  coming   to"  and   where  "the   issue  of   both                                                               
normalization and education holds that  it is simply not safe for                                                               
those around those who are smoking."                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER asked,  "So, are there any  limits to what                                                               
the state should be able to do to protect individual health?"                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MS.  HANSEN  answered yes.    She  said  she respects  those  who                                                               
support personal liberty, and she  supports it, as well; however,                                                               
she indicated  her top  priority is the  right to  breathe smoke-                                                               
free  air.   Second  to  that, she  said,  would  be the  state's                                                               
support of  the educational value of  [a smoke-free environment].                                                               
In response to a follow-up  question from Representative Saddler,                                                               
she confirmed that  this is not a personal  preference that could                                                               
extend to personal use of perfumes  or colognes; this is a health                                                               
concern.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
9:12:24 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ASHLEY PELTIE testified  in support of CSSB  63(FIN) and strongly                                                               
urged the  committee to  keep the  language pertaining  to e-cigs                                                               
intact.   She  opined  that  it is  counterintuitive  to pass  "a                                                               
statewide  smoking law"  and "exempt  something  that still  puts                                                               
people  at risk  and makes  business  owners have  a harder  time                                                               
enforcing a  law."  She urged  the committee to get  CSSB 63(FIN)                                                               
to the floor  for a vote, because "Alaskan  workers cannot afford                                                               
to wait any longer."                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
9:13:46 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
NOEL  CROWLEY  BELL testified  in  support  of CSSB  63(FIN),  as                                                               
written.    She  echoed  previous testimony  regarding  the  2016                                                               
surgeon general's report, which  "clearly illuminates the science                                                               
and the  uncertainty of the  secondhand aerosol that  is expelled                                                               
when  people vape."   She  said the  proposed bill  is needed  to                                                               
protect  the   health  of  all   Alaskans,  not  just   those  in                                                               
communities that  have already established health  policies.  She                                                               
said [CSSB  63(FIN)] is  not about the  restriction of  vaping or                                                               
removing the rights of Alaskans to  "choose a quit method"; it is                                                               
about  "protecting  the  rights  of workers  in  their  place  of                                                               
employment and giving  them the opportunity to  breathe clean air                                                               
as  they  work throughout  the  day."    She concluded  that  the                                                               
proposed  legislation  simply would  ask  smokers  and vapers  to                                                               
"take it outside."                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
9:15:32 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHRYSTAL  SHOENROCK,  Owner,   Forelands  Bar;  Secretary,  Kenai                                                               
Peninsula CHARR,  testified in opposition  to CSSB 63(FIN).   She                                                               
explained that CSSB 63(FIN) would  take away the rights of owners                                                               
to  speak with  their customers  about the  choice whether  to go                                                               
smoke-free.   She said  if the majority  of her  customers wanted                                                               
the  bar to  go  smoke-free,  then she  would  make that  happen;                                                               
however,  the  majority  of  customers   smoke  and  all  of  her                                                               
bartenders smoke.   She  stated, "My  dad lived  to be  100 years                                                               
old; he smoked every  day of his life.  He  didn't die of cancer;                                                               
he died  of old age."   She said she understands  that smoking is                                                               
not good  for a person,  but it is  a personal choice  whether to                                                               
smoke.  She said soldiers  have died protecting freedoms that are                                                               
increasingly being  taken away.   She reiterated that  she thinks                                                               
the owners  should be permitted  to make  the decision -  not the                                                               
government exercising  another form  of control.   She  said bars                                                               
need to  be taken  out of  the equation,  because there  are many                                                               
smoke-free bars on the Kenai Peninsula  and only a few that allow                                                               
smoking; the people choose which bar to patronize.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
9:18:18 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JENNIFER  BRANDT  testified in  support  of  CSSB 63(FIN).    She                                                               
shared that up until last year  she had worked in a building that                                                               
allowed smoking  outside, with no requirements  regarding how far                                                               
