Legislature(2003 - 2004)
05/15/2003 08:45 AM Senate FIN
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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
CS FOR HOUSE BILL NO. 210(RES)(efd fld S)
"An Act relating to the Chitina dip net fishery."
This was the first hearing for this bill in the Senate Finance
Committee.
Co-Chair Wilken stated this bill, "eliminates the $25 fee for the
Chitina dip net fishing permit and requires State agencies to
publicize and mark the State land that provides access to the
fishery."
RYNNIEVA MOSS, Staff to Representative John Coghill, Jr., presented
the bill.
SFC 03 # 100, Side A 10:21 AM
Ms. Moss continued that this legislation addresses an equity issue,
explaining that the Chitina dip net fishery is the only fishery in
the State that assesses a fee to participants. She noted the intent
of the $25 fee was valid, as it compensated the two private
property owners upon whose land was trespassed.
Ms. Moss reminded that through the efforts of former Representative
John Davies and former Senator Pete Kelly, funds were appropriated
to survey the access to the Chitina fishery. With the completion of
the survey, she shared that it has been determined that over 60
percent of access to the river is public access on State-owned
property.
Co-Chair Wilken directed the witness to identify the areas in
question on a map she possessed [copy on file].
Senator Bunde asked if the participants would still be required to
hold a sport-fishing license.
Ms. Moss replied that licenses were not required in the past,
although the Alaska Board of Fisheries determined the fishery to be
personal use rather than subsistence, and licenses were
subsequently required.
Ms. Moss detailed the map showing a section of the Copper River and
the areas of the dip net fishery, in conjunction with the land that
is privately or publicly owned.
Ms. Moss clarified that although the fee would not be imposed, a
permit would still be necessary to participate in the fishery. She
stated this is to ensure that all who participate receive a
brochure indicating public assess. She informed that funds
remaining from the survey project would be utilized to produce the
brochure as well as a "large public sign" indicating the public
assess to the river.
Ms. Moss qualified that conflicts would continue, as occur in many
other areas of the State where people might trespass on private
land. She admitted the local residents would be impacted; however,
they should "take advantage" of the situation and undertake
economic development. She suggested boat ramps, campgrounds and
other establishments to accommodate the fishers.
Senator Taylor asked if this legislation is identical to a bill he
sponsored the previous legislative session.
Ms. Moss affirmed and reminded that the original legislation passed
the Senate but did not complete the House of Representatives'
process before adjournment.
Ms. Moss reminded the original legislation contained a provision
that would have retained the $25 fee for one year and that Co-Chair
Wilken testified, "the intent of the fishery is to have an
accessible, productive State fishery". She recalled Co-Chair Wilken
supported the collection of fees for one year with the knowledge
that an agreement would be reached between the State and the Native
corporations that owned portions of the land.
Senator Taylor asked about the issue of adverse possession. He
understood that over time "prescriptive easements" could be
acquired to allow public assess, due to the utilization of
privately owned land for several years. He spoke to other pending
legislation that would eliminate "any opportunity to gain any of
those access rights across that private land". He cautioned that
this private land would never become accessible to the public
except through a licensing fee if the other legislation passes.
Senator Hoffman asked the ownership of the land nearest the parking
area indicated on the map.
Ms. Moss responded that Chitina and Ahtna Native corporations own
most of the private land in the area.
Senator Hoffman asked if most participants in this fishery utilize
this parking area.
Ms. Moss replied that "pavilion area" is used for parking, as well
as a private campground at O'Brien Creek.
Senator Hoffman asked how the fees were utilized.
Ms. Moss detailed that $18 of the fee [likely $8] was paid to the
Native corporations to compensate for trespassing; $12 was used to
maintain portable toilets and dumpsters; and $2 remained with the
Department of Fish and Game to administer the fee program.
JESSE VANDERZANDEN, Executive Director, Alaska Outdoor Council,
testified this bill is one of the top priorities of the Council for
the current legislative session. He told of the approximately
12,000 collective membership of hunters, fishers and trappers
represented by the Council, many of whom, he stated participate in
the Chitina dip net fishery. He furthered that the Council is
comprised of approximately 50 outdoor activities-related clubs, one
being the Chitina Dipnetters Association.
Mr. VanderZanden characterized this legislation as a "well-timed
housekeeping proposal". He pointed out that the survey of the lands
around the Chitina River was completed in the Summer 2001, and
conclusively showed that at least 60 percent of the area utilized
by the dip netters is public land. In addition, he said public
corridors were identified that would allow dip netters access to
fishing sites without crossing private land. He remarked that as a
result of this recently identified public access, the initial $25
fee instituted by the Legislature in the year 2000 to secure
trespass rights across the private lands, is no longer necessary.
Mr. VanderZanden read portions of a letter from then Governor Tony
Knowles to the Chitina Native Corporation dated April 25, 2002, as
follows.
