Legislature(2001 - 2002)
02/20/2001 01:34 PM Senate TRA
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* first hearing in first committee of referral
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= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
Number 1725
SB 88-METROPOLITAN PLANNING ORGANIZATIONS
SENATOR RANDY PHILLIPS, sponsor of SB 88, said SB 88 just adds two
voting members to the Anchorage Metropolitan Area Transportation
Study (AMATS). One of the new members would be a member of the
senate who resides in Anchorage and the other would be a member of
the house of representatives who also resides in Anchorage.
SENATOR PHILLIPS said there was a two-tier step for the AMATS
process. AMATS consists of a policy committee and a technical
committee. The technical committee goes to the community, takes
input, and then makes recommendations to the policy committee.
There are five members on the policy committee. Two members are
appointed by the governor - commissioner or designee of the
Department of Environmental Conservation (DEC), and designee from
the Department of Transportation and Public Facilities (DOTPF),
there are two elected officials who are assembly members, and the
Anchorage mayor.
SENATOR PHILLIPS said the legislature was expected to put five to
ten percent of the monies into AMATS without any say about the
process. He said it was frustrating to have a project make it up
the AMATS process and the next year see the project go back to the
bottom. Senator Phillips felt that having elected officials on
AMATS would give the legislature some say in how the priorities are
set and how the money is spent.
Number 1545
SENATOR ELTON said it may be easier for people to "grab the sleeves
of their local government person rather than to grab the sleeve of
a state legislator." He said it also seems that a system is being
created whereby a legislator from the house and from the senate
have "two bites at the apple." They have the legislative bite and
then they have the local government bite.
Number 1443
SENATOR PHILLIPS said the legislature does approve AMATS projects
but it has no say in the priorities. AMATS is a federal program,
through regulation, that was set up between the state and federal
government, but legislators are the ones who get beat up by their
constituents if a project is not there. The AMATS policy committee
prioritizes the projects without accountability.
Number 1321
SENATOR ELTON said this was not a unique problem, other legislators
have the same frustration with the Statewide Transportation
Improvement Program (STIP). He said the fundamental
misunderstanding might be that the pressure Senator Phillips has to
not make changes is coming from the municipality - the only
constraint is that he might not want to go against the wishes of
the municipality, although he has every right to do so.
SENATOR PHILLIPS said wishes could be conveyed to the AMATS
committee but that does not mean they would be heard.
SENATOR ELTON said this is also the case with anything that goes
before the finance committee.
SENATOR PHILLIPS said he would agree if the legislature were not
paying anything into AMATS. He said a park and ride program was
installed next to the landfill at Eagle River. No one from his
community requested this program and yet it passed over another
project that had been requested.
SENATOR ELTON commented that the argument being used to have
legislative representation on spending could also be used for
municipal assistance revenue sharing or safe community. He
wondered why this would be different than other problems.
SENATOR PHILLIPS said no one else in the state has this problem.
SENATOR ELTON said other communities felt the same frustration with
the STIP.
Number 1156
SENATOR TAYLOR said he applauds Senator Phillips for trying to get
some rationality back into the process.
CHAIRMAN COWDERY asked if there had been any thought of replacing
the two non-elected members.
SENATOR PHILLIPS said the two state members could not be replaced
because of federal regulation. He said he liked the make up of
AMATS but believed it needs legislative representation.
Number 900
MR. DENNIS POSHARD, Department Of Transportation and Public
Facilities (DOTPF), noted that DOTPF and the Anchorage municipality
realize there is a high sense of frustration with the AMATS
planning process, and DOTPF understands Senator Phillips'
frustration.
MR. POSHARD said the Anchorage municipality sought a grant from the
federal government specifically for the purposes of reviewing
transportation planning in the Anchorage area and recommending
changes to the AMATS public and planning process. Mr. Poshard had
just received a draft of this study and that the study would
recommend ways to change the AMATS process.
MR. POSHARD commented that it is by design that the legislature not
have much say on AMATS' projects. When the Intermodal Surface
Transportation Efficiency Act (ISTEA) formed municipal planning
organizations it was a negotiated position on how to divvy up the
federal funding. Because the federal government did not want to be
involved with this process, it came up with the Municipal Planning
Organization (MPO). The MPO would be responsible for planning and
devising a process on how to spend federal transportation dollars
within a municipality. The funds would still have to flow through
the state for programming in the STIP, but there would be control
on how the funds were spent. This is why the legislature is not
heavily involved but there is nothing preventing it from being
involved.