away from the  building smokers must be.  She  said people smoked                                                               
right next to  the exhaust intake, often filling  her office with                                                               
secondhand smoke.   She  said she developed  a chronic  cough and                                                               
had to look for another job.   She said she was fortunate to find                                                               
work  at  a  smoke-free  campus,  but  said  others  are  not  so                                                               
fortunate.    She  asked the  committee  to  protect  hardworking                                                               
Alaskans by passing CSSB 63(FIN).                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
9:19:24 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REBECCA  "BECKY" STOPPA  testified  in support  of CSSB  63(FIN),                                                               
with  the inclusion  of  e-cigs.   She said  she  is a  life-long                                                               
nonsmoker, who has suffered from  asthma, which she is certain is                                                               
due, at least  in part, from exposure to  secondhand smoke during                                                               
her youth  and as  a young adult  working in  establishments that                                                               
allowed smoking.  Ms. Stoppa said  today she is fortunate to live                                                               
in a community  and work in an environment, both  of which do not                                                               
allow smoking  in the workplace.   She stated her belief  that it                                                               
is  important to  extend  the same  workplace  protection to  all                                                               
Alaskans.    She encouraged  the  committee  to keep  the  vaping                                                               
language in  the proposed legislation,  because "we know  that e-                                                               
cigarettes and ... vape liquid ...  [have] many of the same toxic                                                               
chemicals found  in regular cigarettes, and  ... the consequences                                                               
could  be just  as  dire."   Ms.  Stoppa  said  the language,  as                                                               
written, does  nothing to  prevent people  from vaping;  it would                                                               
simply ask them "to take it outside, just like smokers."                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
9:21:03 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
LINCOLN  BEAN, Chair,  Alaska Native  Health Board,  testified in                                                               
support of CSSB 63(FIN), as follows:                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
     The use of tobacco is  the nation's number one cause of                                                                    
     preventable  death, killing  nearly  600 Alaskans  each                                                                    
     year from  direct tobacco use.   In 2012,  Alaska spent                                                                    
     $538   million  in   medical   expenditures  [and]   an                                                                    
     additional  $231 million  in lost  productivity due  to                                                                    
     tobacco related deaths.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     At twice the rate of  non-Natives, 42 percent of Alaska                                                                    
     Natives  smoke and  15 percent  use smokeless  tobacco.                                                                    
     Cancer  is  the leading  cause  of  death among  Alaska                                                                    
     Native  people, and  lung  cancer is  one  of the  most                                                                    
     frequently  diagnosed cancers.   Heart  disease is  the                                                                    
     second  leading  cause  of death  among  Alaska  Native                                                                    
     people, and  smoking and  exposure to  secondhand smoke                                                                    
     are major risk factors for heart disease.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     Not all  Alaskans are protected from  ... [exposure to]                                                                    
     secondhand  smoke.    Currently  smoke-free  workplaces                                                                    
     cover  only  half  the   state's  population  and  many                                                                    
     boroughs lack  the authority necessary to  pass a local                                                                    
     law.   The  only way  for  Alaska to  protect from  the                                                                    
     harmful  effects  of  secondhand  smoke  is  through  a                                                                    
     statewide,  smoke-free  workplace  law.   Among  Alaska                                                                    
     Native adults, 89 percent  believe smoking should [not]                                                                    
     be  allowed  in an  indoor  work  area and  86  percent                                                                    
     support smoke-free in restaurants.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     Currently  there's  not  enough evidence  to  say  that                                                                    
     electronic  cigarettes   are  an   effective  cessation                                                                    
     device.   The  long-term  health  impact of  electronic                                                                    
     cigarettes ...  [is] also unknown, as  they are largely                                                                    
     unregulated,  and  the  amount of  nicotine  and  other                                                                    
     chemicals aren't  known.   Thorough analysis  has shown                                                                    
     potentially  harmful   ingredients,  including:     ...                                                                    
     ultrafine particles  that can be inhaled  deep into the                                                                    
