Legislature(2021 - 2022)BARNES 124
04/12/2022 08:00 AM House COMMUNITY & REGIONAL AFFAIRS
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| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| HB167 | |
| HB349 | |
| HB402 | |
| HB411 | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| *+ | HB 167 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| *+ | HB 349 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| *+ | HB 402 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| *+ | HB 411 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | TELECONFERENCED |
HB 167-GOLD AND SILVER SPECIE AS LEGAL TENDER
8:06:22 AM
CO-CHAIR HANNAN announced that the first order of business would
be HOUSE BILL NO. 167, "An Act relating to specie as legal
tender in the state; and relating to borough and city sales and
use taxes on specie."
8:06:56 AM
REPRESENTATIVE KEVIN MCCABE, Alaska State Legislature, as prime
sponsor, paraphrased the sponsor statement [included in the
committee packet], which read as follows [original punctuation
provided]:
The purpose of HB 167 is to recognize Alaska's
constitutional duty, power and right under Section 10,
Article I, of the United States Constitution, and the
Tenth Amendment of the United States Constitution to
make gold and silver legal tender in the payment of
debt. HB 167 will secure the rights of citizens of
this state under the Ninth and Tenth Amendments of the
United States Constitution to tender gold and silver
in the payment of a debt should the merchant or payee
agree to accept it. This bill will bring Alaska into
full compliance with the United States Constitution
with the policies, practices, and procedures of this
State with respect to the use of gold, silver and
specie as legal tender in the payment of debt. In
these unprecedented times, this bill will preserve,
protect, and promote the state and its economic
security, safety, health, and welfare of the people of
this state; and protect this state and its citizens in
the acquisition and possession of gold and silver and
their use as legal tender in the payment of debt.
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE remarked that "it sounds dangerous." He
noted many states have done this. He said there is interest in
the bill, which would create a study in the House Finance
Committee on "the possibility of establishing an alternative
form of legal tender for the payment of debts, public charges,
taxes, and other money owed to the state."
8:11:43 AM
JULIE MORRIS, Staff, Representative Kevin McCabe, Alaska State
Legislature, on behalf of Representative McCabe, prime sponsor
of HB 167, read the sectional analysis [included in the
committee packet].
8:14:07 AM
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE, in response to Representative McCarty's
query as to the trustworthiness of gold specie, said he thinks
it is as trustworthy as any other legal tender. In response to
a follow-up question regarding changes in the value of gold,
said he cannot say what the value of the gold, in terms of
carats, is in the specie, but he could find out. He said other
states just look up the value of gold; he acknowledged that the
value fluctuates.
REPRESENTATIVE MCCARTY said, "I think this is a great idea."
8:18:59 AM
REPRESENTATIVE PRAX suggested the problem is that many years ago
U.S. Congress abandoned "the constitutionally required manner of
establishing a currency." It is the value of the federal
reserve note that fluctuates. He indicated it is the public
that will have to accept it.
8:20:21 AM
REPRESENTATIVE DRUMMOND observed that "this appears to be
applied to plastic" and said she is used to "gold or ...
metallic foils, in printing, being stamped onto paper." She
asked, "How do you know there's gold in this, and how do you
recover it from plastic, which melts when you apply heat to it?"
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE said he did not know, but was assured from
a dealer that [the specie samples he had brought for the
committee to view] were legitimate. In response to a follow-up
question, he said the states that issue these accept them as
legal tender.
REPRESENTATIVE DRUMMOND noted the words "should the merchant or
payee agree to accept it" in the sponsor statement and
considered that since the value fluctuates, the burden to
determine the value would fall on the merchant.
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE likened that to setting gas prices.
8:24:59 AM
PAMELA LEARY, Director, Treasury Division, Department of
Revenue, in response to a question from Representative McCarty
regarding tax reporting in relation to species, said she does
not know the tax ramifications but guessed that the value
tendered would be the reported income value, as with any other
currency. She said she would need to do some research to
provide a definite answer to that question.
8:27:57 AM
CO-CHAIR HANNAN asked Ms. Leary to also find out whether the
states using species accept them for state tax purposes and how
states are dealing with this within the states' treasuries.
MS. LEARY responded that some of the states have gold
repositories, so that may be how they are able to "accept that."
She said she could do further research.
8:29:00 AM
REPRESENTATIVE PRAX suggested Ms. Leary research Epperly v.
Alaska. He said the federal reserve notes are "accepted" but
"not constitutionally authorized."
8:30:44 AM
REPRESENTATIVE DRUMMOND said she sensed this could present a
problem to the recreational marijuana industry, which currently
cannot be served by Alaska's financial institutions because of
federal laws.
8:31:54 AM
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE countered that making species be legal
tender would actually benefit the marijuana industry, because
currently it cannot put its dollars in a bank, and dollars lose
value. He said, "These wouldn't lose value because they're tied
to gold." To Representative McCarty's question about taxes, he
surmised that if [a merchant] brings in one dollar's worth in
gold, and at the end of the year it is worth $20, then the
merchant would have to [report that as taxable income] "much the
same as you would with interest." He offered his understanding
that the value of the dollar has gone down 30 percent in the
last three years. In closing, he asked for the committee's
support of HB 167 and indicated upcoming testimony and receipt
of letters of report.
8:34:25 AM
CO-CHAIR HANNAN announced that HB 167 was held over.
| Document Name | Date/Time | Subjects |
|---|---|---|
| HB167 VerO.SupportingLetters2.4.11.22.pdf |
HCRA 4/12/2022 8:00:00 AM |
HB 167 |