MR. POCHARD said in the past, staff has dealt with changes in the
program and this has been cause for frustration. New rules require
that changes now go before either the technical committee or the
policy committee.
MR. POSHARD said the administration does not support SB 88 mainly
because it feels this is a local issue and should be solved at that
level.
Number 584
SENATOR WARD said tax dollars are being taken out of peoples'
pockets to fund projects that are not following a public process.
Number 168
SENATOR ELTON asked if the study had recommended changing the
membership of the AMATS board.
MR. POSHARD said he had not had time to read the study in detail
but it did not appear to have a recommendation for adding
legislators. The study was focused on communication efforts and
the public and planning processes of AMATS.
SENATOR ELTON said SB 88 is the second iteration of this
legislation, and in the past the municipality has opposed adding
legislators. Senator Elton asked if the new assembly and new mayor
had been asked for their position on this.
MR. POSHARD said he has heard nothing from the current
administration or the current assembly.
TAPE 01-5, Side A
Number 001
SENATOR TAYLOR asked how much money is allocated to AMATS.
MR. BRIGHAM said about $30 million in the Community Transportation
Program (CTP) and about $6 million in Trails and Recreational
Access for Alaskans (TRAAK).
SENATOR TAYLOR said that means $36 million is allocated every year
by the legislature to the Anchorage area.
MR. BRIGHAM said that was correct in terms of the community
transportation and TRAAK projects. There are also national highway
system projects that go beyond that amount. Some years there are
no projects and other years there are several.
SENATOR TAYLOR asked if the projects, when completed, belong to the
state or to Anchorage.
MR. BRIGHAM said it depends on the road. There are state roads
that function as local roads, but are state owned. There are
national highway system routes, such as the Seward Highway, that
are state owned, and there are municipal roadways - all three are
funded by the AMATS process.
SENATOR TAYLOR said that Anchorage gets its local roads paved and
rebuilt with federal money and the state pays the match.
MR. BRIGHAM said that was correct, but this is also done for
projects outside of AMATS. DOTPF funds approximately $45 million
of locally owned streets and roads each year. It also pays the
match unless the local government has proposed to pay some of the
match as a way of getting its project elevated in the process.
Number 248
SENATOR PHILLIPS said there are no "local, local" roads that AMATS
has taken over.
SENATOR TAYLOR asked if part of the federally allocated money was
for mass transit.
MR. BRIGHAM said that mass transit could be funded as part of the
service transportation program.
SENATOR ELTON asked if the AMATS money comes from the community
transportation program.
MR. BRIGHAM responded yes, both CTP and TRAAK.
SENATOR ELTON said that half of the CTP funds are being reserved
for AMATS projects or for very large municipalities.
Number 782
MR. BRIGHAM said SB 59 would not require local match, it would
prioritize, giving communities an advantage in the scoring if the
local government provided local match.
SENATOR ELTON asked if the prioritization could take $20 million
out of the CTP.
MR. BRIGHAM said that large municipalities with the capability to
do the engineering would have an advantage - Anchorage could do a
federal aid project. SB 59 would be a way for Anchorage to get
more of the CTP money.
Number 850
MR. WILLIAM CUMMINGS, Assistant Attorney General, Department of Law
(DOL), noted that DOL had two observations to make concerning SB
88. First, SB 88 takes AMATS, which is a municipal organization,
and turns it into something more akin to "Big Brother" - with the
state taking over a local function. This is a policy call to be
made, but it is a profound thing to do to a local way of dealing
with a problem. Second, there are constitutional concerns about
the appointment of legislators to this board. There are strong
provisions in the constitution prohibiting dual office holding. SB
88 very likely would violate this provision, which could result in
a member of the legislature, who took a seat on the AMATS board,
losing his or her seat in the legislature.
MR. CUMMINGS said DOL cautions the legislature on SB 88, and a
review would certainly say that these two provisions do violate the
state constitution.
SENATOR WARD said he would like to obtain a written legal opinion.
SENATOR TAYLOR moved SB 88 out of committee with individual
recommendations.
SENATOR ELTON objected and a roll call vote was taken. Senators
Taylor, Wilken, Ward and Chairman Cowdery voted "yea." Senator
Elton voted "nay." The motion carried, and SB 88 passed out of
committee.
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