     lungs;  flavorings  such  as  (indisc.)  -  a  chemical                                                                    
     linked  to  serious   lung  disease;  volatile  organic                                                                    
     compounds; and  heavy metals, such as  nickel, tin, and                                                                    
     lead.    72  percent   of  Alaskans  supported  the  e-                                                                    
     cigarettes in statewide, smoke-free workplaces.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
9:23:45 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
TERESA HOLT,  State Long  Term Care  Ombudsman, Alaska  Long Term                                                               
Care Ombudsman,  testified in  opposition to  CSSB 63(FIN).   She                                                               
explained that many residents in  nursing facilities and assisted                                                               
living homes would not be able  to walk the 20-foot distance from                                                               
an entrance or  window to smoke, as would be  required under CSSB                                                               
63(FIN).   She  said these  facilities are  essentially homes  to                                                               
their residents, and  while most do not allow  residents to smoke                                                               
in the homes, residents are allowed  to smoke in the garage or on                                                               
the back deck, where staff can  keep watch on them without coming                                                               
into contact  with secondhand smoke.   She remarked that  some of                                                               
these  folks are  in their  80s and  have been  smokers for  [the                                                               
majority of]  their lives.   She said  the Alaska Long  Term Care                                                               
Ombudsman would  like to  see an amendment  to CSSB  63(FIN) that                                                               
would allow  these residents to  continue to be allowed  to smoke                                                               
in the garage or out back.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
9:25:15 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  PARISH  remarked  that  that is  "a  nuance"  that  the                                                               
committee may  not have  considered.   He asked  Ms. Holt  if she                                                               
thinks  passage of  CSSB 63(FIN)  would result  in any  practical                                                               
change  in  the  way  business   is  conducted  [in  the  nursing                                                               
facilities  and  assisted living  homes].    He added,  "I  can't                                                               
imagine troopers kicking down doors on this subject."                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MS.  HOLT answered  that she  thinks  the homes  would not  allow                                                               
smoking if  a complaint was filed  either by a resident  or staff                                                               
person.  She  said on the nonsmoking campuses  people have wanted                                                               
to smoke  so badly that they  walked off campus, fell,  and broke                                                               
their hip or had to  stand outside in freezing weather conditions                                                               
to smoke.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
9:27:12 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MEGAN TALLY testified in support of  CSSB 63(FIN).  She said as a                                                               
former smoker,  she recognizes the  challenges of quitting.   She                                                               
encouraged the  committee to keep  the language pertaining  to e-                                                               
cigs in  CSSB 63(FIN),  because she  conducted an  on-line search                                                               
and found "plenty  of other issues that come  up with e-cigarette                                                               
use,  even though  it is  technically not  the same  as smoking."                                                               
She  urged  the committee  to  move  the  bill out  of  committee                                                               
quickly  on behalf  of Alaskans  who want  clean air  to breathe.                                                               
She added that it makes it easier  on a former smoker not to have                                                               
to smell smoke and desire to smoke as a result.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
9:28:47 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JOEL MEDENDORP  noted that he  works in the  healthcare industry,                                                               
with   a  background   as  a   respiratory  therapist,   invasive                                                               
cardiological  technician,  and  a certified  pulmonary  function                                                               
technician, but  he is testifying  on his own behalf.   Regarding                                                               
local  option/local  control, he  said  for  the vast  geographic                                                               
majority  of Alaska,  state government  is the  local government.                                                               
Glennallen, for example, is unincorporated.   He said the surgeon                                                               
general has established that e-cigs are not safe.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MR. MEDENDORP posed  a question regarding rights:  "Why  is it in                                                               
our state  venue to control someone's  right to smoke or  vape or                                                               
any of  that?"  He offered  an anecdotal response that  he drinks                                                               
diet soda, which some believe to be  toxic.  He said he would not                                                               
argue whether  diet soda is or  is not toxic, but  he pointed out                                                               
that when  he drinks it,  he is making  the choice to  ingest it,                                                               