…Last summer, DOT&PF [Department of Transportation and Public
Facilities] staff completed this legislatively funded survey,
which held that at least 60 percent of the length of the
right-of-way between O'Brien Creek and Haley Creek affords
legal public access to the Copper River… The results of this
survey places the State in the awkward position of collecting
fees from a personal users in the Chitina Subsistence Fishery
to pay for access that is not needed in order to participate
in the fishery… ADF&G [Department of Fish and Game] is
considering a proposal that would repeal the access fee.
Mr. VanderZanden next read from an August 25, 2002 letter from then
Department of Natural Resources Commissioner Pat Pourchot and then
Department of Fish and Game Commissioner Frank Rue addressed to the
Ahtna Native Corporation as follows.
…The current year-to-year compensation process has been
difficult for all parties and given information from the
survey and other developments, we do not believe that the
current arrangement is sustainable… A bill seeking a repeal of
the fee passed the Senate 18 to one and would likely have
passed the House as well if it had not been so close to the
end of the session.
Mr. VanderZanden furthered that this bill addresses a
public/private lands issue that would resolve issues for both
private landowners and fishers. He pointed out that public lands
have already been posted in the Chitina corridor, specifically to
Haley Creek. He understood that adequate funds remained from the
survey project to produce and widely distribute brochures
delineating public and private lands.
Mr. VanderZanden surmised that by delineating these public lands
would reduce the impact to private lands caused by trespass, and
also allow private landowners to charge a fee for access across
their land. He noted this currently occurs in nearby fisheries
under similar circumstances. He asserted that because private and
public lands had not been identified and posted in the past,
fishers were unable to discern trespass on private land, thus
necessitating the trespass fee to allow access for all fishery
participants. He remarked that proper identification of private
land would allow landowners to prosecuting for knowing and
egregious trespass, were it to occur.
Mr. VanderZanden stated this bill would "get the Department of Fish
and Game out of the waste and trash removal business." He asserted
that the time spent on contracting for these services was valuable
and could have better been spent on managing the fishery. He
admitted this bill does not address the matter of funding these
services, however, he stressed it should be discussed in the
"regulatory arena" rather than the "statutory arena," as no other
fishery or access matter contains statutorily mandated fee.
BYRON HALEY, President, Chitina Dipnetters Association, testified
via teleconference from Fairbanks, in support of passage of the
bill. He stressed there is no need to charge one group of people to
use public lands to access the Copper River. He noted that
participants must purchase a sport-fishing license. He reiterated
earlier testimony regarding the survey's findings of 60 percent of
the land in the fishery area is publicly owned. He gave a history
of the fee, which initially was ten dollars but was raised at the
request of the affected Native Corporations.
PAUL HOLLAND, Board Member, Chitina Dipnetters Association,
testified on his own behalf via teleconference from Fairbanks in
support of the legislation. He described the seven-mile area in
which the fishery occurs, referencing the aforementioned map. He
surmised that approximately 90 percent of the dip netters access
the fishery through public land.
MARK HEM, Owner, Chitina One-Stop grocery store, Hem Charters
guided dip net fishing, a café, and private property in the Chitina
area, and Vice President, Chitina Dipnetters Association, testified
via teleconference from Fairbanks about his business operations in
the Chitna area. He shared that he has had his land surveyed and
developed to lessen trespass on his property. He stressed that if
the State continues collecting fees from a user group for potential
trespass on private property, he should receive payment as well. He
opined the fee collection sets a "bad precedent" for the State and
he urged passage of this bill.
Senator Hoffman noted a portion of the fees was expended on waste
removal and similar services. He asked as a resident of the area,
if the witness was concerned with the trash of 8,000 visitors not
being removed.
Mr. Hem was concerned but emphasized that the matter should be
addressed differently. He characterized the fee collection
primarily addresses trespass on private property.
Senator Hoffman commented that the $40,000 expense of waste removal
has not been otherwise addressed.
Ms. Moss injected that the House Finance Committee discussed the
expense of waste removal and that the co-chairs of that Committee
committed to finding a solution. She stated that waste removal is
undertaken in relation to other fisheries and that the Chitina dip
net fishery should be treated equally.
Senator Taylor clarified that the Alaska Board of Fisheries changed
the definition of the fishery from subsistence to sport and that a
sport fishing license would be required to participate.
Ms. Moss corrected the classification was changed from subsistence
to personal use.
Senator Taylor surmised that subsistence is personal use and that
if the fishery was classified as subsistence no resident of
Fairbanks could participate.
Ms. Moss was unfamiliar with the details of the Alaska Board of
Fisheries decisions.
Senator Taylor offered a motion to report the bill from Committee
with individual recommendations and accompanying fiscal notes.
Without objection CS HB 210 (RES) MOVED from Committee with zero
fiscal note #1 from the Department of Natural Resources and
($172,800) fiscal note #3 from the Department of Fish and Game.
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