but he  is not  "pouring [it]  over your head  or smearing  it on                                                               
surfaces or spraying  it through the air," which he  said is what                                                               
happens when  people smoke  or vape  inside a  closed space.   He                                                               
added  that it  is not  only the  air that  is affected;  residue                                                               
lands on  surfaces and  transfers to  people's hands  or clothes.                                                               
He  said if  he entered  a cigarette  or cigar  shop or  an e-cig                                                               
shop, then he  would expect to be exposed; however,  he would not                                                               
expect "to  be exposed to  this stuff unknowingly" when  going to                                                               
places  where people  have  smoked  and where  he  does not  know                                                               
whether anyone has smoked or not.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MR. MEDENDORP  concluded, "The only  thing that's  interesting to                                                               
me  is the  question about  assisted living;  that's a  thought I                                                               
hadn't  thought of  before;  but  other than  that,  I'm in  full                                                               
support of SB 63, as it's written."                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
9:31:43 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JANET KINCAID,  Owner, Colony Inn,  described herself as  "an old                                                               
coot" who  has been in Alaska  since before statehood.   She said                                                               
at  one  time  smoking  was   allowed  everywhere,  including  in                                                               
hospitals, because no  one knew the health  risks; therefore, she                                                               
advised that it would be a  mistake not to include vaping in CSSB                                                               
63(FIN), because not everything is  known about the detriments of                                                               
vaping.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MS. KINCAID related  that her business was the  first in downtown                                                               
Palmer  to become  smoke-free.   As  the face  of the  smoke-free                                                               
[movement],  she  said she  "got  a  lot  of  hits from  the  bar                                                               
owners,"  including  a  banner flown  to  boycott  her  business,                                                               
because  people feared  she was  taking away  their rights.   Ms.                                                               
Kincaid said the bar owners  ultimately discovered that a benefit                                                               
of going  smoke-free was  that they gained  customers.   She said                                                               
another benefit is  not having to clean as often.   She indicated                                                               
that if  anyone ever  cleaned a  wall in a  room where  there was                                                               
heavy smoking,  then he/she would  be appalled at what  people in                                                               
the room were inhaling in their lungs.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MS. KINCAID said  she has one of the only  24-hour restaurants in                                                               
the   Matanuska-Susitna   Valley.       Becoming   a   smoke-free                                                               
establishment has resulted  in other benefits:   tables turn over                                                               
faster and  kids don't carve up  the tables.  She  emphasized her                                                               
strong support  of CSSB 63(FIN).   In response to a  request from                                                               
Vice Chair  Fansler, she  stated that in  addition to  owning the                                                               
Colony  Inn,  she also  works  at  the  Valley Hotel,  which  she                                                               
indicated comprises  the Caboose  Lounge, Iron Horse  Liquor, and                                                               
the Round House Caf?.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
9:34:59 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MARGE  STONEKING, Executive  Director, American  Lung Association                                                               
(ALA), stated that ALA's mission  includes fighting for healthful                                                               
indoor and outdoor air for the  prevention of lung disease and an                                                               
improvement  of lung  health for  those with  lung disease.   She                                                               
reported that  she is one  of the approximately  100,000 Alaskans                                                               
with lung  disease.  She  expressed appreciation for  the stories                                                               
shared  by those  who  have converted  from  cigarettes to  vapor                                                               
products, but  said "this is not  about the liberty to  use vapor                                                               
products."  She  said CSSB 63(FIN), in its  current form, exempts                                                               
vape shops from the  bill.  She said the people  who vape want to                                                               
be  able to  do so  anywhere  in Alaska,  including indoors,  but                                                               
there are harmful ingredients in e-cigarettes.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MS. STONEKING  referred to a  letter of evidence from  the Center                                                               
for  Disease Control  and Prevention,  which is  included in  the                                                               
committee  packet,  which  lists the  ingredients  in  secondhand                                                               
aerosol:     nicotine,   a  psychoactive   neurotoxin;  ultrafine                                                               
particles that  can be inhaled  deep into the  lungs; flavorings,                                                               
such as  diacetyl, which is  linked to a serious  disease, called                                                               
"popcorn  lung"; volatile  organic compounds;  and heavy  metals,                                                               
such as  nickel, tin, and  lead.  She  said, "This is  what we're                                                               
talking about, in  terms of secondhand exposure; this  ... is not                                                               
a proven safe product to be able to expose others to."                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MS.  STONEKING said  CSSB  63(FIN) would  allow  all Alaskans  to                                                               
breathe  smoke-  and  aerosol-free  air at  work  and  in  public                                                               
places.    She  echoed  previous testifiers  who  said  that  the                                                               
proposed legislation would  simply ask those who use  to "take it                                                               
outside."  She called attention  to the Dittman poll, included in                                                               
the committee packet, which notes that  not only do 69 percent of                                                               
Alaskans  support a  statewide smoke-free  workplace law,  but 72                                                               
percent of  Alaskans support the  inclusion of e-cigarettes.   In                                                               
conclusion, Ms. Stoneking said, "So,  this is not about the right                                                               
...  or prohibition  to vape  or  not; this  is about  protecting                                                               
others from  secondhand exposure  to known neurotoxins  and other                                                               
toxic chemicals."                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
9:38:02 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SHARON WOLKOFF  testified in support  of CSSB 63(FIN).   She said                                                               
she  thinks  e-cigarettes  should  be included  and  [their  use]                                                               
should not be normalized for  children.  She mentioned the opioid                                                               
epidemic and suggested the possibility  that other drugs could be                                                               
in e-cigs.   She  said she  wants to  have the  peace of  mind in                                                               
knowing  that she  is not  breathing  in secondhand  drugs.   She                                                               
placed emphasis  on the  protection of  children.   She mentioned                                                               
budget cuts and  reform in healthcare, and she  opined that "this                                                               
will improve the health of a  lot of people."  She indicated that                                                               
she  thinks [CSSB  63(FIN)] should  "stay as  it is."   She  said                                                               
people can  get exposed to  the chemicals  left behind in  a bar,                                                               
even if  no one is  currently smoking there; therefore,  she said                                                               
she does  not think the idea  of limiting smoking hours  in a bar                                                               
will work.   She  urged the  committee to  pass CSSB  63(FIN) and                                                               
protect communities.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
9:40:58 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ALEX MCDONALD, Owner,  Ice Fog Vapor, stated, "We're  on the same                                                               
team as far  as trying to reduce tobacco use  and related illness                                                               
in the  state."  He shared  that he lost his  grandmother to lung                                                               
cancer and he used to smoke.   Notwithstanding that, he said this                                                               
legislation is  being heard for the  fifth year in a  row, and he                                                               
still opposes  it; each year  research and reports  are published                                                               
that  support his  concerns with  the legislation.   He  said the                                                               
inclusion  of vapor  products  in CSSB  63(FIN)  "is contrary  to                                                               
public policy  suggestions from experts and  organizations around                                                               
the world."   He relayed that both "Public Land  England" and the                                                               
Heartland Institute in  the U.S. have issued  statements that the                                                               
inclusion  of  vapor products  in  any  clean  air bills  is  bad                                                               
policy, and those entities site  studies showing that "there's no                                                               
concern for harm  for bystanders" and "forcing  former smokers to                                                               
use  their vapor  products in  smoking areas  leads to  increased                                                               
relapse" and "dual use."                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MR. MCDONALD said  most people who use vapor  products are former                                                               
smokers or people  trying to quit smoking, and asking  them to go                                                               
to  smoking areas  makes  as much  sense  as "asking  [Alcoholics                                                               
Anonymous] (AA)  to hold meetings at  a bar."  He  questioned how                                                               
that would  better public  health, and he  pointed out  that CSSB                                                               
63(FIN)  would  actually  "force  people into  smoking  areas  to                                                               
breathe secondhand smoke to use a smokeless product."                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR.  MCDONALD noted  that  in  the last  few  weeks, New  Zealand                                                               
legalized the sale of nicotine-containing  e-liquids to assist in                                                               
the country's efforts  to have a smoke-free country by  2525.  He                                                               
said vapor  products are currently covered  under [New Zealand's]                                                               
Clean  Air Act,  but  the country  is looking  to  amend them  to                                                               
exclude vapor  products.   Mr. McDonald  said the  United Kingdom                                                               
has the same  goal to be smoke-free; however,  the country treats                                                               
combustible   products  and   smokeless  products   as  separate,                                                               
"because they're not the same thing."   He relayed that this year                                                               
the   Royal  College   of  Physicians   stated  that   electronic                                                               
cigarettes  are at  least 95  percent  safer than  smoking.   The                                                               
United Kingdom  does not  include vapor  products in  their clean                                                               
air  laws, because  they do  not  produce smoke  and "there's  no                                                               
concern for secondhand  exposure."  Mr. McDonald  said the Office                                                               
of National Statistics  reported that 56.7 percent  of smokers in                                                               
the UK  quit smoking last year.   He suggested that  "we can have                                                               
the same result."                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MR.  MCDONALD said  new vape  shops would  not be  exempted under                                                               
CSSB  63(FIN);  they  would  need   to  purchase  and  install  a                                                               
ventilation system,  which could  cost $3,000-$50,000.   Further,                                                               
he  said in  Fairbanks, "every  suite  has an  Arctic entry  that                                                               
opens into  a common area."   He said  the vape shop  owner would                                                               
have to get  permission from the property owner to  cut a doorway                                                               
in the  outside wall and  pay for  the installation of  the door.                                                               
Higher heating costs and increased security issues would result.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MR. MCDONALD reiterated  that he is on the side  trying to ensure                                                               
public health.   He opined that smokeless products  should not be                                                               
included in  CSSB 63(FIN).   He shared  that as someone  who once                                                               
worked in a group home and  had to assist blind people to smoking                                                               
areas,  he concurs  with the  former testimony  of the  ombudsman                                                               
that assisted  living homes should  be excluded, because  he said                                                               
that "that is a health and safety concern."                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
9:46:13 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FANSLER, after  ascertaining that no one  else wished to                                                               
testify, closed public testimony on CSSB 63(FIN).                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
9:47:13 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR PARISH  questioned what  effect CSSB 63(FIN)  would have                                                               
on underage smoking.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
9:47:28 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JOE  DARNELL,   Investigator  IV,   Tobacco  Youth   Education  &                                                               
Enforcement  Program, Division  of Behavioral  Health, Department                                                               
of  Health  and  Social  Services (DHSS),  answered  that  vaping                                                               
"renormalizes smoking  in public"; therefore, he  opined that the                                                               
language  regarding vaping  should remain  in CSSB  63(FIN).   He                                                               
said in  the last 20-30  years, people have become  accustomed to                                                               
seeing people go  outside to smoke and would react  with shock if                                                               
someone  lit up  a combustible  cigarette in,  for example,  this                                                               
committee  room.   He  reiterated  that  allowing vaping  indoors                                                               
would renormalize smoking indoors.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
9:48:42 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE WESTLAKE  said the  committee has heard  from many                                                               
testifiers  that vaping  can help  people quit  using combustible                                                               
cigarettes.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MR. DARNELL said when talking about  "less harm," while it may be                                                               
true that vaping  can help some adults quit smoking,  [the use of                                                               
vaping  products]  "is initiating  children  into  smoking."   He                                                               
named  the following  flavors  used in  vape  products:   cherry,                                                               
gummy bear, cotton  candy.  He said his  program's research found                                                               
that the sell rate [of vape  products] to minors is 28 percent in                                                               
the state and 50 percent in  Anchorage alone.  He said this shows                                                               
that vaping  is being  used as  an initiation  for children.   He                                                               
said, "So,  to keep the  vape language in  this bill, I  feel, is                                                               
extremely  important."    In response  to  Co-Chair  Parish,  Mr.                                                               
Darnell  said that  by comparison,  the sell  rate of  tobacco to                                                               
minors  is 5-6  percent statewide  and  just under  3 percent  in                                                               
Anchorage.   He  talked  about checking  vape  shops and  helping                                                               
their  workers "do  business the  way they're  supposed to."   He                                                               
said after 15 minutes in a vape  shop his lungs will burn for 3-4                                                               
hours  afterwards.   He  acknowledged that  there  is no  science                                                               
behind that statement, but that is how he feels.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
9:52:33 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  DRUMMOND asked  if  there is  an age  restriction                                                               
related to vaping products.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MR. DARNELL  answered the  age restriction  is currently  19, the                                                               
same as  for cigarette  smoking.  He  mentioned there  is another                                                               
Senate bill  that is attempting  to "tighten that language."   In                                                               
response to a follow-up question,  he confirmed that he has found                                                               
that  the vaping  products are  being sold  to minors  at a  high                                                               
rate.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR PARISH said he finds  this information alarming that the                                                               
sell rate  of vaping products  to youth  is almost six  times the                                                               
sell rate of tobacco to youth.   He asked if Mr. Darnell includes                                                               
18-year-olds in those statistics.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MR. DARNELL answered  that the program checks the ages  of 16 and                                                               
17.  He indicated  the reason for using that age  range is to not                                                               
trick anyone  by gathering  a statistic on  someone who  might be                                                               
turning 19  in two days.   He said the majority  [of sellers] did                                                               
not even ask for identification ("ID").                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR PARISH  offered his understanding that  the other Senate                                                               
bill mentioned  by Mr. Darnell  is aimed at making  the penalties                                                               
more stringent  and "the education  more comprehensive  for these                                                               
folks."  He asked, "What's the solution to the problem?"                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
9:54:25 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. DARNELL  answered that  SB 15 is  the legislation  that would                                                               
tighten  the law  regarding vaping  products to  be more  in line                                                               
with that of  tobacco products.  He said his  program checked all                                                               
the  shops it  could  find;  however, the  vaping  shops are  not                                                               
currently  required  to  have  any   kind  of  endorsement.    He                                                               
explained that  currently tobacco [sellers] must  have a business                                                               
license  and a  tobacco  endorsement, which  makes  it easier  to                                                               
figure  out where  all the  tobacco  shops are  by searching  the                                                               
endorsements.  In  order to find vape shops, a  search is done on                                                               
line  by  using  various  words,   including  "vape,"  "ice,"  or                                                               
"cloud."  Mr. Darnell said that  leaves the possibility that if a                                                               
certain word was not  put in a search, then a  vape shop could go                                                               
undiscovered.  For example, he said  he found out only because of                                                               
a complaint  from a parent that  there is a vape  shop in Juneau,                                                               
named   "Global   Communications."     Half   the   store   sells                                                               
international  calling  cards  and  the  other  half  sells  vape                                                               
supplies.  He emphasized that  his program would never have found                                                               
that store just  doing a search, and that is  why the addition of                                                               
the endorsement  requirement is  so important,  which is  what is                                                               
being attempted under SB 15.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR PARISH  asked what proportion of  underage smokers begin                                                               
nicotine use through vaping.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. DARNELL said he does not know.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
9:56:55 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FANSLER  reminded members to submit  amendments no later                                                               
than 24 hours before the next  hearing, which he said would be on                                                               
Tuesday, April 25, 2017.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
9:57:58 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  PARISH  requested  documentation  regarding  "the  sell                                                               
rate."                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
9:58:22 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR MICCICHE,  Alaska State Legislature, as  prime sponsor of                                                               
CSSB 63(FIN),  noted that he  has actively pushed this  issue for                                                               
the last two years.   He said he has a  solution for the assisted                                                               
living home.  He said he is not  against vape shops.  In fact, he                                                               
said, the  bill separates  vape shops so  that existing  ones can                                                               
continue to  operate as they  currently do.  Under  CSSB 63(FIN),                                                               
only new vape shops would have  to have improved ventilation.  He                                                               
said  employees should  not be  subject  to breathing  [unhealthy                                                               
air].   He said he would  not support legislating what  people do                                                               
in  their  homes.   He  added,  "In  fact,  we changed  the  bill                                                               
specifically on someone who receives  health care in their home."                                                               
Regarding  the comment  about the  [diet] drink,  he said,  "When                                                               
someone  drinks  a sugary  drink,  they  don't  spit it  into  my                                                               
mouth."    He stated  that  CSSB  63(FIN) is  specifically  about                                                               
"balancing  the rights  of  the  smoker with  the  rights of  the                                                               
nonsmoker," and  "we made it as  easy as we possibly  can through                                                               
this  process for  the  smoker" by  simply  requiring smokers  to                                                               
"take it outside - not very far outside - just outside."                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR MICCICHE said he is "always  happy to see a better bill."                                                               
Notwithstanding  that, he  said he  had hoped  that CSSB  63(FIN)                                                               
would move  out of  committee today, but  he asked  the committee                                                               
members to consider that the  proposed legislation has a long way                                                               
to go through the legislative  process, and he requested that the                                                               
bill be  given a chance to  be heard.  He  expressed appreciation                                                               
to both co-chairs for the time spent on CSSB 63(FIN).                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
10:00:39 AM                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FANSLER  asked Senator Micciche  if he has  an amendment                                                               
to address the issue of the assisted living homes.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR MICCICHE  answered yes.   He said  he had it  drafted for                                                               
the next  committee, which  is where he  had anticipated  more of                                                               
the changes to the  bill being made.  He said  the amendment is a                                                               
simple fix that would lessen the  distance a person would have to                                                               
be from a door.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FANSLER  offered that the  House Community  and Regional                                                               
Affairs  Standing  Committee  would  be  willing  to  offer  that                                                               
amendment.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
[CSSB 63(FIN) was held over.]                                                                                                   

Document Name Date/Time Subjects
HB33 ver A 1.18.17.pdf HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
HB 33
HB33 Supporting Documents AFN Resolution.pdf HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
HB 33
HB 33 Fiscal Note DOA.pdf HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
HB 33
HB33 Supporting Documents AFN Letter to Governor.pdf HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
HB 33
HB33 Supporting Documents ADN.pdf HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
HB 33
HB33 Sponsor Statement 3.28.17.pdf HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
HB 33
CSSB063 Sectional Analysis Ver. N 3.29.2017.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
CSSB063 Explanation of Changes Ver. U to Ver. N 3.29.2017.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
CSSB063 Resolutions of Support 3.29.2017.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
CSSB063 Ver. N 3.29.2017.PDF HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
CSSB063 Fiscal Note DCCED-AMCO 4.6.2017.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
CSSB063 Fiscal Note DEC-FSS 4.6.2017.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
CSSB063 Fiscal Note DOT-COM 4.6.2017.PDF HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
CSSB063 Sponsor Statement 3.29.2017.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
CSSB063 DPS-DET 4.6.2017.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
CSSB063 Fiscal Note DHSS-CDPHP 4.6.2017.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
CSSB063 Resolutions of Support 3.29.2017.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
CSSB063 Support Document - Evidence on Secondhand Smoke 3.29.2017.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
CSSB063 Support Letters 3.29.2017.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
CSSB063 Support Document - Dittman Survey 3.29.2017.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
CSSB063 email opposing, amend.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
SB 63 Maniilaq 17-06 Supporting a Smokefree Alaska.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
SB 63 Electronic_Nicotine_Delivery_Systems_Key_Facts_Infographic_CDC.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
SB 63 ecigarette-secondhand-aerosol.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
SB 63 E-cigarette nicotine labels not always accurate -- ScienceDaily.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
SB 63 ASHRAE_PD_Environmental_Tobacco_Smoke_2013.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
SB 63 - States Map Smoke-Free.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
CSSB063 Resolutions of Support UPDATE 4.11.2017.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
SB 63 Addnl Support 4-12-2017.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63
SB064 DoD 4-6-2017Addnl Comments UECA Bill.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 64
SB064 DEC response to DoD 4-6-2017 Addnl Comments.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 64
SB 63 email opposing 03302017.pdf HCRA 4/13/2017 8:00:00 AM
HCRA 4/18/2017 8:00:00 AM
SB 63